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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Pixie in the Playground
     
    RogueGuy

    Join Date
    Jul 2017
    Gender
    Male

    Default New Player Bard Help

    Hi everyone,

    My girlfriend has decided she wants to try out playing D&D with myself and the group. I'm not the DM, but I am one of the more experienced people at the table, however, I'm not that well versed in bards. My playing career has been mostly melee-centric, but she likes the idea of playing a Gnome Bard.

    My problem is, like I said, I don't know that much about them. I want her to be able to enjoy playing and have fun with it and not worry too much about optimization, which of course she knows nothing of.

    Are bards by themselves relatively self sufficient? Do I need to dig out the obscure splat books to find that one feat that makes them viable?

    I look forward to reading your answers.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Titan in the Playground
     
    Nifft's Avatar

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    NYC
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: New Player Bard Help

    Bards are support characters who make everybody in the party more awesome, especially those who make attacks.

    Here's a good guide to making a Bard in 3.5e: http://www.joshuad.net/new-bard-handbook/

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Bugbear in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jul 2009

    Default Re: New Player Bard Help

    Have her take extra music as her 1st feat, and explain what her three music abilities are good for: fascinate for having the rogue sneak up on somebody, countersong when you're fighting a caster you know like enchantment spells, inspire courage for most fights in general. Give her a chain shirt and a heavy shield, and use javelins for ranged attacks (good AC, decent damage). As for skills, it depends on the party, but I figure bards should focus on social skills and social-related knowledges, and UMD if she can afford it. As for spells, my two picks would be lullaby and detect magic.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    BardGuy

    Join Date
    Jun 2012

    Default Re: New Player Bard Help

    Bards get a bit of everything, but they aren't especially good at any of it. With 6-level spell progression, 3/4 BAB, and a good helping of skill points, they are a bit lackluster in terms of power but offer a versatile character that can introduce a new player to just about every aspect of the system.
    Depending on what level you're starting at, a few spells you want to look into are Glibness, Ruin Delver's Fortune, and Bonefiddle.
    Glibness offers a flat +30 bonus to bluff checks, which allows you to talk your way out of almost any situation.
    Ruin Delver's Fortune, AKA the DM's Worst Nightmare, can be used as a reaction to gain a variety of useful bonuses against spells and traps, including a bonus equal to your charisma modifier to the saving throw of your choice. This has saved my life more times than I can count.
    And Bonefiddle - well, if you aren't worried about optimization, I just think the flavor text of this spell makes it a pretty badass choice for a bard's signature spell.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Bugbear in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    UNKNOWN

    Default Re: New Player Bard Help

    A bard benefits greatly from access to non-core spells. When selecting spells it pays to hit up every source book you can.
    I am rel.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Hiro Quester's Avatar

    Join Date
    Dec 2013

    Default Re: New Player Bard Help

    Joshuad's bard handbook linked above is excellent. it has a thorough and clear discussion of options, skills, feats, spells, gear, and much more.

    For a more optimized build than straight bard, consider the Sublime Chord PrC at 11th level. This gets your bard access to 9th level spells, by sacrificing a bit of music progression for magic. (Only one or two levels is enough; then switch to a bardic PrC that advances the SC's casting for 9th level spells with better class abilities than SC offers at higher levels.)

    You can even toss in a class that loses spellcasting progression (e.g. at 10th level) and still get the full spellcasting awesomeness of Sublime Chord.

    I'm partial to Bard 9/War Weaver 1/Sublime Chord 2/War Weaver +4, Bardic PrC +4 for a buffer build that specializes in getting the party ready for battle in one round. Heartfire Fanner, is good for the last PrC. It has a feat tax, but has some awesome party buffs (e.g. at 3rd level a song that grants temporary use of whichever two fighter feats each ally wants), and progresses basic abilities and SC casting. It also has some fun fluff --seeing fire as an expression of artistic creation.

    Bard 8-9 Virtuoso1-2/Sublime Chord 2/Virtuoso+8 or +9 (depending on whether you want Inspire Greatness or the Virtuoso capstone; the bard I played got a lot of mileage from Inspire Greatness.)

    I'm not a fan of extra music feat, until/unless you take metamagic song and want to use bardic music to fuel spells. Having limited uses per day will hurt at very low levels, but there are so many good feats for bards, that it's a waste to take this. It might make your lower levels more musical, but after a few levels you will not need the feat much, and will feel feat-starved. There are so many other good feats for bards.

    Melodic casting is almost a must-have feat for bards. It enables you to cast spells while maintaining bardic music. So you begin singing inspire courage in the first round, and can cast spells next round while maintaining that bardic performance.

    If you learn the spell Harmonics (races of stone --an excellent book for gnomes as well as for bards BTW) then starting a bardic music is a move action. That means you can sing and cast a spell in the same round.

    Other feats will give you extra things to do with your bardic music performances. snowflake wardance if you want to get into melee. Disguise spell to be able to work your spells into a performance while busking on the streets or performing in a bar.

    Bonefiddle is nice, at lower levels. But it requires concentration (means you can't be maintaining a bardic music). And it damages one target. One of the cool things about bards is the way you can have a huge variety of options available to you.

    In particular, the bard is the party buffer. you specialize at making everyone else better at what they do. there are so many other options to take besides a spell that requires your exclusive concentration.

    There are plenty of spells you will want to cast that achieve this aim. You will find for example, that in most parties with at least three people doing melee or raged damage, casting haste on your party and singing inspire courage will do far more damage to the enemy than almost any direct damage spell you could cast.

    Think about buffing spells that help the party, or battlefield control spells that limit the bad guys' actions (Grease will be a staple, for example; especially if you have a rogue who wants enemies to be flat-footed).

    Gnomes also specialize in illusions and trickery, which are perfect for a bard. There are lots of good illusions on your list. e.g. minor image can solve a lot of problems with just a little imagination. Prestidigitation, ghost sounds and dancing lights, which gnomes get as SLAs will be helpful even at high levels.

    And there are lots of good spells for social situations and talking your way out of problems (Glibness for the win).

    Seriously, JoshuaD's bard guide linked above explains a plethora of good options. (Pay attention to the ACFS; some bardic music abilities are practically useless --countersong-- that you can trade for more useful abilities.)
    Last edited by Hiro Quester; 2017-12-03 at 10:57 PM.
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    Awesome Dragonfire Bard Avatar by Oneris. A detailed version is here.
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