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  1. - Top - End - #211
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobold-Bard View Post
    Lintha [no idea what these are]
    They're the castration-pirate mafia-that live on a behemoth-island, obsessing over blood purity and the Primordial who's shunned them. They prey on pretty much the entire West without regard to the sheer size that would entail.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by TheCountAlucard View Post
    They're the castration-pirate mafia-that live on a behemoth-island, obsessing over blood purity and the Primordial who's shunned them. They prey on pretty much the entire West without regard to the sheer size that would entail.
    Also, they used to be a separate species descended from Kimbery (implied to have power comparable to the exalted, whose initial design was at least in part based on the lintha), but despite their obsession with maintaining the bloodline they've managed to interbreed to the point of being humans with a few cosmetic differences and a creepy cannibalism obsession. They even have produced a couple exalted of their own in the form of Dragonbloods.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Actually, the implication is that while Kimberry was out and about, they had the power of the Exalted through the direct support of a Primordial. Once that got take away, they weren't too powerful.

    As for the separate species, that's been altered multiple times. I think the current dev team is supporting 'they're human(godblooded) with a bunch of primordial support'.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    As I recall they were so powerful for two reasons.

    1. Kimbery was handing out akumaships like sub-prime loans. With access to her charms they could match Celestial power in a very small subset of areas. Being pirates who lived in the Ocean meant that very small subset happened to be the only relevant one to them.

    2. Kimbery was also handing out her souls like sub-prime loans with which the Lintha built stuff. The current Lintha muckety muck has a ship made from one of her Second Circle Souls. She used to give up third circles with regularity. Consequently they had rather easy access to a high tech level without real infrastructure to target.

    Honorable Mention to their island being a quarter of the size of the Blessed Isle. Its motivation is to grow even bigger so it can shift the metaphysical center of Creation to itself. It is much smaller now. It does still have a direct line to Kimbery for the akuma and souls she can still squeeze past her oaths.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by Exthalion View Post
    As I recall they were so powerful for two reasons.

    1. Kimbery was handing out akumaships like sub-prime loans. With access to her charms they could match Celestial power in a very small subset of areas. Being pirates who lived in the Ocean meant that very small subset happened to be the only relevant one to them.
    Wasn't Gorol the first Akuma?
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by Sanguine View Post
    Wasn't Gorol the first Akuma?
    He was indeed.
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    Quote Originally Posted by turkishproverb View Post
    I am not getting into a shootout with Golentan. Too many gun-arms.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    So now that we've got a few, I'll go ahead and drop my own explanations. I just didn't want someone's explanation to color anyone's immediate gut reaction, so thanks for the spoilers, Alucard.

    The first four in my list are special in that they each bring with them their own world (technically, so do Sidereals, but more on that later): the beautiful and alien Malfeas; the politicking of the Realm, Lookshy, and the various other nations; the propaganda and underground movements of Autochthonia, the early-Lovecraftian delirious wonder of the Underworld. Further, each type is interesting in that it presents a certain behavioral archetype while providing a method to rebel against it (though sadly, it's almost required for Abyssals): Infernals, even loyalists can flit between patrons; Dragonblooded make and break alliances; Alchemicals can use their power to encourage reform (for good or ill) or even go voidbringer; and Abyssals will eventually replace the Deathlords.

    Dragon-Kings through Sidereals are interesting. They all have interesting histories and interesting plot hooks, but they don't bring a whole lot to the table: Dragon-Kings are effectively irrelevant to Creation at large; most spirits are confined to a region and get slapped around by common DBs; Lintha have no way up the power scale except becoming demons(?); raksha are entirely too...focused...to play all the time; Sidereals don't really belong anywhere and do a thankless job, which gets stale after a time.

    Lunars...are conceptually really neat but actually pretty dull. Luna still gets my vote for Best Incarna, however.

    Tyrant lizards are on the list simply because playing a game as a completely ordinary t-rex should be a thing that happens every once in a while.

    Mortals score higher than godblooded because they don't draw off of anything else. Any power a mortal has is earned through blood and sweat. Godblooded currently feel more like a waiting period before playing spirits, too.

    Jadeborn are...dwarves with the same sort of "broken people" theme as the Dragon-Kings. They have a connection to the Primordials and so are slightly more interesting.

