[3.5][DMM persist] Help needed - build advice.

[Angelmaker]

Hello.

I wanted to build a DMM persist cleric for a regular D&D 3.5 game. The plan is to buff the party with spells like mass bear´s endurance, mass lesser vigor and other good stuff to ensure party survival.

Allowed sources: All the completes ( complete divine, complete warrior, etc. ) and unearthed arcana, as well as tome of battle.

So, AFAIK this excludes nightsticks ( Libris Mortis ).

How Do I go best about this? Is it really worth it without nightsticks?

My thinking so far:

Human Paragon 1 / Cleric 3 / Human Paragon +2 / Radiant Servant of Pelor X

This hits my spellcasting for a level, but allows me more feats, so I can have enough turning attempts and persist metamagic by level 5 - and have enough turn attempts by level 6 for two persisted spells. Might be worth to take a flaw from unearthed arcana, so it´d be up and ready to go by level 3, but it´s not a necessity, because the good party buff spells come at later levels.

I can´t find a class that grants me a rebuke pool without being evil and it´s a mostly good aligned party, so I figured I might as well go radiant servant.

Also, I figured that a converted cleric from obad hai ( neutral ) could probably rebuke undead, but would probably loose that rebuke pool and exchange it for a turn undead pool as soon as he started revering Pelor. I can´t really find anything on that matter and I don´t want to try any ridiculous attonement shananigans just for the sake of the rebuke undead pool.

So, any helpful input would be most appreciated. I know the limitations in sources are pretty steep, but that´s what I got to live with. :)

[mattie_p]

DMM Persist really works best when you have more than one turning pool. With the sources you listed, I don't know that it is possible to help you. You are really looking for Death Delver, a PrC from Heroes of Horror (minimum entry at ECL 6), which grants rebuke and can be good. Does not advance cleric casting, but it gives you the rebuke pool that you really really need

[Xervous]

DMM persist does not need to go off that early, mainly because there are very few good targets for its capabilities. Only once mass lesser vigor is available does it become unconditionally practical.

If you have access to the magic item compendium, get the reliquary holy symbol, 1k for +3 turn undead attempts, given you meet all the prereqs (which you should)

Also, with a limited turn undead pool, make sure you select actual good spells to persist, while mass X's Y may seem nice, other effects may be more beneficial to the party.

[Angelmaker]

Death Delver... noted.

Thanks for the info. At least you saved me another dozen hours scouring the available material for possibilities.

@ Xervus: Thanks. The item passed by my radar. Noted. Combined with eagle´s splendor it just might net me another persisted spell. :)

[mattie_p]

Just a note, eagle's splendor won't stack with a permanent + Cha item. Use one or the other.

MIC wasn't on your permitted source list. If it is, great. Any other sources that you care to list?

See the list of stuff (I linked the most updated version I could find).

Cleric 1
Paladin 4
Blackguard 3, ecl, command or rebuke only
Sacred Exorcist 1, ecl 8, Complete Divine, turn only
Ur-priest 2, ecl 7, Complete Divine, rebuke only
Divine Mind 4, Complete Divine, class variant (here)
Dread Necromancer 1, base class, Heroes of Horror, rebuke only
Death Delver 1, ecl 6, Heroes of Horror, rebuke only
Chameleon 3, ecl 8, Races of Destiny, see text
Master of Radiance 1, ecl 6, Libris Mortin, turn only - unclear whether you gain turning or if it only stacks
Tenebrous, vestige, ecl 7, Tome of Magic, unlimited use but see text
Knight of the Raven 3, ecl 7, Expedition to Castle Ravenloft
Apostle of Peace 1, ecl 8, Book of Exalted Deeds
Soldier of Light 1, ecl 6, Deities and Demigods
Deadgrim 1, ecl 6, Magic of Eberron - unclear whethero you gain turning or if it only stacks

[Angelmaker]

Thanks again. Actually, I need to recheck on the MIC to see if it is allowed. I checked it anyway just in case just missed the item. Still, I don´t see the brokenness of it - 2 or 3 turn attempts isn´t something to worry about as a DM.

[mattie_p]

There's other reasons why a DM might not allow the item. The DM might not have the book or access to it. He or she might be fairly new and want to keep total sources to those they are most familiar with. Allowing MIC for a single item might be opening up the floodgates to other items they perceive as broken. But it never hurts to ask.