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Thread: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
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2013-02-08, 06:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
Q674b: I'm afraid I'm still confused. Let me try again.
So say there's a rogue hidden behind a tree (he's already hidden behind the tree, he's not trying to hide in the middle of combat. And yes the tree is big enough to obscure him entirely). That rogue uses his light crossbow to shoot at an unaware enemy 30ft. away. If I understand you correctly this is what happens:
Rogue gets attack against enemy at +2 to hit, and enemy is denied dex bonus to AC (which allows sneak attack).
After the attack is resolved, enemy gets a reactive spot check against a DC 3 (0 + 1 for every 10ft away = 0 + 3 = 3). If he makes it he sees the rogue, otherwise the rogue remains hidden.
Next round if he is not still hidden the rogue can use his move action to duck behind the tree and attempt another hide check which, if successful, would allow him to attack with the bonuses of attacking an unaware opponent. Your interpretation seems to indicate that he would also be unable to use the "sniping" action since he doesn't have his move action anymore, but in looking more closely at the "sniping" action I don't see anything that suggests you need to use a move action; it seems like the check is simply made as part of the attack.
Alternatively, the rogue could have elected to try to snipe as detailed under hide in the PhB. In this case, the enemy would still roll against that 3 DC, but if the rogue's hide -20 check beats the enemy's spot check (the same one against the DC 3? A new roll?) then he remains hidden, but the enemy knows what square he was in when he made the attack.
A couple questions:
Q674b: doesn't having cover give you a bonus to your hide check, so the DC should be a little over 3? I looked it up in the PhB but it's very vague. The most concrete thing it says is that near total darkness gives a 40% miss chance and +10 to hide checks. Is there anything more substantial than that with regard to bonuses to hide checks from concealment?
Q674c: The wording of sniping seems to suggest that the hide check at -20 replaces the DC of 3 in the example. Why is this not the case?
Thanks for your help btw.
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2013-02-08, 06:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
q676
Are additional natural attacks gained through the Morphic Weapons class feature (warshaper) included in a full attack with pre-existing natural attacks? ie. can a wildshape ranger4/warshaper1 wildshape into a leopard, grow a gore attack via morphic weapons, then charge/pounce a foe and include the gore attack in its full attack (granted by Pounce)?
Thanks!
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2013-02-08, 07:28 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
A 674bYes, I can see you're still confused. If the tree is big enough to obscure the Rogue entirely, the Rogue doesn't have line of sight to the enemy and cannot be hidden (and also cannot attack); instead both parties have total concealment from each other.
You need cover or concealment in order to attempt a Hide check. Total cover or total concealment usually (but not always; see Special, below) obviates the need for a Hide check, since nothing can see you anyway.
I'll skip the rest, because you've got to understand the basics before proceeding.
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2013-02-08, 11:23 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
Last edited by rockdeworld; 2013-02-08 at 11:25 PM.
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2013-02-09, 02:26 AM (ISO 8601)
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2013-02-09, 03:33 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
A 678 Yes.
If you stay within 60' of the skull you'll not only be aware of a living creature entering the guarded area, you'll also have the chance of being deafened for being too close.
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2013-02-09, 08:22 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
Q679
Is there a version of the Alarm spell that can be keyed to silently alert a person other than the caster?
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2013-02-09, 11:46 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
Q680
How many feet do you fall per round?
Free fall, no means of halting or slowing your fall. Do you just use terminal velocity rl logic applied to 1 rd = 6sec?"If you are going to walk on thin ice, you might as well dance."
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2013-02-09, 11:51 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
So you're saying you can't envision someone hiding behind a tree and peeking out from the side to shoot?
Okay, whatever, let's say they're hidden behind a bush or something instead. Is that better? The actual object they're hiding behind is immaterial, I don't know why you're so focused on it. If it helps, I'll say that the rogue is already successfully hiding behind some appropriate cover. So here are my questions and my example again, ammended for your benefit:
Better?Last edited by Mongrel; 2013-02-09 at 11:59 AM.
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2013-02-09, 12:06 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
Q681
Is there a martial maneuver (or other effect available with the expenditure of one feat) which causes knockback, similar to the Awesome Blow feat but available to creatures of Medium size?
Q682
If you take the Martial Study feat for the first time, can you select a maneuver higher than 1st level if it has no prerequisite maneuvers? Do you need to have an initiator level equal to one less than twice the maneuver's level? And your initiator level is equal to half your Hit Dice if you have no initiator classes? So to select a 2nd level maneuver, you'd need to have at least 6 hit dice? Have I got all this right?
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2013-02-09, 12:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
Q683
Do Bloodline Levels from UA stack with class levels to determine Spell Resistance if you get Spells Resistance from a racial trait like the Githzerai?
The Githzerai from MM gets Spell Resistance = Class Levels +5. If you were a fighter 7/Monk 7 with a major bloodline, would you have SR = 25 (7+3 + 7+3 +5) or SR = 19 (7+7+5)?
