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  1. - Top - End - #841
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamerlord View Post
    I never lost a single soldier to a Berserker, and my soldiers pretty much just played Pinball whenever one of them showed up. In fact, First Contact with one of the xenos was also a live capture! However, I had a very Sniper-heavy play style on my first playthrough (Usually had three snipers, and one each of the other classes) so that usually made the job easier.
    Only once, in my first game. Was in a Terror Mission, the museum map. I was busy taking out the 'lids when this Berzerker comes out of the FoW and ends up on the opposite side of the wall from my Assault . I thought I was safe but NOPE - turns out 'zerkers can do this Deus Ex style through-the-wall takedown and the poor guy got pummeled into paste.
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by SlyGuyMcFly View Post
    Only once, in my first game. Was in a Terror Mission, the museum map. I was busy taking out the 'lids when this Berzerker comes out of the FoW and ends up on the opposite side of the wall from my Assault . I thought I was safe but NOPE - turns out 'zerkers can do this Deus Ex style through-the-wall takedown and the poor guy got pummeled into paste.


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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by Reynard View Post
    I'm not sure know what exactly Military Guy does in the game that the player doesn't do for him, aside from wearing an olive green jumper.
    He's the executive officer, isn't he? At a guess, he finds buyers for the grey market, yells at constructors to make sure they finish the satellite uplink on the day they've given, tries to be inconspicuous about hauling in enough food and materials to run a secret base, is in charge of payroll and death benefits, keeps track of psych evaluations and on-site tech support, negotiates with council nations for rookie recruitment, satellite placement and permission to let foreign soldiers with laser cannons run around in their territory, or (more likely) keeps up to date with the department heads who do these things, depending on X-com's size and paranoia.

    His job is to let the commander make the most important decisions without having to worry about the tracking devices in the last ammo shipment, or about what happened when chryssalid #7 exploded in storage.

    In other words he takes care of the menus.
    Last edited by Kizor; 2012-10-22 at 08:13 PM.

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by SlyGuyMcFly View Post
    Only once, in my first game. Was in a Terror Mission, the museum map. I was busy taking out the 'lids when this Berzerker comes out of the FoW and ends up on the opposite side of the wall from my Assault . I thought I was safe but NOPE - turns out 'zerkers can do this Deus Ex style through-the-wall takedown and the poor guy got pummeled into paste.
    Dude, they showed that back in the E3 footage! That was the second thing I learned aliens could do, after the mind merge.
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by Kizor View Post
    He's the executive officer, isn't he? At a guess, he finds buyers for the grey market, yells at constructors to make sure they finish the satellite uplink on the day they've given, tries to be inconspicuous about hauling in enough food and materials to run a secret base, is in charge of payroll and death benefits, keeps track of psych evaluations and on-site tech support, negotiates with council nations for rookie recruitment, satellite placement and permission to let foreign soldiers with laser cannons run around in their territory, or (more likely) keeps up to date with the department heads who do these things, depending on X-com's size and paranoia.

    His job is to let the commander make the most important decisions without having to worry about the tracking devices in the last ammo shipment, or about what happened when chryssalid #7 exploded in storage.

    In other words he takes care of the menus.
    Yea, the XO's job is to handle all the little details so the CO can handle the crisis at hand.

    So it's the XO that is informally speaking with the NCOIC about the actions concerning the mess hall, the sectoid corpse and the peanut butter, and that he trusts that the matter will be resolved.

    It's the XO that goes over the inventory and has a private discussion with the supplier concerning the discrepancies in the quality and/or quantity of the goods delivered. Said conversation just happening to wander by a Muton autopsy in progress, pointing and saying "You see that? When you've got that thing barreling down at you, and your gun jams... well, you saw the Hall of Honor, right? Your name goes right there. So, you're from... Detroit, eh? A very good town. It would be a shame if we had an 'equipment malfunction' when the damn xenos landed and wiped it off the face of the planet, wouldn't it? All because of the crap equipment you're trying to offload on us.", then proceeds to make sure that the suppliers make up for the 'unfortunate oversight' at no additional charge.

    But you, the CO, don't notice any of that. In fact, you really don't want to notice that. Because you've got a really damn good team that is kicking xeno arse, and you'd really rather not bust your best sniper back to rookie because he played a prank on someone.

    Besides, you've got three bogeys inbound and only two aircraft in position to intercept, and you need to decide which nation to save, and which two are going to panic and pull support before you can soothe ruffled feathers because you have neither the funding nor the manpower to catch all three.

    So yea, he does all those little things that give you the breathing room you need to make the tough choices. So every time you assign the last plasma rifle to a unit being dispatched, and it is actually there instead of 'Umm... yea, about that Sir... umm... it was... well... you see, there was an incident in the shooting range last week.'... thank him.
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by Brumski View Post
    Is this a bug, or just the RNG screwing with me.

