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  1. - Top - End - #31
    Halfling in the Playground
     
    GrinningDemon's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dread Necromancer Advise

    What do you guys thinking about taking the spell Black Sand through my advance learning?

    Black Sand. This spell out of Sandstorm is absolutely incredible. It's an AoE effect that deals 1d6 points of negative energy damage to everyone in the area per round for caster level rounds. Also, it creates a darkness effect. Thus, it heals your minions and hurts enemies. More importantly, however, anyone killed by it permanently turns into Black Sand. As such, you can now put this generated sand in the boots/body of any of your minions (and maybe in your boots if you have Tomb Tainted Soul) to gain fast healing 1d6, permanently. Awesome. Also, the spell itself can be made permanent if you lack bodies to turn into the stuff, and this is great for making fortifications.
    I will kill you, then raise you, then have you kill your friend...muhahahahaha!!!

  2. - Top - End - #32
    Banned
     
    SolithKnightGuy

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    Default Re: Dread Necromancer Advise

    Shroud of Undeath specifically by RAW blocks a turning attempt. If you get turned while it's up, it ends the spell but has no further effect. Thus an undead with shroud of undeath is protected from 1 turning attempt.

    Also there is a feat in libris mortis to increase your turn resistance.

  3. - Top - End - #33
    Orc in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Dread Necromancer Advise

    Quote Originally Posted by GrinningDemon View Post
    What do you guys thinking about taking the spell Black Sand through my advance learning?
    To put it simply: This spell can break games. But if it is allowed you should take it.
    However, it would be wiser to have it cast for you (or you buy a scroll of it) and then toss a small rat in there. By RAW (as far as i understand) the black sand created by the spell should disappear after the spell ends, but the black sand from the rat you just killed should remain. Now you can make infinite amounts of it.

    But as usual it all depends on your DM.
    For example, how much sand do you need to gain the effect? a hand full? 1cubic foot? a single grain?
    Glue some grains to arrow tips and fire them in the general direction of the enemy.
    Drill a small hole in the bones of your skellies and pour some inside. They gain fast healing and when they are defeated (their bones broken) the sand is released and creates darkness.
    If you are Necropolitan you now have fast healing 1d6. Put it in your boot, but you could also swallow it (not like you need your stomach for anything anyway)
    Have some pocked-sand with you and throw it in peoples faces. Damages them and creates an easy get-away with the darkness effect.
    You can almost permanently kill someone, as there with be no remains to cast a resurrection on.


    You can do a whole lot of things with that stuff, but if you are not careful a bad uncreative DM will come with the ban-hammer and a creative DM will come up with better enemies.
    In most games I DM we have a simple gentleman's and ladies agreement: "The BBEG will not try any cheese that you don't try yourself."


    side note:
    that gave me a great idea for a scene! The PCs walk into a room/field/cave where the entire floor in balck-sand two hordes of Skeletons are attacking each other, but as soon as one lands an attack the damage is healed. The two forces are locked in a never ending battle that may have lasted for centuries.

    DM note: The battle is part of fight between two necromancers that were bitter rivals. During the battle they both had to release their undead, which are still carrying out the last commands given to them. The two Necromancers have either destroyed each other or the battle has shifted somewhere else.
    ok i might need to include that somehow, somewhere
    Hide behind your tower shield, to gain total cover for you and your equipment. Your tower shield now has total cover.

    Quote Originally Posted by Story Time View Post
    Good job, Wookiee-Ranger.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yora View Post
    You can always start the game by making a coup the grace against yourself.

  4. - Top - End - #34
    Halfling in the Playground
     
    GrinningDemon's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dread Necromancer Advise

    Wookie I love that image at the end of your last post and I really like the idea of carrying some of the black sand in my pocket. Good escape and also good bartering tool with the blacksmith lmao
    I will kill you, then raise you, then have you kill your friend...muhahahahaha!!!

  5. - Top - End - #35
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Doxkid's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dread Necromancer Advise

    The thing about Bland Sand as an Advance Learning spell is...well...you only really need it for all its cool applications ONCE. Maybe 2 or 3 times.
    Dropped a car battery on a finger: this broke the finger slightly.

    Slammed a door on that same finger while leaving for the hospital: this took off that finger nail.

    Found out I'm resistant to most paid medications and my job would not want me testing positive for others: I'm not taking pain meds.

    Killed my car's engine and radiator after filling up the gas tank.

    Also, I might have an ear infection.

    ...it's better to be handsome than lucky, I guess.

  6. - Top - End - #36
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Dread Necromancer Advise

    This doesn't actually work. As written, Black Sand damages undead too.

    Also, Libris Mortis has tons of ways to increase Turn Resistance. Off the top of my head, there's two feats and a cloak for personal turn resistance (+12), plus another feat and the bagpipes for AOE turn resistance (+8). Unfortunately, it also has tons of ways to boost turning.

  7. - Top - End - #37
    Orc in the Playground
     
    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Dread Necromancer Advise

    Quote Originally Posted by Story View Post
    This doesn't actually work. As written, Black Sand damages undead too.
    ?
    No, not really.
    Creatures that come in contact with the sand take 1d4 points of damage per round from negative energy (no save)
    From Sandstorm Page 20 AND Page 111.

    Negative energy = healing undead.

    Lets not make a discussion about the fact that RAW never states that explicitly, but instead decided to write it in the description of every undead published.
    Hide behind your tower shield, to gain total cover for you and your equipment. Your tower shield now has total cover.

    Quote Originally Posted by Story Time View Post
    Good job, Wookiee-Ranger.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yora View Post
    You can always start the game by making a coup the grace against yourself.

  8. - Top - End - #38
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Dread Necromancer Advise

    Quote Originally Posted by Wookie-ranger View Post
    Negative energy = healing undead.
    Except when it doesn't. Given there are negative energy spells that don't heal undead, and the Inflict line specifically says it does heal undead, I think it's safe to assume that the default is that it doesn't heal undead unless it says so.

    Notice that the entry on undead doesn't say negative energy does heal undead, only that it can heal undead, and in the same sentence gives a specific example where this is the case. From context, it's clear that it's talking about options to heal an undead, and Inflict X is one such option.

  9. - Top - End - #39
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    The Viscount's Avatar

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    Default Re: Dread Necromancer Advise

    Chill touch is a specific example of negative energy not healing undead, but it is to my knowledge the only negative energy channeling spell that I can think of right now that has a separate, non-beneficial effect for undead, not counting ones that have no effect. Undead are powered by negative energy, though. I have yet to see a case of negative energy harming undead explicitly. We all know that editing can be a bit spotty at times, especially for items (such as the magnificent captain's coat allowing you to "threat the coast as a shirt or vestment"). In addition, negative and positive energy receive minuscule coverage compared to the other energy types. I have yet to see a being with negative energy resistance. I read "undead can be healed by negative energy" in the same way I read "a paladin can use any or all of this healing power to deal damage to undead creatures" in the description for lay on hands. I don't see them as saying negative energy can be used to harm undead, just like I don't see lay on hands as saying you can heal undead. It's saying what you choices you have for using the energy, at least to me.

    On topic, I'll throw in my two cents for OP. While many seem to favor ghostly visage for its power, I honestly much enjoyed my quasit familiar. He's hardier than your average familiar, and flight (perfect maneuverability!), invisibility, and alternate form give plenty of utility. Material form for actually manipulating the world around doesn't hurt, and you don't have to worry about him being turned. I know it's bad form to attack familiars, but a simple turning won't kill a ghostly visage, just will hinder him much.

    Ask your DM for a ruling on fear aura time limit and suggest 1 round/level, which is the most common suggestion I've seen. Either way, knowing is good, because going by RAW the target is scared forever. You can also ask for a ruling on the negative energy burst, but here most people choose not to look the gift horse in the mouth and say that it affects you, too. This is another reason why tomb-tainted soul or going necropolitan is a must.

    As for protecting yourself from turning, life ward is highly effective, but unfortunately not viable for advanced learning. Perhaps a wand.

    Some people argue that Dread Necromancer should have the circle spells and they was simply left out by accident, since they have planar binding. It wouldn't surprise me if they were. Dread Necromancer is very poorly written.

    Corpsecrafter is nice enough on most builds, and the feats it opens up can be quite useful, but take note that the bonus to Str unfortunately does not stack with that of Undead Mastery. The 2 hp per HD does stack, and so does the 2hp per HD from desecrate.

    I second the suggestion of sickening grasp. It's a lovely little debuff to have on hand, especially since you always have a necromancy spell available to cast. On the subject of reserve feats, I would also like to suggest summon elemental. Summon undead V qualifies you for it, but means you are limited to only summoning a small elemental one at a time. Still, a fire, earth, water, or air elemental can be useful in a bind.

    I second Doxkid's recommendation that you make sure you know your role. You can control stupid amounts of undead if you put effort into it, but chances are your party will not enjoy that.
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    Only playing Tier 1s is like only eating in five-star restaurants [...] gorrammit sometimes I just want a cheeseburger and some frogurt. Why limit yourself?
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