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    Default Ultimate Skillmonkies

    The factotum is pretty much the ultimate skillmonkey class, with its ability to pick any class skill, intelligence focus, and delightful inspiration point mechanic. But a great deal of its effectiveness is tied up in its magic, and the necessity for it to use obscure tactics like iajatsu focus to deal damage. And, worse, it's not the most familiar archetype.

    So. Here I take the basic

    The Rogue

    Hit Die: d8
    All skills are class skills.
    Skill Points at 1st level: (8+Intelligence modifier) x4
    Skill Points at each additional level: 8+Intelligence modifier

    Level BAB Fort Ref Will Inspiration Points Special Sneak Attack
    1st +0 +0 +2 +0 0+Int Inspiration, Cunning Insight, Sneak Attack, Trapfinding +1d6
    2nd +1 +0 +3 +0 0 +Int Evasion, Cunning knowledge +1d6
    3rd +2 +1 +3 +1 1 +Int Brains over brawn, Trap Sense +2 +2d6
    4th +3 +1 +4 +1 1 +Int Uncanny Dodge +2d6
    5th +3 +1 +4 +1 1 +Int Cunning defense +3d6
    6th +4 +2 +5 +2 2 +Int Trap Sense +4 +3d6
    7th +5 +2 +5 +2 2 +Int Improved Sneak Attack +4d6
    8th +6 +2 +6 +2 2 +Int Cunning surge, Improved Uncanny Dodge +4d6
    9th +6 +3 +6 +3 3 +Int Hide in Plain Sight, Trap Sense +6 +5d6
    10th +7 +3 +7 +3 3 +Int Special Ability +5d6
    11th +8 +3 +7 +3 3 +Int Cunning breach +6d6
    12th +9 +4 +8 +4 4 +Int Improved cunning defense, Trap Sense +8 +6d6
    13th +9 +4 +8 +4 4 +Int Special Ability +7d6
    14th +10 +4 +9 +4 4 +Int Cunning dodge +7d6
    15th +11 +5 +9 +5 5 +Int Master Sneak Attack, Trap Sense +10 +8d6
    16th +12 +5 +10 +5 5 +Int Special Ability +8d6
    17th +12 +5 +10 +5 5 +Int Hide in the Light +9d6
    18th +13 +6 +11 +6 6 +Int Trap Master +9d6
    19th +14 +6 +11 +6 6 +Int Special Ability +10d6
    20th +15 +6 +12 +6 6 +Int Cunning brilliance +10d6

    Class Features

    Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A rogue is proficient with all simple and martial weapons, and with light armor and shields (except tower shields).

    Inspiration (Ex): The rogue is a dabbler, a professional explorer who plunders a wide variety of fields to find the tools he needs to survive. But while a rogue learns many paths, he masters none of them. Rather than train in a given field, he masters all the basics and manages to pull out something useful when the situation is desperate enough. To represent this seemingly random body of knowledge, a rogue gains inspiration points that he can spend to activate his abilities. At the beginning of each encounter, he gains a number of inspiration points equal to his Intelligence modifier. Expended Inspiration Points regenerate at a rate of one per minute. At any one time, he may have a maximum number of inspiration points as shown on the table above.

    Cunning Insight (Ex): Before making an attack roll, damage roll, or saving throw, you can spend 1 inspiration point to gain a competence bonus on the roll equal to your Intelligence modifier. Cunning insight does not require an action, and you can use it as often as you wish during your turn or others’ turns—provided that you have the inspiration points to spend. Because this ability provides a competence bonus, it does not stack with itself.

    Sneak Attack (Ex): If you can catch an opponent when he is unable to defend himself effectively from your attack, you can strike a vital spot for extra damage. Any time your target would be denied a Dexterity bonus to AC (whether the target actually has a Dexterity bonus or not), or when you flanks you target, you gains a bonus to damage, as shown on the table above. Should you score a critical hit with a sneak attack, this extra damage is not multiplied.

    Ranged attacks can count as sneak attacks only if the target is within 30 feet. With a sap (blackjack) or an unarmed strike, a you can make a sneak attack that deals nonlethal damage instead of lethal damage. You cannot use a weapon that deals lethal damage to deal nonlethal damage in a sneak attack, not even with the usual -4 penalty.

    You can only sneak attack living creatures with discernible anatomies—undead, constructs, oozes, plants, and incorporeal creatures lack vital areas to attack. Any creature that is immune to critical hits is not vulnerable to sneak attacks. You must be able to see the target well enough to pick out a vital spot and must be able to reach such a spot. This ability generally comes into play against creatures who are at least two sizes larger than the you and tall. For example, a human you could sneak attack an ogre (large), or a remorhaz (huge, long), but not a titan (huge, tall). Some sneak attack variants, like hamstring, might still work (DM's digression).

    Trapfinding (Ex): Rogues can use the Search skill to locate traps when the task has a Difficulty Class higher than 20. Finding a nonmagical trap has a DC of at least 20, or higher if it is well hidden. Finding a magic trap has a DC of 25 + the level of the spell used to create it. Rogues can use the Disable Device skill to disarm magic traps. A magic trap generally has a DC of 25 + the level of the spell used to create it. A rogue who beats a trap’s DC by 10 or more with a Disable Device check can study a trap, figure out how it works, and bypass it (with her party) without disarming it.

    Evasion (Ex): At 2nd level and higher, you can avoid even magical and unusual attacks with great agility. If you make a successful Reflex saving throw against an attack that normally deals half damage on a successful save, you instead take no damage. You may only use this ability when wearing light or no armor. You do not benefit from this ability when unconscious or helpless.

    Cunning Knowledge (Ex): Starting at 2nd level, when making a check involving a skill in which you have at least 1 rank, you can spend 1 inspiration point to gain a bonus on the check equal to one half your rogue level.

    Brains over Brawn (Ex): At 3rd level, you may use your Intelligence modifier in place of your Strength modifier for attack rolls, skill checks, and ability checks.

    Trap Sense (Ex): At 3rd level, you gain an intuitive sense that alerts you to danger from traps, giving you a +2 bonus on Reflex saves made to avoid traps and a +2 dodge bonus to AC against attacks made by traps. These bonuses increase by 2 every third level (+4 at 6th, +6 at 9th, and so on). Trap sense bonuses gained from multiple classes stack.

    Uncanny Dodge (Ex): Starting at 4th level, you can react to danger before her senses would normally allow her to do so. You retain your Dexterity and dodge bonus to AC (if any) even if caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. However, you still loses these bonuses bonus if immobilized. If you already uncanny dodge from a different class, you automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead.

    Cunning Defense (Ex): You study your opponents and learn to anticipate their attacks. Starting at 5th level, you can spend 1 inspiration point to gain your Intelligence modifier as a dodge bonus to Armor Class against one opponent for 1 round. Using this ability is a free action. You gain this benefit even while wearing medium or heavy armor. You can use this ability multiple times to gain a bonus against different opponents, but you cannot use it more than once during your turn against a single foe.

    Improved Sneak Attack (Ex): At 7th level, you may pick one of two tracks, and gain the accompanying ability:
    • Archer: The range at which you can make sneak attacks with ranged weapons increases to 60ft.
    • Fencer: A foe struck by a melee sneak attack remains vulnerable to sneak attacks for one additional round. This ability can only be applied once per foe per encounter.


    Cunning Surge (Ex): Starting at 8th level, you learn to push yourself when needed. By spending 3 inspiration points, you can take an extra standard action during your turn.

    Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex): Starting at 8th level, you can no longer be flanked. This defense denies another character the ability to sneak attack you by flanking you, unless the attacker has at least four more levels of sneak attack granting classes than then you do.

    Hide in Plain Sight (Ex): At 9th level, you can attempt to use the Hide skill even while being observed. To do so, you must be within your normal movement distance of a source of cover or concealment, and take a full-round action. If you succeed on your Hide check, you successfully “vanish” and move to the hiding spot.

    Special Abilities: On attaining 10th level, and at every three levels thereafter (13th, 16th, and 19th), you a special ability of your choice from among the following options.
    • Crippling Strike (Ex)- You may sneak attack opponents with such precision that your blows weaken and hamper them. After successfully damaging a foe with a sneak attack, you may spend an inspiration point to also inflict 1 point of Strength or Dexterity damage per die of sneak attack damage. Ability points lost to damage return on their own at the rate of 1 point per day for each damaged ability. You may only make one Crippling Strike per turn, even if you hit with multiple attacks, each dealing sneak attack damage. A successful Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 level + your Intelligence modifier) halves the ability damage.
    • Hamstring (Ex)- After successfully damaging a foe with a sneak attack, you may spend an inspiration point to immobilize them. At the beginning of each of their turns, they may attempt a Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 level + your Intelligence modifier) to reduce the effect from immobilization to entanglement, and then from entanglement to nothing.
    • Improved Evasion (Ex)- This ability works like evasion, except that while you still take no damage on a successful Reflex saving throw against attacks, henceforth you takes only half damage on a failed save. You do not gain the benefits of improved evasion while unconscious or helpless.
    • Opportunist (Ex)- Once per round, you can spend an inspiration point to make an attack of opportunity against an opponent who has just been struck for damage in melee by another character. This attack counts as your attack of opportunity for that round. If you have the ability to make multiple attacks of opportunity in a round, you may use this ability multiple times, spending a new inspiration point each round you attempt to do so.
    • Skill Mastery (Ex)- You become so certain in the use of certain skills that you can use them reliably even under adverse conditions. Upon gaining this ability, select a number of skills equal to your Intelligence modifier. When making a skill check with one of these skills, you may take 10 even if stress and distractions would normally prevent you from doing so. You may gain this special ability multiple times, selecting additional skills for it to apply to each time.
    • Slippery Mind (Ex)- This ability represents the your ability to wriggle free from magical effects that would otherwise control or compel her. if you are affected by an enchantment spell or effect and fail your saving throw, you may spend an inspiration point and attempt it again 1 round later at the same DC. You may only use this ability once per casting of any given effect.
    • Feat- You may gain a bonus feat in place of a special ability.


    Cunning Breach (Su): Starting at 11th level, your broad knowledge allows you to study an opponent and gain a brief flash of insight to breach her defenses. By spending 1 inspiration point as a free action, you can ignore a single target’s damage reduction for 1 round, and inflict sneak attack damage on creatures normally immune to it.

    Improved Cunning Defense (Ex): At 12th level, you gain your Intelligence score as a dodge bonus to Armor Class. You no longer need to spend an inspiration point to gain this benefit. Unlike the standard cunning defense ability, you do not gain this benefit when wearing medium or heavy armor.

    Cunning Dodge (Ex): Starting at 13th level, your luck, reflexes, and intuition allow you to avoid an attack or spell that would otherwise defeat you. If you take damage that would reduce you to 0 or fewer hit points, you can spend 4 inspiration points as an immediate action to ignore the damage. You dodge out of the way, take cover from a spell, or otherwise escape. You can use this ability once per day.

    Master Sneak Attack (Ex): At 15th level, the ability you gained from Improved Sneak Attack improves again.
    • Archer: You can sneak attack any foe within range of your weapon.
    • Fencer: A foe struck by a melee sneak attack remains vulnerable to sneak attacks for one additional round. This ability can be applied twice per foe— in other words, you can “chain” three sneak attacks together.


    Hide in the Light (Ex): At 17th level, your mastery of stealth is almost supernatural. You can make Hide checks without penalty, even without the benefits of cover or concealment.

    Trap Master (Ex): Beginning at 18th level, you are immune to traps. All attack rolls made by traps against you automatically miss, and you automatically succeed on all reflex saves made to resist trap-based effects.

    Cunning Brilliance (Ex): At 20th level, you become the ultimate jack of all trades. Your sharp mind and keen sense of your surroundings allow you to duplicate almost any ability you witness. At the start of each day, choose three extraordinary class abilities. Each ability must be available to a standard character class at 15th level or lower, and must appear on the advancement table or in the text description for that class. By spending 4 inspiration points as a free action, you gain the benefits and drawbacks of one chosen ability for 1 minute. You use the ability as if your level in the relevant class equaled your rogue level. You can use each chosen class ability once per day.

    For example, if you use a monk’s flurry of blows ability, you gain all the benefits and drawbacks described under Flurry of Blows (PH 40). You do not gain the benefits of unarmed strike, because that is a separate ability in the monk’s class description.

    *With this change, the Font of Inspiration feat should probably be reduced to just adding 2 points every time to take it.

    Swashbuckler ACF

    Note: this is roughly an ACF, but it's big and complex enough that it's easier just to present it as its own thing.

    Hit Die: d8

    The swashbuckler’s class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Balance (Dex), Bluff (Cha), Climb (Str), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Disguise (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Gather Information (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (Local), Knowledge (Nobility and Royalty), Listen (Wisdom), Open Lock (Dex), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Sense Motive (Wis), Slight of Hand (Dex), Spot (Wis), Swim (Str), Tumble (Dex), and Use Rope (Dex).
    Skill Points at 1st level: (6+Intelligence modifier) x4
    Skill Points at each additional level: 6+Intelligence modifier

    Level Base Attack Bonus Fort Ref Will Inspiration Points Special Precise Strike
    1st +1 +0 +2 +0 0 +Cha Inspiration, Suave Insight, Precise Strike, Trapfinding +1d4
    2nd +2 +0 +3 +0 0 +Cha Evasion, Suave Dabbler +1d4
    3rd +3 +1 +3 +1 1 +Cha Beauty over Brawn, Buckle Your Swash +2d4
    4th +4 +1 +4 +1 1 +Cha Uncanny Dodge +2d4
    5th +5 +1 +4 +1 1 +Cha Suave Defense +3d4
    6th +6/+1 +2 +5 +2 2 +Cha Acrobatic Movement +3d4
    7th +7/+2 +2 +5 +2 2 +Cha Combat Style +4d4
    8th +8/+3 +2 +6 +2 2 +Cha Charismatic Surge, Improved Uncanny Dodge +4d4
    9th +9/+4 +3 +6 +3 3 +Cha Fast Talk +5d4
    10th +10/+5 +3 +7 +3 3 +Cha Special Ability +5d4
    11th +11/+6/+1 +3 +7 +3 3 +Cha Flamboyant Attack +6d4
    12th +12/+7/+2 +4 +8 +4 4 +Cha Improved cunning defense +6d4
    13th +13/+8/+3 +4 +8 +4 4 +Cha Special Ability +7d4
    14th +14/+9/+4 +4 +9 +4 4 +Cha Favored of Fate +7d4
    15th +15/+10/+5 +5 +9 +5 5 +Cha Precise Barrage +8d4
    16th +16/+11/+6/+1 +5 +10 +5 5 +Cha Special Ability +8d4
    17th +17/+12/+7/+2 +5 +10 +5 5 +Cha Lightning Words +9d4
    18th +18/+13/+8/+3 +6 +11 +6 6 +Cha Acrobatic Perfection +9d4
    19th +19/+14/+9/+4 +6 +11 +6 6 +Cha Special Ability +10d4
    20th +20/+15/+10/+5 +6 +12 +6 6 +Cha Spotlight +10d4

    Weapon and Armor Proficiency: A swashbuckler is proficient with all simple and martial melee and thrown weapons, and with light armor, but not with shields.

    Inspiration (Ex): The swashbuckler is a dabbler, a professional explorer who plunders a wide variety of fields to find the tools he needs to survive. But while a swashbuckler learns many paths, he masters none of them. Rather than train in a given field, he masters all the basics and manages to pull out something useful when the situation is desperate enough. To represent this seemingly random body of knowledge, a swashbuckler gains inspiration points that he can spend to activate his abilities. At the beginning of each encounter, he gains a number of inspiration points equal to his Charisma modifier. Expended inspiration points regenerate at a rate of one per minute. At any one time, he may have a maximum number of inspiration points as shown on the table above.

    Suave Insight (Ex): Before making an attack roll, damage roll, or saving throw, you can spend 1 inspiration point to gain a competence bonus on the roll equal to your Charisma modifier. Suave insight does not require an action, and you can use it as often as you wish during your turn or others’ turns—provided that you have the inspiration points to spend. Because this ability provides a competence bonus, it does not stack with itself.

    Precise Strike (Ex): A swashbuckler thrives on momentum and risk. When wielding a light or one-handed weapon and either a light weapon or no weapon in your off hand, every time you perform a Balance, Bluff, Climb, Escape Artist, Intimidate, Jump, Sleight of Hand, Tumble or Use Rope check during in a combat encounter, and do not take 10 or take 20, you may spend an Inspiration Point to make each attack that round deal 1d4 extra damage. At third level, and every subsequent odd-numbered level, this damage increases by 1d64.

    This extra damage only works against living creatures with discernible anatomies— undead, constructs, oozes, plants, and incorporeal creatures lack vital areas to attack. Any creature that is immune to critical hits is not vulnerable to sneak attacks. You must be able to see the target well enough to pick out a vital spot and must be able to reach such a spot. This ability generally comes into play against creatures who are at least two sizes larger than the you and tall. For example, a human you could sneak attack an ogre (large), or a remorhaz (huge, long), but not a titan (huge, tall). Some sneak attack variants, like hamstring, might still work (DM's digression).

    Any creature that is immune to critical hits is not vulnerable to a precise strike, and any item or ability that protects a creature from critical hits also protects a creature from a precise strike.

    Evasion (Ex): At 2nd level and higher, you can avoid even magical and unusual attacks with great agility. If you make a successful Reflex saving throw against an attack that normally deals half damage on a successful save, you instead take no damage. You may only use this ability when wearing light or no armor. You do not benefit from this ability when unconscious or helpless.

    Suave Dabbler (Ex): Starting at 2nd level, when making a check involving a skill in which you have at least 1 rank, you can spend 1 inspiration point to gain a bonus on the check equal to one half your swashbuckler level.

    Beauty over Brawn (Ex): At 3rd level, you may use your Charisma modifier in place of your Strength modifier for attack rolls, skill checks, and ability checks.

    Buckle your Swash (Ex): Starting at 3rd level, you may add twice your Swashbuckler level as a perfection bonus to all Balance, Jump, and Tumble checks. This bonus only applies when you’re wearing light or no armor and not carrying a heavy load.

    Uncanny Dodge (Ex): Starting at 4th level, you can react to danger before her senses would normally allow her to do so. You retain your Dexterity and dodge bonus to AC (if any) even if caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. However, you still loses these bonuses bonus if immobilized. If you already uncanny dodge from a different class, you automatically gains improved uncanny dodge instead.

    Suave Defense (Ex): You study your opponents and learn to anticipate their attacks. Starting at 5th level, you can spend 1 inspiration point to gain your Charisma modifier as a dodge bonus to Armor Class against one opponent for 1 round. Using this ability is a free action. You gain this benefit even while wearing medium or heavy armor. You can use this ability multiple times to gain a bonus against different opponents, but you cannot use it more than once during your turn against a single foe.

    Acrobatic Movement (Ex): Beginning at 6th level, you may move and charge over difficult terrain, through the spaces of allies, jump, swing, and so on at full speed, although you still must make any appropriate skill checks.

    Combat Style (Ex): At 7th level, you may pick one of two tracks, and gain the accompanying ability:
    • Duelist: When wielding two weapons and making a standard action attack, you may spend one inspiration point to make one attack at your highest base attack bonus with your off-hand weapon as part of the same action.
    • Einhander: When wielding a light or one-handed weapon in your main hand and no weapon or shield in your off hand, you may add one-half your swashbuckler as a deflection bonus to armor class.


    Charismatic Surge (Ex): Starting at 8th level, you learn to push yourself when needed. By spending 3 inspiration points, you can take an extra standard action during your turn.

    Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex): Starting at 8th level, you can no longer be flanked. This defense denies another character the ability to sneak attack you by flanking you, unless the attacker has at least four more levels of sneak attack granting classes than then you do.

    Fast Talk (Ex): Beginning at 9th level, you can talk circles around anyone. As a full-round action, you may attempt to convince a target that you are their friend. The target must make a Will save with a DC of 10 + ½ you swashbuckler level plus your Charisma modifier or be taken in— for the next day, you may choose to add your swashbuckler level to any Bluff, Diplomacy, or Sense Motive check made against the target. You may gain this bonus to a number of checks equal to your Charisma modifier. The target gains a +4 bonus to their saving throw if they are currently being attacked by you or your allies, and a +6 bonus if you have personally attacked them within the last hour. If a target successfully saves against this ability, he cannot be affected by it again for 24 hours.

    Special Abilities: On attaining 10th level, and at every three levels thereafter (13th, 16th, and 19th), you a special ability of your choice from among the following options.

    • Crippling Strike (Ex)- You may sneak attack opponents with such precision that your blows weaken and hamper them. After successfully damaging a foe with a precise strike, you may spend an inspiration point to also inflict 1 point of Strength or Dexterity damage per die of sneak attack damage. Ability points lost to damage return on their own at the rate of 1 point per day for each damaged ability. You may only make one Crippling Strike per turn, even if you hit with multiple attacks, each dealing precise strike damage. A successful Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 level + your Charisma modifier) halves the ability damage.
    • Hamstring (Ex)- After successfully damaging a foe with a precise strike, you may spend an inspiration point to immobilize them. At the beginning of each of their turns, they may attempt a Fortitude save (DC 10 + 1/2 level + your Charisma modifier) to reduce the effect from immobilization to entanglement, and then from entanglement to nothing.
    • Improved Evasion (Ex)- This ability works like evasion, except that while you still take no damage on a successful Reflex saving throw against attacks, henceforth you takes only half damage on a failed save. You do not gain the benefits of improved evasion while unconscious or helpless.
    • Opportunist (Ex)- Once per round, you can spend an inspiration point to make an attack of opportunity against an opponent who has just been struck for damage in melee by another character. This attack counts as your attack of opportunity for that round. If you have the ability to make multiple attacks of opportunity in a round, you may use this ability multiple times, spending a new inspiration point each round you attempt to do so.
    • Skill Mastery (Ex)- You become so certain in the use of certain skills that you can use them reliably even under adverse conditions. Upon gaining this ability, select a number of skills equal to your Intelligence modifier. When making a skill check with one of these skills, you may take 10 even if stress and distractions would normally prevent you from doing so. You may gain this special ability multiple times, selecting additional skills for it to apply to each time.
    • Slippery Mind (Ex)- This ability represents the your ability to wriggle free from magical effects that would otherwise control or compel her. if you are affected by an enchantment spell or effect and fail your saving throw, you may spend an inspiration point and attempt it again 1 round later at the same DC. You may only use this ability once per casting of any given effect.
    • Feat- You may gain a bonus feat in place of a special ability.


    Flamboyant Attack (Ex): Starting at 11th level, your broad knowledge allows you to study an opponent and gain a brief flash of insight to breach her defenses. By spending 1 inspiration point as a free action, you can ignore a single target’s damage reduction for 1 round, and inflict precise strike damage on creatures normally immune to it.

    Improved Suave Defense (Ex): At 12th level, you gain your Charisma score as a dodge bonus to Armor Class. You no longer need to spend an inspiration point to gain this benefit. Unlike the standard suave defense ability, you do not gain this benefit when wearing medium or heavy armor.

    Favored of Fate (Ex): Starting at 13th level, your luck, reflexes, and intuition allow you to avoid an attack or spell that would otherwise defeat you. If you take damage that would reduce you to 0 or fewer hit points, you can spend 4 inspiration points as an immediate action to ignore the damage. You dodge out of the way, take cover from a spell, or otherwise escape. You can use this ability once per day.

    Precise Barrage (Ex): Beginning at 15th level, when you spend an inspiration point for Precise Strike, you add the bonus damage to all attacks you make that round, rather than just the first.

    Lightning Words (Ex): Starting at 17th level, you may use your Fast Talk ability as a swift action. In addition, when speaking to an already charmed target, you may force them to make another Will save or be affected as though by a geas/quest spell. Again, a target who successfully makes his save cannot be affected by this ability again for 24 hours.

    Acrobatic Perfection (Ex): Starting at 18th level, you may take 20 on Balance, Jump, and Tumble checks. Doing so takes no longer than the check she is attempting to make normally does.

    Spotlight (Ex): Beginning at 20th level, you take a standard action as an immediate action, or a full-round action as a standard action. However, doing so attracts the attention of all nearby creatures, who must make Will saves with a DC equal to 10 + ½ Swashbuckler level + you Charisma modifier or focus their attention— and, more importantly, attacks— on you for 1d4 rounds.
    Last edited by Grod_The_Giant; 2014-10-10 at 03:10 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
    Grod's Law: You cannot and should not balance bad mechanics by making them annoying to use
    Major Works:
    • STaRS: The Simple Tabletop Roleplaying System; my attempt at a generic rules-light system.
    • Giants and Graveyards: My collected 3.5 revisions-- houserules, class fixes, ban lists and more.
    • Chopping Down the Christmas Tree: Rules for low- or no-magic item games of 3.5.
    • D&D in M&M-- Balancing 3.5 by porting it lock, stock, and barrel into a more balanced system.

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    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Arcanist's Avatar

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    Default Re: The Roguetotum (3.5, PEACH)

    You could have allowed access to the magic, but left it at a lower level then 7 (I recommend 5) and give it a limited spell list.

    Makes the Rogue more effective and gives it the Master Thief type thing some people (including myself) wanna see... Tired of the Wizard having the response "I use rope trick and hide away to re-prep spells"
    Last edited by Arcanist; 2012-10-23 at 09:25 PM.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: The Roguetotum (3.5, PEACH)

    I love the wording on Hide in Plain Sight; that's much clearer and more intuitive than any other version I've seen. But giving it at 6th level? Wow. He can basically sneak anywhere with impunity at that point; even if he's discovered, he can just hide again. Sneaking around in the middle of an army is not even very difficult. I'm not sure what the exact implications of that would be, but it's more than I think I'm comfortable with at 6th level.

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    Troll in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: The Roguetotum (3.5, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Arcanist View Post
    You could have allowed access to the magic, but left it at a lower level then 7 (I recommend 5) and give it a limited spell list.

    Makes the Rogue more effective and gives it the Master Thief type thing some people (including myself) wanna see... Tired of the Wizard having the response "I use rope trick and hide away to re-prep spells"
    I... the point of this rewrite was to remove the magic from the factotum.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vadskye View Post
    I love the wording on Hide in Plain Sight; that's much clearer and more intuitive than any other version I've seen. But giving it at 6th level? Wow. He can basically sneak anywhere with impunity at that point; even if he's discovered, he can just hide again. Sneaking around in the middle of an army is not even very difficult. I'm not sure what the exact implications of that would be, but it's more than I think I'm comfortable with at 6th level.
    Hmm, you might be right. I put it just before greater invisibility comes online, but I wouldn't mind pushing it back. RAW, the earliest I can think of where you can pick it up is 8th level, with a 1-level dip into Shadowdancer. Maybe move it back to 9th? (Thanks for the compliment on the wording, by though)
    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
    Grod's Law: You cannot and should not balance bad mechanics by making them annoying to use
    Major Works:
    • STaRS: The Simple Tabletop Roleplaying System; my attempt at a generic rules-light system.
    • Giants and Graveyards: My collected 3.5 revisions-- houserules, class fixes, ban lists and more.
    • Chopping Down the Christmas Tree: Rules for low- or no-magic item games of 3.5.
    • D&D in M&M-- Balancing 3.5 by porting it lock, stock, and barrel into a more balanced system.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
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    Aug 2012

    Default Re: The Roguetotum (3.5, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
    I... the point of this rewrite was to remove the magic from the factotum.


    Hmm, you might be right. I put it just before greater invisibility comes online, but I wouldn't mind pushing it back. RAW, the earliest I can think of where you can pick it up is 8th level, with a 1-level dip into Shadowdancer. Maybe move it back to 9th? (Thanks for the compliment on the wording, by though)
    Tying it to Greater Invisibility is good in theory, but I think it slightly misses the point. HiPS isn't really a "combat" mechanic, in most circumstances; the requirement that you spend your entire turn hiding means that in all but a very few encounters, you're wasting your time. HiPS matters because it completely changes the way the roguetotum approaches non-combat uses of stealth. You know how in stealth video games, if you get found out, you have to desparately run away from whatever is chasing you or kill them quickly before they alert others? I think that's how stealth normally works in D&D. HiPS completely turns that on its head; it's like having an instant "reset the alarm" button that you can press all the time. You no longer have to run from people who have found you out; you can just keep moving without even paying them any mind. Pushing it to 9th level (which just one behind the Shadowdancer - good plan) makes more sense to me; the roguetotum has already spent a good portion of the game operating under "normal stealth" rules, and it's a cool benefit. By 9th level, being able to mostly ignore even highly skilled (by your average not-so-high-level game world standards) guards is not such a big deal.

    That's a lot of words to say "Yeah, I agree with that idea".

    As a side note, has Trap Sense ever felt really annoyingly worthless and situational to you? I replaced it in my game with Danger Sense, which adds to Initiative instead, and it feels a lot more useful.

    Also, with the Crippling Strike wording you have now, a 10th level rogue can put down a dragon - any dragon in two turns. That seems very wrong to me. High levels of ability damage are hard to come by in D&D; it's pretty difficult to balance. I think allowing Crippling Strike to hit Dex and restricting it to 1/round still leaves it as a good special ability.
    Last edited by Vadskye; 2012-10-23 at 11:37 PM.

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    Default Re: The Roguetotum (3.5, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Vadskye View Post
    As a side note, has Trap Sense ever felt really annoyingly worthless and situational to you? I replaced it in my game with Danger Sense, which adds to Initiative instead, and it feels a lot more useful.
    Very much so, but I think I've included traps in maybe one adventure I've ever run, so I may be a bit biased. It's probably nice to have if you do ever trip a trap, but... there's a reason I pair it with a nicer ability as often as I can.
    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
    Grod's Law: You cannot and should not balance bad mechanics by making them annoying to use
    Major Works:
    • STaRS: The Simple Tabletop Roleplaying System; my attempt at a generic rules-light system.
    • Giants and Graveyards: My collected 3.5 revisions-- houserules, class fixes, ban lists and more.
    • Chopping Down the Christmas Tree: Rules for low- or no-magic item games of 3.5.
    • D&D in M&M-- Balancing 3.5 by porting it lock, stock, and barrel into a more balanced system.

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    Default Re: The Roguetotum (3.5, PEACH)

    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
    I think we can all agree that the Factotum is what the Rogue ought to have been.
    Eh, not sure I really agree with that. I don't know what the exact inspiration for the Factotum was, but IMO the two classes have a significantly different play style.
    Giving some factotum abilities to the rogue can make it less MAD and more powerful in combat, but I don't think it really keeps the spirit or the flavor of either class. When I was doing a rogue fix I basically made a mashup between the rogue, the CAd ninja, and the swashbuckler. The rogue can be your sneaky, spying, dirty-fighting skill expert, and the factotum can be a magic using, shapeshifting jack of all trades that doesn't (or at least shouldn't) be better rogue-skills than the rogue. I think there's room for both.

    If you are looking to capitalize on the sneaky-archetype, but don't want this class to have full-on spells, why not just let them use invisibility as a SLA? I fully support giving quasi-magic like abilities to more classes without the need for a spell progression. Then you don't have to worry about those weird "hide in plain sight" quirks where you can take cover behind your own shield and then have it disappear with you.

    In my version of the rogue fix, I had an ability that let a rogue learn to ignore the crit-immunity from enemies of different types.
    Also, I would strip out more of the restrictions on Sneak Attack, particularly against larger foes. The ability is called "sneak attack", not "headshot"; so long as the strike is surprising, why should it matter where you hit? Nothing else in the game really cares about location, why should this?


    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
    Very much so, but I think I've included traps in maybe one adventure I've ever run, so I may be a bit biased. It's probably nice to have if you do ever trip a trap, but... there's a reason I pair it with a nicer ability as often as I can.
    I like the idea of a "danger sense", maybe sort of like a spidey-sense in that it gives you either a warning or a bonus whenever your character is in trouble. This can include in combat situations, against traps, if you're about to walk into an ambush, when some one is disguised or lying to you, etc.

    Also, traps that are like "diffuse this bomb on the door or it explodes" are boring, but I've had good experiences with more creative ones.
    For example, one of our DM's described a trap that was basically a wide pit in the pathway with an invisible platform over the top. The trap was that while the platform felt solid, and would even let one person walk across, it would collapse out from under the feet of the next person who tried.
    Of course, our group was so paranoid that we had the party monk and rogue jump over, and then they strung up a rope for the wizard and meat-shield to clamber over. I thought it was a good attempt though.
    Last edited by Deepbluediver; 2012-10-24 at 04:03 PM.
    "A man is known by the company he organizes." -Ambrose Bierce

    Homebrew Extended Signature!

    Progress in my Core rebalance project: 9 of 11 classes complete
    Druid, Fighter, Cleric, Rogue, Ranger, Wizard, Sorcerer, Monk & Paladin

    Magic Fix: spell rewrites paused; rules under revision


    Non-core stuff I want to take a crack at rewriting: Healer, Warlock, Ninja, Samurai, Artificer, Soulborn Incarnum, psionics, bloodlines, and the item-crafting system

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    Default Re: Ultimate Skillmonkies

    I corrected a few errors in the original roguetotum, but more importantly, I've added a "swashbucklertotum" that's somewhere between an ACF and its own class.
    Quote Originally Posted by Grod_The_Giant View Post
    Grod's Law: You cannot and should not balance bad mechanics by making them annoying to use
    Major Works:
    • STaRS: The Simple Tabletop Roleplaying System; my attempt at a generic rules-light system.
    • Giants and Graveyards: My collected 3.5 revisions-- houserules, class fixes, ban lists and more.
    • Chopping Down the Christmas Tree: Rules for low- or no-magic item games of 3.5.
    • D&D in M&M-- Balancing 3.5 by porting it lock, stock, and barrel into a more balanced system.

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    Default Re: The Roguetotum (3.5, PEACH)

    Good stuff. I think the Swashbuckler's Precise Strike would sit better with me if it were "on 1 attack per round..." instead of "when you attack as a standard action..." as this opens it up to be combined with other things. Namely, spring attack. Though it should be noted that players could combine this with martial maneuvers or arcane channeling, neither of which makes me nervous.

    Also, in the case of the Rogue, maybe you should consider having Cunning Breach retain its "overcome SR" line. Mostly for rogues who like to use offensive wands with UMD. This additional tidbit is a bit out of flavor for a swashbuckler, though.

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