Results 1 to 14 of 14
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Seerow's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Gender
    Male

    Default The Fighter Revitalized

    Welcome one and all to Fighter Thread #8734.6. I, Seerow, am your host today, and I'm here to talk about the Fighter. The Fighter was the class that first got me into Homebrewing way back in 2006 on the WotC forums. I actually made a Fighter fix that was fairly popular there before those forums went down. Since then, I managed to recover most of it from the Way Back Machine, but lost out on a lot of what I had. I've never really found the will to go back to it since then (though you can see what I did recover through the link in my Homebrewer's sig).

    In the years since then, I've grown a lot as a homebrewer, and after submitting some stuff to RoC's Thread I got the itch to get back to making an actual full class again. Most of what's here is just refining and packaging what I had posted there, but I feel it makes for a solid unique base class with extreme versatility as its niche. Most Fighter Fixes try to add a bunch of new features to the Fighter, or resources to track, and ultimately that's just not what a lot of people want from their Fighter. My goal here is to provide something generic enough to satisfy the general Fighter audience while good enough to justify its existence as a PC class.


    The Fighter

    Level BAB Fort Ref Will Special
    1 +1 +2 +0 +2 Bonus Feat, Warlord's Knowledge
    2 +2 +3 +0 +3 Bonus Feat
    3 +3 +3 +1 +3 Master of Many Styles (2nd Combat Style)
    4 +4 +4 +1 +4 Bonus Feat
    5 +5 +4 +1 +4 Warrior's Expertise
    6 +6 +5 +2 +5 Bonus Feat
    7 +7 +5 +2 +5 Martial Adaptation (1 feat)
    8 +8 +6 +2 +6 Bonus Feat
    9 +9 +6 +3 +6 Master of Many Styles (3rd Combat Style)
    10 +10 +7 +3 +7 Bonus Feat
    11 +11 +7 +3 +7 Battlefield Mobility
    12 +12 +8 +4 +8 Bonus Feat
    13 +13 +8 +4 +8 Martial Adaptation (2 feats)
    14 +14 +9 +4 +9 Bonus Feat
    15 +15 +9 +5 +9 Master of Many Styles (4th Combat Style)
    16 +16 +10 +5 +10 Bonus Feat
    17 +17 +10 +5 +10 Disciplined Soldier
    18 +18 +11 +6 +11 Bonus Feat
    19 +19 +11 +6 +11 Martial Adaptation (3 feats)
    20 +20 +12 +6 +12 Bonus Feat, Warmaster

    Hit Die: d10
    Class Skills: The Fighter's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Balance(Dex), Bluff(Cha), Climb(Str), Concentration(Con), Craft(Int), Diplomacy(Cha), Gather Information(Cha), Handle Animal(Cha), Heal(Wis), Intimidate(Cha), Jump(Str), Knowledge[History](Int), Knowledge[Geography](Int), Listen(Wis), Profession(Wis), Ride(Dex), Sense Motive(Wis), Spot(Wis), Survival(Wis), Swim(Str), and Tumble(Dex)
    Skill Points per level: 4+Int Modifier
    Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Fighters are proficient with all simple and martial weapons, and with all armor and shields including tower shields.


    Class Features

    Bonus Feats- At 1st level, a fighter gets a bonus combat-oriented feat in addition to the feat that any 1st-level character gets and the bonus feat granted to a human character. The fighter gains an additional bonus feat at 2nd level and every two fighter levels thereafter (4th, 6th, 8th, 10th, 12th, 14th, 16th, 18th, and 20th). These bonus feats must be drawn from the feats noted as fighter bonus feats. A fighter must still meet all prerequisites for a bonus feat, including ability score and base attack bonus minimums.

    Starting at 5th level, and every even numbered level after that, you may retrain one Bonus Feat you gained from this feature to another feat you qualify for.

    Warlord's Knowledge- The Fighter can make a special knowledge check with a bonus equal to his Fighter class level in place of any knowledge check involving battle on a small or large scale. This may be used to identify creatures, gain information about battle formations, draw out a siege plan, and so on. 5 ranks of Knowledge(History) provides a +2 synergy bonus with Warlord's Knowledge.

    Master of Many Styles-Most warriors are required to specialize, mastering a single style of combat. The Fighter suffers no such limitations. The Fighter's first combat style is made up of his Fighter bonus feats. Starting at 3rd level, he gains a second combat style. For every bonus feat gained from his Fighter levels, choose one additional [Fighter] feat. This set of feats becomes the Fighter's second combat style. When gaining new feats, the Fighter may not use feats from one combat style to qualify for a feat in a different combat style. (For example, you cannot take Dodge in your first style, then use that Dodge to qualify for Mobility in your second style. But you can still take Mobility in the first style as normal). If a Fighter uses a combat style feat to qualify for a prestige class or a non-style feat, he only gains the benefit while using the combat style that qualifies him for the Class or Feat.

    The Fighter may switch between his two combat styles as a swift action at will. When he switches combat styles, all feats for that style are changed, he may not pick and choose which feats from the style are swapped out. When you retrain a feat at level up, you also may retrain 1 feat per combat style.

    The Fighter masters additional Combat Styles as his level increases. At level 9 and 15, the Fighter gains one additional combat style.

    Warrior's Expertise-The Fighter's mastery of the the fundamentals of combat allow him to pick up new tricks with less investment. For every 5 Fighter levels possessed, the Fighter may ignore one prerequisite of a [Fighter] feat he wishes to take. The Fighter also adds his Fighter level to his attributes for the purpose of qualifying for all feats (including non-Fighter feats).

    Martial Adaptation-The Fighter gains one floating feat at level 7, which may be changed at any time to a feat he qualifies for as a swift action. This feat need not be a [Fighter] bonus feat. The Fighter may not use this Floating feat to qualify for any other feats or prestige classes. An levels 13 and 19 he gains one additional floating bonus feat, changing each of these feats requires separate actions.

    Battlefield Mobility-At level 11 the Fighter gains a 10ft bonus to his Movement Speed for every 5 Fighter levels possessed (round down). As a swift action you can choose to move up to half your movement speed without provoking attacks of opportunity, or double your movement speed for 1 round.

    Disciplined Soldier-Starting at level 17, the Fighter has perfected the art of acting reliably under extreme pressure. If there is a surprise round, the Fighter may act in it, even if caught unaware. Additionally, the Fighter may choose 3 skills that he has at least 1 rank in. He may always take 10 on these skills even in combat.

    Additionally, at the start of each round you may choose between the ability to take 10 on all attack rolls or gain a +5 dodge bonus to AC. After selecting one or the other, it remains in effect until the Fighter chooses to change it as a free action at the start of another round.

    Warmaster: The Fighter's skill and flexibility in combat is unparalleled. The Fighter gains an extra swift action per round. Additionally, all Martial Adaptation feats may now be changed as a part of the same swift action.
    Last edited by Seerow; 2014-04-04 at 01:39 PM.
    If my text is blue, I'm being sarcastic.But you already knew that, right?


  2. - Top - End - #2
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Seerow's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Fighter Revitalized [D&D 3.5]

    Alternate Class Features

    So this is where the fun is. I intend to adapt most of the stuff from RoC's thread (cited at the top of the post. If you want to see the original writers, go there and read through. If anyone posted there and wants a more specific citation post here or PM me. I am currently working under the assumption anything posted to RoC's thread was intended to be free use.), plus add new stuff of my own here as well. The idea behind this Fighter is to let it be anything for anybody who wants it. The core chasis is extremely flexible, but it is still largely focused on feats (with a couple other relatively minor features). The ACFs let you trade out those feats/styles for more unique features, to any degree you want. Ideally it will eventually be possible to play a Fighter taking advantage of these ACFs to not have any bonus feats at all, and still be totally usable; but to start the features will mostly be useful for fleshing out a character or augmenting a specific fighting style.

    Either way, expect a lot of content here (I'm reserving a couple extra posts just in case). Also willing to take any suggestions for things people want to see as an ACF.

    On Alternate Class Features-Many ACFs exist in printed material, few are available in public domain and so are not reprinted here. If there is an ACF available for the Fighter in D&D 3.5, it is available to this Fighter. If the feature calls for the Fighter to give up a bonus feat, he instead needs only give up a bonus feat from one of his styles (rather than losing the feat and another feat for each style), but only gains access to the feature while using that Combat Style.

    For example, a 6th level Fighter has two Combat Styles with 4 feats each. The Fighter could have one of these styles as Improved Bullrush, Dungeoncrasher(2), Power Attack, and Dungeoncrasher(6); while the other style is Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Rapidshot, and Farshot.

    This rule applies to any ACF listed here that gives up a Bonus Feat as well. For example the above Fighter could give up the Bonus Feat used on Farshot to gain the Spelltouched feature (listed below), used to gain Arrowmind as a passive effect. A single ACF may be taken once per combat style if desired (so if you want Dungeoncrasher in all combat styles, give up the feats in each weapon style for it).

    Any level that allows the retraining of a feat also allows for the Fighter to retrain the feat into one of the ACFs listed here. The ACFs may also be retrained back to feats, if desired.


    Minor ACFs
    These ACFs trade out on a 1 for 1 basis, typically 1 feat or 1 minor class feature for a new feat or class feature to support a more niche role. These will not typically not trade out any major class features like Combat Styles, and will not grant anything more complex than a typical class feature (ie no large lists of choices, no resources).


    Trades out Warlord's Knowledge
    Traveler's Knowledge-Functions as Bardic Knowledge (using Fighter levels in place of Bard levels).

    Veteran of a Thousand Wars-The Fighter gains the ability to make a special knowledge check in combat with a bonus equal to his Fighter Level plus his Intelligence Modifier. The Fighter gains an insight bonus to attack and damage against creatures of that type equal to 1 + 1 for every 5 points you exceed 15.

    Well Rounded-Increase skill points per level by 2, and add 2 skills of your choice to the Fighter's class skill list.

    Watchful Eye-The Fighter gains an Insight bonus to Initiative, Spot, and Listen checks equal to 3 + 1 per 3 fighter levels.



    Trades out Bonus/Style Feats
    Parry-As an opportunity action, you may negate an attack made against you by making a melee attack roll at your highest base attack modifier. If your attack roll is equal to the result of the attack roll you wish to negate, the attempt is successful. You may use this ability multiple times during a round. You take a cumulative -5 penalty on your attack roll for every time you have used Parry since the beginning of your last turn. You must have a melee weapon drawn to use this class feature, and you must be aware of the attack and not flat-footed.

    Riposte-Requires Parry. After a successful use of the Parry ability, you can make an attack of opportunity against the opponent whose attack you have successfully negated.

    Weapon Superiority-The Fighter is a master of fighting with weapons in esoteric ways that foes do not anticipate. The Fighter may choose one feature from the list below to use with any weapon he has Weapon Focus in (or can apply Melee/Ranged Weapon Mastery to). For every 7 Fighter levels possessed (round down) he may choose one additional feature.

    The Fighter may change these properties with a few minutes of practicing and concentration. At level 6, he may change these properties as a Move action once per round. At level 12, he can change these properties as a swift action. At level 18, he may change the properties as an immediate action.

    Spoiler
    Show
    Reach-You may treat a non-reach weapon as a reach weapon.
    Inclusive Reach-You may threaten squares adjacent to you while wielding a reach weapon
    Finessible-You may treat the weapon as if it was usable with Weapon Finesse, even if it is normally not capable of such.
    Concealable-You gain a +5 bonus on sleight of hand when attempting to hide your weapon.
    Brutal-Reroll any 1s on your damage roll. If taken a second time, reroll 2s as well.
    Deadly-Gain a +2 bonus to confirm critical threats.
    Accurate-Gain a +1 bonus to-hit.
    Forceful-Your weapon deals damage as though it were 1 effective size category larger.
    Charger-Use your weapon to deal double damage on a mounted charge, like a lance.
    Chargebreaker-You can set your weapon against a charge.
    Double Weapon-You can treat your weapon as a double weapon, even if it is not one. Effectively you can two weapon fight while wielding only a single weapon. Normal rules for double weapons apply (take normal TWFing penalties, count weapon as 1h and light weapon, even if being wielded in two hands).
    Tripping Weapon-You may use the weapon to trip an opponent
    Grappling Weapon-You may use the weapon in a grapple even if you otherwise would not be able to.
    Bullrushing-You may use the weapon to bullrush an opponent without provoking an attack of opportunity. If you have the Improved Bullrush Feat, this allows you to bullrush creatures 1 size category larger than normal.
    Combat Maneuver Bonus-You gain a +4 bonus to a specific combat maneuver (such as Bullrushing, Tripping, Feinting, etc) made using the weapon.
    Melee Adaptation-You can use a ranged or throwing weapon as a melee weapon.
    Throwing-You may treat a weapon not designed to be thrown as a throwing weapon with a range increment of 20ft.
    Increased Range Increment-You may treat a throwing or projectile weapon as though its range increment were 30ft longer than usual
    Rapid Reload-Reloading your weapon is faster than normal. (Full Round becomes Standard, Standard becomes move, move becomes free). You may use this ability multiple times with the effect stacking.
    Returning-If you miss an attack with a thrown weapon, it returns to your square at the end of the round.
    Ricochet-When successful with a ranged attack, you can make a second attack roll at a -2 to hit an adjacent target. This may be used 1/round.


    Spelltouched-The Fighter has internalized ambient magical energies and can focus it into usable capability. Choose one spell of up to 1/4th (round up) of your Fighter level that has a duration of at least one round per caster level. You gain that spell as a passive effect. This effect is treated as having a Caster Level equal to your Fighter level, and if dispelled it returns automatically after an extended rest. You may choose the spell from any spell list desired, however if multiple spell lists have the same spell available at different levels, you must use the later spell level. This feature may be taken multiple times, each time allowing the Fighter to choose a new spell appropriate to his level.

    Spellwarped-Lose one bonus feat at any level. The fighter's ability to tap into magic improves. He gains access to one melee touch spell, or a spell with the [Teleport] descriptor. He may use this spell at will. If he chose a touch spell, he may choose to channel that spell as a part of a weapon strike. You may choose the spell from any spell list desired, however if multiple spell lists have the same spell available at different levels, you must use the later spell level. This feature may be taken multiple times, each time allowing the Fighter to choose a new spell appropriate to his level.

    Master the Basics-The Fighter has an intuitive grasp on the fundamentals of melee combat. He gains a +1 bonus per 3 fighter levels to all checks relating to combat maneuvers (ie trip, grapple, bull rush, etc), and gains twice that bonus to his Armor Class against any attacks of opportunity he provokes. Additionally, the Fighter's penalty to-hit from Fighting Defensively is reduced by 1 point for every 3 Fighter levels posessed (to a minimum of 0).

    Instinctual Guard: The Fighter may take an Immediate action to grant themselves a Deflection bonus to AC equal to their Strength modifier until the beginning of their next round.

    Alternatively, if they are targeted by an effect that does not require an attack roll, they may, as an immediate action, force the user of that ability to make a touch attack. The touch attack is a melee touch attack if the user of the effect is threatening the Fighter in melee; if the user of the effect is not threatening the Fighter, it is a ranged touch attack instead.

    If the touch attack fails, the effect fails to affect the fighter.

    Fierce Guard (Ex): Requires Instinctual Guard. As long as a Fighter is benefiting from a bonus to their armor class due to Instinctual Guard, they may, as a free action able to be taken on another creature's turn, regain their Dexterity bonus to armor class and cease being flatfooted.

    In addition, if they use Instinctual Guard to force another creature to make a touch attack, that creature instead has to make a normal attack roll.

    Finally, if a creature makes a touch attack against them, the Fighter may, as an immediate action, force them to make a normal attack roll instead.

    Shot to the Ground-A fighter make a ranged attack roll as a standard action against a flying opponent. If the attack is successful the opponent must make a Fort save (DC 10 + Ĺ his base attack bonus + his Dexterity modifier) if successful the target falls to the ground. If the creature has a natural fly speed they are unable to fly for the next 1d4+1 rounds. If the creature was flying through the use of a spell, supernatural ability, or spell-like ability it is negated and must be recast.

    Bodyguard-A fighter can spend an immediate action when an opponent attempts to attack one ally adjacent to the fighter with a melee or ranged attack or casts a single target spell, or spell-like ability against that ally. The attack, spell, or ability instead targetís the fighter.

    Bodyguard, Improved-Requires Bodyguard, Battlefield Mobility. The Fighter can spend an immediate action in response to an opponent's attack to move up to 1/2 his movement speed. If this gets the Fighter adjacent to the target of the attack, the Fighter becomes the target instead.

    Unstoppable Force-When the Fighter makes a full-round attack, he may eschew his additional attacks in favor of a single attack. If this attack hits, resolve damage as normal. The Fighter then gets to make a free Bullrush attack against the opponent, with a +5 bonus to the Bull Rush check for every attack sacrificed.

    Zone of Control-The Fighter gains an additional 5ft of reach with all melee weapons. Additionally, he may use combat reflexes to make multiple attacks of opportunity against an opponent for the same move or charge action.

    Mobile Defense-You react quickly to opponents attempting to move past you. In addition to squares you can reach with the melee weapon you wield, you threaten all squares adjacent to those you can reach. If an opponent provokes an attack of opportunity from you, you may make a 5-foot step before you make the attack, as long as you can reach the opponent when you make the attack. If the opponent provoked the attack of opportunity from a square you cannot reach, you must use this ability to move such that you can reach that opponent in order to take that attack of opportunity.

    The Bigger They Are...-Bigger isn't always better. When attempting a combat maneuver against a larger foe, a fighter gains a +4 bonus to opposed Strength checks, grapple checks, and the like, effectively cancelling out one size category's worth of difference. This feature may be taken multiple times, each time allowing the Fighter to cancel out one additional size category.

