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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Cute_Riolu's Avatar

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    Default Query regarding saving throws

    I have a question regarding saving throws. I'm aware that this is not an intended consequence of saving throws, but a friend of mine is convinced that every class you take should give you an additional +2 to their "good" saving throws.

    I can't seem to find anything that indicates otherwise using google easily. Could I have some help?
    Formerly known as Cariyaga.

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    Default Re: Query regarding saving throws

    Welcome to the insanitude that is D&D. Yes, by the rules, your friend is right. A fighter 1/barbarian 1 has base Fort +4!

    However it's not unheard of for DMs to house rule out this little nugget of cheese, and there is in fact an official variant that does so. I want to say it's in Unearthed Arcana...

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    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Kelb_Panthera's Avatar

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    Default Re: Query regarding saving throws

    Quote Originally Posted by HalfGrammarGeek View Post
    Welcome to the insanitude that is D&D. Yes, by the rules, your friend is right. A fighter 1/barbarian 1 has base Fort +4!

    However it's not unheard of for DMs to house rule out this little nugget of cheese, and there is in fact an official variant that does so. I want to say it's in Unearthed Arcana...
    You're thinking of the fractional BAB and Saves variant?

    If so, that actually explicitly includes the extra +2 for multiclassing multiple classes with the same good save.

    I do suggest using the fractional BAB and saves variant without that little bit of nonsense though.
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    Jade Dragon's Avatar

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    Default Re: Query regarding saving throws

    Quote Originally Posted by Cute_Riolu View Post
    I have a question regarding saving throws. I'm aware that this is not an intended consequence of saving throws, but a friend of mine is convinced that every class you take should give you an additional +2 to their "good" saving throws.

    I can't seem to find anything that indicates otherwise using google easily. Could I have some help?
    When the fractional BAB/saving throws variant explicitly calls it out as still working when you use that variant, I think it counts as "intended", or at least "they're fine with it".
    Last edited by Jade Dragon; 2012-11-18 at 11:20 PM.

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    Default Re: Query regarding saving throws

    He's right. 3.5's designers did not fully think through the consequences of their revolutionary new way of doing multiclass characters. Similar nonsense can happen with the BAB numbers by RAW- if you dig up enough classes/PRCs to dip into you can get a character with a +40 save and +0 BAB, which is pretty clearly a degenerate case. Fractional advancement of BAB/Saves is a common houserule to fix this, in which instead of only going by the tables you just take the actual advancement of the number instead- ie, a 'good' save doesn't advance by 1 every 2 levels. Instead it advances by 1/2 each level, and you just round down the fractions. An additional refinement is limiting the +2 boost to a 'good' save to only being received once, either only at the character's 1st level or once per save category (so if you start with a poor Reflex, for example, then you can still get the +2 by multiclassing to something with good Ref.. but you can't take Monk 1/Ranger 1/Rogue 1 to get +6 Ref.)

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    Default Re: Query regarding saving throws

    Quote Originally Posted by Kelb_Panthera View Post
    You're thinking of the fractional BAB and Saves variant?

    If so, that actually explicitly includes the extra +2 for multiclassing multiple classes with the same good save.
    Hm, I could have sworn I've read something published that suggested PCs getting only the +2s from their first class. Maybe a digital article graced with the Soveliss pic...well, whatever.

    I personally espouse a "You get the +2s from each of your classes, but they don't stack" house rule. That way players aren't thinking "Well it doesn't really fit my character, but if I take my classes in this particular order, I get more bonuses..."

    EDIT: Everything tyckspoon just said.
    Last edited by HalfGrammarGeek; 2012-11-18 at 11:28 PM.

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