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    Default could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    my question is do you think it is possible for belkar to die is such a Heroic way as the OOTS would feel guilty/obligated enough to resurrect him?

    such as say he dies trying to stop Durkon from killing the rest of the party or something?

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by captpike View Post
    my question is do you think it is possible for belkar to die is such a Heroic way as the OOTS would feel guilty/obligated enough to resurrect him?

    such as say he dies trying to stop Durkon from killing the rest of the party or something?
    Sure, they could feel guilty and obligated, but the prophecy pretty much says that they won't be able to even if they feel that way.

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Remember, the prophecy is "draw his last breath," not merely "die" - so coming back like Roy did would not be in line with the prophecy. Coming back like Durkon did, however, is quite feasible...
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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by captpike View Post
    my question is do you think it is possible for belkar to die is such a Heroic way as the OOTS would feel guilty/obligated enough to resurrect him?
    It is possible, I suppose. I know I would not want them to, but everything is possible.

    However, if that happens it will be hard to explain why the Oracle's prophecies chose this exact time to stop being accurate. Or it would imply that he would die again (or become a vampire, perhaps?) before the end of the year.

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Well Roy seems to be counting on Belkar dying soon and isn't planning on raising him, and I doubt that Belkar could do anything heroic enough at this point to change Roy's resolve to let the clock run out on him.

    However, they did bring Belkar back to life in the SS&DT alternate continuity, so it IS technically possible that they might do it in the main online comics as well (but probably not).
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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    "Last breath--ever."

    If Belkar dies and then comes back, that would no more fulfill the prophecy than if he simply didn't die.
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    This, in a nutshell.
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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    maybe he will get a ring that as a "does not need to breath" property

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by captpike View Post
    maybe he will get a ring that as a "does not need to breath" property
    Still need to never have birthday cake again, not have a use for an IRA, and, hardest of all to evade, not be in the world.
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    "The really unforgivable acts are committed by calm men in beautiful green silk rooms, who deal death wholesale, by the shipload, without lust, or anger, or desire, or any redeeming emotion to excuse them but cold fear of some pretended future. But the crimes they hope to prevent in the future are imaginary. The ones they commit in the present--they are real." --Aral Vorkosigan

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    This, in a nutshell.
    Yes, exactly.

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Not celebrating another birthday could be read as him not coming back as undead. OTOH would he celebrate his birth as undead? Coming back as a ghost would seem most suitable if he were.

    OTTH could there be a simpler explanation: Belkar changes sex permanently? So Belkar would then celebrate her birthday?

    I'm sure that whatever Rich has planned it will be interesting, obvious in retrospect, and hilarious.

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by Quartz View Post
    I'm sure that whatever Rich has planned it will be interesting, obvious in retrospect, and hilarious.
    Or it's just that Rich plans to kill Belkar but not remove him from the strip somehow.

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kish View Post
    Still need to never have birthday cake again, not have a use for an IRA, and, hardest of all to evade, not be in the world.
    Not quite: the Oracle says Belkar 'isn't long for this world.' That phrase is normally a euphemism for death, but I'm wondering about the word 'this'. Going to the Snarl world is an obvious way out, but then he'd still celebrate his birthday etc.

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by Quartz View Post
    Not quite: the Oracle says Belkar 'isn't long for this world.' That phrase is normally a euphemism for death, but I'm wondering about the word 'this'. Going to the Snarl world is an obvious way out, but then he'd still celebrate his birthday etc.
    Maybe they don't have cake on the world in the Snarl.

    That said, he would have to stay there permanently (without cake, somehow not breathing) for the prophecy to be fulfilled.
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    "The really unforgivable acts are committed by calm men in beautiful green silk rooms, who deal death wholesale, by the shipload, without lust, or anger, or desire, or any redeeming emotion to excuse them but cold fear of some pretended future. But the crimes they hope to prevent in the future are imaginary. The ones they commit in the present--they are real." --Aral Vorkosigan

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    This, in a nutshell.
    Yes, exactly.

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kish View Post
    Maybe they don't have cake on the world in the Snarl.

    That said, he would have to stay there permanently (without cake, somehow not breathing) for the prophecy to be fulfilled.
    What if he gets Reincarnated? I don't think ive seen too many authors handle that in any sort of D&D based work, so it would be interesting to see how Rich would do it.
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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    I find it...unlikely...that Rich is going to write the kind of ripoff that, "When I said Belkar Bitterleaf, I meant that he would randomly start going by another name after reincarnation. When I said The Halfling, I meant that he would soon be an elf. When I said He, I meant that he would soon be a she. When I said Your Friend, I meant...aw, when was Belkar ever your friend?" would be.
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    "The really unforgivable acts are committed by calm men in beautiful green silk rooms, who deal death wholesale, by the shipload, without lust, or anger, or desire, or any redeeming emotion to excuse them but cold fear of some pretended future. But the crimes they hope to prevent in the future are imaginary. The ones they commit in the present--they are real." --Aral Vorkosigan

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    This, in a nutshell.
    Yes, exactly.

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kish View Post
    I find it...unlikely...that Rich is going to write the kind of ripoff that, "When I said Belkar Bitterleaf, I meant that he would randomly start going by another name after reincarnation. When I said The Halfling, I meant that he would soon be an elf. When I said He, I meant that he would soon be a she. When I said Your Friend, I meant...aw, when was Belkar ever your friend?" would be.
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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    I think he could die heroically, but even if the order tried to resurrect him, he wouldn't want to come back.
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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    What would his afterlife be like anyway? fire and brimstone? I don't know much about planes in 3.5

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vinyadan View Post
    "So what I told you was true... from a certain point of view."
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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    What WOULD be interesting is if the Oracle can't see into the Rift. What if Belkar ends up there?

    I still think he's going to die, permanently, but speculation is fun.
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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Maybe he'll get reincarnated, but somehow, through unforeseen circumstances involving the Overdeity of Cats and Shojo's ghost's second cousin twice removed, he'll end up reincarnated into an iron lung and stuck there permanently, which will breath for him, so he won't ever draw breath for himself ever again....

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    We've already seen one way a raise/resurrect could fail to work even if there was no specific block from outside three times (one of them implied as having happened years before): you can't raise someone who doesn't want to be raised. If Belkar is enjoying his afterlife, he knows better than anyone (since he was the one who explained why the attempt to resurrect Shojo failed) that he can say, "Um, no--having fun here. Good luck with that Snarl thing."
    Last edited by eilandesq; 2014-01-18 at 07:19 PM. Reason: slight correction

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by Loreweaver15 View Post
    What WOULD be interesting is if the Oracle can't see into the Rift. What if Belkar ends up there?
    That's actually possible, now that you mention it.

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by Loreweaver15 View Post
    What WOULD be interesting is if the Oracle can't see into the Rift. What if Belkar ends up there?
    Then the Oracle can still see him, because the Oracle can just read the book when it's printed and see what happens in the Rift.

    Similar to how he "understood" Haley: he "read the published book", as it were.

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by captpike View Post
    Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?
    "I'm not dead! I'm getting better! I don't want to go on the cart. I feel fine! I think I'm goin' for a walk! I feel happy!"


    Seriously though, I doubt Belkar dies before the climax of the story. There won't be much point to resurrecting him. (I'm still half-expecting a prophecy twist of some kind.)
    Last edited by Talya; 2014-01-18 at 11:13 PM.
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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    I would love for Belkar to die and get Resurrected in some way that technically fulfills the prophecy...

    ...and then a few strips later get dusted and permanently killed. It would be an epic troll of the forums.

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kish View Post
    Maybe they don't have cake on the world in the Snarl.

    That said, he would have to stay there permanently (without cake, somehow not breathing) for the prophecy to be fulfilled.
    Well if he was a vampire in the Snarl world he wouldn't be eating cake, he'd be drinking blood.

    Not that I'm saying this is at all likely but twisting prophecy is always fun.

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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    I know!

    Time travel!

    Belkar will die before the end of the year - and a million years before his own birth! He'll live in a world where cakes and IRAs haven't been invented yet.

    (Of course, he is a gourmet chef, so cakes are right up his alley. But he prefers a decent kitchen, not a cave.)
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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by Keltest View Post
    What if he gets Reincarnated? I don't think ive seen too many authors handle that in any sort of D&D based work, so it would be interesting to see how Rich would do it.
    He would, of course, come back as a kobold
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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by Faramir View Post
    Well if he was a vampire in the Snarl world he wouldn't be eating cake, he'd be drinking blood.
    Blood pudding!

    (does it count as cake?)
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    Default Re: could belkar do be resurrected by OOTS?

    Quote Originally Posted by captpike View Post
    my question is do you think it is possible for belkar to die is such a Heroic way as the OOTS would feel guilty/obligated enough to resurrect him?

    such as say he dies trying to stop Durkon from killing the rest of the party or something?
    No. There is no way, no how that Roy Greenhilt will allow "Death's Little Helper" to cheat his just rewards. The Order might feel guilty enough to buy a nice headstone, maybe bury the Belkster in a ceremony under a thunderstorm, but they won't Raise him from the dead.

    Also, the spells Raise Dead and Resurrection are not the same thing in Dungeons & Dragons. The former is a 5th level spell that brings a recently deceased target back to life, while the latter is a more powerful spell, able to revive those dead for long periods of time, missing parts of their body, and even those turned into Undead (and then destroyed). Resurrection is, obviously, the more expensive of the two.
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