    Heroic Grappler-After striking a foe with an unarmed strike, or any weapon which may be used to make a trip attempt, you may attempt to start a grapple as a free action. You do not provoke attacks of opportunity for doing so.

    Legendary Grappler-After successfully grappling a foe, you may make a second Grapple check as a move action. If it succeeds, you may wield the grappled foe as a weapon on subsequent turns. Grappled foes are two-handed weapons with a x2 crit modifier, dealing 2d6 damage, +2d6 for every size category over medium, -1d6 for every size category under medium, to a minimum of 1 damage-- to both the target of the attack and the grappled target. Grappled foes may attempt to escape from grapples normally. Alternately, you may throw a grappled creature, treating it as a throwing weapon with a range increment of five feet.

    Pole Vault-When wielding a two-handed pole weapon or staff a fighter may use it to propel themselves in a jump doubling their jumping distance and allowing them to jump more than their move speed as a single move action.

    Leaping Strike-When jumping a fighter may spend a standard action to make a single attack (melee or ranged) at any point during the jump.


    Trades out Warrior's Expertise
    Armsmaster-Lose Warrior's Expertise. You gain an enhancement bonus equal to 1+1 for every 3 levels above first to all Attack Rolls, Damage Rolls, and Armor Class.

    Force of Will-A fighter's sheer heroic will power allows them to shrug off most effects. Starting at Xth level if a fighter fails a save against a non-instantaneous spell or ability he re-rolls the saving throw one round later against the same DC.

    Feat Amplification-The Fighter adds 1/4th his Fighter level (round up) to the benefit of any [Fighter] feat he possesses that provides a numerical bonus. This benefit includes bonuses to things such as DR and Hit Points.

    Speak with your Muscles-You may use your Strength modifier to determine your bonus on CHA based checks in addition to Charisma, if it would be an improvement.


    Trades out Martial Adaptation Feats
    Legendary Fortitude-The Fighter gains the ability to maintain strenuous labors for an unreasonably long time. Any time a Strength, Con, or Dexterity check, or saving throw to which one of those stats is applied, is called for on a periodic basis (ie "once a round", "once a minute", etc) the time between checks is increased exponentially, if it is beneficial to the Fighter. Effects that require rolls once a round now are rolled once per hour. Effects that require rolls once per minute require rolls once per day. Any effects that require rolls further apart than that are now rolled once per week.

    Strategic Adjustment-The Fighter can spend a full round action analyzing his opponent's fighting style, and develop a strategy to beat it. After taking the full round action, the fighter makes an intelligence check with a bonus equal to his BAB, with a target equal to the enemy's BAB+10. If the Fighter is successful, the Fighter chooses one ability or feat the target possesses, the Fighter and all allies ignore the chosen ability for a number of rounds equal to 3+fighter level. An enemy that has been affected by this ability once may not be affected again for 24 hours. (Note for the purpose of this feature, "Spellcasting" is not a valid ability selection, but a specific spell, such as "Haste" is).

    Second Wind-A number of times per day equal to constitution modifier, the Fighter can spend a swift action to regain 33% of his maximum hit points. The round he does this, he gains benefits as though taking the Total Defense action, but may still act normally.

    Avenge the Fallen-If an ally is dropped to -1 or fewer hit points, then the Fighter may charge the person who killed them if they are in range as an immediate action. The Fighter may take a full attack at the end of this charge, even if they are not capable of it normally.

    God of War-When making a full attack, extra attacks gained from a high base attack bonus are made at a cumulative -3 penalty instead of -5. For example, +17/+12/+7/+2 would become +17/+14/+11/+8.

    Special: if wielding two weapons, extra attacks gained from improved two weapon fighting and greater two weapon fighting are made at a -3 and -6 penalty respectively, instead of -5 and -10.

    Antimagic Guard-Allies within the Fighter's reach gain 12 + Fighter level spell resistance and power resistance at sixth level, which does not stack with any spell/power resistance they already have, so long as the Fighter wields a shield.


    Trades out Disciplined Soldier

    Combat Mastery- As a fighter, you possess deep wells of training and experience that you can call upon in combat. You gain 9 mastery points, plus one additional point for every 2 levels gained beyond 17. These points can be spent in a number of ways as described below. You regain all spent mastery points at the end of your actions each round.

    Conflict: You may spend any number of points before making an attack roll with a weapon to add a competence bonus of equal size to your roll. With a successful attack roll, you may spend any number of points before rolling for damage to gain a competence bonus twice as large to that single damage roll (this bonus is not multiplied with a successful critical hit).

    Defense: You may spend any number of points before making a saving throw to add a competence bonus of equal size to your roll. Further, you may spend points to gain a competence of equal size against any attack made against you before the attack roll is made (you must be aware of the attack and capable of movement to gain this last bonus).

    Practice: Whenever you would make any other d20 roll to which you add a physical ability score modifier (Strength, Dexterity, and/or Constitution), you may spend a number of points before rolling to add a competence bonus of equal size to your roll.

    Tactics: You may spend a single mastery point to draw or sheath a weapon as a free action, make a single provoked attack of opportunity beyond your normal limit for the round, add a +5 foot bonus to your speed or that of your mount for the duration of a single move or charge action, increase the range increment of a ranged or thrown weapon by +5 feet for your next attack, or reduce a miss chance that would apply to your next attack by 10% before making the attack roll (to a minimum of 0%). The final three effects all stack with themselves.

    On the Fly Adjustment-The Fighter can spend a full round action analyzing his opponent's fighting style, and develop a strategy to beat it. After taking the full round action, the fighter makes an intelligence check with a bonus equal to his BAB, with a target equal to the enemy's BAB+10. If the Fighter is successful, the Fighter chooses one ability or feat the target possesses, the Fighter and all allies ignore the chosen ability for a number of rounds equal to 3+fighter level. An enemy that has been affected by this ability once may not be affected again for 24 hours. (Note for the purpose of this feature, "Spellcasting" is not a valid ability selection, but a specific spell, such as "Haste" is).

