Arcane caster tank?

[StreamOfTheSky]

Even in core only, it's very doable and simple. Dwarf or Gnome Transmuter Wizard w/ 1 level dip in Fighter (possibly 1st level, though then you get your x4 on a vastly inferior set of skills...) into Eldritch Knight. Using polymorph and mage armor. Actually, if you mostly just buff then fight, Barb 1 as your 1st level could be quite good, instead of using Fighter at all.

Highest stat is Con. Int is 2nd highest, but it only needs to be an 18 by the time 7th CL rolls around, plenty of time to buy a +2 headband.

You just turn into Annish Hags, Treants, etc... for big AC and reach. Grab the trip line of feats and you've got some lockdown, too.

[Sayt]

FWIW, the Runesmith gives you casting in armor without arcane spell failure with full casting progression and two good saves. It also lets you hand out spells to your party members!

[Hiro Protagonest]

I can't believe nobody made a suggestion for the guy to hide inside a metal box on wheels and cast blasty spells through a small window.

But, uh, otherwise, MMO tanking doesn't exist. In D&D, you have crowd control. And wizards are the kings, nay, emperors, of crowd control. Read Treantmonk's guide to GOD wizards.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

I can't believe nobody made a suggestion for the guy to hide inside a metal box on wheels and cast blasty spells through a small window.

But, uh, otherwise, MMO tanking doesn't exist. In D&D, you have crowd control. And wizards are the kings, nay, emperors, of crowd control. Read Treantmonk's guide to GOD wizards.

Cast Animate Object on that metal box so it's mobile. You can buff it with (Greater) Mage Armor and similar. Get UMD ranks and give your familiar a Wand of Repair Light Damage to use on the box whenever it takes a hit.

Forget the small window, put a periscope on it and a hole to stick his finger out for line of effect. Or even better, put a tiny window in the top leading to a second room above with windows, cast Project Image into the second room and cast spells through the windows via that.

[Gnaeus]

You can get some really nice stuff as a wizard, but it's distinctly a 'later in the game' thing.

Why do people keep saying this? Wizard tanks are pretty clearly viable no later than level 3.

A level 3 fighter has an average of 21 hp +con x3
A level 3 wizard with False Life and a Toad has an average of 20.5 hp+ con x3. (or kill the toad and go Abrupt Jaunt, which is clearly better if allowed)

Martial Wizard variant gives you a fighter feat. Improved init is nice, or an exotic weapon to + your damage. Maybe a sharktooth staff or greathammer or spiked chain.

Fighter using 2h weapon in full plate (1500 gp) has 18 AC +1 maybe for dex.
Wizard who spent 2k gold on a ring of protection +1 has 15 AC + dex + Shield spell if he has a round to cast.

Lets say we have a specialist wizard banning enchantment and evocation. L3 (core) we get:
L1: Mage Armor, Shield x2, (Mount or protection from evil or grease or enlarge person)
L2: False Life x2, Mirror Image or Blur

This is really fairly decent for the Tankish role. It isn't better than the fighter at this level (unless abrupt jaunt) but it is pretty darn close. It is already better in melee than the weaker tanks, like monk or TWF ranger, probably similar to paladin. At level 5 Heroism + GMW + Vampiric Touch + Haste + Displacement all join the party.

[Deth Muncher]

But, uh, otherwise, MMO tanking doesn't exist. In D&D, you have crowd control. And wizards are the kings, nay, emperors, of crowd control. Read Treantmonk's guide to GOD wizards.

While I disagree with your first part, the second part is definitely true - it's much easier to go for a battlefield control caster than a tank. However...

Yeah, stack mirror image with blink and even a squishy wizard can wade into melee.

I ran a defensive abjurer once. I wasn't optimized for melee, just party buffs, but I was really hard to kill. Day-long mage armor, high constitution, and Toughness make for a really solid mage.

This is where we start getting into the bread and butter here. Back in the day when I played WoW, I was focusing on turning my Mage into a Dodge-Tank. What does that mean? In WoW, it meant pumping my Dodge rank so that everything would miss me. In D&D, though, there's a few simple things you can do to achieve the same.