    See, my problem with Solars isn't that they're boring, necessarily. But they are certainly bland. Everyone else - even the generic dwarves - bring something new to the table. Solars just don't. There are no Solar stories. Even saving/becoming Sol can be done by Abyssals and Infernals. Any case of "my Solar punched out/saved/built/suplexed [thing]" can be replaced by any other type of Exalt or maybe even one of the other character types with enough effort. There has to be a more interesting way of covering the "me" theme than "bring your own awesome," because I can bring that awesome to any other character type as well.

    As for Devil-Tigers, I agree with Alucard. Metaphysically, the concept is one of the most beautiful things I've seen, but at this point, they number like Chaotic Good drow rangers.


    RE: Lintha and Kimbery

    The Lintha were so powerful because Kimbery frequently took their greatest heroes as consorts and bore them stupidly-powerful godblooded children. Separate race or human godblood, the Lintha's continued prominence mostly rested upon consistent infusion of Primordial Essence (including from their island).
    Last edited by Gensh; 2012-10-29 at 09:04 PM.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    my preferred order?

    lesse….

    My favs, and are roughly equal:
    Infernals
    Alchemicals
    Sidereals
    Raksha

    Things I like:
    Abyssals
    Dragon-Blooded.
    Lunars
    Jadeborn
    Dragon Kings
    Heroic Mortal Beastmen
    y'know what, screw it, Heroic God-Blooded in general.

    Things I'm OK with:
    Gods
    Elementals
    Demons
    Mortals
    Ghosts
    Pretty much everything else, unless I'm forgetting something.

    Things I greatly dislike:
    Solars.

    Why Solars? its not for any classical reason of disliking them…

    its just that I have Spirit of the Century and Legends of the Wulin now. If I want to play a normal guy taken to extremes, I already have two RPGs for that, who do it simpler and with less blatant sun-theme stuff that makes my minds eye bleed from the blatant shininess.
    Last edited by Lord Raziere; 2012-10-29 at 09:36 PM.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Okay, explanations for our preferred splats time?

    So, among my favorite exalt types there are a couple of things that stand out for me. Alchemicals, Terrestrials, Sidereals, and even Infernals all by default acknowledge that their whims are not the end all be all of the world. They have phenomenal cosmic power, but they put it to use in support of a loyalty. Politics may result in internal conflict, and they may abandon that loyalty, but they will always remember that when they were young they served Yu-Shan, or the Realm, or the Eight Nations and that their goals have to be weighed against the needs of the system that allows them to pursue those goals. In addition, they all require some thought to accomplish their ends. Alchemicals need to plan what magic they have access to in order to be effective, terrestrials need to work together to accomplish their feats and cover each other's weaknesses, and sidereals and infernals both have to come at problems sideways to fit the weirdness that their magic works.

    Lunars have much of the same versatility mixed with oddness of some of my favorites, but they fall short of my main four because when it comes down to it they still believe themselves above answering to others. A young lunar may work for an elder, but it seems to be more in the vein of an apprenticeship, building the youngling's power and understanding until they are ready to strike out and carve their own realm on the borders of the world. The silver pact isn't so much an organization as a massive non-agression treaty, and the thousand streams river by its nature requires by its nature that the political beliefs of the exalted take primacy even if it is ruled secretly with a light hand.

    Spirits can be interesting, but ultimately they're too limited in scope and require so much effort to make mechanically distinct that I just find them less fun to play than the exalted. Very similar problems plague their children in my mind. Mortals are so hopelessly outclassed by the things around them that unless they're for a horror story they simply aren't suited to the typical exalted game. As for solars, they have both nothing that sets them apart magically (they are humans, only more so, and glowy) and by default owe allegiance to nobody and nothing. They can work some tremendous things, but they do epic in a relatively bland way and have no real theme to give their goals context.

