Page 5 of 49 FirstFirst 12345678910111213141530 ... LastLast
Results 121 to 150 of 1453
  1. - Top - End - #121
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Thanqol's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Canberra, Australia

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarion View Post
    I get the sense from the last time Deadly actually participated in this discussion that this is not the planned setting. I responded similarly to you and he mentioned having communities and food and entertainment and other stuff going on, so that rather than an inescapable lawless hellscape, you have an inescapable but interesting hellscape. A place where enterprising characters can take over and gain power. Perfect for a band of young mages.
    True, I may have gone a bit far from the point in the course of this. But it occurs to me that 'an inescapable lawless hellscape' isn't really different from the core cosmology of Mage's Fallen World, and the invincible doom setting element that prevents escape is called the Abyss.

    Just add five years, a dash of dystopia and set it in some overbuilt slum city and you're done.
    If you teach a man to fish, he'll still vote for the guy that gives him a fish.

  2. - Top - End - #122
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Anarion's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Washington DC
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanqol View Post
    True, I may have gone a bit far from the point in the course of this. But it occurs to me that 'an inescapable lawless hellscape' isn't really different from the core cosmology of Mage's Fallen World, and the invincible doom setting element that prevents escape is called the Abyss.
    A thought occurs to me. What if there were a city that actually formed in the middle of the abyss? And somehow, in some way, a group of mages managed to access it. How would that even work?

    Just add five years, a dash of dystopia and set it in some overbuilt slum city and you're done.
    Thanqol's Mage setting soup™
    Soul Tracer avatar by Thanqol.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    Anarion's right on the money here.
    Quotes
    Spoiler
    Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    Dulce Et Decorum Est Pro Anarion Mori?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    You just highlandered an entire city block into a glass-filled storm by road-runnering down it in your underwear.

  3. - Top - End - #123
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Thanqol's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Canberra, Australia

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarion View Post
    A thought occurs to me. What if there were a city that actually formed in the middle of the abyss? And somehow, in some way, a group of mages managed to access it. How would that even work?
    I'm going to have to leave this conversation now.
    If you teach a man to fish, he'll still vote for the guy that gives him a fish.

  4. - Top - End - #124
    Titan in the Playground
     
    SiuiS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Somewhere south of Hell
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanqol View Post
    > Characters all have amnesia
    > Characters cannot easily escape
    > City is a lawless hellscape

    I'm not seeing how I can start with any motivation other than 'escape back to reality' unless I build a character with a very specific set of motivations.

    That's fine, there could be an awesome game in escaping back to reality. If it's a Mage game, I have powers that let me teleport anywhere I've heard described and go dimension hopping out of character generation. That does not support the theme of entrapment. If these powers do not function then my character is dead weight.
    None of that I'd a given. You are reading into things, which is fine, but you are asserting your reading as some sort Of proof to my pointing out a different reading.

    The system is not supporting the setting is what I'm saying.
    The system can support the setting. It is not some point of Mage to be unable to design such a setting, only that it require explanation.



    It's not silly. You are keeping yourself trapped.
    Sophistry. Keeping yourself imprisoned is not having nothing keeping you imprisoned. While it would be nothing external, that category is already dismissed by acknowledging motivation as a factor itself.

    Doing why you did, saying you're still here, why, is what I was suggesting.

    I have powers to get me information to make meaningful decisions. If the setting, not an individual, blocks use of those powers I am unable to get meaningful information. I am therefore unable to make meaningful decisions and just have to blindly follow whatever path is not blocked by the Archmaster's magic.

    I consider that dissatisfying.
    None of that was mentioned. That's all you readin into it. There are other possible outcomes to the equation. As has been said, specifically in reference to a dissatisfying campaign, might I add; there are no bad ideas, only bad execution. You are discussing a hypothetical bad execution. I am discussing a hypothetical good execution. Getting you to willingly switch gears and say "alright, what have you got" instead of "that's dumb" is where I am struggling. I already said it would require willful cooperation. Saying it won't work without that cooperation is silly, and no real argument at all.

    > If it's an Astral Realm, Mind/Prime 1 will tell you're in an Astral Realm
    > If something happened in the past, Time 2 will tell you what happened in the past.
    > If it's a mysterious figure manipulating you, Space 2 will tell you who it is.
    > Mind 3 is telepathy.

    Mages have an immense information gathering suite. To maintain a mystery you have to find a way around that, because it's a trivial expenditure of effort for a player character to make. What stops them from doing it?
    A meta game question, when asked as a requirement to play the game. Part of the sort if asked by the characters in the game. The difference between a game that may or may not be fun, and and a straight-out bad time is willingness to try.

    That being said, I see your point. The astral realm I can maybe finagle, but it's the least adjustable. The other things listed I could prevent from being an instant-solve issue with little effort. The trouble is, why would EVERYONE be thwarted? It's too coincidental that only the mages are blocked. Still, thr required about five more seconds of effort.

    Is it a permanent solution? No. There are no such things. It just changes your Uratha detection spell from auto-win, to pointing out what you need to cast next for an auto-win. At that point, you could either say "I soved it!" and sit there smiling, or play. Knowing a thing means nothing. The game is in what you do about it.

    It's also entirely possible that a Mage could just turn left three times and walk out. But that's not really satisfying, is it?

    There is no other force that can stop a Mage examining his own history with Time 2. He has an Intimate connection to it, after all.
    This is, with certain values of stop, not true.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarion View Post
    I do not see a meaningful difference between a setting using magic and a setting that has a lot of effect of high level magic of the same type. Either the setting is arbitrarily created in a way that cancels several to all of a charcter's mechanical abilities, or it is not.
    I do not see where anything is arbitrarily canceling your magic, either.

    I will be honest, though. This is easy to grasp on a visceral level for me (and I suspect deadly) and thus the process from statement to fully realized plot is a natural, unspoken thing. For you and thanqol it is not. The frustration of seeing you two extrapolate so wildly off in a random direction feels like you're asking why a campaign in the City of Brass arbitrarily cancels your hit points. I want to sneer and say "because you're on fire." it's not a flaw in the design, it's the point of the design. You don't sign up for a campaign in the land of Fire and complain about all the burning.

    There is a city that even mages get stuck in. You are there. It stands to reason every other Mage has tried the same tricks. They are still here. There is obviously a 'why'. Saying you should have easy access to escape info is lazy. If you should, then so should everyone else. It is by its nature a place that is the exception to the rule.

