Completely Dysfunctional Handbook [3.5]

[nedz]

Done, please proof read.

[Snowbluff]

Done, please proof read.

Commoner Rail Gun and Physics are contradictory. If the parcel doesn't have momentum, it would not be moving very fast after the last commoner releases it.

[Hamste]

Commoner Rail Gun and Physics are contradictory. If the parcel doesn't have momentum, it would not be moving very fast after the last commoner releases it.

The rail gun doesn't do any damage. The problem/dysfunction with it is that you can transport anything an infinite distance with enough commoners.

[Snowbluff]

The rail gun doesn't do any damage. The problem/dysfunction with it is that you can transport anything an infinite distance with enough commoners.

Oh, okay. Carry on, then.

[nedz]

What is this momentum of which you speak ?
SRD reference please ?

Commoner Rail Gun 3.5 and Physics are contradictory. If the parcel doesn't have momentum

FTFY.

[Snowbluff]

What is this momentum of which you speak ?
SRD reference please ?



FTFY.

FTFY meaning "I screwed that up for you."

There is an entry for Physics, and one for Commoner Railgun. The former would make the old version of the latter impossible. If momentum isn't conserved, the "Railgun" makes a rather lousy gun.

[Hamste]

Yeah, commoner railgun is a misnomer. It does the exact same damage as a commoner throwing it at the end as an improvised weapon making it nearly pointless as a doom weapon. Is still lets you make a package travel any length of distance is 6 seconds which is the main advantage. Who needs a teleportation circle when you can get a bunch of commoners to crowd surf you at the speed of light to the destination.

[NeoPhoenix0]

These kinds of discussions are probably better held in the current thread. This thread is mainly for the collecting of the dysfunctions of the dysfunctional threads.

[nedz]

Pages 41-45 of Thread 3

Class|Shugenja|Shugenja's require Cha equal to 10+SL+Cha mod to cast a spell|3|42|3.5
(Not a dysfunction, at least not one in the rules — the reader's eyesight maybe)

Feat|Ki*|Ki feats specify bonus feat rather than Monk bonus feat|3|42|3.5
Feat|Superior Unarmed Strike|One level of Monk stips this from scaling|3|42|3.5
Item|Single Gloves|Use both hands to wear one glove|3|42|3.5
feat|Dream of Perception (SoS)|Dreamtouched state ended by any augury|3|43|3.5
Class|Death Master|A Wizard can copy their spells into their spellbooks|3|43|3.5
Vestige|Astaroth|Grants craft feats, but not the ability to use them|3|43|3.5
Mystery|Black Labyrinth|AoE 1 mile radius, but the range is Long|3|43|3.5
Class|Monks|Cannot use bonus feats if they are not qualified|3|44|3.5
PrC|Deepstone Sentinel|Mountain Fortress Stance flawed interaction with Stone Dragon stance|3|44|3.5
Spell|Control Water|Abusable on land|3|44|3.5
Power|Compression/Expansion does not change your speed|3|44|3.5
Spell|Reduce/Enlage does not change your speed|3|44|3.5
Monster|Undead type|Immune to physical ability damage, Con - makes them immune to all ability damage|3|45|3.5
Items|Maneuver items in ToB|Iron Heart Vest, Setting Sun Slippers etc - can never been taken off even to bathe|3|45|3.5
Feat|Extraordinary Concentration|Allows you to cast a spell when maintaining concentration on another, only it doesn't|3|45|3.5
Stance|Shifting Defense|Allows 5' steps on AoO, but only 1/rd|3|45|3.5

[nedz]

OK I'm going to wrap up Thread 3 by doing Pages 46-50.

Items|Weapons|Contradictory rules about weilding weapons of the wrong size|3|46|3.5
PrC|Paragnostic Initiate|Discern Weakness uses wrong knowledge|3|46|3.5
Monster|Black Pudding|Made of Acid but take full damage from Acid|3|47|3.5
Item|Defending|Only works on swords|3|47|3.5
Misc|Nonlethal Damage|Nonlethal Damage does damage, but then it doesn't|3|48|3.5
Spell|Haste|Dodge bonuses are never granted by spells, except Haste|3|48|3.5
Combat|Throw weapons|Splash weapons can go farther when you miss then when you hit|3|48|3.5
Class|Factotum|Cunning Breach: Targets fail SR against Factotum's spells. SR tests are made by the caster, which Factotums aren't|3|48|3.5
Item|Talsiman of the Disk|Makes a Tenser's floating disk with a Transmutation aura. Tenser's floating disk is Evocation|3|49|3.5
Spell|Footsteps of the Divine|Unknown duration|3|49|3.5
Feat|Corrupted Wild Shape|Superflous|3|49|3.5
Misc|Extravagent cost of living|Makes you arbitarily wealthy|3|49|3.PF
Misc|Supply and Demand|All prices and supplies of things remain constant|3|50|3.x

I'll consolidate these shortly, but not today

[nedz]

Well I finally found time to finish summarizing Thread 3, anyone feel like making a start on Thread 4 ?

We have broken the 500 barrier already, and have our first dizzy Vestige.

[nedz]

I'll pick up pages 1-5 of Thread 4

PrCs|Tenebrous Apostate|Tenebrous grants TU so no actual Cleric requirement|4|1|3.5
Misc|Disease|Natural mummy rot is less dangerous than that spread by mummies|4|1|3.5
Spell|Shadow Conjuration|Double 20% reduction on Non-lethal and ability damage|4|1|3.5
Combat|TWF|Handedness is still in the rules|4|1|3.5
Misc|Disease|Plague Blight: nauseated, no duration|4|1|3.5
PrC|Various|Some SLAs have no defined spell level|4|1|3.5
Weapon|Ghost Touch|Can't hit Ghosts — unless manifested|4|2|3.5
Monsters|Aquatics|Abilities are not limited to working in water|4|2|3.5
Archetype|Armor Master: Deflective Shield (Ex) Assumes shields provide an armour bonus|4|2|3.PF
Spell|Curse of Pain ETERNAL|(Dr#300) Duration: 10 minutes/level|4|3|3.5
Race|Changelings|+10 bonus to disguise somewhat misleading|4|3|3.5
Feat|Escape route|Makes you immune to AoOs from movement|4|3|3.PF
Spell|Elemental Familiar|CAn be cast on any creature|4|3|3.5
Item|Bearskin Armor|Functions in Wild Shape, but it's made from metal|4|3|3.5
Spell|Sanctified spells|Neutral characters can cast Sanctified spells|4|3|3.5
Monster|Devourers|Can deflect various spells which they are immune to anyway|4|3|3.5
Template|Sentry Ooze| Int — +2 = 2|4|4|3.5
Combat|Readied actions|If staggered, you can ready a charge. Otherwise you can't|4|4|3.5
PrC|Disciple of Xl|Has +8 BAB at level 10, should be 7|4|4|3.5
PrC|Moon Guardian|Grants Natural Spell to Lycanthropes|4|4|3.5
PrC|Black Flame Zealot|Requires Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Kukri); Kukri is a martial weapon|4|4|3.5
Feat|Mythic Path abilities|Most are badly worded|4|5|3.PF
Class|Barbarian|Ghost Rager — Touch AC can be higher than AC|4|5|3.PF

[TuggyNE]

I'll pick up pages 1-5 of Thread 4

Ooh, I should take 6-10, but it'll have to be tomorrow.

[The Viscount]

Dibs on 11-20, though it'll be a few days before I get to them.

[TuggyNE]

Spell|Wall of Sand (Sandstorm)|Adjacent target inside wall cannot be attacked|4|6|3.5
Spell|Telepathic Bond|Can be put on ghouls, treants, inevitables, etc*|4|7|3.PF
Feat|Intimidating Strike|Can't be used in a charge|4|7|3.5
Spell|Charm Person|Sets attitude to friendly, even if it was more positive before|4|8|3.PF
Feat|Mage Slayer|Automatically informs spellcasters of their inability to cast defensively, even if they were unaware of the enemy|4|8|3.5
PrC|Rage Mage|Can quicken spells without changing casting time|4|8|3.5
Misc|Wizard specialization|Many spell trigger/spell completion items of banned schools are still usable|4|9|3.5
Spell|Vermin Shape|Can't be dismissed, unlike other [polymorph]|4|9|PF
Misc|Animal type|If Int increased in various ways, animal is no longer animal?|4|10|3.PF
Misc|Swarm subtype|Not immune to distraction|4|10|3.PF

Well, it wasn't exactly tomorrow, but close enough for govmint work.

[nedz]

I'll grab 21-25 then.
I'll do the update when The Viscount has completed his tranche — holidays permitting.

Spell|Aspect of the Wolf|Type changes to animal, but retain mental abilities|4|21|3.5
Skill|Spot and Listen|Inverse square law is linear|4|21|3.5
Power|Heavy Earth|Immune to being knocked prone|4|21|3.5
Skill|Knowledge Arcana|DC 10 to identify an intelligent item|4|22|3.5
PrC|various|Advances spells/day but not CL or Spells Known|4|22|3.5
PrC|Eldritch Knight|Doesn't advance CL except that it does|4|22|3.5
Feat|Improved fiendish servant|Gives you a doubly fiendish servant|4|22|3.5
Class|Favored soul|dead level ability faith healing grant NI healing|4|22|3.5
Class|Cleric|Domain powers do not specify the descriptor|4|23|3.5
Monster|Kraken|Jet power is not specified as Swim|4|23|3.5
Spell|Damnation Stride|Dim Door + Fireball with a duration of 1 min/level|4|23|3.PF
Item|Shield|Lose AC bonus after using it as a weapon, until you mumble|4|23|3.5
Combat|Tiny Creatures|Must spring attack, can't full attack|4|23|3.5
Race|Changelings|Only qualify for Able Learner and Chameleon via variant rule|4|24|3.5
Item|Morphing weapon|Thrown category confusion|4|24,25|3.5
PrC|Master of Many Forms|Language confusion|4|24|3.5
Item|Scrolls|Scrolls of multiple spells exist but there is no way to make them|4|25|3.5
Item|Scrolls|Clerics can make scrolls of domain spells, but usually can't use them|4|25|3.5
PrC|Invisible Blade|Has Innuendo as a class skill|4|25|3.5

[The Viscount]

Sorry for the wait. Here's 11-20.

Equipment|Double Weapon|Interaction with two-weapon fighting are odd|4|20|3.5
Monster|Swarm|Can be half-dragon*|4|11|3.5
Monster|Swarm|Can be held if swallowed whole, constituent creatures cannot|4|17|3.5
Monster|Swarm|Druid can potentially wildshape into swarm without gaining swarm subtype|4|17|3.5
Monster|Troglodyte|Smell worse when alive than when dead or zombie*|4|11|3.5
Race|Spellscale|Can gain bonus to Perform (Storytelling), which does not exist|4|14|3.5
Adventure|Shadows of the Last War|Yellow lock can only be opened by a yellow key which does not exist|4|11|3.5
Misc|Gaze Attacks|Iteratives can be made with gaze attacks|4|12|3.5
Misc|Attack Action|Attack action is never defined|4|12|3.5
Misc|Movement Speeds|Multiple movement speed types do not interact|4|12|3.5
Misc|Dying and Unconsciousness|Neither makes the creature prone|4|12|3.5
Misc|Difficult Terrain|Poor visibility may reduce falling speed or increase falling damage|4|14|3.5
Skill|Jump|Swim speeds and jump interact weirdly, you can jump while flying|4|17-19|3.5
Vestige|Zceryll|Summon Alien has no duration or range|4|12|3.5
Spell|Polymorph Any Object|Creature bodies created using PaO have no HD|4|12|3.5
Spell|Seed of Undeath|Is not an [Evil] spell*|4|16|3.5
Feat|Undead Meldshaper|Allows undead to take Incarnum classes, but not Incarnum feats|4|12|3.5
Feat|Swarmfighting|Has rules for creatures smaller than Small, which cannot take the feat|4|16|3.5
Prestige Class|Legendary Captain|Can reroll failed roll, but must be done before it is declared a success or failure by DM|4|14|3.5
Prestige Class|Knight of the Sacred Seal|Changes type to outsider, referencing monk class feature which does not change type|4|15|3.5
Prestige Class|Blackguard|Fiendish Servant has more SR from template than from class|4|16|3.5
Prestige Class|Nar Demonbinder|Can cast all equivalents of blasphemy, may affect self or familiar
Prestige Class|Justice of Weald and Woe|Saves are abnormally progressed|4|17|3.5
Prestige Class|Soulbow|Phase Arrow is stopped by wall of smoke, but not brick wall|4|20|3.5
Mystery|Greater Life Fades|Conflicting target information|4|16|3.5

[nedz]

OK, I've done the update.

The collection is now too big for 1 post and so has had to be split.

I'm now regretting not reserving more posts at the top of the thread; though we will be OK for some time.

[NeoPhoenix0]

If it gets too big, then we can either try to make a new thread, or we could hyperlink a table of contents to latter posts.

[nedz]

If it gets too big, then we can either try to make a new thread, or we could hyperlink a table of contents to latter posts.

Sure, there are lots of options, and we have some time as yet.

[nedz]

I'm going to grab 26-30

[nedz]

PrC|Knight of the Thorn|Requires all Martial Weapon Proficiency feats|4|26|3.5
Skill|Disable Device|Skill function specifically tied to Rogue class|4|26|3.PF
Misc|Burrow|No rules for this ability|4|26|3.PF
Monster|Vampire|Blood Drain Temp HP have no listed duration|4|26|3.5
Monster|Vampire spawn|Blood Drain Temp HP have no listed duration|4|26|3.5
Monster|Boneworm|Desiccation aura Temp HP has no listed duration|4|26|3.5
Monster|Boneworm|Can render you shaken with no duration|4|26|3.5
Monster|Siabrie|Temp HP has no listed duration|4|26|3.5
Spell|Wall of Water|No listed height|4|26|3.5
Class|Warshaper|Can grow NI (at least 103) Natural attacks|4|26|3.5
Spell|Polymorph|Confusion over Disguise skill|4|26|3.5

Monster|Succubus|Can give you variable doses of Negative levels|4|27|3.5

Monster|Wolf|Cannot Trip as part of an AoO|4|28|3.5

Feat|Double hit|Can make an AoO with off hand weapon even if it's out of reach|4|29|3.5
Combat|TWF|Can't dual wield unarmed strikes, unless you have a weapon in one hand|4|29|3.5
Item|Armor Spikes|These are, and are not, weapons|4|29|3.5

Skill|Profession(Miner)|Governs how far you can dig, this is Wis based|4|30|3.5
Feat|Song of the Dead|Spells prepared with this feat become necromantic, spontaneous ones don't|4|30|3.5


Publication list
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showp...&postcount=761

[nedz]

I'm going to do 31-35 next

Soulmeld|Soulspeaker Circlet|Spend essentia to understand a language you already understand|4|31|3.5
Misc|Line of Effect|Two different definitions|4|31|3.5
Combat|Pounce|Grants single melee attack + full attack|4|31|3.5
Feats|[aberrant]|Aberrations cannot take [aberrant] feats, in fact only humanoids can|4|32|3.5
Template|Mindless undead|Creatures with mindless undead templates can have class levels despite being mindless|4|32|3.5
Spell|Shadow Trap|Has meaningless Reflex save|4|32|3.0
Spell|Soul Shackles|Confused targetting|4|32|3.0

Feat|Ineluctable Echo|Possibly infinite loop|4|33|3.5
Feat|Hindering Opportunist|Feat helps opponent|4|33|3.5
Combat|Demoralize|Opponents can avoid demoralization by playing peek-a-boo|4|33|3.5

Template|Half-Dragon|Breath weapon not depend on it's size|4|34|3.5
Misc|Ultimate Magic|Can cure yourself of nausia when casting a spell, which you can't do when nausiated|4|34|3.PF
Class|Ranger|Favored terrain boosts Knowledge: Geography when in the favored terrain|4|34|3.PF
Skill|Hiding/Moving Silently|Confused rules when at full speed|4|34|3.5

Feat|Heighten Spell|Can be used as a metamagic cost reducer — maybe|4|35-36|3.5
Feat|Channel the Gift|Can fuel free metamagic|4|35|3.PF
Feat|All Devotion feats|TU attempts grant additional daily uses|4|35-36|3.5

I actually went through to page 36, because the debate continued.

[nedz]

I'm going to do Pages 37-42 next

Vestige|Balam|Gaze attack has no listed range|4|37|3.5
Spell|Mind Blank|Works against some suprising Divintations|4|37|3.5
Feat|Ring the Golden Bell|Allows Grapple at Range etc.|4|37|3.5
Power|Wild Surge|Free Augmentation|4|37|3.5

Monster|Guecubu|Defines what happens if you don't sleep|4|38|3.5

Misc|Hands|Come in several sizes|4|39|3.5

Misc|Cold Immunity|Being immune to cold makes you vulnerable to Fire|4|39|3.5

Spell|Crack ice|Effects Ice creatures — whatever they are ?|4|40|3.5

Monster|Spider Eater|Auto death in six weeks time, if you're hit|4|41|3.5

Misc|Ships|A ship that is going backwards must stop before it can go backwards|4|41|3.5

Item|Phylactery of Negative Channeling|Adds 2d6 to any damage|4|42|3.PF

Misc|Retraining Rules|Paradoxiacal pre-reqs|4|42|3.PF
Templates|Half Fey and Half Celestial|Children may be a lot larger than their parents|4|42|3.5
Misc|Planar Bubbles|Overlapping bubbles can cause a contradiction|4|42|3.5

[TuggyNE]

43-51 for me!

Spell|Incorporeal Nova|Can "destroy" living creatures instead of killing|4|43|3.5
Misc|Divine, Glory|Some deities with those domains have incompatible alignments and cannot grant some spells|4|43|PF
Power|Call Weaponry|Can include siege weapons|4|43|3.PF
Monster|Glimmerskin|Has Cleave, but Str -|4|44|3.5
Monster|Mountain Giant (MM2)|No listed rock-throwing range|4|44|3.5
Template|Voidmind (LM)|Template makes immune to dominate effect it imposes|4|45|3.5
Monster|Mane (FC1)|Physically unable to do any damage at all to any devil, ever|4|45|3.5
Spell|Polymorph Any Object|Can give targets ability scores even if they are null|4|45|PF
Spell|Wall of Force|May not block LoE for everything*|4|45|3.PF
Stance|Dance of the Spider (ToB)|Eliminates all bonuses on enemy attacks while climbing|4|47|3.5
Race|Aasimar w/ Scion of Humanity|Always passes for human no matter what|4|48|PF
Feat|Tomb-Tainted Soul|Does not explicitly prevent negative energy from harming you|4|48|3.5
Feat|Double Wand Wielder/Dual Dorje|Override casting time to always be a total of a full-round action|4|49|3.5
Monster|Change Shape ability|Most creatures cannot change back|4|49|3.5
Spell|(Un)hallow|Can apply detection spells in an area but do not define where the detected information goes|4|49|3.PF
Vestige|Shax|Gives sonic/electricity touch attack; what type is sneak attack with it?|4|49|3.5
Combat|TWF|Undefined for most ranged weapons, including slings|4|49|3.PF
Equipment|Longarm Bracers|Gives reach with all weapons, not merely those held|4|49|PF
Feat|Inhuman Reach|Gives reach with all weapons, not merely those held|4|49|3.5
Misc|Spooked drawback|Attempts to override immunities to fear, but doesn't|4|49|PF
Maneuver|Thicket of Blades|May or may not override Tumble AoO avoidance|4|49|3.5
Monster|Vorr (FF)|Unupdated 3.0 DR|4|50|3.5

[Gadora]

43-51 for me!

Combat|TWF|Undefined for most ranged weapons, including slings|4|49|3.PF

Minor correction: Slings are among the handful of weapons that are defined.

[deuxhero]

You missed

Equipment|Bonebreaker Gauntlets|Occupy the wrong body slot for gauntlets, allowing a character to wear two pairs of gauntlets|4|49|PF
Equipment|Gauntlets of Skill at Arms|Occupy the wrong body slot for gauntlets, allowing a character to wear two pairs of gauntlets|4|49|PF

[TuggyNE]

Minor correction: Slings are among the handful of weapons that are defined.

Well don't I feel silly.

You missed

Equipment|Bonebreaker Gauntlets|Occupy the wrong body slot for gauntlets, allowing a character to wear two pairs of gauntlets|4|49|PF
Equipment|Gauntlets of Skill at Arms|Occupy the wrong body slot for gauntlets, allowing a character to wear two pairs of gauntlets|4|49|PF

I'm not sure those are really dysfunctional? But I guess they could go in with an asterisk.

[nedz]

OK — I'm going to do the compositing now.

I'm going to change
Combat|TWF|Undefined for most ranged weapons, including slings|4|49|3.PF
to
Combat|TWF|Undefined for most ranged weapons|4|49|3.PF
Shout if this is wrong and I'll fix it.

[nedz]

I've just updated the handbook for the new table format.

This is cool, unfortunately it does consume almost twice as much space and so I've had to move the top category into the bottom of post 1, and the last category (Adventures) has been, temporarily, removed.

I should have reserved more pages.

Options:

1. Create a new thread
2. Move more categories into Page 1 (There's plenty of space)
3. Borrow another post
   
   • Have TuggyNE move his stuff from post 4 into the top of post 6 and delete post 4
   • Reuse my old post 5 (now 4) for an extra page

No huge rush on any of this. I can shuffle categories up which will allow me to replace the lost section, but that won't be today.

Post Sizes for reference

• Post 1 6K
• Post 2 49K
• Post 3 49K
• Lost Post 1K

The limit, for a post, is 50K