    As for Raksha and Abyssals... Abyssals serve such a repugnant and self destructive cause it actually enrages me. They seem to be forced to be mindless nihilists (and really, whose brilliant idea was it to charge destruction of everything, which would presumably include the abyssals, to the people willing to destroy the world rather than die?) or play the victim card in a way that exalted should not. On top of which, they share much of the blandness of their solar counterparts, only they've painted everything in blood instead of gold. It doesn't add much. Raksha, meanwhile, share the ikea wacky complications of spirits with an ultimate goal that is as repugnant to me as that of the abyssals. Both splats make for good villains when you need someone absolutely despicable, or the occasional interesting turncoat, but they both seem to be completely unplayable in any way I'd find enjoyable.
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    Quote Originally Posted by turkishproverb View Post
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    My thoughts (assembled in an order that vaguely correlates to preference):

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    Solars: are just fun! It's true that they don't come with any built-in structure: they belong to no organization, they have no alternate dimension to call their own, no masters to rebel against or cause to serve. The upside of this is that they don't have any baggage attached, either. Sometimes I want to tell a story that doesn't involve the Yozis, or the Underworld, or Yu-Shan, or the Silver Pact; that's where these guys come in. They're a wide-open sandbox. They're simple to make (by Exalted standards) and fun.

    They're plain vanilla, but you know what, I like vanilla.

    Dragon-Blooded: I enjoy the Realm as a setting (Lookshy not so much). The elemental powers are neat, plenty of nifty imagery and themes. And like Solars, they're pretty free to do what they like if Realm politics doesn't appeal—you don't have to be a scion of the Realm, nor are you tied to the Blessed Isle even if you are.

    Abyssals: although I have no particular desire to play an omnicidal nihilist or a tormented rebel, which are the two default Abyssal archetypes, these guys remain appealing for some reason. They have some very evocative themes and imagery. Most of my characters end up being people who are not quite openly rebelling; either they are not fully aware of what they're sworn to, or they're deluding themselves because they don't want to admit what they're doing.

    Infernals: I like their Charms and general design. I like the alien setting of Malfeas and would happily play an entire game centered there. I like playing tragic heroes. I like the Yozis as NPCs and/or antagonists. The fact that they keep turning up in games that have no connection to the Yozis or Infernal themes is a little irksome, but I'm determined not to let it change my opinion of them.

    Alchemicals: are pretty boss mechanically, and I like Autochthonia as a setting. They're tough to include in most games, though, and unless the game is set in Autochthonia/features their return to Creation as a plot point, I'm content to go without them.

    Spirits: The rules for these are a little sketchy, but I think they offer a lot of really intriguing possibilities. An infernal pilgrim on the slopes of Qaf, summoned to tutor a sorcerer's children. Outlaw gods hiding from Yu-Shan's watchful eyes among the teeming mortal masses. Custom Second Circle demons, scheming and warring to advance their standing in Malfeas. There are all sorts of cool non-standard game possibilities here.

    God-Blooded: More or less as above, except the concepts are slightly less fantastic and the character creation rules are slightly better defined.

    Lunars: I want to like these guys, but the details keep tripping me up. Their Charms are often irritating to work with, and I don't like being forced to include the Silver Pact in every character's backstory (unless I want to play Casteless, which is no fun).

    Mortals: could be fun, but the system doesn't offer much that's interesting to them, and the setting isn't written with mortal protagonists in mind. Nonetheless, I've always wanted to play a slice-of-life mortal game set in one of Creation's more interesting locales, or possibly a game set in Autochthonia.

    Ghosts: I've actually played one of these once (the ghost of a Lunar elder in a Lunar-centric campaign). Potentially neat, but very niche.

    Lintha: I always liked that these guys got a detailed write-up in Compass: West. It would have been easy to write them off as demon-worshipping cannibal slaver pirates (because they are), and leave it at that because who's going to want to delve any deeper than that? They hit a wide range of social taboos: virulent racism, cannibalism, slavery, occasional incest… most people are uncomfortable playing in a society such as this. Nonetheless, I like that we know about their culture: their history, their social structure, the philosophical conflicts within their society.

    Dragon Kings: I've never really given them much thought. They definitely have a coherent theme going (once-proud people on the verge of extinction), which is good. But it doesn't grab me and make me start thinking of character concepts, the way some other Exalted splats do.

    Jadeborn: like Dragon Kings, except less interesting to me. Never felt any desire to play one.

    Raksha: aaaaugh don't make me try to understand how these rules work again. Also, they bug me as characters because they have no genuine personality, only a shallow imitation of one. Interesting concept. Neat as antagonists or untrustworthy allies. Would not play.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by Sanguine View Post
    The problem with DBs wasn't that they were written early. It's that they were written before the core rules were finalized. This is why without errata many of their Charms don't make sense or just don't do anything.
    Yeah, a lot of their Charms were just straight-up copied from 1e. Also, the guy who wrote them didn't know the system. I mean, you can target Elemental Bolt with Athletics. Why? Because in WoD throwing stuff is an Athletics roll. He just went with that. Nevermind there was an Ability called THROWN.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gensh View Post
    I'm sort of interested in seeing a trend here: which is your preferred order of splats? Just interest-wise; not actually playing as them in 2e. Let's not chat about the topic until three or four people have already posted. Please and thank you.
    Eh. This changes so often. Also, I can't properly say that THIS one is better than THAT one; I tend to stuff them into tiers rather than strict one-by-one lists.

    1) Terrestrials
    2) Sidereals
    3) Solars
    Spoiler
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    These are my favourites. Terrestrials were my first love. After the Sidereal errata, I finally took the time to look into them and found a goldmine. Solars... well, it's good to be king.

    4) Alchemicals
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    Alchemicals is a mixed bag. It's in-between groups because I'm a fan of their idea as such, but I've not read up on Autochthonia a lot and they are so heavily tied to their robot aesthetics.

    5) Infernals
    6) Lunars
    7) Abyssals
    Spoiler
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    These are the ones that have some interesting themes but also carry ideas I found to turn me off. Abyssals are cool, in a way, but the "two viable stories" problem is indeed a problem. Infernals kind of get a bit of that as well, for me, but it's also the fact that they are also rather aesthetically locked; a Yozi Charm set makes you become as that Yozi, not much else. Lunars have been grossly miscast throughout 2e. They need to take a long step away from being furries (if anything, Wood Aspects should be the most animal-related Exalts) and more towards a middle-thing between Solars, Abyssals and Infernals. I'd play that Lunar in a heartbeat.

    8) Mortals
    9) Godbloods (non-Lintha)
    10) Spirits
    Spoiler
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    These could be interesting, of done right. The last parts of 2e got mortals and, by association, goodblooded kind of vindicated. I hope 3e continues down that path. Spirits are cool becasue they are what makes the world tick, but the different subclasses' mechanical expression needs a revision.

    11) Dragon-Kings
    12) Jadeborn
    13) Lintha
    14) Tyrant Lizards
    Spoiler
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    These are just bleh to me. Part of the thing with Exalted is that it skips the whole "all these races" thing and is about humans instead, so Dragon Kings and Jadeborn actively annoy me. The Lintha are kind of cool, but they get some kind of special Kimbery Charms, the hell is up with that? Tyrant Lizards are damn animals.

    15) Raksha
    Spoiler
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    I can't abide the metaness. Sorry. Trying to make "stories" into something mechanically coherent is not a clever thing.
    Last edited by Weimann; 2012-10-30 at 09:08 AM.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Weimann: It's well worth it to read up on Autochthonia. That Compass is easily one of my favorite books from 2e, and I suspect it might bump the Alchemicals up a spot on your list.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Favourite types listing!
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    Infernals, for all the reasons other people complain. I like devil tigers, I love their thematic charmsets. If I can't do a character with something else, Infernals are there to scratch my back.

    Terrestrials. I have an odd fondness for good old elemental powers, and always have. At some point I really must return to the DB Project, and get the other twelve aspects playable.

    Solars. Okay, so they're plain and get boring. But they're the first stop on the train, and they do have a handful of REALLY cool, evocative charms.
    I will never grow bored of shouting LIGHTNING! STRIKES! TWICE! (Thoom split the chase flicker fade storm burst...)

    Nocturnals. Yes, they count. Partly, I just appreciate the effort that goes into making an entire splatbook. Mostly, they have some really cool themes, and their limit is much less irritating imo.

    Alchemicals. Are SO MUCH FUN, but are very limited in their thematics. You can do any kind of -punk you care to name, but beyond that you have to go elsewhere.

    Abyssals. Only two stories, but they can be fun stories. Plus, there are third paths you can take. Seeker, one abyssal I play, is a murderous huntress who doesn't really care about oblivion,

    Sidereals. Are a lot of effort. They're playable now, but... ech.

    Lunars. Oh, lunars. I want to love you. So often I go 'Ooooh, I wanna play a SPIDER exalt!' and then I go 'Wait, that means I'm playing a lunar... never mind, I'll rehash my infernal monster.'
    I want to play a lunar a lot. I never want to play with lunar rules. I need five books and two websites, and my homebrewing head screwed on.