    And same problem. If the thing keeping me trapped is a character or object that I can interact with, I need to be able to find it. If it's the setting itself, it's mechanically nullifying the system, and I agree with Thanqol that that is unsatisfying. And if it's a character, but they're also protected from all scrying and never reveal themselves and are hidden far away and you can't teleport to them etc. etc. then that's not a character, it's a plot fiat.
    This all hinges on there being a nullification of your power.
    All I've said is it would be a more than two step process, and you would have to feed info gained from the first casting back into another. I have been met with cries of nullification. It is puzzling.


    Quote Originally Posted by Winterfate View Post
    Devils! Stop binding SiuiS' pony!

  5. - Top - End - #125
    Titan in the Playground
     
    SiuiS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Somewhere south of Hell
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    It should be noted that rather than argue for anything, I'm merely tryin. To undo misconceptions enough to get you back to square one. I would hate to be the reason Deadly doesn't get to try something.


    Quote Originally Posted by Winterfate View Post
    Devils! Stop binding SiuiS' pony!

  6. - Top - End - #126
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Thanqol's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Canberra, Australia

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by SiuiS View Post
    It should be noted that rather than argue for anything, I'm merely tryin. To undo misconceptions enough to get you back to square one. I would hate to be the reason Deadly doesn't get to try something.
    This is a good point but arguing theory is kind of what I do. I phase from specifics into generalisations very easily, often with the motive that a resolved argument leaves both sides with a stronger position and a more comprehensive understanding. Sometimes this habit gets silly.
    If you teach a man to fish, he'll still vote for the guy that gives him a fish.

  7. - Top - End - #127
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Deadly's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    The Wasteland
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Huh, I didn't expect to start such a massive debate over this

    I'm in a bit of a hurry since I have an appointment with the dentist a bit later, but let's see what I can add ...

    Consider what I said originally, that what all the mages there have in common is that they were just Awakened, in that very instant when they appeared in the city. They woke up from their spirit journey in this place. For all they can tell, they really do have no past, they were never born, never had any parents, never had any experiences before, and there is nowhere to go but here. They were always mages, from the moment they came into existence in this place. Maybe, from the outside, these are mages who failed their awakening somehow.

    Perhaps (probably?) the Abyss is involved in some way, maybe this is the Abyss. Or perhaps the bleak view is absolutely true, that this is all that exists and there is no "why". That would make escape as such impossible, and perhaps the whole purpose of the game is to rather create something instead. Perhaps you can only escape by creating a new world for yourself, or maybe lucking out and locating the world of someone who did so before you.

    Or, who knows, maybe you resign yourself to this fate and work to change the world you happen to live in, trying to make it a better place. That's another kind of creating rather than escaping, a more practical approach perhaps. As Anarion said, there's lots an lots of opportunity in such a place for the enterprising mage. It's ripe with opportunity.

    Sure, it's a very different kind of Mage game, but I think it has potential to work. It just needs players who are willing to accept the premise that there is no (obvious or easy) escape and the whole standard cosmology may be gone out the window and should not be relied upon.

    However, I will say that I think I massively underestimated how much thought such a game probably needs, so my earlier statement that it could be set up in no time is probably way optimistic If nothing else, you've all given me a lot of good points to ponder


    ***


    On the topic of Setting vs Characters, as has been pointed out the two are really interdependent. A setting without characters is like the moon, the real moon where nothing lives. There are not many stories you can tell on the moon unless you put something else up there. That's not much of a setting, so you won't have a good setting without characters.

    Likewise, a character without a setting is ... a mind drifting in empty space. Not many stories you can tell there either. Thus, you won't have a good character without putting them in some setting or another.

    Sure, you can have a good character who is more or less independent of setting, one you can put in any setting, but you have to put that character in some setting before you can have a story to tell.

    You won't have a story without a setting, and focusing solely on characters may or may not give you a good setting in the process, but it also may just give you a bunch of characters doing some stuff in what might as well have been empty space for all the reader cares. And that's not how you get a great story.

    deviantArt | FiMFiction | Twitter | Skype : athecoon
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel Fedora View Post
    Deadly, a delightfully daring drawer and drafter of dissertations. Defying the dictations of our disparate denizens, Deadly decides his direction with a dirth of dependence on the decisions of despotic desperados. Deadly detests dismissive derision, and will debate any dude or dame that dares to detest discussion.

  8. - Top - End - #128
    Titan in the Playground
     
    SiuiS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Somewhere south of Hell
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanqol View Post
    This is a good point but arguing theory is kind of what I do. I phase from specifics into generalisations very easily, often with the motive that a resolved argument leaves both sides with a stronger position and a more comprehensive understanding. Sometimes this habit gets silly.
    Aye. Myself as well, though I'm nowhere near as good at it. This entire exercise would have been me bloodily banging my head into a wall, were it not for Tiki and engaging me in a debate I began to lose for interpreting things. I have a hard time letting go of an argument, but an easy time admitting to misunderstandings. Strange really.


    Quote Originally Posted by Winterfate View Post
    Devils! Stop binding SiuiS' pony!

  9. - Top - End - #129
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Thanqol's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Canberra, Australia

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadly View Post
    Huh, I didn't expect to start such a massive debate over this
    Like I said, 'swhat I do.

    Consider what I said originally, that what all the mages there have in common is that they were just Awakened, in that very instant when they appeared in the city. They woke up from their spirit journey in this place. For all they can tell, they really do have no past, they were never born, never had any parents, never had any experiences before, and there is nowhere to go but here. They were always mages, from the moment they came into existence in this place. Maybe, from the outside, these are mages who failed their awakening somehow.

    Perhaps (probably?) the Abyss is involved in some way, maybe this is the Abyss. Or perhaps the bleak view is absolutely true, that this is all that exists and there is no "why". That would make escape as such impossible, and perhaps the whole purpose of the game is to rather create something instead. Perhaps you can only escape by creating a new world for yourself, or maybe lucking out and locating the world of someone who did so before you.

    Or, who knows, maybe you resign yourself to this fate and work to change the world you happen to live in, trying to make it a better place. That's another kind of creating rather than escaping, a more practical approach perhaps. As Anarion said, there's lots an lots of opportunity in such a place for the enterprising mage. It's ripe with opportunity.

    Sure, it's a very different kind of Mage game, but I think it has potential to work. It just needs players who are willing to accept the premise that there is no (obvious or easy) escape and the whole standard cosmology may be gone out the window and should not be relied upon.
    I am unable to discuss this in detail for reasons. I would just like to say that I am inherently very, very leery about amnesia as a plot device in general and as a plot device for the entire party in particular. The reason it's a thing is predominately for lazy video game writing so they can justify a tutorial segment. In practise with writing and gaming, it involves a lot of running, a lot of screaming, a lot of bad decisions and a lot of bitterness.

    Moreover, I don't consider it to be especially interesting as a thing. I have enormous fun thinking through my characters and their life stories and the decisions that got them to that point. I like thinking about their friends and family and childhood enemies. I like thinking about their Awakenings and that fundamental decision and shattering of perception and what that means for them and their soul. Without that I don't have an internally consistent decision making framework, no personal points of reference, goals or ambitions, no petty jealousies or minor personality notes. It's like roleplaying an infant. I actually don't think I have any interest whatsoever in playing under conditions of amnesia to the point where I might actually wind up passing on that game.

    I especially dislike amnesia's interactions with skills, where someone 'discovers' they good at lying for some reason without knowing why or how. Leads to a lot of internally stupid introspection.

    I'm getting a kind of Planescape vibe to it, and that's cool, but it's kind of not the reason I'm interested in Mage if that makes sense? I really like Mage's interaction with the normal world, and I like the idea of ordinary people opened up to the expansive possibility of magic.

    However, I will say that I think I massively underestimated how much thought such a game probably needs, so my earlier statement that it could be set up in no time is probably way optimistic If nothing else, you've all given me a lot of good points to ponder
    There's some points in that pitch that echo themes of this game. A city fallen to the Abyss, characters with a mysterious connection to each other, etc. I'm not doing the same thing but there's some interesting stuff to consider about why I've done it this way.
    If you teach a man to fish, he'll still vote for the guy that gives him a fish.

  10. - Top - End - #130
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Deadly's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    The Wasteland
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanqol View Post
    I am unable to discuss this in detail for reasons. I would just like to say that I am inherently very, very leery about amnesia as a plot device in general and as a plot device for the entire party in particular. The reason it's a thing is predominately for lazy video game writing so they can justify a tutorial segment. In practise with writing and gaming, it involves a lot of running, a lot of screaming, a lot of bad decisions and a lot of bitterness.

    Moreover, I don't consider it to be especially interesting as a thing. I have enormous fun thinking through my characters and their life stories and the decisions that got them to that point. I like thinking about their friends and family and childhood enemies. I like thinking about their Awakenings and that fundamental decision and shattering of perception and what that means for them and their soul. Without that I don't have an internally consistent decision making framework, no personal points of reference, goals or ambitions, no petty jealousies or minor personality notes. It's like roleplaying an infant. I actually don't think I have any interest whatsoever in playing under conditions of amnesia to the point where I might actually wind up passing on that game.

    I especially dislike amnesia's interactions with skills, where someone 'discovers' they good at lying for some reason without knowing why or how. Leads to a lot of internally stupid introspection.

    I'm getting a kind of Planescape vibe to it, and that's cool, but it's kind of not the reason I'm interested in Mage if that makes sense? I really like Mage's interaction with the normal world, and I like the idea of ordinary people opened up to the expansive possibility of magic.
    's cool if you decide it's not a game for you, although I'll do my best to make it sound interesting anyway

    I'm wary about amnesia in general too, but not so much that I'll never ever consider it. I'm not opposed to clichιs by default.

    I can absolutely see your point about playing a character with no past at all. That's why I pictured it more as a broken character than a totally blank character. They have personalities and memories, skills and flaws and everything. Not full memories, or wrong memories, or maybe too many memories, more than one person could possibly have. There are options beyond total amnesia.

    You should absolutely be able to define some sort of past, even if it turns out in the end that it was all a fabrication it still defines your character within this setting.

    As for me, I've always liked fantasy and coming up with stuff completely different from the real world. Until you introduced me to WoD I had never imagined I'd ever bother with a game about the real world (even if it has supernatural and fantastical elements.) I've learned to see the fun in such a setting, but I suppose that preference still influences how I look at and think about WoD.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanqol View Post
    There's some points in that pitch that echo themes of this game. A city fallen to the Abyss, characters with a mysterious connection to each other, etc. I'm not doing the same thing but there's some interesting stuff to consider about why I've done it this way.
    Glad to provide food for thought

    deviantArt | FiMFiction | Twitter | Skype : athecoon
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel Fedora View Post
    Deadly, a delightfully daring drawer and drafter of dissertations. Defying the dictations of our disparate denizens, Deadly decides his direction with a dirth of dependence on the decisions of despotic desperados. Deadly detests dismissive derision, and will debate any dude or dame that dares to detest discussion.

  11. - Top - End - #131
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Anarion's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Washington DC
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    If Deadly's setting is intended, via abyssal interference or otherwise, to be the only world the characters know, ever, then it might actually be better to start out more experienced (whether that's reflected in starting the characters with mechanical xp is irrelevant). Being a stranger in a strange land with literally no memories or experiences is going to result in a very slow game. Take my word for it, I started Gathering of Mists with the characters literally tumbling out of the Hedge with no idea about how anything related to changelings actually worked and I think it too a couple months of real time to get everything going. Heck, they still haven't gotten a couple of their fake ID merits as actual in-world things and those have been sitting on character sheets for months now.

    Whereas, if the characters start in this crazy city with a community, knowing several different people, some friends, some foes, and with a sense of different organizations, people, and places, then the characters also come with motivations, plot hooks, and ideas about what is good and what is bad for their home.
    Soul Tracer avatar by Thanqol.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    Anarion's right on the money here.
    Quotes
    Spoiler
    Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    Dulce Et Decorum Est Pro Anarion Mori?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    You just highlandered an entire city block into a glass-filled storm by road-runnering down it in your underwear.

  12. - Top - End - #132
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Deadly's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    The Wasteland
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarion View Post
    If Deadly's setting is intended, via abyssal interference or otherwise, to be the only world the characters know, ever, then it might actually be better to start out more experienced (whether that's reflected in starting the characters with mechanical xp is irrelevant). Being a stranger in a strange land with literally no memories or experiences is going to result in a very slow game. Take my word for it, I started Gathering of Mists with the characters literally tumbling out of the Hedge with no idea about how anything related to changelings actually worked and I think it too a couple months of real time to get everything going. Heck, they still haven't gotten a couple of their fake ID merits as actual in-world things and those have been sitting on character sheets for months now.

    Whereas, if the characters start in this crazy city with a community, knowing several different people, some friends, some foes, and with a sense of different organizations, people, and places, then the characters also come with motivations, plot hooks, and ideas about what is good and what is bad for their home.
    It depends on the players and ST, what they want out of the game, I think. What you describe sounds just like Waiting for Rain, Thanqol's other game, where we also started out right out of the Hedge and still haven't gotten beyond the first two days IC even after ... more than half a year of play, I think.

    And yet I think it's been a great game, I've really enjoyed even the times when we just played ping pong. Can't obviously speak for everyone else, but I like to think something like that can be very enjoyable for the right players. I know I love the way the characters find their place in the world during play, rather than doing so before play.

    deviantArt | FiMFiction | Twitter | Skype : athecoon
    Quote Originally Posted by Colonel Fedora View Post
    Deadly, a delightfully daring drawer and drafter of dissertations. Defying the dictations of our disparate denizens, Deadly decides his direction with a dirth of dependence on the decisions of despotic desperados. Deadly detests dismissive derision, and will debate any dude or dame that dares to detest discussion.

  13. - Top - End - #133
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Tiki Snakes's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Crystal Wasteland

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    I've not really got a horse Pony in the debate here, but it did bring to mind a couple of questions, especially relating to the ease of which a mage could escape such a setting and some related things.

    So, the first one and probably a simple answer (nothing), but what happens when a mage tries to open a portal/teleport/etc to a place that doesn't exist. Say, Narnia, Gotham City or Cabbot Cove or something?

    Second related issue; If escaping, say, an Astral Plane is so easy, (You'll roll enough successes eventually), what is the difference between that and getting to where the exarch's go? I'm guessing it's not as simple as just physically getting there or something?

    Third Question; Powerful magic can, I think, make it so that not only is something a certain way, but it always was. How many Archmages would it take to turn the fallen world into the setting that Deadly described and make it so that it always was that way? Would it even take an Archmage?

    Anyway, as to the actual issues raised in discussing the setting, I had some thoughts too.
    I think Thanqol is right on the issue of the obvious reaction to the setting. It's not a lovely place to be, so the first and most rational reaction is to escape it. Some people may, depending on how easy that is, append the secondary goal of helping everyone else escape it or tearing the whole thing down/swear vengeance on the person who trapped them, etc.
    I'm not sure this is a problem, though, as long as there are legitimate reasons built in that mean that it isn't as simple as "single ritual ends the game".

    I'm sure there are plenty of ways you could engineer such a setup. I guess the central quirk of Mage is that you shouldn't expect any of the involved factors to remain secret indefinately. They could come out into the open at any time, and arguably should. But then, that just means that they should be interesting problems/issues for the players to deal with, rather than simply justifications for maintaining the status quo. Like Exalted, it is my personal suspicion that if a mage game doesn't end with the status quo at least a little bit in flames, something has gone dreadfully wrong.

    It should be expected for the protagonists of a setting like Deadly's to wrest the secrets of why everything is happening and who is doing it from the universe pretty soon. Dealing with that should occupy most of the campaign, but maybe not even the whole thing. What comes after their success or horrible failure could even take up a significant portion of time (depending on the actual nature of the problems, secrets, and state of reality after the middle bit is resolved).

    I would suggest that, as Thanqol mentions, real world people are a core element of mage. It would feel more Mage without the amnesia. Perhaps instead simply they remember their normal life up until awakening, and then they were here. Nothing inbetween, but all present and accounted for. Perhaps the sleepers (or equivalents depending on how far out of shape you bend the cosmology) differ in that they don't remember ever having been anywhere else, and don't see life in the city as anything other than the norm, (even if perhaps, the awakened sometimes remember them from before).

    (the fun mind-screw is that there is no guarentee the awakened are the ones who remember the truth in that kind of setup).

    Without that real-world-people element, there are possibly games better suited to the concept.

    Other things it's reminded me of since I last posted; Gormenghast, Perdido Street Station.

  14. - Top - End - #134
    Troll in the Playground
     
    the_druid_droid's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    In a cornfield
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanqol View Post
    I'm going to have to leave this conversation now.
    Why does this make me nervous?

    >.>

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    Second related issue; If escaping, say, an Astral Plane is so easy, (You'll roll enough successes eventually), what is the difference between that and getting to where the exarch's go? I'm guessing it's not as simple as just physically getting there or something?
    My Guardian senses are telling me that the answer is "The Abyss". Of course, they like to offer that up as the answer to everything vaguely bad.
    Last edited by the_druid_droid; 2012-10-02 at 05:45 PM.
    This Machine Surrounds Hate And Forces It To Surrender

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarion View Post
    DD, your unicorn is stronger, prettier, and higher-ranking than mine, and her secret lab has a better name than mine. THERE SHALL BE NO QUARTER.
    Ponythread Learns to Draw!

    Avatar by Aruius

    Spoiler
    Show
    Bleeeeh! Alfalfa Monster!

  15. - Top - End - #135
    Titan in the Playground
     
    SiuiS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Somewhere south of Hell
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Gathering of Mists suffers from the only playes who know enough about society being the most likely to take their time dealing with minutia of their situation. Charlotte intends to start painting soon, even if she ends up spewing condiments all over Swifthoof's table in the middle of the night.

    On the labyrinths, I think the best way to put it is that if escape is not the best option it's fine, but if escape is impossible - not hard, mind, but actually not allowed to happen - then I think it shifts from interesting to not a good Mage idea.

    On merits in general, it's finally clicked. Buying a bunch of one or two dot merits from the get go is a waste of time, and one should get all the big expensive things they aren't sure they will ever afford, first. Took me, what, a year Thanqol? Almost two?
    Well, no. A year exactly. We started in november.


    Quote Originally Posted by Winterfate View Post
    Devils! Stop binding SiuiS' pony!

  16. - Top - End - #136
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Anarion's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Washington DC
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by SiuiS View Post
    On merits in general, it's finally clicked. Buying a bunch of one or two dot merits from the get go is a waste of time, and one should get all the big expensive things they aren't sure they will ever afford, first. Took me, what, a year Thanqol? Almost two?
    Well, no. A year exactly. We started in november.
    But, I told you that during character creation.
    Soul Tracer avatar by Thanqol.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    Anarion's right on the money here.
    Quotes
    Spoiler
    Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    Dulce Et Decorum Est Pro Anarion Mori?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    You just highlandered an entire city block into a glass-filled storm by road-runnering down it in your underwear.

  17. - Top - End - #137
    Titan in the Playground
     
    SiuiS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Somewhere south of Hell
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarion View Post
    But, I told you that during character creation.
    You did, but hearing a thing, and feeling it's significance are entirely different. I am a creature of impulse. Until it sinks in to the instinctive level, it is just one of many potentialities. A thing one knows in the marrow is true, no matter how factually unverifiable it is.
    Last edited by SiuiS; 2012-10-02 at 07:48 PM.


    Quote Originally Posted by Winterfate View Post
    Devils! Stop binding SiuiS' pony!

  18. - Top - End - #138
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Thanqol's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Canberra, Australia

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadly View Post
    's cool if you decide it's not a game for you, although I'll do my best to make it sound interesting anyway

    I'm wary about amnesia in general too, but not so much that I'll never ever consider it. I'm not opposed to clichιs by default.

    I can absolutely see your point about playing a character with no past at all. That's why I pictured it more as a broken character than a totally blank character. They have personalities and memories, skills and flaws and everything. Not full memories, or wrong memories, or maybe too many memories, more than one person could possibly have. There are options beyond total amnesia.

    You should absolutely be able to define some sort of past, even if it turns out in the end that it was all a fabrication it still defines your character within this setting.
    Right, this all sounds really interesting for a Changeling game, where all of this stuff you just said is supported by the game's core themes. My mind just does not cognitively associate it with Mage in any sense. It doesn't feel like a Mage game in the slightest to me. My personal interest is correspondingly low.

    As for me, I've always liked fantasy and coming up with stuff completely different from the real world. Until you introduced me to WoD I had never imagined I'd ever bother with a game about the real world (even if it has supernatural and fantastical elements.) I've learned to see the fun in such a setting, but I suppose that preference still influences how I look at and think about WoD.
    I am far more ambivalent/negative towards the same thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarion View Post
    If Deadly's setting is intended, via abyssal interference or otherwise, to be the only world the characters know, ever, then it might actually be better to start out more experienced (whether that's reflected in starting the characters with mechanical xp is irrelevant). Being a stranger in a strange land with literally no memories or experiences is going to result in a very slow game. Take my word for it, I started Gathering of Mists with the characters literally tumbling out of the Hedge with no idea about how anything related to changelings actually worked and I think it too a couple months of real time to get everything going. Heck, they still haven't gotten a couple of their fake ID merits as actual in-world things and those have been sitting on character sheets for months now.

    Whereas, if the characters start in this crazy city with a community, knowing several different people, some friends, some foes, and with a sense of different organizations, people, and places, then the characters also come with motivations, plot hooks, and ideas about what is good and what is bad for their home.
    ^ Word. Like I said, a game starting without social connections and a base involves a lot of running, screaming, bad decisions and bitterness.

    Which is fine so long as that's what you want.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    I've not really got a horse Pony in the debate here, but it did bring to mind a couple of questions, especially relating to the ease of which a mage could escape such a setting and some related things.

    So, the first one and probably a simple answer (nothing), but what happens when a mage tries to open a portal/teleport/etc to a place that doesn't exist. Say, Narnia, Gotham City or Cabbot Cove or something?
    #404 Wrong Dimension Error. Please relocate to the Astral Realm and try again.

    You can find all those places in the Astral, but Space doesn't let you cross dimensional barriers like that - without Mind 4.

    EDIT: Alternately, depends what you use as a focus. You use a copy of The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe and the portal might take you to the author or the place where it was published. It doesn't have a sympathetic connection to Narnia.

    Second related issue; If escaping, say, an Astral Plane is so easy, (You'll roll enough successes eventually), what is the difference between that and getting to where the exarch's go? I'm guessing it's not as simple as just physically getting there or something?
    This is all in the Astral Realms book. Back in the day, any old dude could meditate, enter the Astral, brave their way through the Tenebros and right on down to the very border of their soul, and walk all the way into the Supernal. This Awakened them as a Mage. They couldn't stay there permanently, that was a quirk of the Silver Ladder transporting the Exarchs there in mind, body and soul.

    Nowadays when people do that there's a massive Abyss metaphor cutting them off; an ocean, a valley, whatever. Perhaps the Supernal is visible on the other side but no one's successfully crossed it.

    As to what 'getting there' means, it's a matter for debate if the Supernal realms exist within your own soul or if they are a parallel dimension or a state of mind or whatever.

    Third Question; Powerful magic can, I think, make it so that not only is something a certain way, but it always was. How many Archmages would it take to turn the fallen world into the setting that Deadly described and make it so that it always was that way? Would it even take an Archmage?
    One. And yes, it would take an Archmage.

    One Archmage can literally do anything. Aaaaaanything. The 10th Practise, Assumption, is "If there's anything which is theoretically not contained within the earlier Practises you can do it with this one. Also you can make one reality defining change for every round in which this spell is active".

    Corollary to this is that the other Archmages can retcon what you have just done and most have a vested interest in not having the world be an industrial city hellscape. If they get into a fight over this, then reality suffers an earthquake, eventually the Archmasters fight, and there's a whole lot of collateral damage and no one is happy. So Archmasters all agree to the Pax Arcanum which is basically "Don't do that". By the Pax you're not allowed to mess with anything another Archmaster is doing because otherwise reality war.

    It's the ST's discretion as to how many Archmasters there are and what they want, though there's generally about 20-50 max.

    If an Archmaster wants to create a pocket dimension with this city and play around with it, heck, good luck to him.

    I'm sure there are plenty of ways you could engineer such a setup. I guess the central quirk of Mage is that you shouldn't expect any of the involved factors to remain secret indefinately. They could come out into the open at any time, and arguably should. But then, that just means that they should be interesting problems/issues for the players to deal with, rather than simply justifications for maintaining the status quo. Like Exalted, it is my personal suspicion that if a mage game doesn't end with the status quo at least a little bit in flames, something has gone dreadfully wrong.
    Status Quo is a Seer objective. If you haven't shaken that up then you have in a very real sense lost the game.
    Last edited by Thanqol; 2012-10-02 at 09:49 PM.
    If you teach a man to fish, he'll still vote for the guy that gives him a fish.

  19. - Top - End - #139
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Anarion's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Washington DC
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Randomness. Was listening to Fate/Stay night music. Read the first comment in uploader comments on this YouTube video. Made me think of Kurosawa. (NSFW btw)
    Last edited by Anarion; 2012-10-02 at 10:37 PM.
    Soul Tracer avatar by Thanqol.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    Anarion's right on the money here.
    Quotes
    Spoiler
    Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    Dulce Et Decorum Est Pro Anarion Mori?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    You just highlandered an entire city block into a glass-filled storm by road-runnering down it in your underwear.