    Fighter's Resilience-Beginning at Xth level the first time each encounter you need to make a save of a specific type (Fort, Ref, and Will) and would succeed on a 10 or lower you automatically succeed at the save and take no effect (as if you had Mettle and/or Evasion).


    Trades out Warmaster
    [None Yet]




    Major ACFs
    These ACFs change the class in a major way, removing major features and replacing them with larger effects. A character may pick only a single Major ACF, even if they qualify for more than one there is no mixing and matching. These ACFs will range from simple (ie give up Master of Many Styles; gain big passive boost related to a single style, becoming the master of one) to complex (ie giving up Combat Styles for Maneuver Progression, Incarna Progression, or even new resources).

    Fighting Adept-This Fighter has extensive training as a Martial Adept. You may choose to give up one Combat Style to gain maneuvers and stances as indicated on the table below. The Fighting Adept Fighter has an initiator level equal to its Class Level, and may refresh all maneuvers with a Full Round Action. When this feature is taken, choose two disciplines, all maneuvers and stances known must come from these two disciplines. At 4th level, and every even numbered level thereafter you can choose to learn a new maneuver in place of one you already know. In effect you lose the old maneuver in exchange for a new one. You can choose a new maneuver of any level you like, as long as you observe your restriction on the highest level maneuvers you know.

    You may choose to give up a second combat style, and gain additional Maneuvers and Stances as indicated in the chart below. Additionally, you may now refresh maneuvers in the same manner as a Warblade. You also may pick one additional discipline to choose your maneuvers from.

    Last edited by Seerow; 2014-03-06 at 08:31 PM.
    If my text is blue, I'm being sarcastic.But you already knew that, right?


  3. - Top - End - #3
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Seerow's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Fighter Revitalized [D&D 3.5]

    Reserving one extra post to give room to grow (if ACF list gets too big, can split Minor/Major into separate posts)
    If my text is blue, I'm being sarcastic.But you already knew that, right?


  4. - Top - End - #4
    Colossus in the Playground
     
    NeoSeraphi's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    My skills exceed yours!
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Fighter Revitalized [D&D 3.5]

    Disciplined Soldier - We need a type for that AC bonus. It seems like a dodge bonus to me, but granting a +5 untyped bonus to your AC through a class feature, while not overpowered, is not explained in any way, and there's no reason for it to be untyped. If you don't want it to be lost against invisible creatures, make it a deflection bonus.

    Martial Adept looks good. The main problem I have with this class fix is that you still don't have an actual capstone for him. You should definitely reward a player for getting to level 20 in a single class more than just giving him another bonus feat.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Titan in the Playground
    Join Date
    Dec 2008

    Default Re: The Fighter Revitalized [D&D 3.5]

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    The main problem I have with this class fix is that you still don't have an actual capstone for him. You should definitely reward a player for getting to level 20 in a single class more than just giving him another bonus feat.
    How about something like

    Warmaster (Or come up with a better name): Once per round as a free action you may choose to either switch between two Combat Styles, or switch all three of your floating feats.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Seerow's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Fighter Revitalized [D&D 3.5]

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    Disciplined Soldier - We need a type for that AC bonus. It seems like a dodge bonus to me, but granting a +5 untyped bonus to your AC through a class feature, while not overpowered, is not explained in any way, and there's no reason for it to be untyped. If you don't want it to be lost against invisible creatures, make it a deflection bonus.
    Dodge and untyped are basically the same thing (since both can be stacked basically forever). I can label it as dodge if it makes you feel better, but I didn't see it as necessary.

    Martial Adept looks good. The main problem I have with this class fix is that you still don't have an actual capstone for him. You should definitely reward a player for getting to level 20 in a single class more than just giving him another bonus feat.
    Yeah my issue is coming up with something that is generic enough to work but powerful enough to be a high level feature. Even Disciplined Soldier I felt might be too weak to be a 17th level ability.

    Warmaster (Or come up with a better name): Once per round as a free action you may choose to either switch between two Combat Styles, or switch all three of your floating feats.
    However I could live with this. It's a boost to action economy, improving on existing features, and fits well. It also gives something else high level that can be traded out for high power ACFs.



    Anyway, last couple days got eaten by Words of Radiance, I'll probably update more ACFs in tomorrow sometime.
    If my text is blue, I'm being sarcastic.But you already knew that, right?


  7. - Top - End - #7
    Colossus in the Playground
     
    NeoSeraphi's Avatar

    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    My skills exceed yours!
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Fighter Revitalized [D&D 3.5]

    Quote Originally Posted by Seerow View Post
    Dodge and untyped are basically the same thing (since both can be stacked basically forever). I can label it as dodge if it makes you feel better, but I didn't see it as necessary.
    Dodge - lost when you are flat-footed or against an invisible attacker

    Untyped - untyped

    Yeah my issue is coming up with something that is generic enough to work but powerful enough to be a high level feature. Even Disciplined Soldier I felt might be too weak to be a 17th level ability.
    Honestly, it kind of is. How about something like "The fighter is an unprecedented master of martial arts and tactics. Once per day, he can take 20 on any Knowledge check made to identify a creature, even if he does not have ranks in that Knowledge skill, and he can't be surprised and always acts in the surprise round."?

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Just to Browse's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2011

    Default Re: The Fighter Revitalized [D&D 3.5]

    This is a good fighter fix. My only concern is that there's no out-of-combat stuff built in, and that the Fighting Styles are written confusingly--I understand what you mean, but it takes some repetition and I think a new player would get confused.

    I wholeheartedly encourage you to keep Disciplined Soldier--taking 10 on attack rolls is absolutely awesome. However, the name could use some work.