The quote from the UA says this:
"Include the character’s bloodline level when calculating any
character ability based on his class levels (such as caster level for
spellcasting characters, or save DCs for characters with special
abilities whose DCs are based on class level). The character
doesn’t gain any abilities, spells known, or spells per day from
the addition of his bloodline levels, though—only the calculations
of his level-based abilities are affected.
If a character has levels in two or more classes in addition to
his bloodline levels, each class gains the benefi t of adding the
bloodline levels when calculating abilities."Last edited by Semada; 2013-02-09 at 12:14 PM.
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2013-02-09, 03:05 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
A680
150 ft. round 1, 300 ft. each round after that.
Originally Posted by Minimum Forward Speed
Yes. I don't know about Githzerai, but for drow:
Originally Posted by Drow
character ability based on his class levels," such as SR.
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2013-02-09, 03:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
"If you are going to walk on thin ice, you might as well dance."
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2013-02-09, 05:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
Re: A 674b
I'm afraid you're not getting the point. You can't under the rules say the Rogue is "already hiding"; it doesn't work that way in D&D. The Rogue behind the tree or bush isn't hiding; they're simply out of sight, and out of combat. Hiding is only possible in the game if someone has line of sight to you. That's what a Hide check opposed by an enemy's Spot score means. (You're not "hiding" from the Sphinx if you're outside of Egypt.)
A 680 b
The "stalling" speed rules apply to winged creatures; non-winged creatures can't stall, but simply fall. From page 136 of Dungeon Master's Guide:This section on world-building assumes that your campaign is set in a fairly realistic world. That is to say that while wizards cast spells, deities channel power to clerics, and dragons raze villages, the world is round, the laws of physics are applicable, and most people act like real people. The reason for this assumption is that unless they are told otherwise, this situation is what your players expect.
As is obvious from the discrepancy in these different falling speeds, wings greatly reduce your terminal velocity.Last edited by Curmudgeon; 2013-02-09 at 05:53 PM.
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2013-02-09, 06:24 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
Q 675
Does Blood Wind work with Improved Grab? It could lead to some hilarious results.
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2013-02-09, 07:47 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
I think you're getting bogged down on largely irrelevant details. I'll simplify this further.
A rogue has succeeded in successfully hiding from an orc. The rogue wants to attack the orc with a ranged weapon for sneak attack damage.
Question 1: How do I know if the orc sees the rogue after the attack or not? You said that he essentially has to make a spot check against a DC of 0 + 1 for every 10ft. away the rogue is. What are the other factors that contribute to this (such as concealment, or creature size)?
Question 2: If the orc sees the rogue, how, exactly, do they re-hide from him? Previously I seem to recall you saying that if you break line of sight you can attempt another hide check, but now you're saying that you actually can't hide if there is no line of sight.
Which seems absurd to me since if there was, say, a search party going down the road looking for you and you ducked behind a tree it should still be hide vs spot rather than "the search party cannot possibly find you!" In your example of "you're not hidden from the Sphinx if you're outside of Egypt," if you somehow managed to make an attack on said Sphinx from outside of Egypt the game would pretty much treat it as though you were hidden from them...
Question 3: How does this sequence of events change if the rogue is using the "sniping" option? You have said that unless the rogue can hide in plain sight the enemy will still get that DC 0 + distance spot check to see him. So after that there's a hide -20 vs spot check and if that succeeds the enemy knows what square the rogue attacked from if they made the low DC spot check (which they probably did), but does not know where the rogue currently is (since he's hidden) and the rogue will be able to sneak attack next round. If he fails then the orc knows where he is.
I am primarily interested in Question 2 (how to legally hide during combat), but I'm curious about the other two as well.
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2013-02-09, 08:16 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
A 647b continuation
1. The other factors affecting the Orc's Spot score are the distraction of combat (-5) and the Rogue's size. Size alters the opposing Spot check by +/- 4 for every size step. If the Rogue is Medium size, that's +4 to the difficulty compared to Large size.
2. Every time you wish to Hide you must satisfy the three requirements to be allowed to make this skill check:
- There must be line of sight; otherwise no Hide check is allowed.
- You cannot be observed.
- You must have cover/concealment.
3. Sniping rules require the following:
- The Rogue is hiding initially, in a location which offers cover/concealment. (Most likely cover rather than concealment, since concealment makes sneak attack impossible.)
- The Rogue makes a ranged attack, and is (probably) Spotted doing so.
- The Rogue does not move anywhere, but uses a move action to (attempt to) Hide in place. By spending this move action the Rogue gets to bypass the usual "not being observed" Hide requirement, but has to eat a -20 penalty to the skill check.
Last edited by Curmudgeon; 2013-02-09 at 08:18 PM.
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2013-02-09, 08:22 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
@Curmudgeon: Where do you get the +4 for a medium creature from?
Q 684 I think
For the purpose of hiding, is movement only the change of position form one square to another or is it any movement the character or parts of him can make?
Q 685
Is a character with the Jotunbrud feat also considered Large for Intimidate checks?
Q 686
If a character with Pounce uses the Bounding Assault maneuver, he can make a Full Attack, right?Last edited by Andezzar; 2013-02-09 at 09:31 PM.
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2013-02-09, 09:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
Q 687
More about Improved Grab. If someone wants to Grab (taking the -20 penalty), does it need to apply that malus to the initial check to start the grapple?
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2013-02-10, 01:42 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
@Andezzar: From the table here.
A 684
The Hide skill specifies movement relative to your speed. Only movement which changes your square is dependent on your speed.
A 685 Yes.
Jotunbrud's benefit applies to any opposed roll, and Intimidate requires such a mechanism.
A 686 No.
Pounce requires that you use the Charge (special full-round) action. Spring Attack stipulates a move action split around an attack. These are incompatible action requirements. Bounding Assault will give you an extra attack when you use Spring Attack; Pounce will give you potentially several extra attacks when you Charge. There is no combination which will combine these extra attacks.
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2013-02-10, 01:48 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
A 687
Yes. In particular, note how the decision on whether or not to take the -20 penalty affects whether the creature can make its other attacks in that round, thus indicating that it must apply to the initial check.
Note that malus, while intuitively the opposite of bonus, is not actually a commonly used english word, and is not the word used in english-language D&D. You're looking for the word penalty. I know what you're talking about, but others might get confused.Lord Raziere herd I like Blasphemy, so Urpriest Exalted as a Malefactor
Meet My Monstrous Guide to Monsters. Everything you absolutely need to know about Monsters and never thought you needed to ask.
Trophy!
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2013-02-10, 03:30 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
This link says +0 for a medium creature. +4 is small.
While true, movement that does not change your square, obviously is moving less than "up to one-half your normal speed" so you can still hide without penalty. Additionally if it only referred to moving form one square to another, how is it possible to hide while attacking (explicitly allowed, albeit being difficult, in the PHB on p. 76). An attack does not require any movement from one square to another.
Please read my question again. I was asking about the maneuver Bounding Assault (ToB p. 62) not the feat from the PHB II. The former states "This maneuver is considered a charge attack when determining if feats and other abilities apply to your attack."
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2013-02-10, 03:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
Q688
I'm casting a spell with verbal component. Will it be interupted if i start to talk?
Is there any rule about that?
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2013-02-10, 05:14 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
Note that those are Hide modifiers. I was reworking them to apply to the opponent's Spot check. The reference used for Spot checks is 0 for Large; the reference used for Hide checks is 0 for Medium. The difference (+/- 4 per size step) is what matters here.
Re: A 684
Originally Posted by Andezzarmovement modes
Creatures may have modes of movement other than walking and running.
Originally Posted by Andezzar
A 686 [updated] Yes.
Originally Posted by Andezzar
A 688 Yes.
Here's the rule:Spell Failure
If you ever try to cast a spell in conditions where the characteristics of the spell cannot be made to conform, the casting fails and the spell is wasted.Last edited by Curmudgeon; 2013-02-10 at 05:24 AM.
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2013-02-10, 05:25 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
Q689 Concentration checks
Prompted by comic 868, I have a question about how Concentration checks work. Here we have Belkar facing off against Malak. Let's assume that the encounter comes to blows, that Belkar and Mr. Scruffy win initiative and attack, and Malak tries a spell, provoking AOO from Belkar and Mr Scruffy. What concentration checks does he need to make to save his spell?
1) A single check vs. all the damage he recieves in the round prior to his spell (including the AOOs)?
2) A check vs. each damaging hit (regular attacks and AOOs) in the round prior to his spell?
3) A single check vs. all cumulative damage from the AOOs only?
4) A check vs. the damage from each succesful AOO?The prison was full of British officers who had sworn to die, rather than be captured.
Avatar by Rich Burlew: The Giant Stuck It To Me!
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2013-02-10, 05:38 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
A 689
If you check footnote 2 on the Concentration check table, you'll see that the answer depends on the action required for casting the spell. If it's 1 standard action to cast, it's one check for each attack of opportunity. If it's a longer casting time, it's one check for the total damage dealt during the action.
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2013-02-10, 06:41 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
Q670
About grappling.
Step 4
Maintain Grapple. To maintain the grapple for later rounds, you must move into the target’s space. If you can’t move into your target’s space, you can’t maintain the grapple and must immediately let go of the target.
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2013-02-10, 08:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
A 689 continued
Note that there is no check for damage that is taken before the spell is cast. Only distractions that occur DURING the act of casting will prompt a Concentration check.
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2013-02-10, 10:40 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII
A670
If, for example, you are tied to a wooden post that is stuck in the ground, and therefore cannot move from your space, but can still make the grab to start a grapple because your arms are free.
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2013-02-10, 11:03 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Simple Q&A D&D 3.5 (by RAW) XXII