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Thread: creating a vampire spawn.
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2012-10-08, 06:25 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2012
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- incheon, south korea.
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creating a vampire spawn.
let's say a character gets slain by a vampire and gets turned into a vampire spawn.
how do you handle the abilities?
the abilities given for a vampire spawn are as follows:
Str 16, Dex 14, Con Ø, Int 13, Wis 13, Cha 14
are you supposed to just go with that? or do you add the vampire template stats from whatever you character had before?
Str +6, Dex +4, Int +2, Wis +2, Cha +4 (and, of course, drop the Con to 0).
if that's the case, then the generic vampire spawn is taking for granted that the living character started out with stats of:
Str: 10
Dex: 10
Con: (whatever)
Int:11
Wis: 11
Cha: 10
which seems kind of... well... generic.
someone help me out here. i'm confused. thanks!
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2012-10-08, 07:33 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2005
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- Davis, California
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2012-10-08, 08:24 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2012
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- incheon, south korea.
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2012-10-08, 08:29 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2008
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- NYC
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2012-10-08, 08:33 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2012
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- incheon, south korea.
- Gender
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2012-10-08, 09:15 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2007
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- Imagination Land
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Re: creating a vampire spawn.
There's nothing unclear about this. Vampire Spawn is not a template. They have the listed stats and nothing else. They are not in any way based on the previous creature's stats. They lose all of the previous creature's class levels and other abilities, because they aren't real Vampires.
Last edited by KillianHawkeye; 2012-10-08 at 09:15 PM.
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2012-10-08, 10:15 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2011
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Re: creating a vampire spawn.
Confusion can reasonably arise because the stat block for Vampire Spawn shows its ability scores based on the Standard array; however, it's also possible to use a different stat array (i.e., Non-elite array) and get noticeably different results, per the usual rules on improving monsters. I don't think there's any particular connection between the Spawn's ability score array and the array of the creature it was made from, which is the key point.
Projects: Homebrew, Gentlemen's Agreement, DMPCs, Forbidden Knowledge safety, and Top Ten Worst. Also, Quotes and RACSD are good.
Anyone knows blue is for sarcas'ing in · "Take 10 SAN damage from Dark Orchid" · Use of gray may indicate nitpicking · Green is sincerity
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2012-10-08, 10:39 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2012
Re: creating a vampire spawn.
Actually, I think that the second point that OP brought up is true. When your fighter, let's say, becomes a Spawn, he retains no memories, nor skills, that he previously had. He does, however, retain his ability scores, as well as some other abilities that he might have had (such as claw attacks if he had naturally possessed them). You simply add the other abilities onto what he has left over.
On a related note, there is a prestige class (I think that it's in Savage Species) that allows Undead Spawn to recall their former lives. The example given is a mage that was turned into a Shadow and was freed from its master's control, but other candidates would also include Wights and even Vampire Spawn.
Edit: Monstrous races (well, really all races) almost always have the Standard Array for their base ability scores, with half of them being 10's and the other half being 11's, because the average stats rolled for people are 10.5's, so the stat block assumes that they are average people, and not unique beings, such as PCs or powerful NPCs. Also, races never receive an odd-numbered amount of points for their ability score bonuses, so the odd-numbered ones are the 11's, with the even ones being 10's. Hope that clears up confusion for the ability scores, at least.Last edited by karkus; 2012-10-08 at 10:45 PM.
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2012-10-08, 10:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2008
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Re: creating a vampire spawn.
[citation needed]
The text on creating spawn is perfectly clear. "A humanoid or monstrous humanoid slain by a vampire’s energy drain rises as a vampire spawn 1d4 days after burial." No "retains ability scores", no "retains natural attacks". If a vampire drains something to death, it becomes a vampire spawn. What's a vampire spawn? See the stat block below. It's an entirely new creature, not a template.
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2012-10-08, 10:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2012
Re: creating a vampire spawn.
Crap on a stick. I think you may be right... However, I do believe that in certain cases, you do retain abilities. By which I mean, if the person possessed wings, then they should probably also possess wings. Just a thought, though, because I think that the monster listed is just a general thing for Humanoids, and was not given with additional information, because it cannot commonly be a PC race.
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2012-10-08, 11:22 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2011
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Re: creating a vampire spawn.
Unfortunately, if it was intended to be generalized it should have been presented in template form, which would have been perfectly suitable. It wasn't, so this is what we've got, and no abilities are retained; Flickerdart's essential point (that it is, for all practical purposes, a new creature) is correct as far as I can tell.
I don't really like the state of RAW in this case, but them's the breaks?Projects: Homebrew, Gentlemen's Agreement, DMPCs, Forbidden Knowledge safety, and Top Ten Worst. Also, Quotes and RACSD are good.
Anyone knows blue is for sarcas'ing in · "Take 10 SAN damage from Dark Orchid" · Use of gray may indicate nitpicking · Green is sincerity
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2012-10-09, 01:05 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2005
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- Davis, California
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2012-10-09, 03:26 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2007
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- Sydnah, Australia
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Re: creating a vampire spawn.
The RAW in this case is dumb. Use RAI instead. So either use the character's regular scores or create a spawn template and apply it by deriving the abilities the spawn monster gets in the usual way.
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2012-10-09, 04:10 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2011
Re: creating a vampire spawn.
I don't think being turned into a Vampire Spawn is dumb. It was suppose to be a deterrent. The whole reason they where created by the game designers was to stop players from going, OH a Vampire I let him bite me to get vampire powers. It's the same reason that they get controlled by their sire.
Last edited by Kyberwulf; 2012-10-09 at 04:11 AM.
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2012-10-09, 05:56 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2007
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- Imagination Land
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Re: creating a vampire spawn.
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2012-10-09, 06:00 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2011
Re: creating a vampire spawn.
Yeah, but then you are under the control of the Vampire that sired you. No saving throw. Just a NPC.
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2012-10-09, 09:23 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2010
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Re: creating a vampire spawn.
If the monster class is any indication, the ability score bonuses are +4 STR, +2 DEX, +2 INT, +2 WIS, and +4 CHA.
"If your heart is fearful throw away fear; if there is terror in it throw away terror. Take your axe in your hand and attack. He who leaves the fight unfinished is not at peace." -The Epic of Gilgamesh
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2012-10-09, 05:16 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2012
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- incheon, south korea.
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Re: creating a vampire spawn.
thank you all. i now feel like i have a complete understanding of how this works, and so i can make an informed decision on how i want to break the rules. i think i'm going to do away with 'vampire spawn' entirely. for the purposes of my story, the distinction of vampire and vampire spawn is insignificant enough to ignore.
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2012-10-09, 06:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2007
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- Imagination Land
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Re: creating a vampire spawn.