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    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    RedWizardGuy

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    Question Slaughtering Constructs with Magic

    I'm looking for spells to kill a LOT of constructs. I know about highly metamagiced orbs of fire but I am hoping for something a bit more. . . stylish

    I don't know how long this wizard (who will hopefully be introduced into the campaign sometime after the new year) is going to have to hold out against a horde of ticked constructs with class levels.

    Wizard 20/Epic Wizard 9/Effigy Master 1

    Build is moderately flexible(but epic feats are TASTY), but I'm most interested in your favorite spell selections.

    MM Feats
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    Important things to know.
    Material Components are Ignored
    I've got 3 10th level, 2 11th and 2 12th level spells
    Metamagic cost is reduced by 4 (not to dip below +1)
    I've got a construct of my own (50HD Runic Guardian)
    My Familiar (coure Eladrin) has a lot of my low level sloots.
    So. . . suggestions?

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    BardGuy

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    Default Re: Slaughtering Constructs with Magic

    Disintegrate generally works well. Works with most of your metamagic feats.

    Target specific weaknesses of various golems to take them down. Just go look them up, it's not that hard.

    Use SR: No spells like Glitterdust (will save, but NOT mind-affecting!) to render them no longer a threat.

    Shatter is a surprisingly fun spell to use against lesser constructs whom are crystalline in structure.

    Spells like Sleet Storm are also hilariously good to shut down constructs, which have notoriously bad Reflex saves and Dex numbers in general.

    Shout and Greater Shout are also scary good against constructs which are made of fragile or crystalline materials.
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    Bugbear in the Playground
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    Default Re: Slaughtering Constructs with Magic

    An epic golem will still die to a large enough patch of grease and someone waiting to finish it off.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Emperor Tippy View Post
    If the wizard is played even half competently then you stand not a chance in hell.

    If the wizard is well played then he can kill you by punching you to death. Why? Because he is immune to death. As in you flat out do not have the capability to kill him regardless of what you do.

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    Halfling in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Default Re: Slaughtering Constructs with Magic

    Dont forget you can shape the battlefield to your own desires as well. Dig big trenches that they can fall in but not climb out of, fill with acid.

    Also, don't be afraid to push out your epic spells. Using the seeds and some careful math, you can make spells that literally do anything. Make it rain down meteors in a two mile radius all day? No problem. Emit an aura that heals you and any nearby allies for several hundred points a round all day? Easy peasy.

    Find out what kind of prep-time the wizard will get before he has to face those hordes of constructs, and you can even keep the spellcast times long if you want to.

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    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Default Re: Slaughtering Constructs with Magic

    Quote Originally Posted by dungeonnerd View Post
    Also, don't be afraid to push out your epic spells. Using the seeds and some careful math, you can make spells that literally do anything. Make it rain down meteors in a two mile radius all day? No problem. Emit an aura that heals you and any nearby allies for several hundred points a round all day? Easy peasy.
    OP doesn't have Epic Spellcasting. He should get it, if his DM will tolerate it. You can also bring in some pretty scarily-powerful creatures through the Summon seed, and generally snap the game like a twig (especially if he uses DC mitigation). Summon creatures with big spellcasting (or strong anti-construct abilities) to do your dirty work for you (or just aid your DC-mitigation rituals ).

    Get Rods of Chain Spell, and slap those on any nasty damage-dealer spells you have. Actually, get the other metamagic rods too, for "free" metamagic, lulz, and win (Rods of Extend are a cheap way to increase your buff rotation). It should be well within your 4 MILLION gp budget as a 30th level character.

    What is our Wizard's objective, exactly? Some background would help.
    Quote Originally Posted by Emperor Tippy View Post
    By level 20 though, you aren't capturing a wizard. A character lives to level 20 by being the most ruthless, lucky, capable, and paranoid bastard around. A wizard is throwing around a 30+ Int score and has, entirely in character, planned contingencies for his contingencies. He may well be running around with flat out total immunity to harm, he does not walk outside without an entire bevy of defensive magics around him and enough magic items to buy himself a nation.

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    Halfling in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Default Re: Slaughtering Constructs with Magic

    OP doesn't have Epic Spellcasting
    umm.. what?

    From the OP:

    Wizard 20/Epic Wizard 9/Effigy Master 1 [.....] I've got 3 10th level, 2 11th and 2 12th level spells
    Non-epic spells are 9th level... soo.... yeah he definitely has epic spellcasting. I'm not sure what you're reading.

    He's right about one thing though.
    You can also bring in some pretty scarily-powerful creatures through the Summon seed, and generally snap the game like a twig (especially if he uses DC mitigation). Summon creatures with big spellcasting (or strong anti-construct abilities) to do your dirty work for you (or just aid your DC-mitigation rituals ).
    The summon speed is one of the best ones, period.

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    TuggyNE's Avatar

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    Default Re: Slaughtering Constructs with Magic

    Quote Originally Posted by dungeonnerd View Post
    Non-epic spells are 9th level... soo.... yeah he definitely has epic spellcasting. I'm not sure what you're reading.
    That's true as far as it goes. However, Epic Spellcasting proper (based on the feat of the same name) does not use spell slots, and its spells are all considered 10th level. Therefore, it's likely he's using Improved Spell Capacity, which states:
    Quote Originally Posted by SRD Epic Feats
    Spell Slots Above 9th Level
    The Improved Spell Capacity feat allows characters to gain spell slots above 9th level (which can be used to hold lower-level spells or spells whose level has been increased beyond 9th by the use of metamagic feats).
    While these slots are only available in epic, they are not Epic Spellcasting, and do not allow the free-form seed combination that is so infamously broken.
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    BarbarianGuy

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    Default Re: Slaughtering Constructs with Magic

    If you can skyrocket charisma; take ``Assume supernatural ability'' feat and polymorph in a Beholder and use its eyes. As supernatural abilities they ignore spell resistance.

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    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Slaughtering Constructs with Magic

    Hey Guys,

    Thanks for the responses.

    Epic Spellcasting is more of a headache than I THINK I want to deal with. It is permitted, and if you can demonstrate a spell that is worth the super high GP cost I'll take a look at it. (after all, I've got to adventure with this character as well, and thus need gear, I've got an expensive golem that I constructed(250,000 for a 50HD Runic Guardian), and a familiar that can use any gear I can throw on her).Re: Summon seed. What are you all thinking? I've never delved deeply into epic spellcasting proper, so I'm not familiar with the better tricks.

    My 10-12th level slots are indeed through improved spell capacity epic feat. I put metamagiced up the wazoo spells in them (ie, persistent shapechange, or maximized timestop :D )

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    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Default Re: Slaughtering Constructs with Magic

    Quote Originally Posted by dungeonnerd View Post
    Non-epic spells are 9th level... soo.... yeah he definitely has epic spellcasting. I'm not sure what you're reading.
    Epic spell slots are a completely different thing from 10th level slots (the former are derived from the feat Epic Spellcasting, the latter from Expanded Spell Capacity). You gain them according to the number of skill ranks a character possesses (as opposed to the table), and they are not affected by metamagic feats. Epic Spells, although considered for most purposes as though 10th level spells, are prepared with Epic Spell Slots, which are completely independent of "normal" spellcasting progression.


    @Wiz: The thing with Epic Spells is that you don't shell out massive GP costs or try to hit a massive Spellcraft DC. You make the spell you want (for example: Permanent duration, Summon Seed, CR=Lolwut, Creature type= whatever I want) and mitigate the spellcraft DC down to 1 via the Mitigating Factors table (this will make the spell far cheaper to produce, and the mitigating factors aren't all that mitigating when you cast outside of combat, and have someone to heal all the Backlash, etc). It takes a bit of math, but you can get some seriously game-shattering stuff without much trouble. Especially if you have some epic spellcasting buddies (i.e. party members) for your Rituals.
    Last edited by Slipperychicken; 2012-11-16 at 11:48 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Emperor Tippy View Post
    By level 20 though, you aren't capturing a wizard. A character lives to level 20 by being the most ruthless, lucky, capable, and paranoid bastard around. A wizard is throwing around a 30+ Int score and has, entirely in character, planned contingencies for his contingencies. He may well be running around with flat out total immunity to harm, he does not walk outside without an entire bevy of defensive magics around him and enough magic items to buy himself a nation.

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    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: Slaughtering Constructs with Magic

    Grease is just a debuff; a golem failing his save doesn't mean you win. What you need instead is Otiluke's resilient sphere. Or at level 8 there is Otiluke's telekinetic sphere. On a failed save the golem is just plain done, and with a golem's reflex save that is very likely. Slaughter his friend and return to him at your leisure, or if he is your only opponent then sphere him halfway through the fight and heal up. Then drop the sphere.

    Against multiple constructs generic crowd control works great, and almost all of them are SR no and many have no save or have a reflex save. For actually damaging the golems, that's what the fighter is for. You can help out a little bit but he does it better so why bother? If anything you might haste the party or greater heroism him.
    Last edited by ericgrau; 2012-11-16 at 11:54 AM.
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    Ettin in the Playground
     
    rweird's Avatar

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    Default Re: Slaughtering Constructs with Magic

    Summon Great Wyrm +38 virtual age categories Gold Dragon (CR 103)
    (14 base, +10 dragon type, +204 CR, +40 on overcoming SR (+80), x5 permanent, DC 228*5=1540, now for Mitigating factors, , 40d6 backlash -40 DC [Have some con buffs before hand [Bite of the Werebear, Holy Transformation, Infernal Transportation (+240 hp total, UMD or the like to casst from scrolls, with a decent con mod, you'll be able to always live, now for it being a ritual, )], have a cleric heal it], 1000 casters casting 1st level spells (-1000, [pay each 10 GP, total of 10000 GP], 100 5th level casters casting 3rd level spells (15000 GP), -500 DC)), DC 0, cost to create, 0, etc, you can change the casters, though this will permanently get you a Great Wyrm +38 gold dragon, it has a 100d10 fire breath weapon and casting as a 95th level sorcerer (and 37th level spell slots, as well as potentially epic spell casting as well). For the cost of 25000 GP of paying casters. Yeah, Epic Spellcasting is crazy broken.
    Last edited by rweird; 2012-11-16 at 08:51 PM.
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