    Spirits/Godbloods are about the same rank. They're very similar but have slight flavourings.

    Lintha might be interesting if they get their own rules. Otherwise, with godblood.

    Jadeborn and DKs. Meh.

    Tyrant Lizards. Uh. Okay. Yeah, I guess I'd try this once? Build a character using a big pile of mutation points.

    Raksha. Nope. Not playing raksha. They're great fun to watch. That's why Meschlum is awesome.

    Mortals. I don't care about mortals unless they're five minutes away from exalting. Sorry.
    Last edited by Lix Lorn; 2012-10-30 at 01:01 PM.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by golentan View Post
    Weimann: It's well worth it to read up on Autochthonia. That Compass is easily one of my favorite books from 2e, and I suspect it might bump the Alchemicals up a spot on your list.
    I suspect you're right. It's just that I buy my stuff on pdf and therefore reading setting info is kind of a pain. It's so long to read of a computer screen. I've been meaning to get a Kindle for ages.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Can Principle Invoking Onslaught (Infernals p.135) cause secondary effects based on the chosen effect?

    eg. if I throw a fireball using it, will the target be set on fire, or if I drop a gallon of sulphuric acid on them will the horrible burns affect their Appearance?

    Or is it just for making people into gold statues and such?
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by Kobold-Bard View Post
    Can Principle Invoking Onslaught (Infernals p.135) cause secondary effects based on the chosen effect?

    eg. if I throw a fireball using it, will the target be set on fire, or if I drop a gallon of sulphuric acid on them will the horrible burns affect their Appearance?

    Or is it just for making people into gold statues and such?
    You would set someone on fire with a clinch. As for the other bit, not without somehow gaining the ability to cause Crippling effects.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Actually, you can inflict crippling effects with Principle-Invoking Onslaught.
    The core rules specifically allow for Coup de Grace attacks that inflict various sorts of maiming; it's just that you can only inflict the natural Crippling effect if you dealt enough damage to kill the person anyway (you can decide to just kill them, too, if you want.) It basically replaces the normal "You would have taken X damage, enough to kill you" with "You take any number of lethal levels, and a Crippling effect."

    Disfigurement that reduces appearance is specifically called out as an option.

    Now, this isn't necessarily useful in combat except for some very unusual situations (for example, weakening someone before they get to do something that happens upon their death... And there are only a tiny handful of charms that do that...)
    Last edited by aetherialDawn; 2012-10-30 at 06:48 PM.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by aetherialDawn View Post
    Actually, you can inflict crippling effects with Principle-Invoking Onslaught.
    The core rules specifically allow for Coup de Grace attacks that inflict various sorts of maiming; it's just that you can only inflict the natural Crippling effect if you dealt enough damage to kill the person anyway (you can decide to just kill them, too, if you want.) It basically replaces the normal "You would have taken X damage, enough to kill you" with "You take any number of lethal levels, and a Crippling effect."

    Disfigurement that reduces appearance is specifically called out as an option.

    Now, this isn't necessarily useful in combat except for some very unusual situations (for example, weakening someone before they get to do something that happens upon their death... And there are only a tiny handful of charms that do that...)
    I could have sworn you were allowed to do crippling just by taking a dice penalty.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by Gensh View Post
    I'm sort of interested in seeing a trend here: which is your preferred order of splats?
    Can someone please explain to me why how it makes sense to separate all the splats in the first place? I mean, for most of them it's fine, but considering that at least one of DBs, Rakaha, and Abyssals are probably going to be some of the main antagonists/enemies in a typical Solars game, it seems incredibly counterintuitive to make people wait months or even years before they can build one.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by Sith_Happens View Post
    Can someone please explain to me why how it makes sense to separate all the splats in the first place? I mean, for most of them it's fine, but considering that at least one of DBs, Rakaha, and Abyssals are probably going to be some of the main antagonists/enemies in a typical Solars game, it seems incredibly counterintuitive to make people wait months or even years before they can build one.
    If you are refering to book release dates, it is simply a matter of not being able to write the majority of a gameline at once. The book would be huge, the required time would be long, and the price would be high.

    These listing are the order people enjoy them in.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Also, the Storyteller's Companion includes pre generated profiles for a whole range of potential enemies or other NPCs, along with charm packages that you can use to tailor their abilities. For 99% of enemies, that's probably all you're going to need. For the others, the enemy masterminds that need serious attention and precise tailoring, that's when you go to the relevant splat and generate them from the ground up.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by Maugan Ra View Post
    Also, the Storyteller's Companion includes pre generated profiles for a whole range of potential enemies or other NPCs, along with charm packages that you can use to tailor their abilities. For 99% of enemies, that's probably all you're going to need. For the others, the enemy masterminds that need serious attention and precise tailoring, that's when you go to the relevant splat and generate them from the ground up.
    They aren't going to be doing one of those for 3E. Holden has grown tired of writing stopgaps which is what that would be.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by Exthalion View Post
    They aren't going to be doing one of those for 3E. Holden has grown tired of writing stopgaps which is what that would be.
    A storyteller's companion is not necessarily a stop-gap. Including rules for how to give a character the appropriate flavor and danger level without having to build every opponent from the ground up is a very useful thing if your solars intend to fight their way through literal armies of dragon bloods or demons over the course of a few sessions.

    That said, having a "If you want to use these as antagonists, start with X, add a bit of Y, and fill out with Z" section in each and every splat would go a long way toward making the system less storyteller hating.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by Sith_Happens View Post
    Can someone please explain to me why how it makes sense to separate all the splats in the first place? I mean, for most of them it's fine, but considering that at least one of DBs, Rakaha, and Abyssals are probably going to be some of the main antagonists/enemies in a typical Solars game, it seems incredibly counterintuitive to make people wait months or even years before they can build one.
    it doesn't. Exalted is a game where seven different Exalts built using the WoD splat method are interacting with a singular cohesive world, which causes a lot of problems. Exalted aims for mind-blowing quality in setting description and player options, not efficiency, intuition or sense.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by Rockphed View Post
    A storyteller's companion is not necessarily a stop-gap. Including rules for how to give a character the appropriate flavor and danger level without having to build every opponent from the ground up is a very useful thing if your solars intend to fight their way through literal armies of dragon bloods or demons over the course of a few sessions.

    That said, having a "If you want to use these as antagonists, start with X, add a bit of Y, and fill out with Z" section in each and every splat would go a long way toward making the system less storyteller hating.
    Holden appears to disagree.

    I hope they do something like the Storytellers Companion that give you the mechanical ability to run certain splats before thier book comes out. (Ranger_Lord)
    Q: Has that ever worked? I mean, even once in the history of ever? (wastevens)
    A: My experience has been "not really," which is why when Rich asked if we wanted to do one of those, I said "Nah, they've never really been adequate to play with, and they just end up as this useless obsolete thing after a couple of years. I don't like writing stopgaps, done too much of that lately." (Holden)
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by Rockphed View Post
    A storyteller's companion is not necessarily a stop-gap. Including rules for how to give a character the appropriate flavor and danger level without having to build every opponent from the ground up is a very useful thing if your solars intend to fight their way through literal armies of dragon bloods or demons over the course of a few sessions.

    That said, having a "If you want to use these as antagonists, start with X, add a bit of Y, and fill out with Z" section in each and every splat would go a long way toward making the system less storyteller hating.
    Do you have the ST companion? I do, and I can say that the use you can get out of it is marginal, as the powers they attribute to the different types of Exalted? Hilariously bad, in terms of applicability to the system.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    it doesn't. Exalted is a game where seven different Exalts built using the WoD splat method are interacting with a singular cohesive world, which causes a lot of problems. Exalted aims for mind-blowing quality in setting description and player options, not efficiency, intuition or sense.
    Look at any setting or series that involves multiple books. They are all doing the same thing as Exalted, and for similar reasons(money is part of the equation, as well as timing, logistics, etc).
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    no no no, this is different.

    the Exalted splats don't feel like they are apart of a cohesive whole, they feel like seven different worlds that just so happen to be right next to each other.
    I get the impression that a bunch of things fit together in other RPG's yes, but the Exalted splats, no, I don't see how they are cohesive, they are so exception based and focused on differentiating them, that they honestly looks like they gone out of their way to make seven different worlds, seven different overlapping realities, thats the feel I'm getting, thats what I'm receiving from these Exalted splats, and Creation, the setting itself, I'm receiving a completely different eighth feel from that. they don't feel like one world, they feel like eight different worlds, that are all right next to each other! whats presented in the Dragon-Blooded book, whats presented in the Solar book and whats presented in the Compasses are all completely different things I'm receiving even though they are all talking about the same place!

    I mean is the reality that a Solar will kick ass, that Dragon-Blooded with kick ass or that the situation is too complicated for either of that to happen? answer: none of these, cause the setting is eight different realities that all disagree with each other, all focusing on the same world.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Raziere View Post
    no no no, this is different.

    the Exalted splats don't feel like they are apart of a cohesive whole, they feel like seven different worlds that just so happen to be right next to each other.
    I get the impression that a bunch of things fit together in other RPG's yes, but the Exalted splats, no, I don't see how they are cohesive, they are so exception based and focused on differentiating them, that they honestly looks like they gone out of their way to make seven different worlds, seven different overlapping realities, thats the feel I'm getting, thats what I'm receiving from these Exalted splats, and Creation, the setting itself, I'm receiving a completely different eighth feel from that. they don't feel like one world, they feel like eight different worlds, that are all right next to each other! whats presented in the Dragon-Blooded book, whats presented in the Solar book and whats presented in the Compasses are all completely different things I'm receiving even though they are all talking about the same place!

    I mean is the reality that a Solar will kick ass, that Dragon-Blooded with kick ass or that the situation is too complicated for either of that to happen? answer: none of these, cause the setting is eight different realities that all disagree with each other, all focusing on the same world.
    This isn't directed against you specifically as I see this often. Apart is a word which means separated. A part is a phrase that means together. Without that space the meaning is totally reversed. Also, X is a part of Y or X is apart from Y.

    Now, on to your actual point. That is actually fairly realistic given the communications infrastructure in Creation. In the Realm, the Lunar Kingdoms on the Edge of the Wyld are as exotic and half mythic in the same way China was to Europe before the Age of Sail. Most people will be buried within a hundred yards of where they were born and never have been more than one or two dozen miles from home. Most of the splats really don't interact with each other in a meaningful sense.

    To the peasant on the Blessed Isle, the Empress ruling All Under Heaven is more or less literal. In the world as they understand it, it is true. The only one's who have the proper sense of scope also tend to be native to somewhere that isn't Creation. Sidereals in Heaven, Abyssals in the Underworld, and Infernals in Hell. Autochtonians don't have a true understanding of the scope of their world. That leaves Terrestrials in the Center where they are rulers of all they survey, the Lunars near the Wyld where they are rulers of all they survey (in the Creation, the Wyld is its own topic), and the Solars who are kind of dropped into the middle of things.

    tldr: Most splats don't interact with each other often enough for there to be a general character to their relations.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    My personal mind list of favorites has a lot of draws, so instead of trying to make a list it's probably going to be more practical to just put them into "tiers of interest". I don't think the inhabitants of each tier are going to surprise anyone, though.

    Tier 1 (Always Interested Tier): Alchemicals, Sidereals

    Tier 2 (Really Cool Tier): Lunars, Raksha, Tyrant Lizards (well, I'm assuming more "dinosaurs in general". Clawstriders also need love!)

    Tier 3 (Neat Tier): Dragonblooded, Heroic Mortals, Jadeborn

    Tier 4 (I Guess It Could Work Tier): Godblooded, Solars, Dragon Kings

    Tier 5 (Not Really Very Interested Tier): Ghosts

    Tier 6 (I Think I'll Pass Tier): Infernals, Gods and similar spirits

    Tier 7 (Only Playing This Under Physical Coercion Tier): Abyssals, Lintha.
    Last edited by Drascin; 2012-10-31 at 08:14 AM.
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    Default Re: General Exalted Discussion XII: One More and Get a Free Deathlord

    Tier 1 (Always Interested): Solars

    Tier 2 (Really Cool): Sidereals, Infernals, Terrifying Argent Witches

    Tier 3 (Neat): Alchemicals, Dragonblooded

    Tier 4 (Meh): Raksha

    Tier 5 (No way): Jadeborn, Godblooded, Dragon Kings, Ghosts, Gods and similar spirits, Heroic Mortals

    Tier 7 (Only Playing This Under Physical Coercion): Lunars, Abyssals, Lintha

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