LGBTAitP #28: Come Taste the Rainbow!

[appending_doom]

Ah, costuming. Every time I get inspired I spend entirely too much time on it and drive myself a little nuts in the process.

Still, I hope you feel accomplished when you get it worked out; or at least that other people enjoy it. If I never got either of those feelings, I'd never put the effort.

And hi, I'm Drew. Friendlier than I seem, I've been assured.

[Mina Kobold]

...Oh. Well that explains a lot. lol

Also I'm not entirely sure what "totes" means, except a bag or a totem



That's true, but I can understand why so many people have such a bad taste in their mouths about feminism. Placing my own opinions aside, a disturbing number of prominent feminists have proposed artificially reducing the male population to some small percentage of the total population. Granted, any more than zero is a disturbing number for something like that, but the fact that they are not ridiculed into submission as is wont to happen with detestable people with detestable ideas in prominent positions suggests tacit approval, or at least prioritizing group cohesion over anything else; either way, it doesn't offer a good image. The fact that Mary Daly was ever given the time of day is disgraceful enough, that she was given a position as professor at such a respectable establishment as Boston College will remain a black mark on humanity's collective soul. Breeding out gays and Jews and selective abortions against girls is horrendously bigoted and unacceptable, but getting rid of men is taking a brave and noble stand? Hardly, and all of us here surely know that, as do the vast majority of people, feminists included. The problem feminism has is the same problem many other groups have though, be they religious or philosophical or political, where the most extreme and rabid members are often the loudest and most outspoken members, and that gives the entire group a bad reputation, deserved or not. What it shares with other dogmatic ideologies is a large degree of silence from members who act out taking the idea to extremes for fear of looking weak or not unified, or simply because "Well obviously that's not REAL feminism! Only a fool would think that's what we support!" While it may be true that it's not mainstream feminism, they ARE the most prominent voices for feminism in mainstream society. Finally, while the patriarchy model may be interesting and explain some things very well, it doesn't explain all problems in gender studies; "Men get harsher prison sentences than women because men rigged the system against women" requires an explanation that is... less than intuitive.

If I'm being honest, it only makes sense then that the self-described skeptical community which purports to have such a problem with dogmatic groupthink would find large swaths of feminism dubious, and again if I'm being honest I don't know that they're entirely off-base, either.

From what I can tell, that is actually not the case. While Radical Feminists (A label adopted by some who seek such things) are seemingly around, the vast majority of outspoken and loud feminists are in the ballpark of Watson, Natalie Reed and others like them. Speaking for equality and reason for all genders, while also criticising the bigoted feminists on the same level as they criticise MRAs. The stereotype of feminists being evil women-supremacists who wish to castrate every male in existence is prevalent, but it is by far a straw-man argument. In the same vein that sceptics are labelled as cynical nihilists who eat babies, so are feminists often labelled as malicious sexists who eat male-assigned babies.

Not to say that we should not fight to be more loud about egalitarian feminism, but we are not coming in large swaths of feminism. It has merely been a few instances of someone talking about how groping and rape jokes are not OK. The response was for the majority to bully the speakers into silence and call them femi-nazis. It is quite likely that I am missing some large amount of anti-men feminists from before my time, but they were not sceptical, they were bullies. As a member of both the sceptical and feminist communities, I find that "dubiousness" dubious. If you are not sure if it is not off-base, you do not hurl insults. You explain your doubts, like you did! ^_^

I found someone that said they could help with makeup. I might actually be able to go half-and-half like the individual in the photo I posted!

Congrats! ^_^

Ah, costuming. Every time I get inspired I spend entirely too much time on it and drive myself a little nuts in the process.

Still, I hope you feel accomplished when you get it worked out; or at least that other people enjoy it. If I never got either of those feelings, I'd never put the effort.

And hi, I'm Drew. Friendlier than I seem, I've been assured.

Welcome, Drew. Hope you will have fun!

PS: My apologies if I seem angry. I have been a bit annoyed at some things lately, both at myself (I can be way too stereotyping sometimes, sorry if I do that! m(_ _)m) and at some classmates. Sorry! ^_^'

PPS: *HUGS for Lena, Absol and Turkish*

[Serpentine]

and now that I think about, slang in general is a stupid concept, perpetuated by people who dislike other people other than their friends understanding them in in some mindless clique-ish obsession, and thus only rendering language less comprehensible for the whole of humanity. I know, sounds a little hateful and extreme, but I'm just being slightly grumpy.

I couldn't disagree more. Slang is some of the most colourful, interesting language that helps to generate and distinguish whole cultures and often helps drive the development of language itself. One of the many things that excite me about coming into contact with and learning about a foreign culture is learning about their slang, how it works, and what it says about the society that developed it. Slang is almost as necessary, inevitable and fundamental an aspect of human communication as grammar.

[Kindablue]

I dislike that word, in my honest opinion, that word is a barbaric and violent mangling of "totally", sounds stupid and will only confuse things further.

and now that I think about, slang in general is a stupid concept, perpetuated by people who dislike other people other than their friends understanding them in in some mindless clique-ish obsession, and thus only rendering language less comprehensible for the whole of humanity. I know, sounds a little hateful and extreme, but I'm just being slightly grumpy.

That's just, like, your opinion, man. And I've never actually met anyone who talks like that, so you can feel a bit better that it's not a totes popular word.

[appending_doom]

I couldn't disagree more. Slang is some of the most colourful, interesting language that helps to generate and distinguish whole cultures and often helps drive the development of language itself. One of the many things that excite me about coming into contact with and learning about a foreign culture is learning about their slang, how it works, and what it says about the society that developed it. Slang is almost as necessary, inevitable and fundamental an aspect of human communication as grammar.

Discussions like these remind me of the linguistic maps showing what names people in the US give to their carbonated drinks.

Also, you know, Shakespeare, who just made up words left and right.

[Serpentine]

Words for swimwear is a good one in Australia. Depending on where you're from, it can be swimmers, bathers, cossie or togs.

[Asta Kask]

Why are kangaroo infants called 'joeys'?

And hi Appending Doom! We don't bite unless you pay extra.

[Zorg]

The etymology is lost in time - might be a corrupted native word or possibly even derived from slang!
And it's also the term for any marsupial's young.


Serps - don't forget boardies (I've heard it used as a generic unisex term) and the good ol' budgie smugglers.

[Astrella]

*sigh* So I didn't go out for clothes and now I'm wondering if I should even bother going to the halloween thingie. And to top it of I ended up hurting one of my friends. :/

How am I going to get there when I can't even do this?

[Arachu]

And hi, I'm Drew. Friendlier than I seem, I've been assured.

Hi~ ^_^

PS: My apologies if I seem angry. I have been a bit annoyed at some things lately, both at myself (I can be way too stereotyping sometimes, sorry if I do that! m(_ _)m) and at some classmates. Sorry! ^_^'

*Hugs!* I think some (most?) Radfems don't fit the stereotype either, but you made a good point...

I couldn't disagree more. Slang is some of the most colourful, interesting language that helps to generate and distinguish whole cultures and often helps drive the development of language itself. One of the many things that excite me about coming into contact with and learning about a foreign culture is learning about their slang, how it works, and what it says about the society that developed it. Slang is almost as necessary, inevitable and fundamental an aspect of human communication as grammar.

If nobody ever made words up, there wouldn't be an English language to mangle.

*sigh* So I didn't go out for clothes and now I'm wondering if I should even bother going to the halloween thingie. And to top it of I ended up hurting one of my friends. :/

How am I going to get there when I can't even do this?

*So many hugs* Please don't be so hard on yourself. There's nothing wrong with being stressed out about stuff. :c


~Bianca

[Irish Musician]

*sigh* So I didn't go out for clothes and now I'm wondering if I should even bother going to the halloween thingie. And to top it of I ended up hurting one of my friends. :/

How am I going to get there when I can't even do this?

Awww, I'm sorry!! what happened?! Ya know, that is if you want to talk about it, if not, then *HUGS*

~Matthew~

[Zorg]

You'll make it - friends can be repaired, and it takes time to get the courage to do things (I chickened out today when buying my coat and said it was for my now non-existant girlfriend despite planning not to). Dealing with other people is the bit I'm finding the hardest too.

If you're going to a store and know what you want write it down on a shopping list so that way it looks like you've been sent on a mission to get particular things. If not certain write down a general description / size and if anyone asks say you'll recognise the style when you see it as "you were in before with sister/GF/friend" etc.

[Coidzor]

*sigh* So I didn't go out for clothes and now I'm wondering if I should even bother going to the halloween thingie. And to top it of I ended up hurting one of my friends. :/

How am I going to get there when I can't even do this?

Well, it's a bit of a philosophical question as to whether they're your friend if it came to violence over LGBTA-related things. And another, different one if knowing who and what you are caused them pain.

And if it was just a tiff separate from the previous context (apologies if I missed a post that lays this out, but I didn't see one when I double checked), then that's hardly an obstacle to deflate your spirit and keep you from going out there and having fun and meeting people to bolster yourself against the coming winter doldrums with social interaction.

All you can do is get up, dust yourself off, and try again. Or maybe redistribute the ordering of your goals so that they're broken down in such a way that you concentrate on one step at a time. Focus on today and what you're doing rather than on the long road ahead and having to keep doing it day in and day out.

It's like with exercise, you don't focus on the long months of the regimen that you have to keep up and let yourself stop completely when you have one bad day or have to go to a wedding or a funeral or a sexy dinner party that you hadn't already planned for, no, you keep yourself focused on making sure that today is a success and keeps to the plan and if you slip up then you get back on and make sure the rest of the day is on target as much as you can and focus on the next day as it comes.

That's how you build up habit and experience as a support mechanism so that you don't have to actively think about it anymore.

You can do it.

[Lentrax]

*sigh* So I didn't go out for clothes and now I'm wondering if I should even bother going to the halloween thingie. And to top it of I ended up hurting one of my friends. :/

How am I going to get there when I can't even do this?

Well, it's a bit of a philosophical question as to whether they're your friend if it came to violence over LGBTA-related things. And another, different one if knowing who and what you are caused them pain.

And if it was just a tiff irrespective of the previous context (apologies if I missed a post that lays this out, but I didn't see one when I double checked), then that's hardly an obstacle to deflate your spirit and keep you from going out there and having fun and meeting people to bolster yourself against the coming winter doldrums with social interaction.

All you can do is get up, dust yourself off, and try again. Or maybe redistribute the ordering of your goals so that they're broken down in such a way that you concentrate on one step at a time. Focus on today and what you're doing rather than on the long road ahead and having to keep doing it day in and day out.

It's like with exercise, you don't focus on the long months of the regimen that you have to keep up and let yourself stop completely when you have one bad day or have to go to a wedding or a funeral or a sexy dinner party that you hadn't already planned for, no, you keep yourself focused on making sure that today is a success and keeps to the plan and if you slip up then you get back on and make sure the rest of the day is on target as much as you can and focus on the next day as it comes.

That's how you build up habit and experience as a support mechanism so that you don't have to actively think about it anymore.

You can do it.

I'm sorry to hear that. Its hard when you hurt friends, especially if you don't mean to.

I don't have a lot of friends IRL, so when I do hurt one of them it hurts me too.

But the best advice I can give is above. Learning from it and trying to move forward, trying to repair the damge done, is what defines who we are.

[Irish Musician]

*Wonderfully worded advice snip*

Yeah, pretty much this. Lovely words Coidzor!!

~Matthew~

[Coidzor]

Yeah, pretty much this. Lovely words Coidzor!!

~Matthew~

Now if only I could live by them keep from trying to use words like "irrespective" instead of ones that actually communicate my meaning.

[Absol197]

Thanks for all your support. You guys are the bestest !

*sigh* So I didn't go out for clothes and now I'm wondering if I should even bother going to the halloween thingie. And to top it of I ended up hurting one of my friends. :/

How am I going to get there when I can't even do this?

*Hugs!* Don't worry Lena, I know it can be hard to go shopping when you're afraid about judging eyes. Zorg's suggestion's a good one, you could try that! But you'll be able to pluck up the courage soon enough, and then we won't be able to keep you out of the stores!

And I don't know what happened with your friend, but if they're truly your friend, they'll find a way to forgive you. The important thing is to talk. It may be hard, but if you feel like you hurt them, be big and apologize. You may find out that they didn't really feel hurt at all (of course, depending on the situation this may not be true, but it's a possibility...)!

If you want to talk, I have a newly clean inbox .


~Phoenix~

[appending_doom]

The important thing is to talk. It may be hard, but if you feel like you hurt them, be big and apologize. You may find out that they didn't really feel hurt at all (of course, depending on the situation this may not be true, but it's a possibility...)!


~Phoenix~

I'll agree on this point. Talking's the best way to deal with the hurt - I'd advise getting very clear (if you don't know) how your friend feels about it. It's hard to have a serious conversation about that sort of stuff (especially if it's personal for either of you), but it's worth it.

[Lord Raziere]

I couldn't disagree more. Slang is some of the most colourful, interesting language that helps to generate and distinguish whole cultures and often helps drive the development of language itself. One of the many things that excite me about coming into contact with and learning about a foreign culture is learning about their slang, how it works, and what it says about the society that developed it. Slang is almost as necessary, inevitable and fundamental an aspect of human communication as grammar.

kay. I reserve my right then, to say "complexily" "complicatedness" "imaginize" and "constringent" then. as well as any other words I modify or make up. like disastrophe.

[noparlpf]

kay. I reserve my right then, to say "complexily" "complicatedness" "imaginize" and "constringent" then. as well as any other words I modify or make up. like disastrophe.

That's basically your right, the same way it's my right to use contractions and speak modern English as opposed to ancient Hebrew or Greek or even whatever came before that.

[Serpentine]

Sure, you can do that if you want. You'll probably just end up looking silly, though. Doesn't effect my point in even the slightest bit.
I assume you hate swearing, too. You know, what with all swearing being slang. And regional terms for certain items. Cockney rhyming slang...

[golentan]

I like evolving languages. Learning how they've changed is one of the more pleasant ways I've found to while away the centuries.

And romance. Romance is by far my number one distraction from the eternal navel gazing I find myself drawn to in undistracted moments. Speaking of which *SQUEE* Girlfriend So Cute!

[Socratov]

I have mixed feelings on shanging languages, on theone hand you gain lovely new things, but on the other hand some language gets lost while also being beautiful.

and I have a lack of romance as of late, and sadly not much time to do something about it (also, the neighbourhood seems to be almost devoid of women of my age), ah well, maybe when I'm back going to class again instead of in my internship...

[Lord Raziere]

Sure, you can do that if you want. You'll probably just end up looking silly, though. Doesn't effect my point in even the slightest bit.
I assume you hate swearing, too. You know, what with all swearing being slang. And regional terms for certain items. Cockney rhyming slang...

really? looking silly? how do you think you look to me when you use that mangled form of "totally"? not anything I'd take seriously.

as for swearing…..eh….there are instances where a well-placed swear is needed, but swear too much and crosses over from flavor to incomprehensible offensive gibberish not worth listening to. and cockney rhyming slang sounds like something I hate to. just because it combines those three words together. I don't even know what it is, and I don't particularly care to find out.

@ golentan: why would WANT to distract yourself from navel-gazing? I practically navel-gaze like breathing.

[Socratov]

I always though swearing was ok, provided it had some comedic value liek in Blackadder and Chef! (BTW, lenny henry is really, really , really great at swearing in that series)

[Zorg]

I'm on my phone at the moment, so just imagine I'm embedding a macro here implying that I use some form of obsolete language like 'æ' and making a reference that "you probably wouldn't have heard of it".

The implication of course being that you're all starting to sound like a bunch of linguistics hipsters and there's a language thread already.

[Socratov]

well, I don't know about accusing us of being hipster, but one (relevant) example of lost language I pity losing is the change of meaning for the word 'gay' from happy through homosexual into a derogatory term for a homosexual passing at the moment into a derogatory term of things (some) people generally don't like.

[Serpentine]

really? looking silly? how do you think you look to me when you use that mangled form of "totally"? not anything I'd take seriously.

*insert Gone With The Wind reference here* :I

as for swearing…..eh….there are instances where a well-placed swear is needed, but swear too much and crosses over from flavor to incomprehensible offensive gibberish not worth listening to. and cockney rhyming slang sounds like something I hate to. just because it combines those three words together. I don't even know what it is, and I don't particularly care to find out.

As this has no place in this thread, I just want to make one last teeny tiny main point.

Spoiler

Show

When you say this:

and now that I think about, slang in general is a stupid concept, perpetuated by people who dislike other people other than their friends understanding them in in some mindless clique-ish obsession, and thus only rendering language less comprehensible for the whole of humanity.

you are insulting (almost?) every single person on this planet, including yourself I'd bet. Every single person who swears; every single person who refers to carbonated sugary beverages as soft drink, soda or pop; every single person who refers to children as kids; every single geek who refers to "d4s" as "caltrops" - or as d4s, for that matter, or to themselves as "geeks"; if you refer to genitals as anything but their scientific names; if you've ever referred to your money as anything other than dollars or pounds (or whatever you have where you are)... If you use language at all, I pretty much guarantee you use slang. And thus, you are thereby calling yourself a "person who dislikes other people other than their friends understanding them in some mindless clique-ish obsession". You are making a humongous generalisation, and big claims demand big backing-up - especially when your claims are insulting literally billions of people.

I kinda wanna divert this into a discussion of LGBTA-related slang, but I'm honestly not sure whether we could do that while staying within the forum rules...

[Coidzor]

From what I recall, it first became a derogatory term for sexually promiscuous individuals and those who were viewed as abusing drugs in those days before it became applied to homosexuality. So in an unfortunate way it makes some amount of sense how the use expanded outward again, though it's messy because of the time scales we're working on and reclamation of the term into a sense of identity.

[Socratov]

*insert Gone With The Wind reference here* :I
As this has no place in this thread, I just want to make one last teeny tiny main point.

Spoiler

Show

When you say this: you are insulting (almost?) every single person on this planet, including yourself I'd bet. Every single person who swears; every single person who refers to carbonated sugary beverages as soft drink, soda or pop; every single person who refers to children as kids; every single geek who refers to "d4s" as "caltrops" - or as d4s, for that matter, or to themselves as "geeks"; if you refer to genitals as anything but their scientific names; if you've ever referred to your money as anything other than dollars or pounds (or whatever you have where you are)... If you use language at all, I pretty much guarantee you use slang. And thus, you are thereby calling yourself a "person who dislikes other people other than their friends understanding them in some mindless clique-ish obsession". You are making a humongous generalisation, and big claims demand big backing-up - especially when your claims are insulting literally billions of people.

I kinda wanna divert this into a discussion of LGBTA-related slang, but I'm honestly not sure whether we could do that while staying within the forum rules...

ofcourse we could, as long as people don't start to call other people names it could even have a positive effect in negating slurs by turnging them into something positive, or generate understanding because of discovering the roots of said term or word.

From what I recall, it first became a derogatory term for sexually promiscuous individuals and those who were viewed as abusing drugs in those days before it became applied to homosexuality. So in an unfortunate way it makes some amount of sense how the use expanded outward again, though it's messy because of the time scales we're working on and reclamation of the term into a sense of identity.

well, it's a mere 90 years (give or take). So if I understand correctly the word 'gay' has gone from an adjective indicating positive traits, to a euphemism for certain practices, to a euphemism for a certain preference of partner (as well as parodied character trait of a group of said preference), to a slur for a group of people, to an adjective indicating negative traits, completely opposite in terms of meaning compared to where it started. IMO that is quite the twist, especially in a mere 90 years (gay was still a positive adjective in the roaring '20s)