Is anyone hoping for a Bobby Ewing Moment?

[KillingAScarab]

Anyone who read the instruction booklet knew Subcon was Dreamland.

In my advanced age the only thing I remember from that instruction booklet is the derogatory description of Birdo, only because I read the manual again years later.

[NerdyKris]

In my advanced age the only thing I remember from that instruction booklet is the derogatory description of Birdo, only because I read the manual again years later.

"He thinks he is a girl and spits eggs from his mouth" isn't really derogatory. It just says that he's a physical male identifying as female. That's not to say the Japanese translation wasn't derogatory (I wouldn't know, I'm looking at the manual I have), or later versions, but the original American release just said it was a male who wanted to be female.

[Mike Havran]

No, I do not.

Yes, it would.

[Sunken Valley]

Oh it's all a Bobby Ewing. The whole strip is Xykon's dream about someone beating him. When Roy kills him we see him wake up, sweaty and gasping. Redcloak comes to check on him. Then Suddenly, Roy comes out of nowhere and stabs Redcloak. Xykon wakes up. He goes to get some water. Then in the mirror, Roy is standing behind him. Xykon wakes up. To Redcloak standing over him, Heal.

It could also be a dying dream of Elan. He died in this strip due to Durkon's incompetance and the whole comic has been building up to this revenge fantasy.

Or it could be Roy's dream, as he died here.

[sam79]

Sincere question: disregarding self-contained elements (episodes, installments, whatever) of a story where it's revealed before the element is over, has there ever been an ending of this type that people actually liked?

Wasn't there a Zelda game for the Gameboy that ended like that? Link's Awakening if my memory serves? I liked this game.

ETA: this may not count as a 'story'. And if it does, it may count as a self-contained 'episode' in the larger Zelda mythology. So...yeah.

[The Pilgrim]

They all died in the castle explosion (including Xykon and Redcloak). The rest of the strip is just their travel through Purgatory.

[Shred-Bot]

What if instead of a Bobby Ewing moment, we had a PATRICK Ewing moment? Elan grows a little taller (enlarge person?), puts on some muscle, gets himself a glorious flat-top hairstyle and some low-post moves... tell me this couldn't work.

Then the Order could challenge Team Evil to a basketball game for ownership of Girard's gate, Xykon tries to use his energy drain spells to steal the talent from the Order but Roy comes out of retirement and he is the best of all so the Order wins. Then Xykon metor swarms the gate and after the krackackoom things are back to normal in the race for Kraagor's gate.

(Okay fine this is even worse than Bobby Ewing... but if the Giant is going to destroy his story, wouldn't you want him to do it in spectacular fashion? I'd rather see things devolve into Space Jam than a boring soap opera)

[Snails]

It only only be funny if it was a double sike out and in the same comic. as to not waste time.
Have Belkar think it was all Girard's illusion, then wake up and realize it's real and they're sol.

This. Not a bad way to hint at further moral growth for Belkar, by, say, imagining himself being a far better person than anyone (including himself) would expect.

[KillingAScarab]

Wasn't there a Zelda game for the Gameboy that ended like that? Link's Awakening if my memory serves? I liked this game.

ETA: this may not count as a 'story'. And if it does, it may count as a self-contained 'episode' in the larger Zelda mythology. So...yeah.

I'm not one to argue for continuity amongst the Legend of Zelda series. However, I did play Link's Awakening and enjoyed it quite a bit.

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It wasn't actually Link's dream. Link was in the Wind Fish's dream and the entire island of Koholint was a figment. The bosses were referred to as "nightmares" and I think there's something which explicitly tells you about the nature of Koholint, but I cannot remember how far into the game you go before learning that. Interestingly, Link must play the Song of Awakening, which is just the Ballad of the Wind Fish which Marin is able to teach you very near the beginning. The song wasn't secret knowledge, but the instruments guarded by the bosses were required to end the dream.

[Incom]

"It was all a dream" as a reset button does not work.

"It was all a dream" as a way to create more conflict (ie. "Koholint is a dream world" or "please wake up from the lotus-eater plant Superman" as mentioned above) can work.

[TopCheese]

8 Bit Theatre was the only story that pulled the "it was a dream" correctly.

[Holy_Knight]

Inception is technically one of those, even though we know it's a dream throughout.

I was thinking of Inception too, although part of why it's interesting is that only some parts of it are dreams, and it's not always clear which ones. Especially the end, which seems intentionally ambiguous. That being said, I think there are enough clues to reasonably conclude that:

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Dom never woke up, and his "return home" was still just a dream.

There's plenty of examples, but they all have one thing in common. Only one character is being focused on, there are hints that it's not real, or outright knowing it isn't, and it's not used as a reset button, but a method of introspection.

I don't know that it has to focus on only one character, but otherwise I think you're right about this. Aside from your examples, I can think of two from Batman: The Animated Series:

1) Batman is trapped by the Mad Hatter in a dream that is supposed to be everything he ever wanted. After he starts noticing little things that don't quite make sense, he has to give up (the illusion of) the happy life he might have had, and figure out how to force himself to wake up.

2) Batgirl dies, and in the wake of her death Commissioner Gordon finds out who Batman is, blames her death on him, and vows revenge. He and the rest of the cops storm Wayne Manor and Batman and Nightwing have to go on the run. Things get progressively worse as the vigilantes are hunted down by their former allies, culminating in even greater tragedy at the end. ...Then we find out that actually Batgirl never died, but she had been dosed with fear toxin and hallucinated all the other events. Even though it was basically a reset button for that episode, it was cool because it allowed the exploration of the characters' fears and raised issues of trust, betrayal, and so on.

I think those episodes were called "Perchance to Dream" and "Over the Edge", but I'm less sure about the first one.

[Dr.Epic]

Only if it was done like this.

[TheWolfe]

This made me think of this theory, which proposes that all of pokemon is a coma-dream. It actually makes a lot of sense.

But I have to agree with the others that it would be stupid if OOTS was just a dream. That would be like LOTR ending with Frodo waking up and realising he dreamed all of Middle-Earth, or Star Wars ending with Luke waking up and finding out it was all a dream.

[Giggling Ghast]

Going to Mom's funeral has given me the strangest dreams. You were there! And you were there! And you were there! And you were there!

(Elan points to the dolls on his shelf that resemble the OOTS members)

You were the bestest friends I ever had.

(Realizes he is alone again, starts crying)

[nonamearisto]

Maybe it was all a nightmare that young black dragon had, only he's a hatchling and fears elves attacking. Not to mention familicide is so overpowered as to be worthy of a nightmare. lol.

[Aquatosic]

if this is all a dream, I will drive all the way to wherever Rich Burlew lives and personally bitch-slap him

[Aquatosic]

if it was a dream, it was all Roy's dream in the moments before he hit the ground after Xykon knocked him off the zombie dragon during the Battle for Azure City.

[KillingAScarab]

What if instead of a Bobby Ewing moment, we had a PATRICK Ewing moment? Elan grows a little taller (enlarge person?), puts on some muscle, gets himself a glorious flat-top hairstyle and some low-post moves... tell me this couldn't work.

Sorry it took me so long to notice this. I want to see this. Forget about, "it was all a dream." We need it to be a Dream Team. Also, Elan is totally the Larry Bird to Nale's "Magic" Johnson. I mean, Nale actually casts magic!

[Domino Quartz]

NO. It would be horrible and terrible story-telling to make this all just a dream.

[Windup]

Yes, because "it was all just a dream" is lazy, hack writing and a cheap copout to boot.

To be fair to the Dallas writers of thirty years ago, it wasn't so much "lazy" writing as "gun to your head" writing. It has to suck when your bosses point-blank order you to resurrect a character in a setting with no resurrection.

[Killer Angel]

For those who are younger than about 35...http://www.ultimatedallas.com/episod...eamzonefaq.htm

So...anyone hoping that this is all some sort of dream sequence/illusory test/etc?

Would it ruin the story for you if it were?

It depends.
The comic "it was all a dream", will be posted on the 1st of april?

[pendell]

The best way I've seen this done is the 90's movie Total Recall . I believe the novelization made it clear that the entire thing had in fact been a dream sequence which the protaganist had paid for.

If something is going to be "all a dream", then the fact that it must be a dream must be foreshadowed and must be a part of the plot. If it IS a dream, it must still be satisfactorily resolved. You can't simply have the character wake up and pop the dream world as if it were a soap bubble.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[Velaryon]

What if instead of a Bobby Ewing moment, we had a PATRICK Ewing moment? Elan grows a little taller (enlarge person?), puts on some muscle, gets himself a glorious flat-top hairstyle and some low-post moves... tell me this couldn't work.

Then the Order could challenge Team Evil to a basketball game for ownership of Girard's gate, Xykon tries to use his energy drain spells to steal the talent from the Order but Roy comes out of retirement and he is the best of all so the Order wins. Then Xykon metor swarms the gate and after the krackackoom things are back to normal in the race for Kraagor's gate.

(Okay fine this is even worse than Bobby Ewing... but if the Giant is going to destroy his story, wouldn't you want him to do it in spectacular fashion? I'd rather see things devolve into Space Jam than a boring soap opera)

I would love to see this as an story in another Snips, Snails, and Dragon Tails style of book.

To be fair to the Dallas writers of thirty years ago, it wasn't so much "lazy" writing as "gun to your head" writing. It has to suck when your bosses point-blank order you to resurrect a character in a setting with no resurrection.

I came in to say something about this. The Dallas writers had to bring back a character that had been killed off, because the ratings took a nose dive after he left and they had to bring him back in order to save the show. The "it was all a dream" copout may have been the only thing they could do.

[kruemeli]

For those who are younger than about 35...http://www.ultimatedallas.com/episod...eamzonefaq.htm

I was there... as it were...

So...anyone hoping that this is all some sort of dream sequence/illusory test/etc?

No. I'd rather it was more the Fallon/alien intervention storyline...

Would it ruin the story for you if it were?

Difficult to answer... I would certainly stop checking often to see if there were updates... maybe check in once a month or so to read through a few strips at once... most webcomics end up fading this way for me.

[Unisus]

The best way I've seen this done is the 90's movie Total Recall . I believe the novelization made it clear that the entire thing had in fact been a dream sequence which the protaganist had paid for.

If something is going to be "all a dream", then the fact that it must be a dream must be foreshadowed and must be a part of the plot. If it IS a dream, it must still be satisfactorily resolved. You can't simply have the character wake up and pop the dream world as if it were a soap bubble.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

If i remember correctly, the whole story was not a dream - at least there was never a statement that it was one. There are bits that point more in the "not a dream" direction.

On topic: i agree that it would destroy a lot of the story, if this should have been a dream - of course, there were enough comments on gaming that it could be a funny ending, should we actually see the gamers leaving the table after the session, with paper minis of the OotS cast still standing around. But the dream of one of the characters? No way - in this environment there is not even the "we had to do this because there was no other way" reasoning.

[BaronOfHell]

If it is not too late to participate.....

So...anyone hoping that this is all some sort of dream sequence/illusory test/etc?

It'd honestly depend on what I'd wake up to.

Also it'd suck major whale testicles waking up on a cliffhanger at "883 Fiend Swap" and never find out the rest of the story, should the story of OOTS only have been imaginary. So if it's a dream, don't wake me up yet, please.

[davidbofinger]

The final strip will be Elan as an autistic boy playing with miniatures while reading a 3.5e handbook.

If you were going to do this - which would be a brain-numbingly bad idea - it would be Roy, I think. Roy is a kid forced to learn mathematics (i.e. wizardry) when he'd rather play football (i.e. fighter stuff - use whatever meaning of "football" is common in your country). Elan could be Roy's puppy.

The best way to do "It was all a dream" is probably the way Red Dwarf did it.

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The characters are revealed to have been inside a computer game, then it's revealed that the series reality is actually real and the computer game a dream, but a frisson of doubt remains.

[Gift Jeraff]

I'm hoping for a Bobby Hill moment.

That's my dwarf! I don't know you!

That bard ain't right...

[Themrys]

Yes, because "it was all just a dream" is lazy, hack writing and a cheap copout to boot.

Not always. If you write it as dream sequence from the start, and accordingly unrealistic, then that can be okay, or even good.

However, the Giant is a good writer, and the comic hasn't gotten weirder than usual in the last few strips. There is nothing to suggest this is a dream, and I think he has put enough planning into it to not need a cheap copout.