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    Default Speed of sound with a white dragon

    I was just randomly thinking of how to break the speed of sound somewhat simply and thought of this:

    A colossal+ paragon white dragon wearing a belt of battle with the run feat and having the spell iron body cast by itself on itself.

    It has a movement speed of 350 (700 but half from iron body). While running this becomes 1750. Straight down it's 3500. Taking an extra full round action means it moved 7000 feet in a round.

    6 seconds in a round means 7000/6 = 1166.7 feet per second. Speed of sound at sea level is 1,116.43701 foot per second. Between down and up of clumsy maneuverability is 20 feet. So the dragon can avoid splatting against the ground and thanks to iron body it shouldn't suffer any of the G-Forces involved.
    Last edited by gooddragon1; 2012-09-11 at 11:44 PM.
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    Daemon

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    This is a really horribly evil way to initiate a fight against Pcs.

    "Roll perception. Your dead."

    No one's going to survive something colossal moving 7000 feet down in one round, especially when its technically a colossal hunk of iron, essentially. Not to mention the crater it'd make.

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Duboris View Post
    This is a really horribly evil way to initiate a fight against Pcs.

    "Roll perception. Your dead."

    No one's going to survive something colossal moving 7000 feet down in one round, especially when its technically a colossal hunk of iron, essentially. Not to mention the crater it'd make.
    If the party wizard can't survive a supersonic dragon made of iron at epic levels it's his own fault really.
    Last edited by gooddragon1; 2012-09-11 at 12:54 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Woland View Post
    Honestly, some lawyer somewhere is probably having an orgasm and he doesn't know why."
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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Good Point. Seems like featherfall would be good enough to fix its initiation?

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by gooddragon1 View Post

    It has a movement speed of 350. While running this becomes 1750. Straight down it's 3500. Taking an extra full round action means it moved 7000 feet in a round.

    Sounds really awesome.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snowbluff View Post
    All gaming systems should be terribly flawed and exploitable if you want everyone to be happy with them. This allows for a wide variety of power levels for games for different levels of players.
    I dub this the Snowbluff Axiom.

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Duboris View Post
    Good Point. Seems like featherfall would be good enough to fix its initiation?
    Contingency Teleport. :D
    Last edited by gooddragon1; 2012-09-11 at 01:00 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Woland View Post
    Honestly, some lawyer somewhere is probably having an orgasm and he doesn't know why."
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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by gooddragon1 View Post
    Contingency Teleport. :D
    You have to wonder how paranoid your PCs are when "If a white dragon tries to divebomb me at supersonic speeds" becomes a specification for activating a Crafted Contingent Spell. Then you have to go home and rethink your life.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowbluff View Post
    All gaming systems should be terribly flawed and exploitable if you want everyone to be happy with them. This allows for a wide variety of power levels for games for different levels of players.
    I dub this the Snowbluff Axiom.

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Snowbluff View Post
    You have to wonder how paranoid your PCs are when "If a white dragon tries to divebomb me at supersonic speeds" becomes a specification for activating a Crafted Contingent Spell. Then you have to go home and rethink your life.
    Far more reasonable is "if anything threatens me."

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    I always liked that Dragon Magazine spell for dragons to fly in a straight line at 4 times normal speed. Think it had something to do with arrows.
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    I was going to PM you about it because I wanted to know, but then you posted it later. Elegant solution. Watch out for Necropolitans.
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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    I could have sworn there was a flaw or feat, or spell, or something that changes your mass. I would suggest taking that as well, so now he comes hurtling down like a lead dragon, rather than an iron one. Now that is an impact zone.

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Answerer View Post
    Far more reasonable is "if anything threatens me."
    ...And your wizard becomes the favorite toy of small children everywhere, as word spreads that yelling 'gonna throw mud pies at you, Wizard!' causes him to become fenced in by a glowing, impenetrable array of warding spells and/or teleported back to his dimensionally-locked private plane.

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Lapak View Post
    ...And your wizard becomes the favorite toy of small children everywhere, as word spreads that yelling 'gonna throw mud pies at you, Wizard!' causes him to become fenced in by a glowing, impenetrable array of warding spells and/or teleported back to his dimensionally-locked private plane.
    I did mean threaten in the game mechanics sense, but that may or may not be valid for contingency; the spell is hideously vague that way.

    Thrown anything doesn't threaten (ranged attacks), mud pies wouldn't threaten (not a weapon), etc.

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Answerer View Post
    I did mean threaten in the game mechanics sense, but that may or may not be valid for contingency; the spell is hideously vague that way.

    Thrown anything doesn't threaten (ranged attacks), mud pies wouldn't threaten (not a weapon), etc.
    Well now we're talking about metaphysical gaming constructs. Your wizard doesn't know what those are~!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darrin View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Snowbluff View Post
    All gaming systems should be terribly flawed and exploitable if you want everyone to be happy with them. This allows for a wide variety of power levels for games for different levels of players.
    I dub this the Snowbluff Axiom.

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Snowbluff View Post
    Well now we're talking about metaphysical gaming constructs. Your wizard doesn't know what those are~!
    Debatable, particularly in the case of AoOs where characters are basing their decisions based around the mechanical realities.

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Duboris View Post
    This is a really horribly evil way to initiate a fight against Pcs.

    "Roll perception. Your dead."

    No one's going to survive something colossal moving 7000 feet down in one round, especially when its technically a colossal hunk of iron, essentially. Not to mention the crater it'd make.
    Yeah if played intelligently most high level monster encounters should start and end that way.
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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Snowbluff View Post
    Well now we're talking about metaphysical gaming constructs. Your wizard doesn't know what those are~!
    It's sort of like how a genius in our world probably knows a fair deal of math and science. By sorting through natural phenomena, a wizard school could get a fairly good idea of how such meta constructs work.
    If you see me talking about Shaper Psions, assume that anything not poison immune within 100 feet will be dead.
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    I was going to PM you about it because I wanted to know, but then you posted it later. Elegant solution. Watch out for Necropolitans.
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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithril Leaf View Post
    It's sort of like how a genius in our world probably knows a fair deal of math and science. By sorting through natural phenomena, a wizard school could get a fairly good idea of how such meta constructs work.
    A PC Wizard is going to be rocking a 30+ Int score, max ranks in several Knowledge skills, and the ability to text message Gods on a whim. He knows. My sig happens to be relevant here.
    Quote Originally Posted by Emperor Tippy View Post
    By level 20 though, you aren't capturing a wizard. A character lives to level 20 by being the most ruthless, lucky, capable, and paranoid bastard around. A wizard is throwing around a 30+ Int score and has, entirely in character, planned contingencies for his contingencies. He may well be running around with flat out total immunity to harm, he does not walk outside without an entire bevy of defensive magics around him and enough magic items to buy himself a nation.

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Similarly, I had a character that Shapechanged into a Very Young Polychromatic Dragon with a 720ft/round fly speed. With the Run feat and his speed boosts factored in, I worked out that he could take Run actions at about the speed of a jet liner.
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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Forgive me for being ignorant, but how would 15/adamantine protect the dragon from hitting the ground at over 4,4 billion newtons?

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by gooddragon1 View Post
    If the party wizard can't survive a supersonic dragon made of iron at epic levels it's his own fault really.
    I totally want to sig this. May I please?
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    Quote Originally Posted by gooddragon1 View Post
    If the party wizard can't survive a supersonic dragon made of iron at epic levels it's his own fault really.
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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Didn't Chuck (the Ruby Knight Windicator) make it up to six times the speed of sound, or something?

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Mithril Leaf View Post
    It's sort of like how a genius in our world probably knows a fair deal of math and science. By sorting through natural phenomena, a wizard school could get a fairly good idea of how such meta constructs work.
    I'm very uncomfortable with this idea. Just because the rules are based on six second rounds, ability scores, etc. doesn't mean that it's necessarily an aspect of the physical reality of the game world. Personally, I wouldn't let this fly at my table.
    "It is the spirit of the game, not the letter of the rules, which is important. NEVER hold to the letter written, nor allow some barracks room lawyer to force quotations from the rule book upon you, IF it goes against the obvious intent of the game. As you hew the line with respect to conformity to major systems and uniformity of play in general, also be certain the game is mastered by you and not by your players..."

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Are you considering that Iron Body halfs your speed? Or you are assuming that it only affects land speed?

    Don't get me wrong, I saw this idea and tried to apply it to my druid and saw the spell and figured that my usual DM would apply that penalty to all kinds of movement speed.
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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    What is the terminal velocity of an iron dragon?
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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Teflonknight View Post
    What is the terminal velocity of an iron dragon?
    Approximately magic meters/second.
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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuulvheysoon View Post
    Didn't Chuck (the Ruby Knight Windicator) make it up to six times the speed of sound, or something?
    He did, and was ridiculous. But wasn't he broken by some errata or other?
    Quote Originally Posted by Emperor Tippy View Post
    By level 20 though, you aren't capturing a wizard. A character lives to level 20 by being the most ruthless, lucky, capable, and paranoid bastard around. A wizard is throwing around a 30+ Int score and has, entirely in character, planned contingencies for his contingencies. He may well be running around with flat out total immunity to harm, he does not walk outside without an entire bevy of defensive magics around him and enough magic items to buy himself a nation.

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Slipperychicken View Post
    He did, and was ridiculous. But wasn't he broken by some errata or other?
    IIRC, they wrote an errata to explicitly prevent Chuck... and miswrote it so that it still works. Or something silly like that.

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Answerer View Post
    IIRC, they wrote an errata to explicitly prevent Chuck... and miswrote it so that it still works. Or something silly like that.
    If you're referring to the original build, I'm pretty sure the Complete Arcane errata totally destroyed the Footsteps of the Divine trick by disallowing Persisting dischargeable spells. If not, I'd like to hear this new speed record guy.

    I don't know how to determine the volume of a Colossal+ White Dragon, but if I could I'd probably be able to calculate his ferrous terminal velocity.
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    Hmmm, I like the way you think.
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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    I could easily be misremembering.

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    Default Re: Speed of sound with a white dragon

    Quote Originally Posted by Teflonknight View Post
    What, is the terminal velocity of an iron dragon?
    Wait, Faerun or Forgotten Realms?
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    Quote Originally Posted by gooddragon1 View Post
    If the party wizard can't survive a supersonic dragon made of iron at epic levels it's his own fault really.
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