Fairy Tail Thread 3: Demon-ex Machinus

[LaZodiac]

What new chapter? I mean it feels like nothing happened. The fight was a non-fight thus far, and the part with Erza the only part with plot import. It feels like a non-update.

I did enjoy one line.

Spoiler

Show

When Hades says that it annoys him when lowly humans try to use dragon slaying magic (paraphrasing).

He put air quotes around magic which further gives evidence to my theory that Dragonslayers are really just baby dragons.

[Zaydos]

He put air quotes around magic which further gives evidence to my theory that Dragonslayers are really just baby dragons.

That's been my theory too ever since Natsu ran into the age based barrier when Laxus decided he wanted to take over the guild. There is some connection between the dragons and demons, and something special up with dragonslayers and their relation with dragons. And that's what I want to find out right now.

[Olinser]

The more I see of Greer, the more I think that this whole face thing is just one step in a much larger plan.

Greer is obviously powerful enough to have just straight up killed everybody without having to resort to the scenery-chewing villainy that is Face. He wasn't even worried when facing the Spirit King himself!

This leads me to believe that the entire Face thing, freezing the entire Eternal Flame mountain, the highly visible assassinations of the council members (if he's trying to quietly get rid of people he wouldn't have sent idiots that would BLOW UP ENTIRE TOWNS), the GIANT FLYING FORTRESS OF OBVIOUSNESS, and now the stupidly obvious 3 thousand Face heads springing up everywhere, were done precisely BECAUSE they are Highly Visible Villainy.

My conclusion is that he is doing these things precisely BECAUSE they are so over-the-top, that they are intended to force somebody/something out into the open so he can fight/control them.

Fairy Tail obviously isn't his goal, he didn't particularly care about them, he was perfectly content to just seal them off and ignore them.

Which leads me to believe that his real goal is 1 of 3 things:

1) The current Council has some other super-weapon that he couldn't get access to, and he's trying to force them to use it because it won't do what they think it will (seriously we've seen this with pretty much everything they've tried to use - there were serious side effects and consequences).

Etherion just charged the batteries of the Tower. Eclipse was supposed to be a cannon and instead was a time portal.

Possibly the side effects of the weapon he is trying to force will open a portal to Hades and release more demons.

2) He's trying to force Acnologia to come into the open. I think this is most likely. According to the lore, Acnologia was originally a wizard that killed and absorbed so many Dragons that he became a Dragon himself. Since he was a wizard, logically, if magic ceases to work, Acnologia will lose his power. I'm pretty sure he wouldn't be too happy about that and would show up to prevent it.

Greer may have some way of controlling him, or thinks/knows if he can kill him then he can absorb Acnologia's power.

3) He's trying to force Zeref to take direct action. Zeref in general is still somewhat of an enigma, the legends about him claim that he created all of these demons, yet he was just hanging out whiny and emo on an island for the past couple hundred years. Now suddenly he's sitting around reading a book. Greer may be trying to force him to take action.

[lord_khaine]

Welcome to Fairy Tail. When it's not doing something absolutely heinous like forcing someone to strip naked infront of everyone/in the middle of the woods so they have to walk home scared naked and three years old, it's...an average sort of generic shounen manga.

I kinda envy you the innocent worldview where just making someone strip down is an absolutely heinous crime

That's been my theory too ever since Natsu ran into the age based barrier when Laxus decided he wanted to take over the guild. There is some connection between the dragons and demons, and something special up with dragonslayers and their relation with dragons. And that's what I want to find out right now.

It has been a rather popular theory ever since both Natsu and Gajeel failed to get though the barrier, with them being above 80 a more popular explanation than them secretly being made of stone

Of course.. if this is to be true then Wendy is also actually pushing 70+

The more I see of Greer, the more I think that this whole face thing is just all part of his plan.

Greer is obviously powerful enough to have just straight up killed everybody without having to resort to the scenery-chewing villainy that is Face. He wasn't even worried when facing the Spirit King himself!

The problem is that we dont have any direct estimate of the Spirit Kings power, since we have not seen him fight anyone else.. and while Greer is extremely strong then i still dont think he could handle a teamup of for example Makarov, Gildarts, Juan and Laxus. Or whoever else there is of the 10 wizard saints.

This leads me to believe that the entire Face thing, freezing the entire Eternal Flame mountain, the highly visible assassinations of the council members (if he's trying to quietly get rid of people he wouldn't have sent idiots that would BLOW UP ENTIRE TOWNS), the GIANT FLYING FORTRESS OF OBVIOUSNESS, and now the stupidly obvious 3 thousand Face heads springing up everywhere, were done precisely BECAUSE they are Highly Visible Villainy.

This is a really good point though, so many other plots have been indirect.. it would be logical for this to be a ruse as well.

And both 2) and 3) does sound very likely for what he is really wishing to accomplish.

[Anteros]

The problem is that we dont have any direct estimate of the Spirit Kings power, since we have not seen him fight anyone else.. and while Greer is extremely strong then i still dont think he could handle a teamup of for example Makarov, Gildarts, Juan and Laxus. Or whoever else there is of the 10 wizard saints.

Are you really implying that the arc's main antagonist isn't going to be beaten soley by Natsu with the "power of friendship"? I don't think Fairy Tail is capable of diverging from that plot point.

Then again, it's Natsu so he'll do something silly like eat the fairy light or whatever is stored under the guild to get enough temporary plot armor to win.

[Kato]

Of course.. if this is to be true then Wendy is also actually pushing 70+

I'm sure there are some people who will be happy about this not very innocent reasons...

In general regard to that.. I still don't like it. I mean, the "Natsu is Igneel" theory. It's stupid. I guess I could go along with "baby dragons" but then why need they be 70+ years old?

Are you really implying that the arc's main antagonist isn't going to be beaten soley by Natsu with the "power of friendship"? I don't think Fairy Tail is capable of diverging from that plot point.

Then again, it's Natsu so he'll do something silly like eat the fairy light or whatever is stored under the guild to get enough temporary plot armor to win.

Oh come on now, it's not like Natsu gets to defeat all major villains because of plot. Well, some. More than not. But not all!



@Olinser
I never thought much about it but you might be right. On the other hand, maybe the demons are just huge pricks who think they will win for sure and don't care about being blatant. But it would be a cool twist if they are actually after Acnologia/Zeref...

[Zaydos]

Igneel has shown up in an alternate dimension, hasn't he? I think Natsu is a dragon or maybe a half-dragon, but not Igneel with the age thing being because dragons mature more slowly. This would also be why Edolas Windy was an adult.

[lord_khaine]

Are you really implying that the arc's main antagonist isn't going to be beaten soley by Natsu with the "power of friendship"? I don't think Fairy Tail is capable of diverging from that plot point.

If not then i have been making several sacrifices to dark and eldrich beings in vain

Then again, it's Natsu so he'll do something silly like eat the fairy light or whatever is stored under the guild to get enough temporary plot armor to win.

Im going to take food-based powerups over friendship based ones almost any day of the week..

In general regard to that.. I still don't like it. I mean, the "Natsu is Igneel" theory. It's stupid. I guess I could go along with "baby dragons" but then why need they be 70+ years old?

I were refering to the Natsu is litterally the son of Igneel theory, though he might not be pureblooded.

And the 80+ part thing could be explained with him having spend quite a bit of time as a egg before he hatched.

Igneel has shown up in an alternate dimension, hasn't he? I think Natsu is a dragon or maybe a half-dragon, but not Igneel with the age thing being because dragons mature more slowly. This would also be why Edolas Windy was an adult.

Flashbacks has revealed that Natsu is aging at the same pace as the other members of Fairy Tail, hence the idea that he might have hatched from an egg.

[Anteros]

Im going to take food-based powerups over friendship based ones almost any day of the week..

Considering that I'm referencing Fairy Tail's "secret" or whatever it is they have locked away...Natsu may literally eat the power of friendship at one point as his power up.

[Kato]

And the 80+ part thing could be explained with him having spend quite a bit of time as a egg before he hatched.

But are you alive if you are an egg?

Well, going by today's chapter in FT everything is possible!

Spoiler: The reveal

Show

Okay, before we get to the gruesome thing, small points: Fanservice-y (bikinis everywhere Well, I guess there's also quite a bit to look at for the ladies/gay gentlemen) title page made it hard to notice but apparently... there's a FT magazine now. And four(?????) spin off manga. How the hell...? "This is why we can't have nice things!" Oh, boy... Will they be names "Sabre Tooth", "Blue Pegasus", "Crime Sorciere" and "Lamia Scale"?

Natsu and co are still fighting and not very successfully, but I'm sure they'll handle somehow. Minerva recognizes mushroom man because ????. Also, apparently NOW you can rip the mushroom of, which didn't work earlier. Maybe not enough force, I guess.. And Twin DS are still fighting Mard. I can't help but somehow for all his cockiness and apparent skill he just utterly fails to intimidate me.


AND NOW FOR THE MAIN EVENT! Gray vs Silver, who is... his father's murderer in his fathers body. You know, I should have seen it happen... and maybe I would have if it wasn't for the fact
a) why does he not use his real name?
b) if the demons can regrow bodies why not his original body?
c) how does he even know Silver's name? (So he also stole his memories?)
d) why would you use ice magic if you hate being frozen for ten years? Deloria was never shown as using ice. Nor was Silver said to be an ice mage...
e) if you want revenge against Ur why wait forever until his pupil shows up to get killed by you?
f) since when can demons just hop to different bodies? (Albeit I think when they destroyed Deloria's body there was some mention of something being off/his soul being missing, so I guess that was decent foreshadowing?)
g) how often do you need to watch Star Wars in order to feel like merely the fact of having a "I am your father" scene would make for a good story...

My Goodness, Hiro, you used to write good stuff, what has happened... But with all that... I'm happy it's not simply his goddamn father.

[Socratov]

I like this chapter. It may have started out weak with a reveal we were all able to more or less guess, with a component that was a lot harder to guess, but ultimately this chapter was good.

[LaZodiac]

I don't believe for a second Grey's gonna used the Iced Shell. But yeah, this was a good chapter. They sort of foreshadowed it way back when, and with the demon reviving machine now. It's fairly good.

I'm still wondering why Juvia is able to sense when bad stuff is happening to Grey. That's kind of weird. Did she put some of...herself, inside of him?

[lord_khaine]

I actually liked this a lot as well, though im not sure if there isnt a couple of huge(or more huge than usual) plotholes in it.

But are you alive if you are an egg?

I certainly would not call you dead?

I don't believe for a second Grey's gonna used the Iced Shell. But yeah, this was a good chapter. They sort of foreshadowed it way back when, and with the demon reviving machine now. It's fairly good.

Actually.. ever since seeing Ur's ice leg, then i have been waiting for a chance for Grey to use a partial Iced Shell or something like that, and just sacrifice his arm for it so he could get a badass new ice replacement

I'm still wondering why Juvia is able to sense when bad stuff is happening to Grey. That's kind of weird. Did she put some of...herself, inside of him?

Its proberly just intuition.. though... its not like it would be hard for her to slip something into his.. drink.. and it would be in character for her..

[Kato]

I certainly would not call you dead?

But without getting us into dangerous territory, isn't it kind of like being unborn? I feel like your birthday would be the moment you hatch, not the one the egg is laid. Then again, that is up to debate, I'll admit.

Actually.. ever since seeing Ur's ice leg, then i have been waiting for a chance for Grey to use a partial Iced Shell or something like that, and just sacrifice his arm for it so he could get a badass new ice replacement

Heh, only if he pays an arm and half a leg for it But I guess it would be kind of cool, but also cheap.

I'm still wondering why Juvia is able to sense when bad stuff is happening to Grey. That's kind of weird. Did she put some of...herself, inside of him?

Its proberly just intuition.. though... its not like it would be hard for her to slip something into his.. drink.. and it would be in character for her..

I think Juvia would prefer it if Gray put something of himself...... Er, sorry. I think it's just the power of love. Yeah, if anyone would slip something in somebody else's drink it's her but I don't think it would work like this...



So, not to spoil anyone's fun and I'll admit it was better than it could have been but... do you really not mind the problems with this resolution?

[Anteros]

Ok, did I miss something before? Why would Deliora (spelling?) have ice powers? I don't think he was ever shown to have them before...and Gray didn't have them until he was trained by Ur, so it isn't something that runs in the family....it makes no sense for him to suddenly manifest ice powers simply because his rival uses them. Also, if it's Deliora...why has he been going as Silver, even in private conversations with the other demons?

Maybe the dude is just lying to get under Gray's skin. That would make more sense than anything.

[Forum Explorer]

But without getting us into dangerous territory, isn't it kind of like being unborn? I feel like your birthday would be the moment you hatch, not the one the egg is laid. Then again, that is up to debate, I'll admit.

From a biological perspective, no not at all. Your cells start ageing and the DNA starts altering at the very first division. And remember, you do a lot of developing in the womb. And you develop out of the womb. So I could see a spell going by the absolute age of the target, not just the perceived age of the target.

[lord_khaine]

From a biological perspective, no not at all. Your cells start ageing and the DNA starts altering at the very first division. And remember, you do a lot of developing in the womb. And you develop out of the womb. So I could see a spell going by the absolute age of the target, not just the perceived age of the target.

Yeah.. and the birthday is the date you actually have the precise time on, while for the other date.. then i suspect everyone here would agree on that the less they knew about that, the better

Heh, only if he pays an arm and half a leg for it But I guess it would be kind of cool, but also cheap.

Of course its cheap, its made out of water?

So, not to spoil anyone's fun and I'll admit it was better than it could have been but... do you really not mind the problems with this resolution?

What do you think off?

[Kato]

From a biological perspective, no not at all. Your cells start ageing and the DNA starts altering at the very first division. And remember, you do a lot of developing in the womb. And you develop out of the womb. So I could see a spell going by the absolute age of the target, not just the perceived age of the target.

Admitted. I still prefer time travel. We'll see how it goes.

Of course its cheap, its made out of water?

What do you think off?

Mostly the things I mentioned in my first post regarding the chapter... and likely a dozen I missed. But it's okay...

[Olinser]

From a biological perspective, no not at all. Your cells start ageing and the DNA starts altering at the very first division. And remember, you do a lot of developing in the womb. And you develop out of the womb. So I could see a spell going by the absolute age of the target, not just the perceived age of the target.

Or from a much simpler angle, Dragon Slayers have the soul/power of whatever Dragon they were with attached to them. The barrier picked up the age of the Dragon, while Natsu was still a teenager.

[lord_khaine]

Or from a much simpler angle, Dragon Slayers have the soul/power of whatever Dragon they were with attached to them. The barrier picked up the age of the Dragon, while Natsu was still a teenager.

We have seen the dragons converse about Natsu and Wendy, so it would have to be some really complicated situation for their souls to suddenly reside in their slayers..

I would say first generation dragon slayers either being pure or half -blood dragons are a much simpler explanation.

Im not saying its correct of course.. just that its simpler.

[Olinser]

We have seen the dragons converse about Natsu and Wendy, so it would have to be some really complicated situation for their souls to suddenly reside in their slayers..

I would say first generation dragon slayers either being pure or half -blood dragons are a much simpler explanation.

Im not saying its correct of course.. just that its simpler.

Nothing says that the Dragon couldn't attach a part of themselves to the Dragon Slayer. THAT would be the simplest part. They can use Dragon powers because part of the Dragon is riding along with them.

[chainer1216]

Huh, I find it odd that no one else thinks time travel might be involved, I mean that IS a thing in the fairy tail universe.

I think it something like: all first Gen DS are from the dragon war or whatever it was called and igneel and all them sent them forward into time to spare them from the BBEDragon, that's why all the fairy tail DS say their parent dragons disappeared on the same day.

[Fiery Diamond]

Huh, I find it odd that no one else thinks time travel might be involved, I mean that IS a thing in the fairy tail universe.

I think it something like: all first Gen DS are from the dragon war or whatever it was called and igneel and all them sent them forward into time to spare them from the BBEDragon, that's why all the fairy tail DS say their parent dragons disappeared on the same day.

That's my theory, currently. It makes the most sense to me. Then, if the spell takes "birthdate" and "present date" and looks at the difference to calculate age... it would put them at over 80, even though from a subjective standpoint they're exactly as old as they look.

Different topic: I've been watching the anime (current episodes), and it bugs the crap out of me that the subbers apparently don't read the manga. In an effort to make the translation read well, they put in pronouns in places where the original Japanese is intentionally ambiguous, but if they'd read the manga, they would KNOW that it is not just ambiguous, but in fact INTENTIONALLY ambiguous. They translators keep having the princess refer to the person from the future as "she" whenever she says "that person" ... because of the fact that Future!Lucy has been revealed... despite the fact that if they had read the manga, they'd know that this is wrong and that the writer was intentionally misleading the audience and characters by not specifying gender such that Arcadios, for example, assumed Future!Lucy was the one who contacted the princess when it was Future!Rogue.

[lord_khaine]

Nothing says that the Dragon couldn't attach a part of themselves to the Dragon Slayer. THAT would be the simplest part. They can use Dragon powers because part of the Dragon is riding along with them.

Alright, yeah that is certainly also a good explanation, keeping things in line with how the second generation of dragon slayers came to be.

[Socratov]

Alright, yeah that is certainly also a good explanation, keeping things in line with how the second generation of dragon slayers came to be.

It also explains other dragons recognising the dragonslayers as kin of the dragons they were with (like with Atlas Flame and Natsu)

[lord_khaine]

It also explains other dragons recognising the dragonslayers as kin of the dragons they were with (like with Atlas Flame and Natsu)

Well.. that would also easily be explained by them being actual kin of the dragons they were with.

[Kato]

Different topic: I've been watching the anime (current episodes), and it bugs the crap out of me that the subbers apparently don't read the manga.

I would be surprised if they didn't read the manga... either they screwed up or they were too lazy to do it properly. Yeah, it's somewhat irritating but in Japanese it's just much easier to not announce a person's gender.

Spoiler: Ice, ice, baby

Show

So... I'm actually pretty fine with this chapter. And I guess I'll have to renounce one of my earlier compliments. (ONE! ) I'm still not quite sure how you become immune to being hit by rocks of ice if you can't eat them (because they are your own magic) but I guess magic...
The exchange with Juvia seemed a bit confusing to me, though...
So, will Gray use the ultimate technique and die? Take a wild guess, readers... (Well, I'm slightly more on edge than with Starpower at least. SLIGHTLY.)

[Somensjev]

Spoiler: Ice, ice, baby

Show

So... I'm actually pretty fine with this chapter. And I guess I'll have to renounce one of my earlier compliments. (ONE! ) I'm still not quite sure how you become immune to being hit by rocks of ice if you can't eat them (because they are your own magic) but I guess magic...
The exchange with Juvia seemed a bit confusing to me, though...
So, will Gray use the ultimate technique and die? Take a wild guess, readers... (Well, I'm slightly more on edge than with Starpower at least. SLIGHTLY.)

Spoiler: new chapter

Show

why would he use iced shell, he already knows that deliora can get out of it, now it would effectively be giving up his life to delay deliora for pretty much no time

[lord_khaine]

why would he use iced shell, he already knows that deliora can get out of it, now it would effectively be giving up his life to delay deliora for pretty much no time

Well.. i guess if there are no nearby corpses then it would delay him quite a bit.. and its proberly desparation as much as anything else at this point?

Though else, really good chapter this week, its a surprising leap in quality we suddenly have, as if FT is currently being handled by a switching group of authors..

[LaZodiac]

This is a pretty good chapter. Only real problems I have with it are

Spoiler

Show

that I wish Silver was beaten at the end of it. This was a really cool trick Grey did, and I wish it had won, if only because it was the perfect time TO end it. Also, this is kind of a retread of the demon village arc where we first learned Grey's past and stuff, so it's not that impact-full.