Page 7 of 50 FirstFirst 123456789101112131415161732 ... LastLast
Results 181 to 210 of 1476
  1. - Top - End - #181
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Forum Explorer's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    I think I'm missing something. Why do we think it's a Khornate Fleet again? I'm just going by general Chaos fleet.


    That said any fleet this big should be lead by a skilled admiral. 6 ships and most of them Cruisers? They likely have a very high ranking officer in charge.
    In order to understand recursion you must first understand recursion.


    Thanks to Elder Tsofu for my new Lancer Avatar

  2. - Top - End - #182
    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
     
    The Glyphstone's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    He's still going to have to slow to 'normal' speeds to do things like gather sensor data and actually fire the guns, though, since the ship hasn't undergone a complete refit, just the drive system.
    Quote Originally Posted by GungHo, on Battletech
    The Atlas is also goofy but it has that whole "Stay Puft Marshmallow Man" menacing smile thing going for it. The guy who drew that one up was obviously taken to the Nutcracker when he was a child... and he was screaming in terror the entire time.
    Spoiler
    Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Enterti, Cogidubnus
    Glyphstone, out of all the playground I think you scare me the most...
    Quote Originally Posted by Zombimode
    Glyphstone, you are an evil person :D

  3. - Top - End - #183
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Central Kentucky
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Oh right... sensor data for firing the guns, hmmm...

    Yea, that will be difficult. So is the ship blind during this method of FTL? I don't know much about Culture tech, I just know that sensors of 40k ships are unrealistically bad, due to genre conventions.

    IE, they don't follow the realistic stuff that it should be quite easy to target lightspeed weapons if you have a functioning computer and that stealth would be hard and such...

    http://www.projectrho.com/public_htm....php#nostealth

    NOTE: EDITED THIS POST TO PUT SOME BITS IN A LATER POST.
    Last edited by Gavinfoxx; 2012-11-03 at 10:22 PM.

  4. - Top - End - #184
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Fan's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Land of Wind and Shade
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Quote Originally Posted by Gavinfoxx View Post
    Oh right... sensor data for firing the guns, hmmm...

    Yea, that will be difficult. So is the ship blind during this method of FTL? I don't know much about Culture tech, I just know that sensors of 40k ships are unrealistically bad, due to genre conventions.

    IE, they don't follow the realistic stuff that it should be quite easy to target lightspeed weapons if you have a functioning computer and that stealth would be hard and such...

    http://www.projectrho.com/public_htm....php#nostealth
    It's more a matter of "These ships have enough guns to hit any target at any approach angle given a long enough time to fire.", than an issue of "These targets are hard to hit."

    Also, if Dawn of War games are to be taken as canon, then Warp Travel can be done into Segementum Obscurus in three days from the forge world of Mars.
    Last edited by Fan; 2012-11-03 at 10:21 PM.
    Hayden, Hot blooded Cyborg by Jakuu.
    Plushrump ITP!



  5. - Top - End - #185
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Central Kentucky
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    And skilled Chaos Admiral? Well, maybe.

    Maybe skilled at doing the particular type of war that Khornate focuses on. Or maybe he has sufficient strength of personality (ie, ability to cow everyone else) that he rose to the top. Or he was more effective at ruthlessly backstabbing other people.

    Seriously, play some of the Dawn of War games where you play as Chaos. Khornate generals are often caricatures. They are generally only competent due to massive, overwhelming ability to localize extreme amounts of brute force (ie, demons or whatever) and raw power where other groups can't do the same.

    And filling the sky with fire... that won't be lance fire. That will be, you know... macrocannon and macrocannon battery fire...

    And I'm not saying that the DoW games are canon, but that they can show patterns of things and are hints to things that can be considered relevant for this thread, albeit through the distorting lens of the game.
    Last edited by Gavinfoxx; 2012-11-03 at 10:23 PM.

  6. - Top - End - #186
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Fan's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Land of Wind and Shade
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Khorne is also the God of Martial Nobility, and strategy.

    He's more than capable of keeping his forces organized, and forming ranks.

    The "Blood for the Blood God" charge thing is only ascribed to his Berserkers. His commanders are far from retarded.
    Last edited by Fan; 2012-11-03 at 10:24 PM.
    Hayden, Hot blooded Cyborg by Jakuu.
    Plushrump ITP!



  7. - Top - End - #187
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Forum Explorer's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Quote Originally Posted by Gavinfoxx View Post
    Oh right... sensor data for firing the guns, hmmm...

    Yea, that will be difficult. So is the ship blind during this method of FTL? I don't know much about Culture tech, I just know that sensors of 40k ships are unrealistically bad, due to genre conventions.

    IE, they don't follow the realistic stuff that it should be quite easy to target lightspeed weapons if you have a functioning computer and that stealth would be hard and such...

    http://www.projectrho.com/public_htm....php#nostealth

    And skilled Admiral? Well, maybe.

    Maybe skilled at doing the particular type of war that Khornate focuses on. Or maybe he has sufficient strength of personality (ie, ability to cow everyone else) that he rose to the top. Or he was more effective at ruthlessly backstabbing other people.

    Seriously, play some of the Dawn of War games where you play as Chaos. Khornate generals are often caricatures. They are generally only competent due to massive, overwhelming ability to localize extreme amounts of brute force and raw power where other groups can't do the same.
    This is a fluff-realism descripincy. After all if Khornate generals are only capable of bloodlust and charging in blindly then how do they ever win a war? Particularly in space where there isn't any blood to be had. I imagine that Khornate Admirals are very very rare. Particularly of a fleet this size. I've read two examples of Khornate ships fighting, one of a individual Frigate which specilized in boarding to the point where it could take on cruisers and win and a Khornate fleet. The fleet used normal and actually quite good tactics to fight. It's eventual fatal mistake was ignoring the lightly armed civilian ships, allowing them to surround it while it pursued and tried to kill the crippled Imperial Cruiser.

    And that was of a fleet that was much smaller then this one. (I think it had one cruiser and six frigates by my memory.) This admiral is commanding a much bigger fleet and should be proportionally more skilled.
    In order to understand recursion you must first understand recursion.


    Thanks to Elder Tsofu for my new Lancer Avatar

  8. - Top - End - #188
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2009

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Quote Originally Posted by Forum Explorer View Post
    I think I'm missing something. Why do we think it's a Khornate Fleet again? I'm just going by general Chaos fleet.
    It's a Khornate fleet because it's Tzeentch's fault.


    If you think the RT might make a few passes and retreat if it becomes clear he can't handle this, then sure, that can happen too. But obviously, he wants to win too (full control of nanobots dangled in front of him). The mercs are still working up and getting used to the hyperdrive and they need his techpriests (which he has lent a few) to teach them.

    The Chaos fleet can be a little damaged if you think that evens the odds a little (the note about lack of escorts is fair enough)
    Last edited by jseah; 2012-11-03 at 10:29 PM.

  9. - Top - End - #189
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Central Kentucky
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Yea, but not all of them. The particular of what group managed to gain power for this fleet, and by what method... can vary. It could be a mostly incompetent that achieved the post via ferocity, or it could be someone with a more strategic bent.

    And there is definitely one much, much, much more prevalent view of khorne and his worshipers in this setting than the more strategic and martial nobility view. I'm not denying that what you say is true (though it's the first I've heard of it!), I'm just saying that it isn't the main way of doing things.

  10. - Top - End - #190
    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
     
    The Glyphstone's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    On the other hand, he's also martial glory, and as you said, Blood For the Blood God. Whether the fleet can develop an effective defensive formation is entirely dependent on the personal magnetism of the Warlord leading the fleet, his ability to intimidate the captains of the smaller ships under his 'command' into following orders, and how long he can maintain that order in the face of the annoying gnat buzzing around and annoying them. Even if the RT can't risk coming into weapons-range, he can still dance around them until their self-control or fleet cohesion breaks and they try to go at it themselves...the commander can't play a defensive/turtle game or he'll lose face in front of his subordinates who will see it as cowardice and possibly make a coup attempt. Assuming the various ships don't take advantage and fire into their 'fleetmates' rear arcs to settle personal slights.
    Quote Originally Posted by GungHo, on Battletech
    The Atlas is also goofy but it has that whole "Stay Puft Marshmallow Man" menacing smile thing going for it. The guy who drew that one up was obviously taken to the Nutcracker when he was a child... and he was screaming in terror the entire time.
    Spoiler
    Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Enterti, Cogidubnus
    Glyphstone, out of all the playground I think you scare me the most...
    Quote Originally Posted by Zombimode
    Glyphstone, you are an evil person :D

  11. - Top - End - #191
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Forum Explorer's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Quote Originally Posted by Gavinfoxx View Post
    Yea, but not all of them. The particular of what group managed to gain power for this fleet, and by what method... can vary. It could be a mostly incompetent that achieved the post via ferocity, or it could be someone with a more strategic bent.

    And there is definitely one much, much, much more prevalent view of khorne and his worshipers in this setting than the more strategic and martial nobility view. I'm not denying that what you say is true (though it's the first I've heard of it!), I'm just saying that it isn't the main way of doing things.
    Sure but here's the thing. The more power the warlord in question has the more effective they will be on every level. This fleet is big enough that the admiral would likely be very effective. Else a more effective leader would have squashed him by now because they'd want control of the fleet.
    In order to understand recursion you must first understand recursion.


    Thanks to Elder Tsofu for my new Lancer Avatar

  12. - Top - End - #192
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Central Kentucky
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    I sincerely doubt that 'effectiveness as an admiral' is the primary determinant for whether or not one gets an admiralship in a Khornate fleet. Just saying...

  13. - Top - End - #193
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Forum Explorer's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Quote Originally Posted by Gavinfoxx View Post
    I sincerely doubt that 'effectiveness as an admiral' is the primary determinant for whether or not one gets an admiralship in a Khornate fleet. Just saying...
    The ability to win is all that matters really. Just as long as he isn't breaking any Khorne rules he should be fine. Thus he needs to have a good sense of tactics or else he wouldn't have amassed such a big fleet.

    Also beserkers generally do not lead Khone armies. They are tend to be lead by a more level headed individual who is skilled in all types of warfare.
    In order to understand recursion you must first understand recursion.


    Thanks to Elder Tsofu for my new Lancer Avatar

  14. - Top - End - #194
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Central Kentucky
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    What I mean is that a potential Khornate Admiral probably has to...

    -be good enough to not lose significantly more than their peers
    -be able to intimidate rivals and underlings
    -be able to backdstab and undermine others, and resist attempts for others to do the same
    -have sufficient strength of personality to get some cohesion out of these independent-minded forces he has to work with
    -be able to maneuver situations such that it brings the blessings he needs to get things done from his patron (ie, do enough of the right type of slaughter and ritual to get the forces he needs)

    Note that being the best admiral is... not a major part of that list.

  15. - Top - End - #195
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Forum Explorer's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Quote Originally Posted by Gavinfoxx View Post
    What I mean is that a potential Khornate Admiral probably has to...

    -be good enough to not lose significantly more than their peers
    -be able to intimidate rivals and underlings
    -be able to backdstab and undermine others, and resist attempts for others to do the same
    -have sufficient strength of personality to get some cohesion out of these independent-minded forces he has to work with
    -be able to maneuver situations such that it brings the blessings he needs to get things done from his patron (ie, do enough of the right type of slaughter and ritual to get the forces he needs)

    Note that being the best admiral is... not a major part of that list.
    For the commander of a fleet? The bolded would all involve military tactics to a degree. The other 40% involves tactics in a much more minor way such as tacking down and punishing failures, or winning consistently and decisively enough that no one in his fleet thinks they can beat him, or that they know better.

    It's also worth noting that a deamonship is serving in his fleet. That's a pretty big boon to get.
    In order to understand recursion you must first understand recursion.


    Thanks to Elder Tsofu for my new Lancer Avatar

  16. - Top - End - #196
    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
     
    The Glyphstone's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    A big boon, but it's also a combination responsibility and white elephant (if white elephants had a tendency to horribly murder your enemies). He's obviously in high favor (because he has a Grand Cruiser, a small fleet, and a Daemonship), but that means he's also riding a much thinner line. He can't afford to be weak, or even to look weak, to his mortal followers or daemonic patrons/superiors. "Turtle up in a defensive formation and fight reactively" would be a cowardly, weak-looking tactic in most circumstances. It might be the proper defense against the Rogue Trader here, but said Rogue Trader is literally the only enemy in the entire galaxy short of actual Culture ships who can fight in this way; it won't be his first go-to response, and even if he figures it out, he'll hesitate to issue the orders because he'll know how it will look to his ambitious and less tactically minded minions.


    Also, I think this might have extra hilarity because I have a sneaky suspicion Jseah picked a few ships off the ship list because they sounded/looked cool, and we've since dragged this off in a completely different direction.
    Last edited by The Glyphstone; 2012-11-04 at 12:18 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by GungHo, on Battletech
    The Atlas is also goofy but it has that whole "Stay Puft Marshmallow Man" menacing smile thing going for it. The guy who drew that one up was obviously taken to the Nutcracker when he was a child... and he was screaming in terror the entire time.
    Spoiler
    Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Enterti, Cogidubnus
    Glyphstone, out of all the playground I think you scare me the most...
    Quote Originally Posted by Zombimode
    Glyphstone, you are an evil person :D

  17. - Top - End - #197
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Forrestfire's Avatar

    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    I honestly think that the Chaos commander may actually think that it's an Eldar attack, depending on how fast the ships drop in and out of sublight.

    Unless I'm grossly underestimating the sensors of the Chaos ships..
    Lolth is so scary that even in TO, "having to be touched by Lolth" is recognized as a serious drawback for Lolth-touched.
    Avatar by Djinn in Tonic

  18. - Top - End - #198
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Forum Explorer's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Quote Originally Posted by The Glyphstone View Post
    A big boon, but it's also a combination responsibility and white elephant (if white elephants had a tendency to horribly murder your enemies). He's obviously in high favor (because he has a Grand Cruiser, a small fleet, and a Daemonship), but that means he's also riding a much thinner line. He can't afford to be weak, or even to look weak, to his mortal followers or daemonic patrons/superiors. "Turtle up in a defensive formation and fight reactively" would be a cowardly, weak-looking tactic in most circumstances. It might be the proper defense against the Rogue Trader here, but said Rogue Trader is literally the only enemy in the entire galaxy short of actual Culture ships who can fight in this way; it won't be his first go-to response, and even if he figures it out, he'll hesitate to issue the orders because he'll know how it will look to his ambitious and less tactically minded minions.


    Also, I think this might have extra hilarity because I have a sneaky suspicion Jseah picked a few ships off the ship list because they sounded/looked cool, and we've since dragged this off in a completely different direction.
    True. So the tactic might be a bit bolder then just turtling. For example they might spread out and try and maximize their killing fields while still covering each other's rear arc. There are actually a lot of tactics they can use, just as long as they cover their rear arcs they'll be able to at least shoot at the RT's ships which is really all they need.

    They are in a warp rift/storm right? That Deamonship is going to be next to impossible to kill if so. I think. Generally deamons are much stronger in the warp, to the point that the RT might need to get the Deamonship into range of a Geller field which is beyond close range and practically touching at that point.


    Basically unless their fleet is heavily damaged then I suspect the RT will be forced to retreat.

    Here's how I see the fight going down. The RT surprises the Chaos fleet with it's tactical FTL doing some damage. He gets in some more hits but then the Chaos Fleet positions itself so there is no safe place to attack from. The two Merc frigates go down to a barrage of fire. They trade blows for a little while and the Lunar decides to bugger off. The RT is forced to retreat shortly afterwards. Chaos loots the destroyed frigates.
    In order to understand recursion you must first understand recursion.


    Thanks to Elder Tsofu for my new Lancer Avatar

  19. - Top - End - #199
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2009

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Quote Originally Posted by The Glyphstone View Post
    Also, I think this might have extra hilarity because I have a sneaky suspicion Jseah picked a few ships off the ship list because they sounded/looked cool, and we've since dragged this off in a completely different direction.
    =D But it's cool. I'll run with it.

    Let's say the Khornate fleet has just come off on the bad side of a scrap with some Tzeentch ships and dropped out of warp to get away. Maybe some light damage, nothing serious, but it explains why they don't have enough escorts.

    All according to plan of course, for Tzeentch.

    The Khorne commander might see the IoM ships and exodite world as a "easy" target to recover his reputation on. At least, easy until the IoM ships go zipping around.

    Quote Originally Posted by Forum Explorer View Post
    Here's how I see the fight going down. The RT surprises the Chaos fleet with it's tactical FTL doing some damage. He gets in some more hits but then the Chaos Fleet positions itself so there is no safe place to attack from. The two Merc frigates go down to a barrage of fire. They trade blows for a little while and the Lunar decides to bugger off. The RT is forced to retreat shortly afterwards. Chaos loots the destroyed frigates.
    Would the mercs even follow his orders if they see it's not safe? Escorts going up into the line of fire for Chaos cruisers sounds pretty suicidal to me.

    Would the RT even give an order to FTL to an unsafe location? I'd assume he's not a tactical nutcase.
    Last edited by jseah; 2012-11-04 at 01:39 AM.

  20. - Top - End - #200
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Forum Explorer's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Canada
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    An exodite world is by no means an easy target. They can call for help from the Craftworlds and an exodite world once almost managed to fend off a Hive Fleet with that help.

    On the other hand being in a warp storm would make it the perfect time to attack the exodite world as Chaos can summon daemonic reinforcements with relative ease.

    Anyways there aren't very many 'safe' zones when fighting capital ships. So if he was willing to fight he'd be willing to put himself into harms way.
    In order to understand recursion you must first understand recursion.


    Thanks to Elder Tsofu for my new Lancer Avatar

  21. - Top - End - #201
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Selrahc's Avatar

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    It's a Khornate fleet because it's Tzeentch's fault.
    Khorne and Tzeentch aren't actually dire rivals. Tzeentch hates Nurgle a lot more...

    But it can easily be a Khornate fleet anyway. I think having it be Khornate adds a little more interest really.

    Khornate fleets are often built around boarding actions. A relatively effective tactic in regular combat, particularly with powerful Khornate boarders. Ships are able to take enough firepower to close and board against most foes. The prizes from successful boarding actions are immense, with the potential to both please Khorne with wanton sacrifice *and* get a juicy new warship under your command. That would be woefully ineffective here. Let's assume that the Khorne admiral hasn't themed his fleet around boarding. The discussion on Khorne admiral behaviour under "Powers of Chaos" is that they are first and foremost effective commanders, but will close to board if they have a chance.

    Where is the idea that Daemonships attack telepathically coming from? They don't do that in Battlefleet Gothic. They radiate a (fairly short range) aura of unease that makes it harder for enemy fleets to coordinate, but they don't do direct mind attacks.

    Daemonships are basically regular warships in their method of attack. Where they step up is in defensive abilities. They can easily ghost in and out of the warp, and they repair (heal?) damage at an insane rate. It is very hard to slowly whittle down a Daemonship.

    EDIT: I'd also say that there will be a *lot* of safe zones when fighting with tactical FTL. The enemy has no idea what angle of approach you will take. You can be any direction or side of them in a millisecond. The Chaos fleet does not have enough firepower to blanket a 360 degree sphere of space around them with weapon fire.
    Last edited by Selrahc; 2012-11-04 at 06:35 AM.
    Avatar by Simius

  22. - Top - End - #202
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2009

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Quote Originally Posted by Selrahc View Post
    Khorne and Tzeentch aren't actually dire rivals. Tzeentch hates Nurgle a lot more...
    It's Tzeentch's fault because it's Tzeentch's fault.

    This is a result of one of his schemes to get Khorne and a Culture (unwitting) proxy to fight to assess the strength of the Culture. Either the Culture wins and the Khorne fleet gets wiped or the Culture loses a pawn and gets angry at Khorne. And Tzeentch gets data on their combat capability in either case.
    There's probably a Tzeentch ship with a couple of Daemons sitting in the warp nearby to see if the Khorne guys get back.

    Sure, his followers probably lost some ships when fighting that fleet to make them run into the arms of the Culture, but that increases his military assessment's accuracy (since his minions would know how capable the Khorne fleet is after fighting them).

    It's almost all win for him. Apart from losing a few followers, but eh, followers.


    And best of all, it's certainly holy-***-complicated enough that only Tzeentch might contemplate something that crazy and actually manage to pull it off.

    So, tl; dr is, it's Tzeentch's fault because its more hilarious that way.

  23. - Top - End - #203
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Tiki Snakes's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Crystal Wasteland

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Pro Tip - Everything is always Tzeentch's fault. Even if there's no way it could be.
    Probably.

    More seriously, this makes sense. It's clearly a successful and powerful fleet, dedicated to Khorn who he does love teasing, regardless of whatever else. That fleet being lost in order to test the Culture would not be a loss for Tzeentch. Alternatively, there's a good chance that the fleet will take down one or two of the ships involved, and that means a non-zero chance of them taking some Culturetech.

    With the Khorn tendancy to want to board ships, this is more likely than it otherwise would be.

    I'd figure once the RT's tactics of hit and run become obvious, the trick will be to force them close. They could do this by deliberately leaving a gap or two in their coverage that herd the RT or the less disciplined mercenaries closer, allowing a teleport boarding attack to hit.

    Inciting battle-lust in their attackers could be a good tactic an interesting idea too. All they need to do is get the idea that FTL ramming speed is a great idea into one of the mercenaries heads and things could get complex.

  24. - Top - End - #204
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Central Kentucky
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    -A lot of the things I mentioned in the list aren't necessarily at 'ship tactical' scale. They might be interpersonal skills (especially with the backstabbing thing).

    -The Daemon ship might not be something that the current admiral earned. It might be something that his predecessor earned... eh, eh?

    -Eldar ships are known to be fast and turn on a dime when you don't expect them to, and have good stealth... so maybe some Imperial that got Eldar tech or something? There are plenty of ways to fool sensors so that a ship appears to be 'not there'; the Chaos Admiral won't immediately jump to the conclusion of 'it's going really fast'. He'll jump to the conclusion of 'it's cloaked or interfering with our sensors somehow'.

    -Agree that they may try to cover one another's rear arcs via non-turtling tactics... but it depends on the particulars of the commander, though...

    -With so few ships and so few escorts... there are limited areas that are safe from overlapping fields of fire. That is kinda the JOB of Escorts, you know... the escorts that this fleet doesn't have!

    -And this is an area with unsettled warp, not necessarily a full, visible-in-realspace, 'warp storm'. It could just be a place that's impassible in the warp but not leaking over.

  25. - Top - End - #205
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Fan's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Land of Wind and Shade
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    You realize that Khornate succession is decided by combat correct?

    If the current commander beat the predecessor it meant that he was MORE cunning and brutal than the one before him. In an orky sense at the very least.

    Also again, 40k ships have A LOT of guns and are designed to fill area's with huge amounts of devastating firepower.

    Given the stated personality of the RT as well (A risk taker, and a man who loves to dance on fate's feet. Given by his previous behavior in handling the Forge World fleet.), I doubt he'd be the type to hang back and flit around as well, and then with the telepathic motivation to get in close and duke it out I'd expect more of a "FTL in close, and try and hit them with a full broadside at point blank.", only to find out that these cruisers being so heavy can not only take it, but also that there's now a full staff of Khronate Berserkers on his bridge asking for his blood type.

    And the Khornate Fleet has enough heavy cruisers to make a formation that covers any angle of approach, they do have prow guns, aft guns, starboard guns, deck guns, etc. These are vehicles made for space.
    Hayden, Hot blooded Cyborg by Jakuu.
    Plushrump ITP!



  26. - Top - End - #206
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Central Kentucky
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Combat yes... but on what scale? For what type of combat? Ship to ship? In what sort of battle? With what forces? Personal? Vehicular? Single person void-fighter? Fleet vs fleet?

    Aft guns? Are you suuure?

    Why don't you go look at the Rogue Trader and Battlefleet Gothic stats for these styles (or at least similar) Cruisers and Grand Cruisers and such, maybe? It's quite notable how uncommon 360 degree coverage actually is! ;) ;)
    Last edited by Gavinfoxx; 2012-11-04 at 12:14 PM.

  27. - Top - End - #207
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Fan's Avatar

    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Land of Wind and Shade
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Quote Originally Posted by Gavinfoxx View Post
    Combat yes... but on what scale? For what type of combat? Ship to ship? In what sort of battle? With what forces? Personal? Vehicular? Single person void-fighter? Fleet vs fleet?

    Aft guns? Are you suuure?

    Why don't you go look at the Rogue Trader and Battlefleet Gothic stats for these styles (or at least similar) Cruisers and Grand Cruisers and such, maybe? ;) ;)
    Daemonships have no listed restrictions, and is the obvious capital ship of this fleet.

    Also RT, and battlefleet Gothic are a bit outdated.

    Recently, Imperial Armour: Aeronautica came out, along with the newest "Battlefleet Gothic: Armada".

    You're welcome to look there.
    Last edited by Fan; 2012-11-04 at 12:39 PM.
    Hayden, Hot blooded Cyborg by Jakuu.
    Plushrump ITP!



  28. - Top - End - #208
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Selrahc's Avatar

    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Quote Originally Posted by Fan View Post

    Also again, 40k ships have A LOT of guns and are designed to fill area's with huge amounts of devastating firepower.
    40K ships can look at a ship at position X, and fill positions X and Y with firepower. This sort of area coverage works well at fighting ships with predictable trajectories, but which you don't have exact positional data for, such as Eldar.

    They can't fill the entirety of a region of space with firepower.

    This ship isn't moving from X to Y like an Eldar or Necron vessel. It is able to move from A to Z in the blink of an eye, or any position in between. Eldar and Necron ships change the rules. Tactical FTL ships aren't even playing the same game. 40K ships *can't* cover that much space with firepower. You're arguing that 40K fleets can simultaneously and continuously hit 100% of all space surrounding them. That just isn't true.
    Avatar by Simius

  29. - Top - End - #209
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Kobold

    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Central Kentucky
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Quote Originally Posted by Fan View Post
    Recently, Imperial Armour: Aeronautica came out.

    You're welcome to look there.
    Except that doesn't have anything on the scale of an actual ship, though... just small craft. Do you have anything recent that talks about the miles-long ships? The ones that have macrocannon, where each gun in the macrocannon itself is the size of at least any of the craft in IA:A?

    And if they want to 'fill all possible vectors with fire'... then I suppose they could point their macrocannons every-which-way. Doing so wouldn't be effective though; these ships are dangerous because of their ability to concentrate massive amounts of fire into one (or a few) area. If they did shoot the macrocannons off in every direction, it would be like a very expensive and draining sensor pulse -- the guns, if they hit the RT's ship, wouldn't be able to even dent the shields... because they aren't concentrating their fire!

    So no, ships in 40k don't have the amount of firepower you are claiming they have. They don't have those capabilities to fill all the space around them with death that is meaningful to any of the other miles-long ships with void shields.
    Last edited by Gavinfoxx; 2012-11-04 at 12:32 PM.

  30. - Top - End - #210
    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
     
    The Glyphstone's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Culture explores 40K II: Now With 100% more Fanfiction

    Actually, I kinda like Fan's idea of the RT getting boarded, if we combine it with the 'he can float like a butterfly, sting like a bee, but eventually he'll screw up'. Putting the SC Agent in direct, personal danger, whether it's permanent or not (for all the Culture knows, Chaos can fritz a backup if they have the 'original' in hand) could be the impetus for her to break out the serious skillz and whip the boarding party's collective butt. The RT gets away - maybe throw him a bone by getting in a lucky shot at the Grand Cruiser, and the remainder of the fleet turns to infighting to sort out the new pecking order rather than pursue the injured light cruiser. But she's blown her cover completely at this point, and as usual, hilarity ensues.
    Quote Originally Posted by GungHo, on Battletech
    The Atlas is also goofy but it has that whole "Stay Puft Marshmallow Man" menacing smile thing going for it. The guy who drew that one up was obviously taken to the Nutcracker when he was a child... and he was screaming in terror the entire time.
    Spoiler
    Show

    Quote Originally Posted by Enterti, Cogidubnus
    Glyphstone, out of all the playground I think you scare me the most...
    Quote Originally Posted by Zombimode
    Glyphstone, you are an evil person :D

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •