XCOM: One Does Not Simply "Shoot" a Cryssalid...

[Trazoi]

Yeah, while I'll need more info to make a proper decision, from that description this DLC sounds terrible. The VIP missions were my least favourite parts of the game (too fixed) and a Triad super unit sounds all kinds of dumb.

I'd be interested in a mission pack like Alien Crossfire to Alpha Centauri that remixes the base game with new elements to make a different game. But this sounds like the standard level pack DLC that standard FPS or action games have, put into a genre where it just doesn't work.

[BRC]

I'm kind of wondering, how SHOULD DLC work in a game like Xcom. More customization options are an obvious, and easy, choice. Same with Map Packs.

Personally, I think any DLC should fit smoothly into a standard campaign.

New Aliens should be designed to start showing up at an appropriate time, or maybe come in multiple versions, depending on when in the campaign the player loads in the DLC. New Equipment should work in a similar manner, maybe requiring some specific event to unlock the research.

New Missions are tricky. I like the idea of this DLC, a special mini-campaign with unique rewards, but implementing it is tough. I don't like the idea of it showing up on the geoscape as soon as you start playing, but if you let it appear like a normal council mission, then players may find themselves paying money for a mission that never shows up.

Some stuff that I would love to see them put into DLC's, besides new customization, new aliens, and new maps.

Unique Equipment: A weapon with a special ability. It's basic stats are based on the highest tech-level you have unlocked (So, a Unique Sniper Rifle gets more powerful when you research Laser Snipers, and gets upgraded again when you research Plasma Snipers).
The trick is that Unique equipment Bonds with an individual soldier (always somebody who can use it, a Unique Sniper Rifle will only bond with a Sniper, for example). When you recover a unique weapon, you'll get a cutscene of a soldier finding it on the ground, or somebody giving it to the soldier in question. If none of the soldiers on that mission can use it, they'll bring it back to base, and you'll get a cutscene of a soldier finding it in the barracks.
If a soldier with a Unique Weapon dies, there is a chance that the weapon will be recovered.

Example Unique Weapon: The Marksman's Carbine. Sniper Rifle. Special Ability, increases Crit Damage from Headshot.

Or: Unique Equipment, Lucky Charm. Bonus to will, once per mission can guarantee next attack will hit, OR guarantee next attack against the user will miss.


Unique Aliens: A single alien, with enhanced or unique abilities. When their HP reaches a certain level, they will gain a defensive boost and begin to retreat. If they manage to escape (And there is a good chance that they will), they may show up again on later missions. There are, however, special bonuses for killing or capturing them. Examples

The Slim Reaper: A unique Thin Man, this one wearing the classic Trenchcoat+Fedora combo over his normal suit. He wields a unique sort of sniper rifle. The soldier that kills him receives a permanent boost to their Aim score.

The Red Bomber: A unique Floater (Or maybe heavy floater), with a distinct red tint to it's skin. He carries, and throws, multiple grenades. All soldiers on the mission where he is killed gain a resistance to explosive damage.

The Spider: A unique Sectoid
Goliath: An especially nasty Muton Berserker, larger than most, with spikes and blades adorning his armor. The Squaddie that kills him gains a special resistance to Melee damage.

[Trazoi]

I'm kind of wondering, how SHOULD DLC work in a game like Xcom.

The Alien Crossfire route is the only one I can think of that would work. If they released a bunch of DLCs where you could choose to play vanilla XCOM or a new XCOM: Terror from the Deep or other variants along the same lines, then it would be a fantastic addition.

The problem I see with DLCs that merely add more stuff* is that the core game was designed around streamlining the original XCOM play experience, and kludging it up with additional cruft will ruin it. Dragging out the mid- or end-game with missions doesn't sound like it will improve the flow of a game playthrough.

*Except customisation options, which are the obvious gravy to any DLC.

[Zevox]

So, new DLC has been announced.

Interesting. I like the idea of new missions with more story going on than the main game has, but if there aren't many of them, which is what it sounds like, I don't know that I'd be willing pay much for them, either.

I do not like the sound of the whole "research shortcut" thing though. It either means it will allow you to get those items earlier, which would be bad since they are powerful late-game tech, or it means you'll get a research credit towards them, in which case it's entirely pointless since by the time you get them to research you'll have enough scientists and credits to do so in a day or two anyway.

