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  1. - Top - End - #61
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Jan 2012

    Default Re: My Latest big project! ( a big deal fighter fix)

    Yeah, i relazed that really besides the Commander archetype, there wasn't a whole lot of out of combat abilities for the fighter, thats something i really need to expand upon, as to me the HUIGE glaring flaw for the fighter is his completel lack of out of combat uses. I know doubling his skill points and adding 10 new skills helps out a lot, but I wanted some actual class abilities to help out.

    Good cacth on the Make a warrior out of you, i guess it would be a bit crazy for fighters running around making armies of 3rd level warriors.

    Im no reallty sure how to break up athetic superiority, and I know its a bit wonky (well REAL wonky) suggestions would be appeciated.

    I meant for pysical prowess to be mostly minor bonuses, Giving them a few extra freed up skill points the can put into other maybe INT or WIS based skills.

    I though ability damaged healed at the rate of 1 per day? Thats prob a house rule ive been playing with though, and never knew it was a house rule ( there seems to be a lot that happeneing ive noticed :) )

    Im not a very good optmizer ( im barely better than WOTC default to be honest) But the last time i play a fighter i got an attack bonus of +42 factoring in everything, which is still good enough to hit everyting even with your +5 final attack. Momentum is supposed to be one of those risk VS reward skills, yes you can theortically get Ni to attack and damage, missing loses those bonuses.

    What level should I put Deadly, I put it at 12th as in my experiences that whne you start running into a lot of crit immune things

    Oh, i was listen to a disney soundtrack and Make a man out of you from Mulan came on and i thought DAMN, that be a perfect ability for a high level fighter. 'oh noes the huns are coming' a little song a little dnace some words and POW now you habe some fighting men with decent abilities! SCORE ONE FOR DISNEY!.. Maybe i should watch soem more disney to get more fighter abilities?

    oops Volley is supposed to be a standard action!

  2. - Top - End - #62
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: My Latest big project! ( a big deal fighter fix)

    to me there are 4 grades of abilities to give a fighter

    Base abilities, these are at a static power level whne you acquire them and while they never grow in power ( or diminish) they are alway relevant, think evasion or aura of courage for a good example.

    Major Abilities, these the fighter gets every so often like every 3rd level and increase in power regularly throughout the fighters career, think sneak attack or favored enemy these tend to start out rather weak but gain in power rapidly.

    Minor Abilities, these the fighter gets throughout his careeer and only increase in power once or twice these tend to be powerful when they are aquired but only gain a tad more power and mostly apply in certain circumsatnces. think of inspire heroics or the rangers combat style

    Utility abilities, these tend to be based on an attribute and semi-scale, so think of turn undead or the duelist Int to AC.

    This is my train of thought on how i create abilities.. Not sure if any of thise is decent, but its what i have always considered.

    I am finished with the Knight and Dervish disciplines and will be working on the Cavalier one trying to think of some out of combat disciplines.

  3. - Top - End - #63
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Jan 2012

    Default Re: My Latest big project! ( a big deal fighter fix)

    Boom added in the cavalier disciplines!

  4. - Top - End - #64
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    Default Re: My Latest big project! ( a big deal fighter fix)

    Quote Originally Posted by ngilop View Post
    to me there are 4 grades of abilities to give a fighter

    Base abilities, these are at a static power level whne you acquire them and while they never grow in power ( or diminish) they are alway relevant, think evasion or aura of courage for a good example.

    Major Abilities, these the fighter gets every so often like every 3rd level and increase in power regularly throughout the fighters career, think sneak attack or favored enemy these tend to start out rather weak but gain in power rapidly.

    Minor Abilities, these the fighter gets throughout his careeer and only increase in power once or twice these tend to be powerful when they are aquired but only gain a tad more power and mostly apply in certain circumsatnces. think of inspire heroics or the rangers combat style

    Utility abilities, these tend to be based on an attribute and semi-scale, so think of turn undead or the duelist Int to AC.

    This is my train of thought on how i create abilities.. Not sure if any of thise is decent, but its what i have always considered.

    I am finished with the Knight and Dervish disciplines and will be working on the Cavalier one trying to think of some out of combat disciplines.
    So, basically, you have "non-scaling but always relevant" abilities (Evasion, ability-to-unusual-place), and "scaling abilities," yes?

    The big issue with your Disciplines is not scaling-verses-non-scaling, it's things that scale at different rates, and (especially) things with different recharge times. Scaling is annoying, but not that bad-- it's a hassle whenever you level up, and it's inelegant as all get-out, but in a game it'll be fine. The differing recharge times, though? Awful. Either ditch the idea altogether, or use a universal recharge time (maybe one minute, making things essentially 1/encounter). 3 minutes verses 8 rounds verses one hour verses blah blah blah... it's a mess.
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  5. - Top - End - #65
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: My Latest big project! ( a big deal fighter fix)

    Well, good news and bad news. I added in most of the Dervish abilities


    the bad news is, i hate the internet. I accitly cut/paste one discipline in the middle of another one and instead of just deleting like it was supposed to do

    the dang webpage went back WOO, so I know I lost 2 or 3 Dervish disciplines, but for the life of me, i cannot remember..

    I wish there was a way for one to go back to you previous screen but NOPE i lost all of that crap and had to do most of them by memory, thats how I know i lost a couple.

    Also I am going to go with Grod's and Djinn's suggestion and create a flat 'cool down timer' for all the abilities that are on cool downs, off the top of my head im thinking 3 or 2 minutes.


    PS.. i wanna punch the internet in the face SOO hard becuase the disciplines im missing are the out of combat ones

  6. - Top - End - #66
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: My Latest big project! ( a big deal fighter fix)

    Ok included the Knight archetype abilities and set every cooldown to 3 minutes


    cept for the obvious 'those would be a bit too much if they were on such a short cooldown'

    I'll be adding in the man at arms ones over the next couple of days, as they are mostly ToB manuevers, only better.

  7. - Top - End - #67
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: My Latest big project! ( a big deal fighter fix)

    Woo me!!

    Ok so i relaized that not all the disciplines were equal in number ( poor fencer was waay behind )

    SO i made the total for each of the main and specific archetypes have 15 disciplines each. Im going to be brainstorming the various man at arms the rest of the day.

    again, any idea on the the class abilities and what they need or anythnig else is helpful ( for instance what level should Deadly come online)

  8. - Top - End - #68
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: My Latest big project! ( a big deal fighter fix)

    Well Ive been reading a LOT of 'how to fix the fighter'

    and 'what is the fighter missing' threads on this forum and WoTC forums amongst others.

    And I can say that I am very please with this Fighter fix.

    SO far it hit most of what people are saying the fighter needs to be relevant, powerful, versatile and customizable. Of course some suggestions were compltely ignored by me (like spells, 2 bonus feats every level, gestalting the fighter With X class* and just being a warblade.. which is the most hated statement i have in regards to anything fighter.)

    I think that I am ready for the finishing touches on this as soon as i can get around to spending 3 or 4 hours typing up the remaining Disciplines and trying to figure out where to put deadly.

    * Before I found this version of the Marshal I used a gestalt Fighter/Marshal as my standard Fighter

  9. - Top - End - #69
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: My Latest big project! ( a big deal fighter fix)

    Ok i am thinking of putting momemtum at 4th level and deadly at 9th and making the penalty to confirm only a -4 penalty ( yes the -8 was a bit harsh now that i look at it) i am keeping a penalty becuase i at least want the crit immune guys like construct to still have that somewhat 'edge' over the guy like that troll over there.

    but then I need something at 10th and 12th.

    I have an idea for 12th but am waiting on permission, I know legally i cna use stuff. but that just seems rude and inconsiderate. plus people need theri props.

    so really what would be a good 10th level ability?

  10. - Top - End - #70
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: My Latest big project! ( a big deal fighter fix)

    Ok, I want to take this time to thank Djinn in tonic. Grod the giant, Zman, classy one, for all the helpful advice, opinions and criticism on my rework.

    thanks to samburke for the spelling assistance :)

    and a special thanks to seerow for allowing me to use an ability "Master of Many Styles". it allows the fighter 2+int mod feats that he can change out daily to be a 'fighting style' I never added it to this fix for by the time I gout around to it, the table code changed and I am honestly unable to do a new table. waay to confusing for me.

    so thanks again I appreciate all the awesomeness everyone has done I hope the best for all of yous.

  11. - Top - End - #71
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: My Latest big project! ( a big deal fighter fix)

    woooo!!!!

    I managed through completely failing to get a workin table from more knowledgable ones


    I shall post my latest update to the fighter later when I am on my desktop. I moved some abilities around I think deadly to lvl 9 and momentum to level 4.. cannot think of the rest off the top of my head.

  12. - Top - End - #72
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Jan 2012

    Default Re: My Latest big project! ( a big deal fighter fix)

    ok did the changes and added in the ability inspired by seerow.

    now to finish the man-at-arms disciplines

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