    I've psi-tested 15 or 18 soldiers to date, most of them squaddies with 49-52 Will (I have all the training school upgrades), yet I've only got one psionic soldier, which happens to be the very first one that I tested.

    My first playthrough I had like 4-5 at this point, and that was without the Will upgrade, not that I'm sure if that effects the chance of psionic ability or not, or just how strong they are with it if they do.
    RNG screwing with you. Psionics seem to be pretty rare - I found only two soldiers with them for most of my first file, getting more only when I tried save/reloading to see if I could force the results I wanted on my last batch of troops late in the game (that worked, btw, though you need to remove them from the psi testing and put them back in to get different results). Had better luck in my second file, where I had about five - which was good, since that was an Iron Man file.

    Quote Originally Posted by YakYak View Post
    I dunno, there seems to be some predetermination, namely that both times I've gone all the way through the game, one of the troops from the first mission (because I don't do the tutorial) ends up psi.
    As near as I can tell from my save/reloading, the results of the test are fixed from the moment you place the troop into the testing, but can be changed by removing them and placing them back in again. I don't know whether there's any sort of pre-determination beyond that as far as survivors of the first mission go - my first file I did the tutorial and the sole survivor of that died before I got psionics. My second the one survivor of that mission who lasted until I got psionics did turn out to have the potential, though, so there's that, for whatever it's worth.

    Quote Originally Posted by BRC View Post
    Really, the one character that bugged me was the Shadowy Council Guy. First of all, his voice sounded ridiculous.
    Secondly, why was he in shadow? Is he worried that the commander of this top-secret, internationally funded military organization might learn his identity, then start calling him during dinner saying "Hey, we need more money to build cool guns. Can you help a brother out?"
    Every time he says "Remember, we will be watching," I keep thinking "could you say that a little less ominously? You're supposed to be on my side!"

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    I don't have XCOM, but I have read this entire thread.

    So I have a question. Has anyone tried a team of Assault/Assault/Heavy/Heavy/Support/Sniper? Doesn't really matter how you build most of the team, but the two Heavies specifically go down the different routes (one takes Bullet Storm, takes Shredder Rockets, takes HEAT ammo, equips grenades, and the other acts as a sort of Support with Suppress and Holo-Targeting, and equips either a medkit or grenades until you get the second item slot and can carry both).
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    I'm currently running a team of Assault/Heavy/Heavy/Support/Sniper/Sniper, with the divergent heavy paths mentioned, and they're doing alright.
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by Jade Dragon View Post
    I don't have XCOM, but I have read this entire thread.

    So I have a question. Has anyone tried a team of Assault/Assault/Heavy/Heavy/Support/Sniper? Doesn't really matter how you build most of the team, but the two Heavies specifically go down the different routes (one takes Bullet Storm, takes Shredder Rockets, takes HEAT ammo, equips grenades, and the other acts as a sort of Support with Suppress and Holo-Targeting, and equips either a medkit or grenades until you get the second item slot and can carry both).
    Needs more snipers; the most powerful class in the game. 2 is the minimum IMHO.

    Holo-targeting isn't very good by contrast to Bulletstorm, and near useless by the late game.

    If you have Support doing Suppression, I don't really find it's worthwhile for the Heavy vis a vis Shredder rockets, though I can countenance more conservative strategies emphasizing Suppression, especially if you lack Snipers to take advantage of blown cover.

    Assault is good, but I prefer more rockets/nades/HEAT.

    I've personally wanted to try 5 Heavies, 1 Support on Impossible Ironman if only to up the challenge (getting rid of Snipers makes the game substantially more difficult).

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by Surrealistik View Post

    Oh wow, how could I not have made that connection, its perfect.

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by SlyGuyMcFly View Post
    Only once, in my first game. Was in a Terror Mission, the museum map. I was busy taking out the 'lids when this Berzerker comes out of the FoW and ends up on the opposite side of the wall from my Assault . I thought I was safe but NOPE - turns out 'zerkers can do this Deus Ex style through-the-wall takedown and the poor guy got pummeled into paste.
    I keep falling for that, although it hasn't yet KOed anyone. Taken a couple of soldiers down to 1 or 2 HP though.

    The main way the Beserkers are dangerous for my teams is that they have armed Muton squadmates to deal with at the same time, and moving to gain more breathing space invariably triggers a bunch of new alien squads.

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Finally finished the game.

    Ending spoilers:

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    The aliens do care about the volunteer - whenever one of your squad goes down you get a comment expressing concern that if one of the chosen one's pack went down so easily then maybe they were wrong, and if the volunteer goes down you get that nonstandard game-over and the aliens are dismayed that their candidate for ascension has failed after all.

    Which makes the last moments even more baffling; clearly they expect your team to survive until the final room, since they're using the gauntlet as exposition about the races they tried to uplift. And they have more to tell you in that room. So okay, they attacked as one final test of your ability or something, confident that their new candidate could handle it.

    But then what is going on with the last room? They swing with lethal force, and if they succeed, are unhappy because their candidate died (and you even get a special message about how upset they are that you were so close when you went down). But if they fail, they freak out and tell you that you're doomed without them to guide you? What outcome were they expecting, that you would counter the assault and force the enemy to obey you without killing them?

    Actually... I was wondering if there might have been an alternate ending if you kill the other enemies and not the super-Ethereal. It doesn't sound like there is, but maybe you're supposed to mind-control it to prove yourself, or something? I doubt there's actually a secret ending, but it would make marginally more sense... pop psi inspiration right before triggering the fight, trigger and mindfray as much as you can, and then try to mind-control it? But you'd have to do that in a single turn, since once it acts it'll mind-control someone and become immune...

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    I want to ask one thing.

    Why has no one made a WH40K mod yet?

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by Impnemo View Post
    Oh wow, how could I not have made that connection, its perfect.
    We now need a mod that replaces the Berserker's animation with the Kool-aid man

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by SlyGuyMcFly View Post
    Only once, in my first game. Was in a Terror Mission, the museum map. I was busy taking out the 'lids when this Berzerker comes out of the FoW and ends up on the opposite side of the wall from my Assault . I thought I was safe but NOPE - turns out 'zerkers can do this Deus Ex style through-the-wall takedown and the poor guy got pummeled into paste.
    Something very similar happened to me the first time I spotted a bezerker. It ran through the wall my sniper was standing behind. Still, that got it close enough that I was able to stun it, so his sacrifice was not in vain.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jade Dragon View Post
    I don't have XCOM, but I have read this entire thread.

    So I have a question. Has anyone tried a team of Assault/Assault/Heavy/Heavy/Support/Sniper? Doesn't really matter how you build most of the team, but the two Heavies specifically go down the different routes (one takes Bullet Storm, takes Shredder Rockets, takes HEAT ammo, equips grenades, and the other acts as a sort of Support with Suppress and Holo-Targeting, and equips either a medkit or grenades until you get the second item slot and can carry both).
    That's the team I used for my first game. I didn't quite get the build right though, having not seen the powers before. So one heavy had suppression and double rockets while the other had shedder rockets and holo-targetting etc. If I can I'll try two heavies again on my current game, with both builds, and see how that goes.
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    I sometimes wish we could opt out of some let's benefits.

    No, I don't want to double-tap, I made you disable the alien weapon so we capture him ALIVE!!

    Assault, I positioned you that close so you can capture the bad guy. Why do you react to his movement with A SHOTGUN?

    Heavy, I need to shoot the rocket to save your here's ass against 2 chrysalis and 3 zombies. Can you NOT have your expanded AoE so we save your body's ass?

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by Cespenar View Post
    I want to ask one thing.

    Why has no one made a WH40K mod yet?
    I suspect because the game is so new heh; give it time and I'm almost certain it'll happen; but it'll probably take a year or two before a team has put together enough art assets and other stuff to have a mod worth playing.
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Open question to the thread: What do y'all think about Assaults with rifles instead of shotguns? I've been experimenting with the setup, and I have to say I like it. It offers less damage than point-blank shotguns, but also offers a lot more range and makes Assaults be able to Overwatch worth a damn. And it's not like a point-blank Rifle Rapid Fire doesn't drop pretty much everything anyway. Overall, it just feels like a superior option.

    Quote Originally Posted by YakYak View Post
    Dude, they showed that back in the E3 footage! That was the second thing I learned aliens could do, after the mind merge.
    I never watched that footage, was avoiding spoilers

    Quote Originally Posted by Cikomyr View Post
    No, I don't want to double-tap, I made you disable the alien weapon so we capture him ALIVE!!
    The game's pretty cool about this, usually. If you don't actually take the second shot Double Tap doesn't go on cooldown. Same for Run n' Gun if you don't dash and Rapid Fire if the first shot drops the x-ray.

    Rockets and whatnot... yeah. Pity about that.
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by SlyGuyMcFly View Post
    Open question to the thread: What do y'all think about Assaults with rifles instead of shotguns? I've been experimenting with the setup, and I have to say I like it. It offers less damage than point-blank shotguns, but also offers a lot more range and makes Assaults be able to Overwatch worth a damn. And it's not like a point-blank Rifle Rapid Fire doesn't drop pretty much everything anyway. Overall, it just feels like a superior option.
    Yeah, that's what I've been doing, especially after I get plasma weapons up.

    I actually like assaults and supports because they can equip the plasma rifles that I usually have a crap-ton of from captures. Heavies and snipers I have to spend money on to equip decent weapons.

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    I used Assaults with rifles my first time through, simply because I've never been a fan of shotguns. It turned out to work very very well for the most part. My current playthrough I'm experimenting with shotguns just for a change of pace, and so far I'm not sure that I find the increased damage/critical capabilities worth the lost range and versatility.
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Perhaps shotguns can be a little more useful in landed UFO missions, but overall, I'd say rifle.

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by SlyGuyMcFly View Post
    The game's pretty cool about this, usually. If you don't actually take the second shot Double Tap doesn't go on cooldown. Same for Run n' Gun if you don't dash and Rapid Fire if the first shot drops the x-ray.

    Rockets and whatnot... yeah. Pity about that.
    Wait, what? How can you end a unit's turn?

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by Cikomyr View Post
    Wait, what? How can you end a unit's turn?
    You can end the squad's turn by pressing backspace or clicking the X in the bottom left corner. Just make sure your sniper is the only one with actions left before ending it.
    Truth resists simplicity.

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by SlyGuyMcFly View Post
    You can end the squad's turn by pressing backspace or clicking the X in the bottom left corner. Just make sure your sniper is the only one with actions left before ending it.
    I LOOKED FOR THAT BUTTON FOR AGES!!

    Thank you sir!

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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    I might have one Assault use a shotgun if he's built for close-range combat. Otherwise, they get the rifles once I make the lasers.
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    I had two assaults, one with plasma rifle, and one with alloy shotgun. They were both pretty good, in their own ways. My rifle guy, Rhino, was the front line. Overwatching with the rifle produced good results. My shotty assault, Sheriff, was more of a finishing move. Cloak, point blank double shotgun run & gun to the face. Kills pretty much anything. They both require different playstyles.
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Quote Originally Posted by Diego Havoc View Post
    They both require different playstyles.
    This is very much my opinion. I actually think you need to divide assaults into 4 builds.
    1. shotgun crit
    2. shotgun defense
    3. rifle crit
    4. rifle defense.

    I'm going to buck the trend of the thread a bit and say that my favorite is to use shotgun builds and I think they're better than rifles. I heavily prefer the shotgun defense build on my assaults. Shotgun crit is a bit of a glass cannon. They still have a lot of hp (especially later) but without extra defense they're risking a lot every time they run in, although whatever you actually target is essentially guaranteed to die.

    What I love about shotgun defense is that they give you a guarantee that can be hard to get from any other unit, especially early in the game. Assault rifles deal lower damage than the shotgun and get less of an accuracy bonus at close range. But if you're playing on a harder difficulty and you need something dead early, like a thin man, it's the assault with a shotgun, not the sniper, who's going to have the most guaranteed way to do it.

    The playstyle with a shotgun is very unique though. You're trying to use your assault as a sort of zoning unit. If anything gets close to your other guys, the assault destroys it, and as you advance, the assault can take the lead to a safe position or be kept in reserve to run and gun an enemy depending on your luck with other, lower percentage shots. It's actually more defensive in style than when you use a rifle and my shotgun assaults probably hunker down more than any other unit type as I maneuver them until I'm ready to unleash them.

    In comparison, the assault rifle build plays much more like a heavy or a rookie, with the ability to advance and do a lot of damage thanks to run and gun and rapid fire plus overwatch capabilities. The defensive assault rifle build is also the best tank in the game since you don't have to get close, get lightning reflexes for advancing, get extra defense, and get the most hp in the game. However, the rifle build isn't especially different from a heavy or a support, and you're giving up rockets or medkits and smoke grenades to get the advantages in tanking and crit.

    So, the reason I say the shotgun is better is that it focuses on the unique advantages of the assault much more than the rifle build.
    Last edited by Anarion; 2012-10-23 at 09:49 AM.
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...



    Kills things just as dead as the shotgun most of the time, allows me to overwatch at range, play more conservatively and engage enemies effectively at most ranges. Overall, it's a safer and more versatile option.

  29. - Top - End - #869
    Titan in the Playground
     
    PirateCaptain

    Join Date
    Jun 2007
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    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    Eh, personally, I see Rifle Assaults as being the ultimate Reserve unit. Run-And-Gun, Plus the range of an assault rifle, means that they can get just about anywhere within your area of deployment. You can have them on your left flank when your right comes under attack, then reposition them to compensate.
    Shotgun serves two roles, they can be the vanguard while breaching a UFO, or a troubleshooter, kind of like a more reliable but higher risk version of a Sniper (since you don't have to deal with that unclear LoS/LoE mechanic)
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  30. - Top - End - #870
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    CreganTur's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2008

    Default Re: XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

    I've tried both version sof assault but now I always run 2 Assaults with Alloy Cannons. They're my vanguard anyway, so shotguns having more damage and hgiher crit rate just makes more sense to me.

    The defense bonus has saved their lives so many times that I cannot justify taking the critical increase.
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