  20. - Top - End - #140
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Thanqol's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Canberra, Australia

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    So over the past few days of NO FORUM ACCESS, I wandered The Internet and the path of my own soul. I'll share my thoughts with you now, based on where I found them.

    Legacy: I've been reading an 800 page biography of Hitler and the rise of National Socialism in Germany - y'know, as you do - alongside Mage Noir, which arrived recently in hardcopy. Combined with recent thought movements towards the Fallout/Fallout Equestria, it all came together into a single word: "Legacy". There are some acts that inflict their ramifications on generations to come, people who will pick up fallen concepts and declare themselves heirs and bearers of those once-great ideas. The most fascinating part of the post apocalyptic future is what becomes of those ideas - who picks them up and how they mutate and evolve.

    It's a personal, sweeping, dark and industrial thought, like an obsolete factory. If I had the time I'd make another game out of it.

    "If some day the taming talisman, the cross, should crumble, the savagery of the old warriors will again burst forth, that insensate berserk rage about which the Nordic poets sing and say so much. The talisman is rotting and some day it shall lamentably crumble. The old gods will rise from the ancient ruins and rub the millennial dust from their eyes. Thor with his giant hammer will spring aloft and shatter the Gothic cathedrals. When you hear that stamping and clashing, take care."

    - Heine

    Lives Unlived: I picked up WoD Mirrors on a whim, and it turned out to be a reasonably good choice. It's a frank, direct and clear talk by the key WoD writers about everything about the system and why it is that way. It's a book of house rules and alternatives and the refreshing honesty of writers who can say whatever they want.

    There was one section, though, in the end, by Malcom Lea Shepperd who I never really understood before I read that essay. He said this:

    My friend Jenny once said something that I now
    carry with me into every game and writing project. I’ve
    never gamed with her, but when we drank into the
    second and third pint at our local bar’s big, graffiti-laden
    back table, she told me she played. She talked about
    surviving the winter in a game, trekking across a blasted
    post-apocalyptic landscape, where the weather mixed
    snow, nuclear ash, and traceries of magical energy.
    She said, “I have all of these real memories that
    never happened to me.”
    I instantly knew that this is why I was roleplaying,
    and that this makes the form so fantastic. I’m tempted
    to say, “That’s what makes it an art,” but people give
    that word a privileged context, and **** that. Lots of
    things are art. Most things are bad art.

    [...]

    Those emotions represent the last sign of authenticity
    I have space to talk about: that it happens to you.
    Yeah, we’re supposed to remind you that You Are Not
    Your Character to save you from moral panic and the
    delusion prone, but to level with you for a second, you
    really are your character. He has no reality outside of
    you; his emotions are yours.
    Once you recognize this fact, you can harness it
    to great effect by identifying the emotions you hope to
    express through the character and recalling situations
    from your own experience where you felt that way. This
    is one of the classic forms of method acting, and starting
    with Stanislavsky’s An Actor Prepares, you’ll find dozens
    of resources to draw from to understand it — but the
    best resource is your own life.
    This truth works for Storytellers, too. Once you
    really get to know your players you can draw upon
    themes, motifs, and situations that not only fit your
    chronicle, but provoke an emotional response from the
    players, not just their characters. This is a powerful, dangerous
    technique. It can create incredibly vivid scenes,
    but it risks offending the players. The best way to go
    about it is to discuss this ahead of time. Ask everyone
    in the group to draw on ideas they want to explore that
    they know would create that kind of stimulus, but in a
    more tightly knit group (such as mine, which has been
    together in some form for about 13 years) you might be
    able to do it spontaneously.
    He's right. My head is filled with lives I've never lived, people who never were, things that are so much bigger and brighter than anything I've ever touched. I can see that field in the rain where the brown haired girl counts the raindrops. I can taste the bitter hate of the thief in the gibbet, shouting at the carrion crow with the last of his strength. I walk cautiously lest I cut another with the blades on my arms. These scenes and memories are amongst the most powerful I possess.

    The People:

    I've met some interesting ideas over the last few days.

    One is this: An alternate character gen setup. It's a great idea because it allows everyone to optimise perfectly without having to optimise unnecessarily.

    Spoiler
    Show
    XP-Based Character Generation for World of Darkness

    The XP values here are derived from the equivalent value of the highest XP allotment of dots at character generation. Unused XP from each category is saved and may later be spent in conjunction with XP earned during the game to increase the relevant category (or may be totalled and spent freely, at Storyteller discretion). Unlike in standard character creation, the cost of the fifth dot is not increased.


    Begin with one dot in each Attribute (this is in addition to the XP listed below):

    70 XP for primary Attributes.
    (•••• 45 + ••• 25)
    55 XP for secondary Attributes.
    (•••• 45 + •• 10)
    45 XP for tertiary Attributes.
    (•••• 45)

    Begin with no dots in any Skills:

    78 XP for primary Skills.
    (•••• 30 + •••• 30 + ••• 18)
    48 XP for secondary Skills.
    (•••• 30 + ••• 18)
    30 XP for tertiary Skills.
    (•••• 30)

    9 XP for 3 Skill Specialities.
    (Flat cost of 3*3)

    Begin with one dot in an appropriate Supernatural Ability (this is in addition to the XP listed below):

    42 XP for Merits and increasing Supernatural Ability (Wyrd, Psyche, Gnosis, Azoth, Blood Potency or Primal Urge).
    (Supernatural Ability ••• 40 + Merit • 2)

    Templates and XP

    Changeling
    3 XP for a Skill Speciality in Athletics, Brawl or Stealth.
    (Flat cost of 3)
    2 XP for one dot in the Mantle appropriate to the character's Court.
    (Mantle • 2)
    48 XP on Contracts, at least 8 XP of which must be spent on Affinity Contracts.
    (Affinity •• 12 + Non-Affinity ••• 36)

    Geist
    36 XP on any Manifestations.
    (Manifestation ••• 36)
    20 XP on two Keys, one of which must correspond to the Keys available to your Threshold.
    (Flat cost of 10*2)

    Mage
    25 XP to increase Favoured Resistance Attribute.
    (Attribute •••••)
    72 XP divided among three or four Arcana, two of which must be Ruling Arcana, with no single Arcanum higher than three dots.
    (Ruling • 6 + Ruling •• 18 + Inferior ••• 48)
    12 XP for Rotes, none of which may be higher than their associated Arcanum.
    (Flat cost of 2*6)