As Thomar said, you're looking at Mirror Image, Blink, and Mage Armor as some key points. If you're limited to Core, these plus the Ring of Forceshield, a decent Dexterity score and casting stat of your choice (plus Constitution, if you have enough good scores, though you may be able to fix that via a magic item as well) gives you +4 from MA, +2 from the Ring (though you could make THAT a +4 if you went for the spell Shield instead), and then 50% Miss Chance from Blink (and a neat +2 to hit, though a 20% chance of losing your attack) and up to a total of 8 Mirror Images of you running around. That's pretty awesome, and if you've got an 18 in Dex (via base scores, racial bonuses, items, etc), you're looking at a minimum 20AC, with no ASF chance, plus the blinking and the shadow clones.

"But wait!" I hear you cry, "You're still not addressing why an enemy would go after a caster who's really hard to hit! That seems like lousy target priority!" Well, you'd be right if the caster just putzed around and did nothing. However, with that sexy Dex score of yours, you could get off some really nice Ranged Touch spells, like Ray of Fire, etc and suddenly make yourself a big problem for people.

Now, if you get OUT of Core, you also get such lovely things as the Greater versions of many of those spells, like Greater Mage Armor (Complete Arcane) which nets you a +6AC, or Greater/Improved Blink (printed various times in Complete Arcane/Divine and Unapproachable East), which gets rid of your chance to lose your attack, as well as granting you the ability to prepare an action to 100% effectively phase out and away from an attack, among other things. Also from Complete Arcane come the Orb spells, which are, of course, lovely things for Ranged Touch and are a staple of many Direct Damage builds.

Now, you can do more silly things like having a Rod of Many Wands stuffed with Orb spells or have magic items which have various spells from above keyed to them as your budget allows to take off the load from your spellcasting, and something else I'd mention is the Metamagic feat Reach Spell, which turns any Touch range spell into a Ranged Touch attack, but those are extra things to add to your build if and when you can spare.

EDIT: Oh yeah, thanks to the guy above me for mentioning Abrupt Jaunt - definitely hit that up, unless you plan on using a lot of Metamagic and want to play a Sorceror, in which case you go for the Rapid Metamagic ACF.

EDIT EDIT: Also, this is completely build-free advice - there are PrCs that boost certain aspects of this, as well as any of the gish classes usually having random bonuses and allowing you to (usually) ignore ACF so you can wear real people armor, but I opted for what I do, which is play a Sorceror.

EDIT EDIT EDIT: I forgot Blur! That's a free 20% miss chance. I don't know if miss chance stacks, though, I forget if that's one of those that get the special exception to the "bonuses with the same name don't stack" flavor of rule.

[Grim Reader]

Stalwart Battle Sorcerer is an option. BaB is a step below Duskblade, but you do get 9th levels spells as a consolation

Slot in heritage feat and a level of Sand Shaper at some point to expand the extremly restricted list of spells known.

[Hiro Protagonest]

While I disagree with your first part, the second part is definitely true - it's much easier to go for a battlefield control caster than a tank. However...



This is where we start getting into the bread and butter here. Back in the day when I played WoW, I was focusing on turning my Mage into a Dodge-Tank. What does that mean? In WoW, it meant pumping my Dodge rank so that everything would miss me. In D&D, though, there's a few simple things you can do to achieve the same.

As Thomar said, you're looking at Mirror Image, Blink, and Mage Armor as some key points. If you're limited to Core, these plus the Ring of Forceshield, a decent Dexterity score and casting stat of your choice (plus Constitution, if you have enough good scores, though you may be able to fix that via a magic item as well) gives you +4 from MA, +2 from the Ring (though you could make THAT a +4 if you went for the spell Shield instead), and then 50% Miss Chance from Blink (and a neat +2 to hit, though a 20% chance of losing your attack) and up to a total of 8 Mirror Images of you running around. That's pretty awesome, and if you've got an 18 in Dex (via base scores, racial bonuses, items, etc), you're looking at a minimum 20AC, with no ASF chance, plus the blinking and the shadow clones.

"But wait!" I hear you cry, "You're still not addressing why an enemy would go after a caster who's really hard to hit! That seems like lousy target priority!" Well, you'd be right if the caster just putzed around and did nothing. However, with that sexy Dex score of yours, you could get off some really nice Ranged Touch spells, like Ray of Fire, etc and suddenly make yourself a big problem for people.

Now, if you get OUT of Core, you also get such lovely things as the Greater versions of many of those spells, like Greater Mage Armor (Complete Arcane) which nets you a +6AC, or Greater/Improved Blink (printed various times in Complete Arcane/Divine and Unapproachable East), which gets rid of your chance to lose your attack, as well as granting you the ability to prepare an action to 100% effectively phase out and away from an attack, among other things. Also from Complete Arcane come the Orb spells, which are, of course, lovely things for Ranged Touch and are a staple of many Direct Damage builds.

Now, you can do more silly things like having a Rod of Many Wands stuffed with Orb spells or have magic items which have various spells from above keyed to them as your budget allows to take off the load from your spellcasting, and something else I'd mention is the Metamagic feat Reach Spell, which turns any Touch range spell into a Ranged Touch attack, but those are extra things to add to your build if and when you can spare.

EDIT: Oh yeah, thanks to the guy above me for mentioning Abrupt Jaunt - definitely hit that up, unless you plan on using a lot of Metamagic and want to play a Sorceror, in which case you go for the Rapid Metamagic ACF.

EDIT EDIT: Also, this is completely build-free advice - there are PrCs that boost certain aspects of this, as well as any of the gish classes usually having random bonuses and allowing you to (usually) ignore ACF so you can wear real people armor, but I opted for what I do, which is play a Sorceror.

EDIT EDIT EDIT: I forgot Blur! That's a free 20% miss chance. I don't know if miss chance stacks, though, I forget if that's one of those that get the special exception to the "bonuses with the same name don't stack" flavor of rule.

Tank means stacking up aggro. It doesn't mean nearly impossible to hit.

[Deth Muncher]

Tank means stacking up aggro. It doesn't mean nearly impossible to hit.

Really? My understanding that tanking was making people want to kill you, and being unkillable. Hence why I'd mentioned the "pimp yo damage" portion - because if you're doing a load of damage, anyone on the enemy team is gonna want you dead. And if they can't hit you...you can't be dead.

EDIT: Admittedly, I didn't focus on mentioning HOW to pimp your damage quite as much as I should have, but it's simple enough to look into Mailman-type builds for that portion of it.

[Biffoniacus_Furiou]

In most MMO's, it's about keeping opponents focused on you and being able to withstand their damage for the length of the fight. WoW has certainly seen its share of gimmick tanking, from the group that 5-manned Gruul with an unhittable rogue tank to fights that are designed to require a nonstandard class to tank a foe (Illidan, the HKM fight, etc.). However, traditional tanking sometimes goes by the wayside, considering such fights as the Shade of Aran and many others which didn't even use an aggro mechanic. Then there are sometimes games which completely throw traditional roles out the window, such as Guild Wars 2 which I've played quite a bit recently.

Regardless, none of this pertains to D&D. Characters don't have a reliable means of 'holding aggro' without shattering suspension of disbelief, and usually can't reliably withstand attacks from multiple opponents round after round. What this game does have are crowd control effects, debuffs, save-or-lose/die effects, and strategic considerations that allow a party to avoid the majority of an encounter's threats. D&D lacks the mechanics of MMO-style tanking, especially in the dedicated healer role that it necessitates, so not allowing opponents to fight back is how the game works. If that weren't the case, then this would not be the same game, and people who have played that style of MMO who wish to bring it into D&D are simply mistaken and need to be informed, rather than accommodated.

[Deth Muncher]

Regardless, none of this pertains to D&D. Characters don't have a reliable means of 'holding aggro' without shattering suspension of disbelief, and usually can't reliably withstand attacks from multiple opponents round after round. What this game does have are crowd control effects, debuffs, save-or-lose/die effects, and strategic considerations that allow a party to avoid the majority of an encounter's threats.

Again, I don't support the first part, but wholeheartedly support the second part.

Also, as a side note, I'm not trying to advocate my "Dodge Tank" method as more viable than the Battlefield Control style caster - I was merely providing a take on the "tank" style response, as opposed to the "You're doing this wrong, do this instead" mentality that tends to show up on the Intertubes. Battlefield Control is definitely a stronger way to go, but if you're not in a high-op game, you don't necessarily HAVE to bring out the orbital laser defense grid when a simple rocket launcher will do the trick.

Also, I'm glad you qualified that as "reliable means of holding aggro without shattering the suspension of disbelief" because I was gonna drop Knight on you so faaaaaast.

[KillianHawkeye]

I agree with Deth Muncher in that tanking is definitely possible in a D&D framework, although not exactly how it works in an MMO. It's all about getting an opponent's attention and then being able to withstand their attacks, right?

Here's an example: my group fought against a hydra a couple of weeks ago. I'm playing a dwarven barbarian. I use an axe and shield, so I don't do as much damage as the other frontline fighters in the group, but I have one of the highest ACs, and with high Con and a d12 HD I have the highest HP as well. So my strategy was to use Fighting Defensively and charge the hydra in order to trigger as many AoOs as possible, the logic being that I am difficult to hit and have plenty of HP to soak the hits that get through my defenses, then once the monster is out of AoOs it will be safe for the other warriors to charge in.

That's tanking.

[Hiro Protagonest]

I agree with Deth Muncher in that tanking is definitely possible in a D&D framework, although not exactly how it works in an MMO. It's all about getting an opponent's attention and then being able to withstand their attacks, right?

Here's an example: my group fought against a hydra a couple of weeks ago. I'm playing a dwarven barbarian. I use an axe and shield, so I don't do as much damage as the other frontline fighters in the group, but I have one of the highest ACs, and with high Con and a d12 HD I have the highest HP as well. So my strategy was to use Fighting Defensively and charge the hydra in order to trigger as many AoOs as possible, the logic being that I am difficult to hit and have plenty of HP to soak the hits that get through my defenses, then once the monster is out of AoOs it will be safe for the other warriors to charge in.

That's tanking.

Wh-wha?

1. He gets only one AoO against you. You only took one action that provoked, and that was charging.
2. If a fighter can't withstand one AoO, something is wrong.

[Jane_Smith]

Yeah but unless he has combat reflexes he can only make one attack of opportunity a round. Unless hydras have something unique for that. So the dwarf is taking/deflecting the aoo for the rogues/etc to run into position.

[KillianHawkeye]

Wh-wha?

1. He gets only one AoO against you. You only took one action that provoked, and that was charging.
2. If a fighter can't withstand one AoO, something is wrong.

Well the DM ruled that he got an AoO with each head as if they were separate creatures. We play it fast and loose like that.

[Jane_Smith]

Makes sense. Heh, would be fun to make all the hydra heads individual creatures with there own stats/hp, if they die, they regrow as two, etc, all rooted to a single lower body/space. Anyway;


You could also "tank" in a sense with necromancy. False life spells, lichdom later on for immunity to sneaks/crits/poisons/etc, army of meatshield skeletons that provoke attacks of opportunity and threaten hundreds of spots later in the game, even if they die quickly, the enemy cant just charge threw 20+ skeletons. Ontop of that you get vampiric touch/etc spells to keep you in the running. Perhaps dread necromancer? Take the flaw slow healing, and cure spells/etc used against you do -50% damage. Its kinda hilarious.

You could also become a lifedrinker, from book of vile darkness. You deal negative levels with touchs/melee attacks and store them for massive stat boosts or temporary hit points. Imagine that with a lich's touch?

[TuggyNE]

Well the DM ruled that he got an AoO with each head as if they were separate creatures. We play it fast and loose like that.

Sadly, that's not actually fast and loose. That is exactly what the hydra gets: provoking an AoO enables attacking with all heads. "Feats
A hydra’s Combat Reflexes feat allows it to use all its heads for attacks of opportunity."

So yes, hydras have Combat Reflexes, but it doesn't actually give them the usual effect; it's even better.

[KillianHawkeye]

Sadly, that's not actually fast and loose.

It is when we go with the ruling on the field rather than stopping to look things up. The fact that we happened to get it right is irrelevent. It also has nothing to do with the point I was making with my hydra example.

[dextercorvia]

Just go Wizard all the way. It is remarkably easy to soak 'attacks' from stunned or unconscious creatures.

Seriously, you can tank as a wizard from level 1. You are better off gishing than tanking, because level 1 is rocket tag, and you have ICBMs as a class feature, but they are thematically similar roles.

[Endarire]

Savage Aasimar Wizard. PrCs optional.

Use alter self to become a Ravid for at least 30 minutes. Use mirror image, shield, mage armor, and other abilities to taste.

Things get more nuts with polymorph.

There's also the Grappling Wizard/Grapplemancer.

So yes, it's possible.

[jaybird]

Wizard/Abjurant Champion/Swiftblade is a gish build I'm particularly fond of.