    Spelltouched is kinda low-quality. You can abuse it at level 1 with the trapsmith spell list (passive haste, I'm sure there's a way to abuse gaseous form), though it allows lots of fun setups like sanctuary, arcane sight, and babau slime. At high levels, you have permanent polymorph or freedom of movement that refreshes every short rest, which completely and totally outclasses any kind of possible fighter feat ever. Meanwhile, cool-but-ineffective spells (air walk, tongues, invisibility purge, the whole summon monster line) are crappy and fighters feel bad for choosing them. You really want to write a spell list if you're going to stop randomly screwing fighters all over the place.
    All work I do is CC-BY-SA. Copy it wherever you want as long as you credit me.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Seerow's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Fighter Revitalized [D&D 3.5]

    Updated OP:
    -Changed Disciplined Soldier to dodge bonus to AC
    -Changed the wording in Master of Many styles, hopefully making it more clear.
    -Added Warmaster as suggested by Dienekes as a capstone (Considering adding Battlefield Mobility to the things you can do as a free action 1/round with Warmaster, for extra awesome. Not sure yet).

    To-Do:
    -Come up with better name for Disciplined Soldier
    -Consider improving Disciplined Soldier/Warmaster [Edit: DS was also updated to include the ability to act in the surprise round. WM got the ability to move or take an extra attack added to the list. Considering changing it to a flat bonus swift action]
    -Add more ACFs [Updated the wording for some existing ACFs. Starting to edit new ones in now]

    Honestly, it kind of is. How about something like "The fighter is an unprecedented master of martial arts and tactics. Once per day, he can take 20 on any Knowledge check made to identify a creature, even if he does not have ranks in that Knowledge skill, and he can't be surprised and always acts in the surprise round."?
    Adding "can't be surprised" seems to fit with the general theme of the ability. Take 20 on a knowledge check seems somewhat out of place.

    This is a good fighter fix. My only concern is that there's no out-of-combat stuff built in
    Thanks. While there's not a lot for non-combat built in, sad truth is putting a lot of non-combat stuff to the baseline will cause problems with whatever non-combat thing you think of violating someone's definition of a Fighter. I boosted the skills/skill list, but I think anything much outside of that needs to fall under ACFs (luckily there's a lot of room to trade out stuff for great non-combat capability and still be useful in a fight)

    and that the Fighting Styles are written confusingly--I understand what you mean, but it takes some repetition and I think a new player would get confused.
    Let me know what you think of the updated description.

    Spelltouched is kinda low-quality. You can abuse it at level 1 with the trapsmith spell list (passive haste, I'm sure there's a way to abuse gaseous form), though it allows lots of fun setups like sanctuary, arcane sight, and babau slime. At high levels, you have permanent polymorph or freedom of movement that refreshes every short rest, which completely and totally outclasses any kind of possible fighter feat ever. Meanwhile, cool-but-ineffective spells (air walk, tongues, invisibility purge, the whole summon monster line) are crappy and fighters feel bad for choosing them. You really want to write a spell list if you're going to stop randomly screwing fighters all over the place.
    I could see restricting which spell list to pick from to avoid things like Trapsmith (say "Pick a Wizard, Cleric, Druid, Bard, Ranger, or Paladin spell"), but I wouldn't be comfortable writing out an extensive spell list to pick from.

    The idea is to leave it as open as possible for players to pick things they think would fit. If someone wants Tongues or Invisibility Purge, they can take it. It will take up one of their style feat slots, but that means when it's not useful they have 1-3 other styles to work with. I could see a Fighter with a whole style dedicated to occasionally useful utility buffs. Yeah, players using it excessively could become really strong or screw themselves. I'm not particularly bothered by that.

    [Edit2: Updated ACF list. Converted a lot of the stuff from RoC's thread mostly. A couple new additions or twists on stuff from that thread. Will probably get my next major ACF up next, either one to gain access to half-casting (up to 6th level a la bard) or Soulmelding. Both will likely work similar to the Martial Adept progression, trading out a combat style for minor access, and a second one for greater access.]
    Last edited by Seerow; 2014-03-06 at 08:34 PM.
    If my text is blue, I'm being sarcastic.But you already knew that, right?


  10. - Top - End - #10
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Yakk's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: The Fighter Revitalized [D&D 3.5]

    Commenting as I read:

    Bonus Feats
    Bonus feats remain a poor class feature. Every level where you get nothing but a Bonus Feat is in essence a dead level, especially past the first few levels.

    Warlord's Knowledge
    Vague. How would Knowledge(Warfare) on the skill list and +1 skill point/level not be strictly better than this feature?

    Master of Many Styles
    Ok, this helps make up for the vanilla feat levels to a limited degree. But again, diminishing returns -- the second style is almost as good as the first, the third a bit less useful, and while the 4th is cute it isn't game changing. Similarly, a feat you can use in 2 styles is better than a feat you have to always use. 3 is marginally better, and 4 is even more marginal.

    So this might shore up the bonus feats until level 8 or so being a worthwhile fature.

    Warrior's Expertise
    Poorly worded. Why not just ignore the BaB requirement instead of reducing it? X is unclear (I assume it is your Fighter Level/5). Again, piles on feats -- but feats aren't that good. Having every non-epic fighter feat would not "fix" the fighter.

    Martial Adaptation
    The "you must read every source book" problem, but available as a swift action: worse than the Cleric's instance of the problem! And it isn't that strong, because feats are not that strong. Way too much bookkeeping for a weak benefit.

    Battlefield Mobility
    Given that this ability will only "tick" 3 times, why use an equation?

    Disciplined Soldier
    Cute abilities. Gained at a level when your compatriots are getting Wish.

    Warmaster
    So, once per round you get to move half your speed or make an attack, or mess around with (at this point) worthless bags of feats.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Seerow's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Fighter Revitalized [D&D 3.5]

    Re: Feats are worthless


    Yes, they are not worth as much as spells, but they are being undervalued somewhat.

    The Martial Adaptation feats are specifically not limited to Fighter bonus feats and can thus be used to grab things like a Soulmeld (and at later levels also include essence to invest in it and the ability to bind it!), a low level vestige, a martial maneuver/stance, a handful of luck feats, a set of 3 Combat Focus feats (and thus get the greater benefit), and so on. Seriously the Floating feat from Chameleon is considered a pretty good feature, and this is better in every way than the Chameleon's.

    I can see the argument for "Too much book keeping"/"Need to dive through every source book to keep up". I could add something like a repertoire where the Fighter spends a little time training and adds a feat to that repertoir, and can switch between those, so you're looking at options on your character sheet instead of digging through books in the middle of combat. It just seemed like extra complexity for little gain (since most people probably would write down the feats they regularly want to use rather than digging through books at the start of a combat).

    The combat styles are more restrictive, but there's still a lot you can do with it. You could easily have a style set up for say Offense, Defense, Control, and Ranged, and be pretty good in any of those areas. A Fighter stuck in core only probably won't even have enough feats to take, but it's not really designed with core in mind. And if you don't really want that level of flexibility/all those different combat styles, you have ACFs. Trade out 20 feats (still keeping two combat styles plus the other stuff), and gain maneuvers as a Warblade. You are now a Warblade+.


    Poorly worded. Why not just ignore the BaB requirement instead of reducing it? X is unclear (I assume it is your Fighter Level/5).
    You're right, the X was a copy/paste error. I'll update it. But you may be right and simply ignoring the BAB requisite would be simpler and probably not unbalancing.

    Given that this ability will only "tick" 3 times, why use an equation?
    Fair enough, I'll change that.

    Disciplined Soldier
    Cute abilities. Gained at a level when your compatriots are getting Wish.

    Warmaster
    So, once per round you get to move half your speed or make an attack, or mess around with (at this point) worthless bags of feats.
    Yeah, the Fighter isn't Tier 1 so isn't going to compete with Wish. Psychic Warrior at this level is getting a Bonus Feat and an extra 6th level power known. Might not be a great direct analogue, but much closer.

    And I am thinking I will just make the Warmaster a straight up extra swift action, which opens up possibilities for using stuff from ACFs/feats as well.
    Last edited by Seerow; 2014-03-08 at 11:52 AM.
    If my text is blue, I'm being sarcastic.But you already knew that, right?


  12. - Top - End - #12
    Troll in the Playground
     
    Yakk's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: The Fighter Revitalized [D&D 3.5]

    Sorcerers get Wish and are Tier 2.

    It doesn't have to be Wish it just shouldn't look like something you could grant at level 5 and not break the game. (At level 5, that ability would be pretty strong, mainly the +5 dodge bonus because AC has not been made nearly irrelevant yet due to scaling issues.)

    I hadn't gotten to the second post yet. If your Alternative Class Features are required to make the Fighter viable, then your ACFs are better than the initial choices, and your initial build is not a good one. Ideally your base build should be viable, and ACFs should be even-steven swaps of one ability for another of similar quality.

    ...

    Looking down there, the ACFs swaps for Feats are better that Feats are. As an aside, Spellwarped lacks the "Fighter level /4" text for a level cap on the ability. So I can create a level 1 fighter who can Imprisonment on every attack (I'm sure there are better level 9 touch attacks).

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Firbolg in the Playground
     
    Seerow's Avatar

    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Gender
    Male

    Default Re: The Fighter Revitalized [D&D 3.5]

    Quote Originally Posted by Yakk View Post
    Sorcerers get Wish and are Tier 2.
    Tier 2 is Tier 1 without the ability to change everything daily.

    It doesn't have to be Wish it just shouldn't look like something you could grant at level 5 and not break the game. (At level 5, that ability would be pretty strong, mainly the +5 dodge bonus because AC has not been made nearly irrelevant yet due to scaling issues.)
    The taking 10 ability is more the focus, the bonus to AC is to give a defensive option for a character who wants it. The main idea being the Fighter doesn't care so much about random chance in combat anymore.

    Maybe make it so any opponent within his reach is forced to take the lower of their rolls or 10 instead of the AC bonus. Makes it easier for the Fighter focusing on defense to say "nope" to anyone trying to attack.


    I hadn't gotten to the second post yet. If your Alternative Class Features are required to make the Fighter viable, then your ACFs are better than the initial choices, and your initial build is not a good one. Ideally your base build should be viable, and ACFs should be even-steven swaps of one ability for another of similar quality.
    An important point to keep in mind is that the Fighter is an extremely generic class. The idea here is to keep the core build of the Fighter as open ended as possible. Frankly, to many people the definition of the Fighter is that customizability. The idea here is to keep that extreme customizability, and push that up to 11. Yes, the ACFs are generally stronger than a feat or what they're replacing. They're also more flavor specific, lending themselves to a particular specialization of Fighter.


    If you have suggestions for better high level class features that are generic enough to fit in with any possible concept of the Fighter, I'm interested to hear them. Or if there are things in the ACFs you think would fit better as a main feature, I'm interested in hearing that. Just understand that I am fully aware of the faults of Martial characters, and went with the design I did intentionally due to how the class is perceived.

    Looking down there, the ACFs swaps for Feats are better that Feats are. As an aside, Spellwarped lacks the "Fighter level /4" text for a level cap on the ability. So I can create a level 1 fighter who can Imprisonment on every attack (I'm sure there are better level 9 touch attacks).
    Obviously that was intended to carry the same restrictions as Spelltouched. I'll edit that in for clarity.
    If my text is blue, I'm being sarcastic.But you already knew that, right?


  14. - Top - End - #14
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Just to Browse's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2011

    Lightbulb Re: The Fighter Revitalized [D&D 3.5]

    So I was thinking up some cool combos for this fighter, which make use of the fighting style / fighter feat ACF benefits:

    ODS(S)T: Orbital Drop Stand Still Tank
    Race: Dragonborn [Wings]
    Min Level: 2

    Feat / Class Features:
    1. Spelltouched (Summon Nature's Ally I) ACF
    2. Spellwarped (Protective Interposition) ACF
    3. Stand Still
    4. Combat Reflexes


    Every time you take a short rest, your summon nature's ally grants you a summoned companion. The eagle has the best flight speed, so that's what you should pick.

    At the beginning of combat, or while planning your ambush, you command the eagle (a free action) to fly 150 ft above the enemy. Then you use protective interposition as a swift action to switch places with the eagle. Not having a fly speed, you fall 150 ft and smack into everyone in your square's area. Rules on this are iffy, but if you're treated as a falling object, you can deal 15d6 damage to whoever you hit... no rules on what happens if you land in another creature's square though.

    Regardless of how much you hit for, as a winged dragonborn, you are immune to falling damage. No matter where the fight is, no matter where the enemies stand, you can get there. Tanks all over the world are jealous of your perfect initiation. When you hit the ground, you've only used a swift action, so you can full attack or maneuver around someone. Spend your AoOs stopping enemies from running away as your allies take their time.

    Other good combinations are Battle Jump, Weapon Focus + Weapon Superiority (Reach / Inclusive Reach) ACF, Spelltouched (Enlarge Person) ACF, Zone of Control ACF.

    The Hulk
    Race: Anything medium
    Min Level: 2

    Feats / Class Features:
    1. Spelltouched (Enlarge Person) ACF
    2. Power Attack
    3. Improved Bull Rush
    4. Dungeoncrasher ACF
    5. Knockback


    Realistically only attainable at level 4, but a level 2 human could do it. You hulk out as a swift action, becoming large as you enter your fighting style. Now you're eligible for knockback without going goliath or half-giant, and you can toss thor loki your enemies into walls all day long.

    Synergizes well with any Bull Rush bonuses, especially Unstoppable Force.

    Superboy v2.0
    Min Level: 2

    Feats / Class Features:
    1. Weapon Focus
    2. Weapon Superiority (Brutal) ACF, taken twice


    The old superboy crusader build has got nothing on this. Get a weapon that deals 1d2 damage, then punch someone. You re-roll the 1s and re-roll the 2s, therefore dealing infinite damage with every attack.

    Unlike the original superboy, you have to re-roll 1s and 2s so this goes on forever until Ao reset the universe. But still, infinite damage at level 2 is nothing to blow off. Aura of Chaos eat your heart out.

    Epic Access
    Min Level: 5 (but stat requirements are rough)

    This is just a trick, no build involved. Warrior's Expertise is the best fighter class feature of all. Use it to ignore the prerequisite of [Epic] feats (needing to have >20 levels). Take stuff like Swarm of Arrows or Fast Healing. Most epic fights are kind of crap anyways.

    Can't necro, so I'm just editing this post with new ideas:

    Melee At Range
    Min Level: 1 (2 is more likely)
    1. Any natural attacks (bite of the wolf, claws of the bear, talons, etc from Spelltouched will do)
    2. Spelltouched (Blood Wind) ACF


    Make your natural attacks at range, using melee attacks. Once you have blood wind you can do whatever you want, but staying in the fighter class will get you more natural attacks from Spelltouched and if you stick it out 6 levels you can get at-will wraithstrike with Spellwarped. Full power attack every round? Hell yes.

    Healing Power
    Min Level: 2
    1. Spelltouched (Sanctuary) ACF
    2. Spellwarped (Cure Light Wounds) ACF


    Surprisingly fun, but falls off really quick. If you want it to last longer, Ability Focus is your friend. Otherwise just play this for level 2-6.

    Heavy Weapons
    Min Level: 2, but scales great
    1. Powerful Build
    2. Spelltouched (Greater Mighty Wallop)
    3. Monkey Grip -- you do need this for THF
    4. Spelltouched (Enlarge Person)
    5. Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Warmace)
    6. Strongarm Bracers


    Get lots of size-altering abilities. At level 3 from goliath or half-giant, you can have 4 weapon size increases. Wield a greathammer designed for huge characters as if it were colossal and deal 6d8 on an attack. If you want to burn another feat on Exotic Weapon Proficiency (Warmace) it's 8d6 instead. At higher levels you can get Strongarm Bracers and you just leave the damage table completely (10d6). If you stick to fighter until level 9 you can get Greater Mighty Wallop (12d6). I'm sure there's more

    Misc Uses of Spelltouched
    • Bulwark of Reality (ToM) -- +6 AC, in all ways better than Mage Armor
    • Light of Lunia (SpC) -- You turn into a torch and can shoot lasers. Falls off quickly, but a cool two free RTAs for 1d6 damage is nice.
    • Produce Flame (Core) -- At-will RTA with 120' range. Good for rogues, but requires level 5+ so that's a problem.
    • Jump (Core) -- Leap Attack?
    • Karmic Aura (CMage) -- Hitting you results in Fatigue, decreasing the chance of you getting hit in the future. Cool tanking ability that remains useful for a while. Karmic Backlash also works too, but only accessible at level 9+. Karmic Retribution is too high-level
    • Expeditious Retreat (Core) -- Put on heavy armor and move as fast as the party barbarian.
    • Ebon Eyes (Core) -- I unfortunately can't find a way to make magical darkness before level 5 (Darklight or Darkness spells). But this synergizes well with them and is still good.
    • Bane (Core) -- Not that great, but cool theme
    • Endure Elements (Core) -- Sometimes you get stuck in the desert
    • Lesser Vigor (SpC) -- Fast Healing 1! Never use potions again, and now the cleric doesn't complain about healing you
    • Aspect of the Wolf (SpC) -- Gaining the animal subtype, good for animal-specific buffs (Enrage Animals, Animal Growth)
    • Suspend Disease (BoVD) and Delay Poison (Core) -- the latter requires level 5+, but this is basically disease/poison immunity


    Misc Uses of Spellwarped
    • Knight's Move -- Need to be level 9+, but swift action movement if you end flanking an enemy
    • Parching Touch (SS) -- Basically irresistible bonus damage, and bonus Con damage
    • Spirit Worm (SpC) -- Con damage over time on hit
    • Lesser Shivering Touch -- 1d6 Dex damage on hit, awesome stuff
    • Bestow Wound (HoH) -- Lifesteal on hit
    Last edited by Just to Browse; 2014-09-10 at 12:53 AM.
    All work I do is CC-BY-SA. Copy it wherever you want as long as you credit me.

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •