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    Pixie in the Playground
     
    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    Ok so before everyone bites my head off I did attempt to search the forum for what i'm looking for and i'm always against just posting questions without trying to figure it out on my own first...

    So with that said I've recently picked up 3.5 with no prior experience to any rp games that aren't virtual. So i plowed through the players handbook and had an idea for a character...

    The character would either be elf or half-elf, leaning more to the half elf, and its starter class would be a wizard. At some point it would find its way to multiclass into a monk & druid...

    The idea began with using a raven familiar to communicate with the party while in wild shape. then the question of if the raven can cast spells was brought up, a no. So then i thought about making monk/druid, but for some reason i still want the damn raven. I know its completely impractical to try and level all three classes and the idea of this character is spread so thin it couldn't support a small stone... But i keep thinking of some random fun to try with the character such as using polymorph on the familiar to make it a humanoid and extra party member. And knowing it would take forever to get all three classes at a higher level, the character would probably die of old age, making me ask is there a way to use clone, reincarnate, magic jar, and contingency in some combination to have my character live on while still keeping its feats, skills, spells, etc.?

    I'm sure all of you have thought about things like this and more but please keep in mind i am still just discovering the fun.
    Thank you for any help and comments, and not shouting at me for being so stupid.

    Tl,dr; Hey how do you make a character retain everything its earned into a new body to allow it to start multiclassing without loosing everything.
    Once again thanks to all that even give this thread a look over, pleasant gaming.

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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    Quote Originally Posted by DraxDauragon View Post
    Hey how do you make a character retain everything its earned into a new body to allow it to start multiclassing without loosing everything.
    Are you sure you read the 3.5 rules? That's something that happened with the AD&D Dual-classing, not the more recent editions.

    But looking at the character premise, Monk 1/Druid 19 with an Urban Companion sounds like it does what you want. Maybe going into the Sacred Fist prestige class from Complete Divine, if you want to play up the Monk Unarmed damage.
    Last edited by eggs; 2012-10-27 at 07:29 PM.

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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    Thank you for the reply; Yes it is indeed 3.5 i just like asking weird questions, so your overall answer is to dump it...

    I followed everything you said until the sacred first prestige class. I don't have any other books yet and the 3.5 is all i've seen so everything else is literally new to me. One of the reasons i wanted the wizard was so i could cast permanency on various spells, such as magic fang; as well as have a wider selection of spells. But other than that yes the idea if wizard cannot be added would be to run a couple more levels into the monk to get some of the bonus feats before jumping into the druid.

    Thank you again

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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    Quote Originally Posted by DraxDauragon View Post
    I followed everything you said until the sacred first prestige class. I don't have any other books yet and the 3.5 is all i've seen so everything else is literally new to me. One of the reasons i wanted the wizard was so i could cast permanency on various spells, such as magic fang; as well as have a wider selection of spells.
    It's probably better to get permanency through scrolls or paying an NPC caster, rather than spending whole levels. In particular, different casting classes don't generally mix well, without considerable extra work, for several reasons: almost any full caster class is perfectly capable of doing nearly anything on its own in some way; every spellcaster level is of increasing importance, so loss of the highest levels is far more significant than adding a few lower levels; and many classes have different spellcasting abilities, which leads to spreading out your scores more than a single-classed character would. Or, in short, single-class a full caster class in order to specialize in being generally powerful.

    But other than that yes the idea if wizard cannot be added would be to run a couple more levels into the monk to get some of the bonus feats before jumping into the druid.
    Which bonus feats are you looking at in particular? I'd look hard at Monk to be sure it's pulling its full weight. One of the best synergies between Monk and Druid is the AC Bonus feature, but you can get that for a 13kgp magic item (Monk's Belt).
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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    You don't need to get all 3 classes to a high level. In fact, it's probably better if you don't: Monk really isn't all that great after the first two levels, and being a Wizard 10/Druid 10 would be a lot weaker then a Wizard 20 or a Druid 20.

    In any case, after you take your first non-monk level you can't go back to taking monk levels, so it would be best to take only a few of them anyway so you could start taking druid levels.

    So here are some options:

    Wizard 1/Monk 2/Druid 17 or Wizard 1/Monk 1/Druid 18.

    The one wizard level gets you a familiar and a few useful spells, the monk levels get you flurry of blows plus a feat or two plus wisdom to AC when unarmoured, which really helps in wildshape, and the druid levels are the heavy lifters, since you get most of the goodies that a standard druid gets.

    You don't get most wizard spells, but you do get to use scrolls, since it takes only one level of wizard to be able to use wizard scrolls. If you want to permanancy something, get a scroll and cast permanancy from that.
    Although Magic Fang isn't a good spell to permanancy since when you go out of wildshape you lose your claws and teeth and then you probably lose all benefits of the spell. Just cast Greater Magic Fang whenever you wildshape: it lasts as long as your wildshape does.

    There other option is something like this:

    Monk 1/Wizard 3/Druid 5/Mystic Theurge 10/Druid 1.
    This gives you the casting of a level 16 druid and a level 13 wizard, which at level 20 kind of sucks, but you get more actual wizard casting, so it might be better fluff-wise for what you're looking for.

    You only take multiclass penalties for the second of these two builds (since as a half elf you could have druid as your favoured class), but multiclass xp penalties are really complicated and stupid so most people don't use them.

    If you want to live forever anyway, then die every once in a while and have someone Reincarnate you, since you come back as a young adult of the new form, so wait until you turn venerable, die, and come back with a long lifespan ahead of you. I suggest using contingency to come back or making a scroll of it and having your familiar cast it on you after you die, since this way you don't need to depend on anyone else. The downside is that you still lose a level, but there's a level 5 spell called Last Breath in a book called Spell Compedium that's the same as reincarnate except you need to cast it the round after the subject dies and there isn't any level loss.

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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    The feats i was looking at were stunning first or improved grapple as well as unarmed strike, combat reflexes, and improved trip. Once again i was assuming the wild shape would get all the bonus' that the monk provides...

    @randomguy: if all else fails i would like to do the 1w/2m/17d, or perhaps put more into monk. i'll have to talk it over with my group the next time we meet

    Thanks again everybody for all the replies
    Last edited by DraxDauragon; 2012-10-27 at 08:31 PM.

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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    As many have said already, Monk isn't really all that great. A level or two is really all you could ever need. If you want to advance as a Druid and as Wizard, there is a prestige class that does that very thing. It's called the Arcane Hierophant and it appears in the book Races of the Wild. It allows you to stack the benefits of both Druid animal companion and your Wizards familiar on one animal and advances the spellcasting of both classes at the same time. The downside is that you must release your familiar to enter this prestige class. Maybe work with your DM and see if he/she will allow you to keep the raven and release the animal companion instead.

    Here http://community.wizards.com/go/thre...phant_Examined is a link to a handbook/guide for the Arcane Hierophant. It can help you with a possible build.

    I hope this information helps you. This seems to me to be the type of character you are going for.

    EDIT: Also it has the ability to form a bond with a plant, and cast spells through that plant if it's within line of sight. Just imagine a tree shooting lightning bolts and fireballs at your enemies.
    Last edited by fishbrains; 2012-10-27 at 08:39 PM.

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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    Quote Originally Posted by DraxDauragon View Post
    The feats i was looking at were stunning first or improved grapple as well as unarmed strike, combat reflexes, and improved trip. Once again i was assuming the wild shape would get all the bonus' that the monk provides...

    @randomguy: if all else fails i would like to do the 1w/2m/17d, or perhaps put more into monk. i'll have to talk it over with my group the next time we meet

    Thanks again everybody for all the replies
    Wildshape actually does get all of the bonuses monk provides. Combat reflexes, improved grapple and improved trip are all great feats.
    Improved grapple is great since as a druid you can turn into something big with improved grab and a high strength and then grapple someone, and they'd have a hard time getting out.
    Improved trip is great in combination with combat reflexes while you're wildshaped into something with a long reach and high dex. If someone tries to move, you trip them, and they can't finish moving to attack you. I'd suggest taking combat reflexes and then this, which would be better then having to take 4 extra levels of monk.

    Improved unarmed strike also benefits you in combat. Since natural attacks and iterative attacks from BAB are two different things, you can turn into a bear, and then attack with all your unarmed strikes, and then attack with claw/claw/bite. That's right: You're a bear that knows martial arts.

    Stunning Fist is a decent feat as well, but if you want it then take it as your bonus feat and take improved grapple normally, since meeting the requirements for Stunning fist is a pain.

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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    I'm unsure, but there might be something in Unearthed Arcana to replace your animal companion with the raven familiar.

    Edit: Nevermind, it was the other way around. Familiar to animal companion.
    Last edited by DonutBoy12321; 2012-10-28 at 12:53 AM.
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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    You can have a Raven as a Animal Companion.

    It's comparable to an eagle (a bit weaker, actually).


    That said, if you really want to be a wizard druid, there is a class for that (Arcane Hierophant). It even combines your animal companion and familiar into a single creature.

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    WolfInSheepsClothing

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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    To everyone who's helped thus far many thanks to all.

    I ended up going with just a monk9/druid11. The character is still at level two so its possible and probable for change still. So the wizard class was thrown out the door because i wouldn't be able to use scrolls in wild form *sad face*.

    so focus began back on just using druid spells and flurry of blows (this point on referred to as fob) while in wild form. as i was looking over which feats would be best to pick i managed to re-read fob and noticed that shurikens can be used. and my imagination started flying around again. Besides debating going into some projectile feats (point blank and rapid shot) i was thinking about how the druid could help with creating shurikens.

    The reasoning for this thinking is because once i stop leveling in monk my dmg output wouldn't get much higher even if im in various wild forms because i would still only be able to do 3 hits with fob, with the summoned animals and spells of course. so while in human form the only weapons i could really use would be fists, shurikens, and if more range is necessary i could use a sling. I'm wanting to avoid the quarter staff and Shillelagh spell for now, but i'll probably cave and start using it once i get to the proper level

    any way back to the point. the druid at max level (11) can cast spells up to 6th teir. I think a combination of the following spells can prove to be entertaining with shurikens and fob: magic stone, produce flame, chill metal, heat metal, warp wood, shape wood, plant growth, stone shape, transmute rock to mud, transmute mud to rock, fire seeds and iron wood

    So magic stone and produce flame are the least useful in applicability but still curious, could you use magic stone to create shurikens? although the basic sling bullet is 5x as heavy as a shuriken... and the text doesn't mention shuriken at all, it mentions throwing them but for the sake of using them in a fob atk. Produce flame is vaguely the same in the sense that you can throw fireballs but they aren't defined as shuriken, so for these two spells the question is there some way to define them as surikens to be used in fob; aside from using shape stone on the magic stones... more on shape stone in a bit.

    Chill metal and heat metal would work by throwing shurikens and after they are implanted in said creature to enchant the already used shurkiens with which either spell is more viable at the time.

    shape wood could be used to create a literal cubic whatever the spell says (i don't have my book on me right now, and i'm just going to assume a butt-ton) and possibly warp wood could be used to make shurikens, if you shatter a wooden door into so many pieces long spikes of wood could possibly consider shurikens debating on how many variety of shapes a shuriken is allowed.

    Plant growth we will touch on in five.

    Shape stone seems obvious, make shurikens out of stone....

    Transmute rock to clay and clay to rock: as a druid i get a pet i can train to do "work" if i get some sort of animal that has hands, lets say a dire ape, i can force it to work and make shurikens form me in our free time or if i wanted to double output of shurikens i could help. and depending on how much "work" i can teach the animal i could possibly teach it to fire the clay so i wouldn't need to transmute it back to rock, i could have terracotta shurikens!

    Iron wood seems obvious as well, enchant wooden shurikens to make them into metal ones (if there is a difference in the dmg they do.)

    And finally my favorite idea... Plant growth + shape wood + fire seeds = explosive shurikens. Plant growth to get acorns and/or berries, shape wood around them to be shurikens, before using fob cast fire seeds, ????, Profit?!

    Ok so i know half of this is completely retarded and i thank you for reading this far if you have the patience the only other thing i'd wanted to ask is if i could be advised on what feats to take if i were to pursue this; or just general opinions.

    I've managed to pick 12 feats i'd like not counting the ones id get for free for being a monk. If my math is right at lvl 20 i'd only be able to have 10 feats total so i was curious to what everyone thinks. the list is:

    1. Animal affinity
    2. Combat Casting
    3. Improved trip (possible to get for free via monk)
    4. Combat Reflexes (possible to get for free via monk, i personally think i should go for deflect arrows as the free feat)
    5. Improved unarmed strike (free via monk)
    6. Deflect arrows (free via monk)
    7. Snatch Arrows
    8. Stunning first (free via monk)
    9. Natural Spell
    10. Point blank shot
    11. Rapid shot
    12. Run

    and finally tl;dr: Hey should a monk9/druid11 bother focusing on shurikens with flurry of blows and what feats do you think i should get?

    Thanks again to all who read through all that and are genuinely interested and to all those who have helped so much already. Ohh and sorry for all the misspelled shurikens...

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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    Ok! OK! Slow down. Breath. In. Out. In. Out. Good.

    Alright, now that your calmed down, I'm going to destroy your fantasies. Mainly, those rather creative uses of those spells are, shall we say, illegal. Those spells can not function in the way you describe. The text says what they do, nothing more, nothing less. None of those spells mention being able to craft things. Second, your going through a lot of effort to make weapons. Weapons are cheap. Magical weapons aren't, but magical Shuriken are cheap, as they count as ammunition for enchanting purposes.

    As for feats, your math is a bit off. At level 20, you get 7 feats. With your monk levels, you get more bonus feats from a small list.

    I'll just mirror what others have said: Monk is not worth more than 2 levels. Your at level 2, I assume that means Monk 2. Stop. Now. Take Druid. For another 18 levels. Not kidding. Totally serious here. See my serious face? Good. What your giving up, mainly spells and wildshape, you are not getting equal returns in. Monk 3-20 is frankly a load of Owlbear droppings with the title "Base Class" slapped on. Your already a whole spell level behind your other casters (at 3rd when you take Druid 1, your Wizard and Cleric will hit 2nd level spells), don't delay it anymore. Especially not for Monk. Remember, Fluff is mutable. You make fluff what you want it to be.
    Last edited by MesiDoomstalker; 2012-10-30 at 12:00 AM.
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    SolithKnightGuy

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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    Also, probably sit down with the 3.5 PHB and read the rules.

    A lot of things you're saying (wizards relying on scrolls, other stuff) really sounds like you haven't actually done that and are relying on knowledge of older version of DnD.

    If you've used office 2007, office 2008 will not be a big issue for you. But it's not the same with DnD. Seriously. Read the rules.


    Secondly, Natural Spell would let you use wizard spells as a bear, and if you /took off/ your scrollcase before you wildshaped, and then put it back on afterwards, you could still use scrolls as they would not be melded with your wildshaped form (or attached a wildling clasp to them, but that's pretty wasteful).


    But thirdly, i'm going to echo what others have said here. Druid is the easiest class to play in Core, and also the simplest. Given the mechanics you've been getting wrong or wanting to use in ways they can't be used in these forum posts, the easiest way for you to play DnD without getting tangled in the rules would probably be to play a druid. If you're a monk 2, that's fine, just take druid levels from now on. Take the feat Natural Spell, and be a bear, and then nothing you do can really be 'wrong'. Remember you can use natural weapons as secondary natural attacks (they all get -5 to their attack roll, but otherwise you use them normally) and use your unarmed monk strikes even as an animal (so bear kung fu).

    Just seriously read the entire druid entry, even the sidebars, and before you use any spell, read what it actually does. That will make life a lot easier on your DM and party.

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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    As has been said go with monk 2 / Druid 18, you'll be fine.

    don't worry about monk damage increases, your druid spells and better wildshape forms will more than compensate for the loss.

    Flurry of Blows is often reffered to as Flurry of Misses, because they have a worse chance of hitting than a non-flurry attack.

    Shuriken are unfortunately a very unoptimal attack form and they will not work as you would like with heat/chill metal (unless the GM wants it too) as the rules don't cover what happens to ammunition that has hit the target, it is not assumed to be stuck into their skin.
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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    @MesiDoomstalke I re-read the definitions of several of the spells both in the book and the D&D wiki.

    The definition for wood shape and stone shape are as follows "_____ shape enables you to form one existing piece of ____ into any shape that suits your purpose. While it is possible to make crude coffers, doors, and so forth, fine detail isnít possible." So my confusion with this spell is if i can make ____ into any shape that suits me.... why can't i shape it into shurikens?

    For warp wood this quote is what caught my attention for it "Alternatively, you can unwarp wood (effectively warping it back to normal) with this spell, straightening wood that has been warped by this spell or by other means." So if i find pieces of wood the proper size i could effectively make bo shurikens (reference http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shuriken)

    For the produce flame, magic stone and fire seed spells; i was trying to see if there are any loop holes to allow me to use them with Flurry of blows. At monk level 9 the fob modifier is +6/+6/+1 making it quite difficult to miss, and the original penalty vanishes at lvl 9 (reference When a monk reaches 5th level, the penalty lessens to Ė1, and at 9th level it disappears.) Meaning missing would be quite rare...

    Now being a newb i had no idea that magical shurikens would be so cheap, and yes you are correct that is a lot of effort going into making shurkiens, but once again i was trying to be creative, what if i ran out in battle and needed more, these would be ways to make some on the fly. And in regards to fire seeds, magic stones and produce flame. If they could be mixed with fob the damage output per round with them would increase.

    As for the feats I went with :
    1 Point Blank Shot, Stunning Fist, Weapon Proficiency's
    2 , Deflect Arrows
    3 Rapid Shot
    4
    5
    6 Snatch Arrows, Improve Trip
    7
    8
    9 Animal Affinity
    10 New Weapon/armor/shield proficiency's
    11
    12 Natural Spell
    13
    14
    15 Combat Reflexes
    16
    17
    18 Improved Grapple
    19
    20

    Combat reflexes and improved grapple are subject to change, when i did my math i included the 3 bonus feats from a monk at lvl 9 would receive, excluding any and all weapon and armor feats.

    Once again please keep in mind i don't want to just run straight druid or monk or w/e I want to have fun and be creative doing things i couldn't do prior to this game. The appeal of D&D to me is its flexibility in its rules. If i wanted to just do dmg based on per-determined skill combinations i would play wow or something.

    @Rejankor
    The only rule book i have & have ever read is 3.5 phb.... I said that in my first post... I have no idea whats inside the 3.5 mm, or the 3.5 dmhb. I don't know what a wilding clasp even is.... I spoke over this class idea with my group and dm (3 out of the six of us have plenty of experience, but are out of practice.) when i asked about the scrolls and wild form none of us thought of dropping the scrolls first (which is very saddening because that means the original class could have worked....)

    @only1doug
    Our dm seems very descriptive when it comes to arrows being lodged into monsters bodies, although i have not spoken to him about using these spells in this way (because i'm many many levels away from using them) i think he might allow them to be used as such. And as i've pointed out to mesidoomstalke fob has greater miss chances in its early levels so a level 2 monk would have flurry of misses, but as you increase in monk ranks the penalties start to fade and the benefits begin to blossom for the purpose of multi-classing i deeply believe lvl 9 monk to be the proper level to jump from.

    Also keep in mind, i'm purposely trying to be unorthodox because this game has the freedom to allow me to... always be different, always try something new for the poots and giggles.
    Last edited by DraxDauragon; 2012-10-30 at 10:42 AM.

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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    Stone Shape specifically says "crude shapes." If you make "crude shuriken", they are not shuriken, not by the definition the game gives them. They are sharp rocks you can throw as improvised weapons. Warp Wood can make wood useless (by warping) or workable (by unwarping and making straight). You don't control how it is warped/unwarped. It is binary, either warped and useless, or unwarped and workable.

    The other 3 spells you wish to Flurry with can not be used with Flurry. Each specify how you can use them. None allow to be used with iterative attacks. Flurry is a special kind of iterative attack sequence but iterative nonetheless. All three require standard actions to use, Flurry is a Full-Action. Furthermore, +6/+6/+1 is not a good chance of hit. Its pretty dang poor. As others have said, it got the nickname Flurry of Misses for a reason.
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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    Quote Originally Posted by DraxDauragon View Post
    @MesiDoomstalke I re-read the definitions of several of the spells both in the book and the D&D wiki.

    The definition for wood shape and stone shape are as follows "_____ shape enables you to form one existing piece of ____ into any shape that suits your purpose. While it is possible to make crude coffers, doors, and so forth, fine detail isnít possible." So my confusion with this spell is if i can make ____ into any shape that suits me.... why can't i shape it into shurikens?
    Because Fine Detail isn't possible, A shuriken without fine detail just won't fly.


    Quote Originally Posted by DraxDauragon View Post
    For warp wood this quote is what caught my attention for it "Alternatively, you can unwarp wood (effectively warping it back to normal) with this spell, straightening wood that has been warped by this spell or by other means." So if i find pieces of wood the proper size i could effectively make usage shurikens (reference http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shuriken)
    If you found some wooden shuriken that had been warped into uselessness then you could warp them back, otherwise I don't see how unwarping back to normal would equate with forming aerodynamic forms with razor sharp edges.

    Quote Originally Posted by DraxDauragon View Post
    For the produce flame, magic stone and fire seed spells; i was trying to see if there are any loop holes to allow me to use them with Flurry of blows. At monk level 9 the fob modifier is +6/+6/+1 making it quite difficult to miss, and the original penalty vanishes at lvl 9 (reference When a monk reaches 5th level, the penalty lessens to Ė1, and at 9th level it disappears.) Meaning missing would be quite rare...
    there are some feats floating around the internet that will allow other weapons to be specified as monk weapons, I think they are mostly homebrew (created by players) and I'm certain that there are none in core (3.5 PHB, MM1, DMG).

    Quote Originally Posted by DraxDauragon View Post
    Now being a newb i had no idea that magical shurikens would be so cheap, and yes you are correct that is a lot of effort going into making shurkiens, but once again i was trying to be creative, what if i ran out in battle and needed more, these would be ways to make some on the fly. And in regards to fire seeds, magic stones and produce flame. If they could be mixed with fob the damage output per round with them would increase.
    Your best bet is a magic item that creates temporary +1 shuriken on demand, there are existing items that create daggers and javelins so I don't think that there would be a problem adapting them (nothing in core though).

    Quote Originally Posted by DraxDauragon View Post
    Once again please keep in mind i don't want to just run straight druid or monk or w/e I want to have fun and be creative doing things i couldn't do prior to this game. The appeal of D&D to me is its flexibility in its rules. If i wanted to just do dmg based on per-determined skill combinations i would play wow or something.
    Please keep in mind that we don't want to spoil your fun, we want to enhance it. Painful experience has taught us that monks are not fun to play, we are trying to pass this to you so that you don't have to experience it personally. That said, it's your choice, if you really want to learn first hand then you will.

    Quote Originally Posted by DraxDauragon View Post
    @Rejankor
    The only rule book i have & have ever read is 3.5 phb.... I said that in my first post... I have no idea whats inside the 3.5 mm, or the 3.5 dmhb. I don't know what a wilding clasp even is.... I spoke over this class idea with my group and dm (3 out of the six of us have plenty of experience, but are out of practice.) when i asked about the scrolls and wild form none of us thought of dropping the scrolls first (which is very saddening because that means the original class could have worked....)
    DMG won't add much for you, MM has useful details for wildshape and animal companions. Much of core is available (legally) online as part of the system reference document (SRD)

    Quote Originally Posted by DraxDauragon View Post
    @only1doug
    Our dm seems very descriptive when it comes to arrows being lodged into monsters bodies, although i have not spoken to him about using these spells in this way (because i'm many many levels away from using them) i think he might allow them to be used as such. And as i've pointed out to mesidoomstalke fob has greater miss chances in its early levels so a level 2 monk would have flurry of misses, but as you increase in monk ranks the penalties start to fade and the benefits begin to blossom for the purpose of multi-classing i deeply believe lvl 9 monk to be the proper level to jump from.

    Also keep in mind, i'm purposely trying to be unorthodox because this game has the freedom to allow me to... always be different, always try something new for the poots and giggles.
    For a class that is supposed to be combat orientated monk is badly balanced, they need all the stats (Multiple Attribute Dependancy or MAD) but don't have full BAB (so they lose on ability to hit and on stat bonus to hit).
    Doug

    Currently GMing :
    Moonshae Mysteries IC / OOC / Central Map / west rooms map / east rooms map
    Moonshae Tales IC / OOC / Map
    Map of Area

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Banned
     
    SolithKnightGuy

    Join Date
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    Sydnah, Australia
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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    @Rejankor
    The only rule book i have & have ever read is 3.5 phb.... I said that in my first post... I have no idea whats inside the 3.5 mm, or the 3.5 dmhb. I don't know what a wilding clasp even is.... I spoke over this class idea with my group and dm (3 out of the six of us have plenty of experience, but are out of practice.) when i asked about the scrolls and wild form none of us thought of dropping the scrolls first (which is very saddening because that means the original class could have worked....)
    Every mistake you've made so far has been in the rules from the PHB.

    Wildling Clasp: Let me google that for you.

  19. - Top - End - #19
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Another Noob Asking Stupid Questions...

    I suggest you change your build a bit here: Monk 2/Druid 18 would be best, followed by Monk 6/Druid 14.

    Why only Monk 6? Well, Monk 6 gets you improved trip, but after that 3 more levels of monk don't really give you much of anything.
    You get wholeness of body, which only lets you heal 18 hit points, but with more levels of druid casting you get more spells which you could use to heal much more then 18 hit points.
    Your unarmed damage goes up from 1d8 to 1d10, but on average that's only 1 point of damage, which isn't worth it.
    You get +10 to your move speed, which is sort of nice but with more druid levels you could wildshape into faster and stronger things, and wildshape more often, which boosts all your stats, not just your speed.
    You also get improved evasion, which is good but not really worth it since it takes so long to get.
    And you get slow fall for 10 extra feet, which reduces damage taken when you fall by 3, on average, which really, really isn't worth it when you can turn into something that can fly.
    And lastly your flurry of blows penalties are reduced, essentially giving you a +2 to hit, but by going into druid earlier you get wildshape faster and can wildshape into better things at lower levels, so you could turn into something with 4 (or probably more) higher strength then you could before and get an extra +2 to damage, as well as to hit.

    Really the same logic applies for monk levels 3-6: Still mind sucks when you've got high will saves and are wisdom focused already, purity of body sucks when you could take druid levels to get access to Remove Disease only a few levels later, and there's no point in Ki Strike when you could cast Magic Fang or Greater Magic Fang.
    The only thing monk level 6 gets you is Improved Trip, and you can wildshape into something like a dire wolf that can trip things, or have your riding dog companion trip things, or just take 2 feats and trip things.


    For your feats: Animal affinity is only +2, and most of the DC's for ride and handle animal are so low that you can make them all without the +2.

    Snatch arrows is one of the only feats you probably can't use in wildshape: Some animals don't have 15 dexterity, so you wouldn't be able to use it because you don't meet the prereqs, and even if you did, you probably wouldn't have hands, making it tough to grab things like arrows.
    You should also check with your DM if you're allowed to use deflect arrows while in bird form or whatever, since if he doesn't allow it then it won't be that useful.
    So while you can be a Kung Fu Action Bear( or shark or dinosaur), you probably won't be able to deflect arrows while you're one.

    Point blank shot and rapid shot are also not that useful. As a monk/druid you're doing the most damage either up close, in melee, or far away, with attack spells. If you're within 30 feet of an enemy, you should be a bear and able to tear its face off. No point on throwing shuriken at it for much less damage.

    Rapid shot is one extra throw of a ninja star, for very little damage (1 or 2 damage plus your strength, which should be pretty low when you're not a bear, lion, or dinosaur), when instead you could take Improved Natural Attack for your unarmed strikes (a feat in the Monster Manual) to boost unarmed damage one size category, so from 1d6 to 1d8, or if you're already large size from wildshape, from 1d8 to 2d6, which is an extra 1 or 3 or more, for bigger wildshapes, damage for every time you hit, instead of just once in a whole round.
    You can only take Improved Natural Attack at level 6, though, so you'd need to shuffle your feats around. I suggest taking improved grapple or combat reflexes at that level instead.
    Oh, and remember to keep track of how much damage your unarmed attacks do in wildshape: As a level 8 druid you get large wildshape, so unarmed strikes in wildshape would do more damage.

    As for Shuriken: You don't need to make any, just stuff your pockets with them. You can get 100 for only 20gp. You'd probably do more damage with Produce Flame anyway, and you can use share spells so your animal companion also shoots fireballs, for even more damage. Oh, and you're allowed to refluff spells, so if you wanted to you could say that produce flame let you shoot ninjastars made of fire at people, but it would do the same damage.

    If you want to make some shuriken on the fly, you could put some ranks in Craft (weaponsmithing), but you'd need equipment for it, and where you've got crafting tools you normally have someone that can sell you shuriken.

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