    Promethean
    22 XP on Transmutations, at least 5 XP of which must be spent on Affinity Transmutations.
    (Affinity Transmutation • 5 + Non-Affinity Transmutation •• 17)

    Vampire
    25 XP to increase Favoured Attribute.
    (Attribute •••••)
    30 XP, at least 10 XP of which must be spent on Clan Disciplines.
    (Clan Discipline ••• 30)

    Werewolf
    36 XP divided among Renown, with at least one dot in each of your Primary Renown types.
    (Primary Renown ••• 36, such as when Auspice and Tribe share Primary Renown)
    51 XP divided among Gifts, with at least one gift from a list associated with Auspice, one gift from a list associated with Tribe, and no gift worth more dots than highest Primary Renown.
    (Auspice ••• 15 + Tribe ••• 15 + Other ••• 21)


    And some quotes:

    Quote Originally Posted by Error 404
    Mage:The Universe Is ****ed And So Are You. That **** You Imagined On Acid?
    It's Real, And It's Going To Kill You, Everything You've Ever Known,
    Everything You'll Never Know, And Then The Universe is Going To Kill Itself While
    You're Screaming Inside Of It II: Electric Boogaloo
    Quote Originally Posted by Benagain
    Obrimos Merit: Played by Error 404

    You're a self-righteous prick with a penchant for solving all problems with fire and lasers. Your confidence in your own abilities and the rightness of your cause gives you a +1 to any roll made as a result of one of your snap judgements about good and evil.
    [supernatural creatures] think they [possess trait], but no one is more [trait] than Mages.
    Nobody can have a sympathetic connection to your mom.

    She counts as a public place.

    Arcana Symbols - surprisingly awesome.

    That was what I did over my summer break.
    Last edited by Thanqol; 2012-10-06 at 06:34 AM.
    If you teach a man to fish, he'll still vote for the guy that gives him a fish.

  21. - Top - End - #141
    Titan in the Playground
     
    SiuiS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Somewhere south of Hell
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Some of these things are so obvious to me I have to blink in frank disconnect at your only now finding them. Some are alien enough i can't grasp them. Others are normal comunicative bits.

    If you guys want real, useful insight, I would say stalk Thanqol on RPG.net. That's where the real fun is. Build and employ sympathetic connections to your ST!


    Quote Originally Posted by Winterfate View Post
    Devils! Stop binding SiuiS' pony!

  22. - Top - End - #142
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Thanqol's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Canberra, Australia

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by SiuiS View Post
    Some of these things are so obvious to me I have to blink in frank disconnect at your only now finding them. Some are alien enough i can't grasp them. Others are normal comunicative bits.
    None of them are new ideas, they're newly articulated ideas.

    If you guys want real, useful insight, I would say stalk Thanqol on RPG.net. That's where the real fun is. Build and employ sympathetic connections to your ST!
    I tend to lurk way more than I post on RPGnet and other forums in general.
    If you teach a man to fish, he'll still vote for the guy that gives him a fish.

  23. - Top - End - #143
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Anarion's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Washington DC
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Thanqol raises some profound points. One that really struck home with me is the fact that I can remember the names and history of almost every character in every RPG I've been in. Whereas I could not name you all 80 people who were in my section in the first year of law school (section meaning that for one year, we took all our classes together 5 days a week).

    That's kinda scary and probably speaks to how weird human interaction has become these days.


    In other news, I'm probably going to make Thanqol pretty happy. One of the things that I did during the no forum crazy time, is I spent considerable time creating the germ of a Mage game, and bought a journal to start taking some notes on the off chance statistical certainty that I actually run it. As a teaser, it would be set in Hong Kong and Macau, and I was thinking that Mammon would be the most powerful ministry there, with the Pentacle mages mostly being in hiding, but with a lot of mages all arriving at the city in force for...reasons...at the start of the game.
    Soul Tracer avatar by Thanqol.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    Anarion's right on the money here.
    Quotes
    Spoiler
    Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    Dulce Et Decorum Est Pro Anarion Mori?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    You just highlandered an entire city block into a glass-filled storm by road-runnering down it in your underwear.

  24. - Top - End - #144
    Titan in the Playground
     
    SiuiS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Somewhere south of Hell
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanqol View Post
    None of them are new ideas, they're newly articulated ideas.
    I don't know, mate. Ever since finding out you spurned classic literature for being stuffy, u don't make assumptions like that anymore. You're a barrel of surprises with a fancy hat and a vocal tuner nailed on, animated by the shadows of a dozen famous US presidents.

    I tend to lurk way more than I post on RPGnet and other forums in general.
    This makes your posts all the more interesting. It means you feel strongly enough abou something to deviate from that norm.

    Like that kaiuu guy. He suggests broad, sweeping changes to the system for no real thematic reason. You say that isn't necessary, what he wants is already right there. And then his response is he's tired of that Bad Guys win because Grimdark bull. That was a good look into a lot of things, from graceful handling of idiocy to Rarity's theorem on the effects of presentation on the reception of the final product.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarion View Post
    Thanqol raises some profound points. One that really struck home with me is the fact that I can remember the names and history of almost every character in every RPG I've been in. Whereas I could not name you all 80 people who were in my section in the first year of law school (section meaning that for one year, we took all our classes together 5 days a week).

    That's kinda scary and probably speaks to how weird human interaction has become these days.
    Social interaction kind of doesn't exist. People are afraid of their neighbors, afraid of their neighborhood and afraid of the embarrassment of putting themselves out there and being rebuffed. As you age, you lose chances to make friends, and many is the adult I know who works so well because they have nothing to live for except work. People in the past were able to maintain relationships through postal correspondence, visitations, and stories. We have the Internet, and a social pressure dictating the Internet is an inferior method of correspondence.

    The next generation is screwed, but that means the one after will look that much brighter by comparison.

    In other news, I'm probably going to make Thanqol pretty happy. One of the things that I did during the no forum crazy time, is I spent considerable time creating the germ of a Mage game, and bought a journal to start taking some notes on the off chance statistical certainty that I actually run it. As a teaser, it would be set in Hong Kong and Macau, and I was thinking that Mammon would be the most powerful ministry there, with the Pentacle mages mostly being in hiding, but with a lot of mages all arriving at the city in force for...reasons...at the start of the game.
    Cool. Any historical surprises? Extended timelines? We still dealing with that worldwide wifi collapse due to cancer scandal? ;P


    Quote Originally Posted by Winterfate View Post
    Devils! Stop binding SiuiS' pony!

  25. - Top - End - #145
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Anarion's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Washington DC
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by SiuiS View Post
    Cool. Any historical surprises? Extended timelines? We still dealing with that worldwide wifi collapse due to cancer scandal? ;P
    Wait, you're paying attention to my setting details?! When did that happen?

    I was actually considering explaining that, and probably my mage setting would be some years before my changeling setting.
    Soul Tracer avatar by Thanqol.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    Anarion's right on the money here.
    Quotes
    Spoiler
    Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    Dulce Et Decorum Est Pro Anarion Mori?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    You just highlandered an entire city block into a glass-filled storm by road-runnering down it in your underwear.

  26. - Top - End - #146
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Thanqol's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Canberra, Australia

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarion View Post
    Thanqol raises some profound points. One that really struck home with me is the fact that I can remember the names and history of almost every character in every RPG I've been in. Whereas I could not name you all 80 people who were in my section in the first year of law school (section meaning that for one year, we took all our classes together 5 days a week).

    That's kinda scary and probably speaks to how weird human interaction has become these days.
    Wow, you're way more social/better with names than I am. I could name for you maybe eight teachers from my entire educational career.

    In other news, I'm probably going to make Thanqol pretty happy. One of the things that I did during the no forum crazy time, is I spent considerable time creating the germ of a Mage game, and bought a journal to start taking some notes on the off chance statistical certainty that I actually run it. As a teaser, it would be set in Hong Kong and Macau, and I was thinking that Mammon would be the most powerful ministry there, with the Pentacle mages mostly being in hiding, but with a lot of mages all arriving at the city in force for...reasons...at the start of the game.
    Oh, nice. Of my character ideas in The Pile one sounds a perfect fit for that. She's a bit difficult to articulate, but after finishing her design I realised I'd finally given life to Prototype Jayden, who was a Moros and a Matter-Mage. Jayden proper ended up an Obrimos because Best Path but I've finally developed the understanding to make her double.

    Very little they have in common. As I've said a few times, nothing changes a character more than even the slightest alteration to their Awakening (which is, incidentally, why I'm generally pretty nervous about having Awakenings 'on camera').

    Quote Originally Posted by SiuiS View Post
    I don't know, mate. Ever since finding out you spurned classic literature for being stuffy, u don't make assumptions like that anymore. You're a barrel of surprises with a fancy hat and a vocal tuner nailed on, animated by the shadows of a dozen famous US presidents.
    I think this is the best description of me that has happened.

    This makes your posts all the more interesting. It means you feel strongly enough abou something to deviate from that norm.

    Like that kaiuu guy. He suggests broad, sweeping changes to the system for no real thematic reason. You say that isn't necessary, what he wants is already right there. And then his response is he's tired of that Bad Guys win because Grimdark bull. That was a good look into a lot of things, from graceful handling of idiocy to Rarity's theorem on the effects of presentation on the reception of the final product.
    Oh, god, Kaiuu. He does this every thread every time. Let me -

    I get 618 results if I search for "kaiu keiichi" "bad guys win" site:forum.rpg.net.

    Sometimes clever people talk to him and say clever things trying to convince him. It never works. He's been banging that goddamn drum for - HOLY SMEG IT'S DAYLIGHT SAVINGS AND I HAVE AN HOUR LESS THAN I THOUGHT I DID - well on eight years now.

    I don't have time for anything deep, I gotta get to work.
    Last edited by Thanqol; 2012-10-06 at 07:30 PM.
    If you teach a man to fish, he'll still vote for the guy that gives him a fish.

  27. - Top - End - #147
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Thanqol's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Canberra, Australia

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Last quick thing:

    "Oh, okay, forums are taking this long to reboot because they need to do a group ritual to exorcise the rage spirit from the sever. That's fine.

    ...

    Okay, it's been a day. I think the rage spirit won the first round. They'll need a day to recover before they can try the exorcism again."
    If you teach a man to fish, he'll still vote for the guy that gives him a fish.

  28. - Top - End - #148
    Titan in the Playground
     
    SiuiS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Somewhere south of Hell
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Admin needs gnosis. Would drastically shorten those roll times.

    Kaiuu is a hoot. I knew what I was in for when the first thing I read was that World of Darkness needs to be more punk, and for that there needs to be a man you stick it to. Kid probably doesn't know a god-damned thing about brutality. Punk isn't good guys win.

    Anarion, remembering things is what I do. My ban comes in when you realize that the importance I ascribe to any piece of information is almost completely arbitrary. That wifi went down due to interesting events was tagged for top of the pile. That my entire motley may have a vested interest in murdering me was not.

    EDIT: I am now ostensibly running a solo Mage game whose stated development goal is "see what comes together naturally, an use this to refine the rules and my knowledge of them". I want to chronicle this somehow, but I'm not sure if I should or where I would do it. Thoughts?
    Last edited by SiuiS; 2012-10-06 at 09:33 PM.


    Quote Originally Posted by Winterfate View Post
    Devils! Stop binding SiuiS' pony!

  29. - Top - End - #149
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Anarion's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Washington DC
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    Quote Originally Posted by SiuiS View Post
    Anarion, remembering things is what I do. My ban comes in when you realize that the importance I ascribe to any piece of information is almost completely arbitrary. That wifi went down due to interesting events was tagged for top of the pile. That my entire motley may have a vested interest in murdering me was not.
    Okay then, I'll keep that in mind when I'm throwing around weird details.

    I haven't actually decided if the WiFi cancer thing would be related to the mage game or not. Obviously "many mages converge on city" is pretty much guaranteed to mean that something big is going down or has been discovered there, but I actually haven't decided what it is yet, still in the planning stage. But it would be amusing if the thing attracting mages to Hong Kong was also the reason that WiFi in the entire world got messed up and started making people sick. I will think on this.
    Soul Tracer avatar by Thanqol.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    Anarion's right on the money here.
    Quotes
    Spoiler
    Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    Dulce Et Decorum Est Pro Anarion Mori?
    Quote Originally Posted by Tiki Snakes View Post
    You just highlandered an entire city block into a glass-filled storm by road-runnering down it in your underwear.

  30. - Top - End - #150
    Titan in the Playground
     
    SiuiS's Avatar

    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Somewhere south of Hell
    Gender
    Female

    Default Re: Skyscraper Graveyard II: Jealousy and Ambition

    "I was downloading these songs of hope and prayer for my sick mother who has cancer, an then bam! Cancer."

    Damn those paradoxes!


    Quote Originally Posted by Winterfate View Post
    Devils! Stop binding SiuiS' pony!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •