[Any game with non-human humanoids] Is ambition a human only trait?

[Agrippa]

I'm curious how people regard ambition as it relates non-human fantasy races, especially in role playing games. Do you treat it as something that non-human races lack compared to humans or even view as an alien mindset? Or are they just as ambitious as humans, but less known for it? And if you do depict them as less ambitious do you try to enforce this mechanically or not?

[Sidmen]

I've never seen humans as being more ambitious than, say, Dwarves or Elves. We're just much less patient and willing to take risks that, to other races, seem utterly stupid.

Instead of, say, finding a way to prevent the air and water from becoming toxic, we'll just build a foundry anyway - so what if it renders the area uninhabitable in a few decades, we'll eek out some cash then die young on a mountain of strippers and blow.

[Ashtagon]

I'm curious how people regard ambition as it relates non-human fantasy races, especially in role playing games. Do you treat it as something that non-human races lack compared to humans or even view as an alien mindset? Or are they just as ambitious as humans, but less known for it? And if you do depict them as less ambitious do you try to enforce this mechanically or not?

I don't think ambition comes into it. Rather, most demi-humans have ridiculously long lifespans compared to humans, so think in terms of decades rather than months and years. A human will plough a field to death and pollute the local environment with industry, because the bad effects won't become significant until about 100 years of such resource abuse, by which time he'll be long past caring. Dwarves and elves? They'll have to live with it still.

otoh, that long-range planning means they'll be picking really good sites for everything. They have far more potential to be chessmasters than humans.

[Mystral]

Ambition has a good side, too. And one that every race can exhibit. The urge to be good at something, to excell and to reach the goals of your desires. A paladin who wants to rid the world from evil is just as ambitious as an evil necromancer who wants to build his own zombie empire.

Of course, every race can have ambitions.

The Dwarf that strives to retrieve his ancestors weapon or to master the craft of smithing.
The Elf who strives for centuries to create the most wonderfull works of art.
The Gnome who.. um..

It's just that humans have way less time to accomplish their goals, and they seem, at least to the glancing eye, more diverse then the other races. The only thing that they seem to have in common is ambition.

[Tvtyrant]

Humans are usually depicted as more ambitious and diverse because the author is human, and therefore can simply choose examples out of human experience. Most humanoids are created as personifying a single stereotype, and so while a forest elf may spend their days making poetry (like a poet would) a Drow spends every second of their day thinking of their own personal advancement (until a certain Drow came into existence.)

So the humanoids who are typically defined by their ambition are as ambitious or more than the average human, while those who are not... Are not.

[JohnnyCancer]

I think ambition is defined as the human trait when the other races have greater longevity, or are otherwise more advanced/powerful. Barring violence the elf is going to live forever, so they can spend a hundred years finding out that they've got no talent for the harmonica; but their human friend has to develop his talent and master it in less than that amount of time.

[Autolykos]

In the games I know, Dwarves are at least as ambitious (and probably quite a bit more greedy) than humans, and Orcs are somewhat more impatient.
The hippie mindset Elves are generally portrayed with, and the Halflings' extreme desire for comfort seems to be incompatible with it though.

[Wardog]

The hippie mindset Elves are generally portrayed with...

The Sons of Faenor, on the other hand...

[tyckspoon]

"Ambition" tends to be the Human hat because Humans, relative to most fantasy races, kind of suck. They're not naturally dextrous or tough or smart or strong or magical (well, except in 3.0/5, where it turns out having an extra Feat is actually *really good*, but I think that was kind of accidental.) And yet because we want humans to have a role to play in the world, writers have to invent a reason that humans are still relevant compared to all the fantastic races that do have significant natural advantages. That reason is very often the idea of ambition- whatever it is humans are pursuing, they do it bigger and with more energy than other races would, thus making up for their disadvantaged start just by wanting it more.

[Joe the Rat]

See, I read this, and thought about not-demi-human humanoids. Orcs n goblins and the like. They seem ambitious as all get out.

Looking at this in context of everyone elses' comments, you could argue that humanity is in the sweet spot of longevity and ambition: goblinoids, by nature or lifestyle, are short lived, and strive quickly to reach their goals. They're in a hurry. The downside of this is that there is little room for long-term planning. Elves and Dwarves and the like can be more patient. What's a couple decades of waiting to reclaim your ancestral home from some upstart anicent dragon? They plan long, but make few moves. Complacency is a threat to their plans.

Humans have the short, brightly burning lives that drive them to get stuff done, yet can take the moments necessary to appreciate the long view, and make grander plans.

Obviously there's more going on than this, but lifespan is a factor.

So no, I'd say its more about taking different forms than being a race-unique trait.

[KillianHawkeye]

Looking at this in context of everyone elses' comments, you could argue that humanity is in the sweet spot of longevity and ambition: goblinoids, by nature or lifestyle, are short lived, and strive quickly to reach their goals. They're in a hurry. The downside of this is that there is little room for long-term planning. Elves and Dwarves and the like can be more patient. What's a couple decades of waiting to reclaim your ancestral home from some upstart anicent dragon? They plan long, but make few moves. Complacency is a threat to their plans.

Humans have the short, brightly burning lives that drive them to get stuff done, yet can take the moments necessary to appreciate the long view, and make grander plans.

Obviously there's more going on than this, but lifespan is a factor.

So no, I'd say its more about taking different forms than being a race-unique trait.

I pretty much agree with this. It's not that humans are the only race that is ambitious, they're just the ones best able to reap the rewards of ambitious behavior.

[Akal Saris]

As written, I always pictured drow as the most ambitious D&D race. After all, they are portrayed as self-serving, selfish elves whose goal is generally to rise to the top of the heap, sometimes through intricate plans spanning decades and family lines.