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    eek [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Gutworm, Lesser
    Conjuration (creation)
    Level: Drd 1, Pestilence 1
    Components: S, F
    Casting Time: 1 standard action
    Range: Touch
    Target: Living creature touched
    Duration: Instantaneous
    Saving Throw: Fortitude negates
    Spell Resistance: Yes

    You cause a horrible parasite to grow within the innards of your target. The target must eat and drink twice as much as normal to survive as the creature gorges. As well, any embibed materials such as goodberries or a healing potion only heal half the hit points, rounded down.

    The parasite partakes of only the most nutricious of the food and drink, gradually weakning its host. The host thus heals 1 less hit point per HD naturally than it normally would.

    Additional castings on the same subject do nothing, the worms fighting within until only one remains. If the target is cured of the worm however the spell may be recast.

    A gutworm can be destroyed with a Remove Disease or Heroes Feast spell, though it is considered to be a 1 HD vermin with a Constitution score of 18 for the purpose of making the Fortitude save to resist the former.

    Focus: A live tapeworm.

    -=-=-=-=-

    Gutworm
    Conjuration (creation)
    Level: Drd 4, Pestilence 4
    Components: S, F
    Casting Time: 1 standard action
    Range: Touch
    Target: Living creature touched
    Duration: Instantaneous
    Saving Throw: Fortitude negates
    Spell Resistance: Yes

    This functions as Lesser Gutworm, except that the Gutworm is considered to have 4 HD and a Constitution of 20.

    As well, the caster can choose for the gutworm one of the following abilities:

    Curious - This gutworm is continuously stretching itself out in an attempt to peer out through its host's maw. This grotesque action causes the target to take a -4 penalty to all Charisma-based skill checks aside from Intimidation.

    Painful - This gutworm is continuously moving about within its victim's bowels in a painful way. The target is considered to be continuously Sickened.

    Plague - Once per day the gutworm can protrude from the host's maw and spray a single individual within 5 feet with a foul liquid full of its own eggs. The victim must make a Fortitude save or be affected as by Gutworm with the Plague ability.

    Ravenous - This gutworm is particularly ravenous and requires the victim to eat and drink four times their normal ammount. If the victim does not meet these demands the gutworm deals 1d6 damage per day as it feasts on its host itself. This damage cannot be healed naturally until the Gutworm is destroyed.

    -=-=-=-=-

    Gutworm, Greater
    Conjuration (creation)
    Level: Drd 8, Pestilence 8
    Components: S, F
    Casting Time: 1 standard action
    Range: Touch
    Target: Living creature touched
    Duration: Instantaneous
    Saving Throw: Fortitude negates
    Spell Resistance: Yes

    The spell functions as Gutworm, Lesser but the creature completely invades the target's internal organs and gains a malevolent intelligence. It has all the abilities, statistics and weaknesses of a Tsochar (Lords of Madness, p. 121), though is already considered to be 'wearing' the target. It loses all its skills besides for Climb, Hide, Move Silently, and Spot.
    Last edited by The Vorpal Tribble; 2007-02-06 at 05:58 PM.

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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Heh, if I had that focus, I could cast that in real life...I'd just need to make a touch attack on the inside of the target's throat.
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    I'm not sure this should be necromancy, it doesn't just magic away the person's life and nutrition, it actually implants (= conjures) a real parasite. (The logical extreme of this line of thought is to make it conjure a properly statted creature. )

    You call the tapeworm a 'focus' when it's really a material component. (May I suggest making it a tapeworm egg instead of a tapeworm? Random trivia: Tapeworm eggs were once sold as primitive 'diet pills'. They worked, of course, after a fashion...)

    The target is one living creature, but not all living creatures need to eat. I suppose they can still use healing potions or whatever, as long as they're capable of eating if they want to. (I think outsiders fall under this description.) Perhaps specify that it doesn't increase the need for food if a creature doesn't need food to begin with? (I know, double nothing is still nothing, but it generally reads better if you state these things outright. A bit of redundancy goes a long way sometimes.)

    Other than that, eww. Nice spell, in a nasty way. Do I foresee other parasite spells coming on? ...what's this, a Parasite domain? *wanders off, absorbed in crystal ball*
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Maybe it's just a focus because it creates a new tapeworm rather than implanting the one you have.
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Quote Originally Posted by Peregrine View Post
    I'm not sure this should be necromancy, it doesn't just magic away the person's life and nutrition, it actually implants (= conjures) a real parasite. (The logical extreme of this line of thought is to make it conjure a properly statted creature. )
    Its necromancy as I was thinking of it more as growing from the very insides of the creature.

    You call the tapeworm a 'focus' when it's really a material component. (May I suggest making it a tapeworm egg instead of a tapeworm? Random trivia: Tapeworm eggs were once sold as primitive 'diet pills'. They worked, of course, after a fashion...)
    Well, except that druids and clerics don't use material components do they?

    The target is one living creature, but not all living creatures need to eat. I suppose they can still use healing potions or whatever, as long as they're capable of eating if they want to. (I think outsiders fall under this description.) Perhaps specify that it doesn't increase the need for food if a creature doesn't need food to begin with? (I know, double nothing is still nothing, but it generally reads better if you state these things outright. A bit of redundancy goes a long way sometimes.)
    I dunno, if all the commonly questioned redundancies were put in most spells there'd not be much space left

    Other than that, eww. Nice spell, in a nasty way. Do I foresee other parasite spells coming on? ...what's this, a Parasite domain? *wanders off, absorbed in crystal ball*
    Eh, possibly

    Isn't there a disease or pestilance domain already though? If not, you betcha it'll be coming soon.

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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    But, it says...
    Quote Originally Posted by The Vorpal Tribble View Post
    Components: S, M/DF
    (The distinction is, a material component is destroyed by the casting, a focus is not; a material component is supposed to provide some 'energy' for the casting, a focus is, well, the 'focus' of the spell in some way.)

    (Of course, it could be the 'Components' line, not the bit that says 'Focus', that's in error. I just think it makes more sense to be a material component. But VT will decide.)
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    <left the keyboard a while, so that was redundant.. >
    Shouldn't it have an instantaneous duration? Unless the parasite is formed of magic, as you can't really dispell tapeworms.
    Last edited by Captain van der Decken; 2007-01-19 at 12:40 PM.
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Even if it is magical, the implanting of a magically-formed creature sounds a lot like conjuration (summoning) to me. I just said the logical extreme of making it conjuration would be to provide complete stats for such a creature, then just make the spell say, 'It summons that.'

    But I can live with it being necromancy. I can live with it being anything except in me. *shudder*

    Edit: Oh, I don't think your post was entirely redundant, just the bit pointing out the Components line. The argument for it being a magical rather than real parasite does have a lot of bearing on the question of school (which is to say, my post makes a whole lot less sense now that you've edited yours!! )
    Last edited by Peregrine; 2007-01-19 at 12:42 PM.
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Well, the Necrotic Cyst spells create something growing in the body, and they're necromancy.

    Of course, the cyst is undead...
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain van der Decken View Post
    Of course, the cyst is undead...
    That... may have something to do with it.

    Besides which, one spell that blurs or oversteps the (read: my) boundaries of spell schools doesn't mean others should start doing so. If Necrotic Cyst had nothing to do with undead, it shouldn't (in my opinion) be necromancy; and if it still were, I would still maintain that other such spells shouldn't be necromancy.
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Well, it's not necromancy, I suppose that's true. It's not summoning something in the body though, so not really conjuration either. What school would be growing something in someone's body? Transmutation seems closest, I think.
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain van der Decken View Post
    It's not summoning something in the body though, so not really conjuration either.
    It's not?

    Even if it's not summoning, conjuration (creation) seems to suit. I just went for (summoning) because it better suits the idea of 'this parasite is made of magic'. Which the spell itself never goes into one way or the other. (Obviously not, because VT wrote it as necromancy, so never considered the finer points of conjuration as applied to this spell. )
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    This seems a touch powerful as a level 1 spell to me. Perhaps level 2 or 3? Mainly for the halving of any healing potion or imbibed magic.

    Does it create a full sized one instantly, or grow it over time?
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Quote Originally Posted by The Vorpal Tribble View Post
    Its necromancy as I was thinking of it more as growing from the very insides of the creature.

    Oh, (creation). Hadn't thought of that. Yeah, that makes sense.
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    There, adjusted a good deal with some of the suggestions. Howsit look now?

    This seems a touch powerful as a level 1 spell to me. Perhaps level 2 or 3? Mainly for the halving of any healing potion or imbibed magic.
    No, definetely not 3, and I doubt even 2.

    #1. Have to eat or drink twice as much. Not even something to worry about in most campaigns.

    #2. Takes half of the healing from some very specific sources. Healing potions and goodberries is about it. Yes they come into play, but... its not much of a much.

    #3. Not healing 1 HP per HD per night... thats a bit rougher, but if you aren't hurt, you don't even have to heal, and it seems like few folks heal naturally anymore. Its all spells. This doesn't even really hurt you. Just keeps you from healing quite so well when you sleep.

    So basically three very weak abilities that together aren't really all that special except in the long term.

    Does it create a full sized one instantly, or grow it over time?
    It grows instantly.
    Last edited by The Vorpal Tribble; 2007-01-19 at 01:29 PM.

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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    I think that looks great now. The healing potion thing is only a really problem at really low levels, I'd think, and even then not a huge one, so not really worth a level 2 spell.


    It's mainly an NPC spell, looking at it.
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    *blink* I am so blind. I missed your first response, VT.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Vorpal Tribble View Post
    Well, except that druids and clerics don't use material components do they?
    True... mostly? *starts looking for counterexamples* But then wh-- well, you've changed it to just DF now anyway, so no worries. (Hmm, I'm sure there's a few expensive material components that divine casters still have to supply for some spells...)

    (Bingo, first off the list: animate dead. It doesn't even use a divine focus at all.)
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain van der Decken View Post
    I think that looks great now. The healing potion thing is only a really problem at really low levels, I'd think, and even then not a huge one, so not really worth a level 2 spell.

    It's mainly an NPC spell, looking at it.
    I don't know its completely useless as a player spell, especially if you, say, want to sicken someone for some reason. Maybe you then get someone to call you in to 'heal' him, to get inside the perimeter or somesuch.

    Thinking of making this a 'lesser' version and making a few nastier ones


    I also just made it a spell for the Pestilence domain in Complete Divine. It has 'Doom' as its 1st level spell, and this one fits the bill much better.

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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Not completely useless, no. Useful if a BBEG or somesuch is drinking lots of healing potions.

    How about a contagious version. That'd be handy for the evil cleric on the go. Starve all the peasants to death, or something. Or one that eats you from the inside if you don't eat enough to sate it. Could be an interesting side-quest, especially if it's difficult to cure.

    Anyway, those are just suggestions.
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    There, added a Greater Gutworm

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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain van der Decken View Post
    How about a contagious version. That'd be handy for the evil cleric on the go. Starve all the peasants to death, or something. Or one that eats you from the inside if you don't eat enough to sate it. Could be an interesting side-quest, especially if it's difficult to cure.

    Anyway, those are just suggestions.
    Hey, I like those. There. We now have Lesser Gutworm, Gutworm, and Greater Gutworm.

    Now, whoes hungry for lunch?
    Last edited by The Vorpal Tribble; 2007-01-19 at 02:23 PM.

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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    These are making me terrified and afraid.

    They need more special abilities! What if you could use metamagic to apply two to one worm? Imagine, a plague of curious tapeworms!
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    I like it.

    I think I'll sick it upon some of my players next Tuesday


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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Squishy, but effective. Maybe it should be Conjuration/Necromancy as far as schools go. You don't need PHB II to use dual-school spells.
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Cool. You used my ideas.

    Curious doesn't seem as powerful as the other options, really.

    Looks great though.
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Quote Originally Posted by Captain van der Decken View Post
    Cool. You used my ideas.

    Curious doesn't seem as powerful as the other options, really.

    Looks great though.
    Powerful, maybe not. But it was the one that made me cringe the most.
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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    A quibble with the Tribble RE: the nibble in my kibble:

    (Sorry, I had to do that)

    DF has a very specific definition: 1) a cleric's holy/unholy symbol, or 2) a druid's holly and mistletoe. The Component line should read:

    Components: S, F

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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Plague needs the [evil] descriptor, at the very least. Creating a highly contageous desease is pretty nasty.

    The rest... well, only sorta should be evil.

    There should be a non-magical way to defeat the gutworm. How about a weekly opposed constitution test? If the player wins, the gutworm takes 1d6 constitution damage that cannot be regained via rest. If the gutworm wins, the gutworm heals 1d6 constitution damage, and gains a +1 to further opposed constitution checks with the host.

    A 4 HD gutworm seems like a bit much. :)

    As an aside, if your character has enough HP, a cast of "power word: kill" could work. ;)

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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Iames Osari View Post

    DF has a very specific definition: 1) a cleric's holy/unholy symbol, or 2) a druid's holly and mistletoe. The Component line should read:
    Adjusted


    Plague needs the [evil] descriptor, at the very least. Creating a highly contageous desease is pretty nasty.
    Mmm, dunno, there are some pretty nasty disease spells without the evil descriptor.

    There should be a non-magical way to defeat the gutworm. How about a weekly opposed constitution test? If the player wins, the gutworm takes 1d6 constitution damage that cannot be regained via rest. If the gutworm wins, the gutworm heals 1d6 constitution damage, and gains a +1 to further opposed constitution checks with the host.
    Possibly... just worried it might be getting too complicated.

    A 4 HD gutworm seems like a bit much. :)
    Its a 'big' worm.
    Last edited by The Vorpal Tribble; 2007-02-06 at 06:01 PM.

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    Default Re: [Spell] Hey, quit your belly achin'!

    Once per week, make a foritude save against (gutworm constitution + gutworm HD).

    If the infected wins, the gutworm loses 2 constitution.

    If the gutworm wins, the gutworm heals 4 constitution.

    There -- not all that much paperwork, and it is possible to throw off the gutworm, eventually.

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