Zevox

[Surrealistik]

Snipers become less necessary with 3x Assaults coordinating their movements to flank and exterminate. Just be careful of those Mutons and their grenades...

Snipers aren't strictly necessary, but they make things, much, much easier and less risky; again the most powerful/impactful class in the game. For that reason, I prefer to build around them in Ironman Impossible, and Heavies provide the natural cover clearing synergy and firepower to back theirs up.


My thoughts on desirable DLC:

http://forums.2kgames.com/showthread...h-DLC-Wishlist

[Iskandar]

I've put in a lot of time playing this game now, like 70+ hours. One thing that has been a little niggling problem is really beginning to irk me. While I don't particularly miss TUs from the original X-Com, I am starting to miss the fine control over your soldiers' movements. "I want you to go here, but walk AROUND the poison gas cloud, not through it, you idiot." "Ok, you need to go here, but stay behind cover because there is an alien in overwatch if you go the direct route." It doesn't come up that often, but sometimes the auto pathing your soldiers will take is just so brain dead.

[Zevox]

Alright, I've done some more of my classic campaign today. Had two abduction missions and a small UFO. The first abduction mission fortunately got me a country that needed a panic reduction offering me 200 credits, so I picked that up, and thus didn't have too choose between another satellite and the alien containment facility. I also made enough money off damaged UFO parts to get my officer training school building, and captured a Sectoid and a Floater on the second abduction mission. Panic is starting to look bad in quite a few regions, but I'll have three satellites before the end of the month.

I am worried that I'll probably be getting my first terror mission soon, though, which I am so not ready for. No Carapace Armor, no laser weapons, no fifth troop slot... Chryssalids would be quite a bitch to face now.

I did end up reloading the second abduction mission once, due to some astonishing bad luck. The first time around I somehow managed, on the second turn, to activate four groups of aliens, three of which moved to flank me, and to lose two men to lucky critical hits from aliens that weren't flanking me. Yeah, total party wipe was not far behind there, and I still have too few troops worth a damn to take one of those. (I have not been able to train many troops due to the whole "still stuck with only four units per mission" thing.)

Zevox

[Surrealistik]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7kJi_pwj2c

Thought this was funny.

[Luzahn]

The DLC does indeed sound a bit underwhelming, but I will at least be looking forward to more customization options for the armor. Some of it looked out of place by the end; I found myself missing the uniform look of the Carapace/Skeleton + laser weapon.

[DaedalusMkV]

I will purchase any DLC which unlocks armour customization to the point where I can change my soldiers' armour colour and put decent-looking helmets on my endgame armours. Until that DLC comes, I will not purchase any, no matter what they offer, and especially if they include customization options I cannot use.

[Cespenar]

Okay, this is getting ridiculous. I just got 3 missions in 4 days, and there isn't an option to send recuperating soldiers into battle. I mean, come on, this isn't Hogwarts. I have countries to save, dammit.

[Anarion]

The DLC doesn't sound that great, although I like the idea of having a few mini-stories that can come up and give some flavor to the world during the midst of the invasion. Customization is fine, and it just seems like this one doesn't have all that much content, since 3 missions can be done pretty fast unless they're really long and involved.

I've put in a lot of time playing this game now, like 70+ hours. One thing that has been a little niggling problem is really beginning to irk me. While I don't particularly miss TUs from the original X-Com, I am starting to miss the fine control over your soldiers' movements. "I want you to go here, but walk AROUND the poison gas cloud, not through it, you idiot." "Ok, you need to go here, but stay behind cover because there is an alien in overwatch if you go the direct route." It doesn't come up that often, but sometimes the auto pathing your soldiers will take is just so brain dead.

Oh god, I'm with you so much. I lost a soldier on ironman this way. He was at 3 life and I didn't have anyone with a med kit. What does he do? instead of running straight, he decides during a council mission to jump down a wall into a poison cloud run straight and then jump back up at the end of his move. Couldn't finish the mission in 3 turns, he died. Genius.

I am worried that I'll probably be getting my first terror mission soon, though, which I am so not ready for. No Carapace Armor, no laser weapons, no fifth troop slot... Chryssalids would be quite a bitch to face now.

I did end up reloading the second abduction mission once, due to some astonishing bad luck. The first time around I somehow managed, on the second turn, to activate four groups of aliens, three of which moved to flank me, and to lose two men to lucky critical hits from aliens that weren't flanking me. Yeah, total party wipe was not far behind there, and I still have too few troops worth a damn to take one of those. (I have not been able to train many troops due to the whole "still stuck with only four units per mission" thing.)

Zevox

Two things. First, you can totally win a terror mission with just guys in normal armor and regular weapons. Bring a metric ton of grenades and as many heavies as you have and level the map, then blast anything that's still moving. This is especially good if you trigger several chrysalids at once. Rocket a clump to 2 hp each, and assault rifle/shotgun/sniper them to death with one shot each. Don't wait around though. If the Chrysalids start offing civilians while you advance too slowly, the eventual trigger will be 6 chrysalids, not 3. That's a bad thing.


Also, I presume you aren't following my ponythread game, but I've got an ironman classic run going that is really deep now. All armor types and weapons researched, just found my first psionic soldier and built 3 firestorms. I failed a terrior mission and have experienced two full party wipes as well as enough random deaths to constitute probably another full wipe again. Surprisingly, training up new squaddies is not so bad, and rookies are actually perfectly competent when they're wearing titan armor and using a plasma rifle.

[DaedalusMkV]

Aand... The Elite Soldier Pack just went up on Steam about an hour ago for $5. That's a steep price to pay for what it includes... But given how irked I've been about the whole thing, and how I said I would do it...

Fine, Firaxis. Take my extra money. The game was only $45 to begin with, and it's certainly worth 50.

[Beacon of Chaos]

Are carapace armours really that useful? I never built one because I figured I'd never need it.

So... I asked this back as my first question in the thread.

Only NOW do I realise that I am a HUGE idiot because I actually meant CHITIN PLATING and not carapace armour.

*headdesk*

So, I'll ask this again, hopefully getting an answer to the question I actually wanted to ask this time:

Are chitin platings really that useful? I never built one because I figured I'd never need it.

[Trazoi]

Are chitin platings really that useful? I never built one because I figured I'd never need it.

They're Super Nano-fiber Vests. I usually put one on my tank Assault if they aren't carrying an Arc Thrower*, or the second item on my elite medic Supports. It gives them a huge amount of health, which means they're more likely to take a shot or a grenade without getting wounded or more likely to survive if I inadvertently send them into a meat grinder. The main downside is they're a little bit pricey in the mid-game and I never get enough Chryssalid pelts to make more than a couple.

* Speaking of Arc Throwers - they're fine and all, but I miss the cattle prod.

[DaedalusMkV]

They're Super Nano-fiber Vests. I usually put one on my tank Assault if they aren't carrying an Arc Thrower*, or the second item on my elite medic Supports. It gives them a huge amount of health, which means they're more likely to take a shot or a grenade without getting wounded or more likely to survive if I inadvertently send them into a meat grinder. The main downside is they're a little bit pricey in the mid-game and I never get enough Chryssalid pelts to make more than a couple.

* Speaking of Arc Throwers - they're fine and all, but I miss the cattle prod.

This. Specifically, it gives +4 Health and, from what I saw, a -2 or -3 reduction on melee damage. An Assault with Titan Armour and Chitin Plating has about as much health as a Sectopod and takes 2-3 less damage from melee attacks, meaning that Cryssalids become much less scary and Berzerkers... Well, 12-13 is still a lot of damage, really.

I found myself using them primarily on my Alloy Cannon-using Assault. Snipers want SCOPES, Heavies want More Boom (alien grenades), Supports want Medikits (and Boom, in their second slot) and Rifle Assaults want... Well, Boom. But Alloy Cannon Assaults don't really want Boom, on account of their gun already doing Ludicrous Damage (TM) if you're in grenading range and Boom not synergizing well with Run and Gun, and love having more HP and being able to laugh off two or three Cryssalids if necessary. So yeah, get one and use it on people you want to keep alive pre-plentiful-Boom, or your Alloy Cannon Assaults post-plentiful-Boom.

[Cespenar]

* Speaking of Arc Throwers - they're fine and all, but I miss the cattle prod.

Heck, I miss the Thermic Lance of TftD.

[Iskandar]

Two things. First, you can totally win a terror mission with just guys in normal armor and regular weapons. Bring a metric ton of grenades and as many heavies as you have and level the map, then blast anything that's still moving. This is especially good if you trigger several chrysalids at once. Rocket a clump to 2 hp each, and assault rifle/shotgun/sniper them to death with one shot each. Don't wait around though. If the Chrysalids start offing civilians while you advance too slowly, the eventual trigger will be 6 chrysalids, not 3. That's a bad thing.

True story, I won the first terror mission I went on in the second turn on the first game I played on Classic. Got the achievement for getting excellent scores in all three categories. Didn't know what I was doing, so my guys were in basic kit.

I had everyone in overwatch, three floaters come charging out in such a way to trigger shots from three separate guys, EVERYONE hit, three dead floaters. Fourth floater pulls that fly straight up and land behind your guys thing, triggers the last guy on overwatch, FOUR dead floaters. I regroup, put everyone on overwatch again, cryssalids come charging out, and get cut to pieces by overwatch fire, game set match in less than 5 minutes. Lost one civilian, and not one of my squad got so much as scratched. Never had as easy a terror mission as that since.

[Cespenar]

I had everyone in overwatch, three floaters come charging out in such a way to trigger shots from three separate guys, EVERYONE hit, three dead floaters. Fourth floater pulls that fly straight up and land behind your guys thing, triggers the last guy on overwatch, FOUR dead floaters. I regroup, put everyone on overwatch again, cryssalids come charging out, and get cut to pieces by overwatch fire, game set match in less than 5 minutes. Lost one civilian, and not one of my squad got so much as scratched. Never had as easy a terror mission as that since.

That's... interesting. My assault rifles in Classic often do 2 damage, and usually miss more than they hit, even on overwatches.

[Iskandar]

Yeah, normally it is the same here. It was just bizarre, everything happened so fast I wasn't sure what had happened, just that there was now 4 dead floaters in less time than I could blink. I kinda shrugged my shoulders, then grouped everyone together to go explore the rest of the map, and boom cryssalids rush in and die just as fast.

BTW, check out episode four of my lets play to see how you handle that first terror mission with basic weapons. I did have improved armor, but that was kind of a moot point, as only one person got injured, and not enough to put him down even if he had been in standard armor. I did lose an inordinate amount of civilians, but other than that, it turned out much better than expected.

[Anarion]

So... I asked this back as my first question in the thread.

Only NOW do I realise that I am a HUGE idiot because I actually meant CHITIN PLATING and not carapace armour.

*headdesk*

So, I'll ask this again, hopefully getting an answer to the question I actually wanted to ask this time:

Are chitin platings really that useful? I never built one because I figured I'd never need it.

I consider chitin plating a late game item only. It's pretty much never worth the money when you have other things to do. But at some point you will end up with a ton of Chrysalid corpses and plenty of extra cash and you can replace every nano-fiber vest you ever made. As people have noted, they're best on assaults and good on supports in the second item slot. They're also okay on the suppression heavy (the one that doesn't have the double grenade perk). They also can be kinda nifty if you're training up rookies late in the game (usually those with psionic potential) as sometimes you just need to put the rookie in the line of fire to try and get a kill with a plasma rifle and a 65% hit chance.

True story, I won the first terror mission I went on in the second turn on the first game I played on Classic. Got the achievement for getting excellent scores in all three categories. Didn't know what I was doing, so my guys were in basic kit.

I had everyone in overwatch, three floaters come charging out in such a way to trigger shots from three separate guys, EVERYONE hit, three dead floaters. Fourth floater pulls that fly straight up and land behind your guys thing, triggers the last guy on overwatch, FOUR dead floaters. I regroup, put everyone on overwatch again, cryssalids come charging out, and get cut to pieces by overwatch fire, game set match in less than 5 minutes. Lost one civilian, and not one of my squad got so much as scratched. Never had as easy a terror mission as that since.

That's pretty cool.

I've done that mission 3 times now and I consider it wildly swingy. The first time I did it, I beat it but lost half my squad, average performance against floaters, killed most chrysalids but messed up the positioning of two that were too far forward, finished by cleaning up zombies.

The second time I did it, I aced it with no trouble but lost that save when I got wiped by mutons later on.

My current classic ironman run I failed the mission utterly. It took me 4 turns to get past the floaters, as I just could not hit them, even with 5 squaddies firing at or above 60%. By that time the chrysalids had killed 3 civilians and were popping around looking for more. I got overwhelmed and lost the whole squad and the country. Ironically, that run is going great now, I'm almost done with all research in the game and getting ready to activate the hyperwave decoder. After losing Egypt to that failed terror mission I never lost another country and have satellites for every single nation except Egypt, since it withdrew.

[Cikomyr]

Come on, Paradox. I know you want more money for cheap, but this dlc, it's lazy. Nothing actually new beyond a few missions and environment.

We want more in game options!

[Gamerlord]

Come on, Paradox. I know you want more money for cheap, but this dlc, it's lazy. Nothing actually new beyond a few missions and environment.

We want more in game options!

Paradox didn't develop or publish the game, Firaxis/2K games did. If Paradox was behind this game, it would have been incredibly complicated and had a tutorial that barely explains anything before throwing you to the wolves.

[Cikomyr]

Paradox didn't develop or publish the game, Firaxis/2K games did. If Paradox was behind this game, it would have been incredibly complicated and had a tutorial that barely explains anything before throwing you to the wolves.

Oops. Sorry then, I meant Firaxis.

I love both gaming companies, but you are right. Had Paradox published the game, you'd have to deal with the inflationary problems of selling alien technology on the world's economies, and trying to balance out the terror level and the economic impact of your interventions.

And France would conquer everyone.

[SlyGuyMcFly]

Unique Aliens: A single alien, with enhanced or unique abilities. When their HP reaches a certain level, they will gain a defensive boost and begin to retreat. If they manage to escape (And there is a good chance that they will), they may show up again on later missions. There are, however, special bonuses for killing or capturing them.

Love this idea. Unique weapons too, but seriously, Unique aliens would be so cool.

* Speaking of Arc Throwers - they're fine and all, but I miss the cattle prod.

I still call them Zappy Sticks. They may not look like the Zappy Sticks, but I know they are Zappy Sticks in spirit.

[Cikomyr]

Love this idea. Unique weapons too, but seriously, Unique aliens would be so cool.

Having them gain experience as you meet them would also be interesting...

But yhea. I have to say, I love the special Council missions in this game. VIP escort is all right (altough too common). The Bomb Defusal mission is nerve-wrecking, but AWESOME.

There should be more of those. How about Hostage Crisis, where aliens capture members of a Government and you have to recover them swiftly and without collateral damage?

How about a DEFENSE MISSION?!

[Reynard]

Oops. Sorry then, I meant Firaxis.

I love both gaming companies, but you are right. Had Paradox published the game, you'd have to deal with the inflationary problems of selling alien technology on the world's economies, and trying to balance out the terror level and the economic impact of your interventions.

And France would conquer everyone.

See, now i want to play this.

[Eurus]

Having them gain experience as you meet them would also be interesting...

But yhea. I have to say, I love the special Council missions in this game. VIP escort is all right (altough too common). The Bomb Defusal mission is nerve-wrecking, but AWESOME.

There should be more of those. How about Hostage Crisis, where aliens capture members of a Government and you have to recover them swiftly and without collateral damage?

How about a DEFENSE MISSION?!

Oh man, defense missions would be the most awesome thing. Digging into a fortified position, perhaps with some civilians huddled inside, and trying to protect it from the overwhelming onslaught of aliens for however many turns? I'd pay for that, if it was done well.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

Oh man, defense missions would be the most awesome thing. Digging into a fortified position, perhaps with some civilians huddled inside, and trying to protect it from the overwhelming onslaught of aliens for however many turns? I'd pay for that, if it was done well.

It would be pretty boring, though...

Overwatch, Overwatch, Overwatch, Overwatch, Overwatch, Overwatch. Turn over

Oh look, the aliens killed themselves trying to close. Hmm... fancy that.

Either that or...

Alien blows away all cover on your perimeter. Now you either have to sacrifice civilians to get behind cover or you die horribly by not being under cover.

[Reynard]

So, apparently there were a dozen Mutons and 2 Commanders just chilling out inside their small scout ship. UFO-HQ never got a clear and complete report, but the Skyranger crew says that the last radio chatter that they picked up from the squad was something to that effect, along with the sound of plasma fire and sobbing.