The Index of the Giant's Comments III - We've Left a Banana In Charge

[pendell]

The "Hel has no living worshippers" link in the table above points to the kickstarter quote.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[Jasdoif]

The "Hel has no living worshippers" link in the table above points to the kickstarter quote.

So it is was. Weird, thought I had double-checked that....Oh well, it's fixed now!

...geez, I somehow managed to post an update notice on the very bottom of a page? OK, quoting myself so no one needs to go back a page to see it:

UPDATE COMING, CALLING FOR PMs TO REQUIRE VOTES

Anyone thinking some/all entries marked "Accepting PMs to require vote" should not be included in the Index should send me a private message, saying which entries should require a vote. (The default is to include, an item not voted on will be included in the Index.) If I get PMs from two or more people about a particular entry, it will be voted on to decide inclusion; the vote will be the next stage, and I'll announce it when the vote is ready.

Five of the quotes below reached strong consensus already. A vote is considered unnecessary in these cases, so they will be included.

Proposed Items for Index 3.5
The Giant on Stats in Earlier Strips Elan singing about skill points, Haley having Rapid Shot and Manyshot, Roy and Vaarsuvius' mental ability scores, verbal components in OOTS, and insight about Vaarsuvius' spellcasting.	#180	05/14/2005	No vote required, will be included.
Evolution of D&D Adherence The Giant hasn't made explicit statements about feats/items since 2008, OOTS' internal consistency is still maintained, and the Giant has no regrets about using D&D in OOTS.	#886	05/09/2013	No vote required, will be included.
Xykon vs Dorukan There would be no dramatic function to drawing out the fight. "If it helps, think of that page as a montage scene rather than a direct moment-to-moment narrative."	#960	08/18/2014	No vote required, will be included.
Malack is Ash Vampires take their gear with them when they assume gaseous form, but not when they're destroyed.	#906	07/28/2013	Accepting PMs to require vote. No vote required, will be included.
The Kickstarter Cameo It hasn't happened yet. "When it happens, I will almost certainly mention it in the News."	#869	02/14/2013	No vote required, will be included.
Hel Has No Living Worshippers "That means literally not one single living person, ever." We'll find out why someday.	#962	09/11/2014	No vote required, will be included.

PMs will be accepted until September 14th, 4PM EDT. I'll try to update the table if/when entries get sufficient PMs.

To send me a PM, click my username (The vaguely-pronounceable(?)-looking word above the spellcasting-and-invocation-using banana with purple hair) and select "Private Message". Or I guess you could click here. Anyway, include the titles of the entries you're nominating in the message. Mentioning something about "Index Nomination" in the subject line would be helpful.

A few final reminders:

• Don't post suggestions to require votes. They're sent by PM to avoid filling up the thread with them, posts will not be counted.
• Only PM for entries you think should be excluded. They'll be included if they don't receive sufficient nominations.
• We're not voting on the entries yet. The voting will be the next stage, assuming a vote is required; I'll call for the vote at an appropriate time.
• We've left a banana in charge. Hi.

Further discussion of entries is encouraged at this point. In particular, recommendations for different titles and descriptions for the quote entries are things I'd be happy to consider.

[Jasdoif]

The one quote that might have been voted on, didn't meet the PM threshold required to trigger a vote, so it will be included. Guess support for it solidified after all!

With nothing to vote on, there will be no vote; all six entries are now in the Index.

I love it when a plan comes together.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

Well, that way easy. More evidence that new system works! I find it interesting that only two of the six entries are recent ones; all the others are old ones that were dug up.

[Gwynfrid]

The one quote that might have been voted on, didn't meet the PM threshold required to trigger a vote, so it will be included. Guess support for it solidified after all!

With nothing to vote on, there will be no vote; all six entries are now in the Index.

I love it when a plan comes together.

I wasn't a strong supporter of that quote, but I saw no compelling reason to oppose it, either. And yes indeed, our process works very smoothly now. Compared to the endless debates in the old thread, this is a marked improvement.

[Zherog]

What you call endless debates I call fascinating discussions. I think we should have a vote to decide what exactly to call those previous discussions!

[Tragak]

What you call endless debates I call fascinating discussions. I think we should have a vote to decide what exactly to call those previous discussions!

No we shouldn't.

[littlebum2002]

No we shouldn't.

I vote that we do vote to decide what they are called

[Jaxzan Proditor]

What you call endless debates I call fascinating discussions. I think we should have a vote to decide what exactly to call those previous discussions!

How about we compromise on fascinatingly endless discussions?

[Jasdoif]

What you call endless debates I call fascinating discussions. I think we should have a vote to decide what exactly to call those previous discussions!

How about we compromise on fascinatingly endless discussions?

How about we go with endless fascination and call it a day eternity?

[Gwynfrid]

What you call endless debates I call fascinating discussions. I think we should have a vote to decide what exactly to call those previous discussions!

I would likely want to debate with you on that point, but first I will need to debate with myself on whether it is appropriate to do so under the rules of this thread, and agree on the rules for setting up a vote on which debates to engage in. I'll be back to you when that's all done.

[Jasdoif]

I would likely want to debate with you on that point, but first I will need to debate with myself on whether it is appropriate to do so under the rules of this thread, and agree on the rules for setting up a vote on which debates to engage in. I'll be back to you when that's all done.

I find your debating debate debating...debatable.

[Vemynal]

I find your debating debate debating...debatable.

I find your stance on debate controversial and would like to continue the dispute on whether to approach an argument about possible deliberation!

[137beth]

I find your stance on debate controversial and would like to continue the dispute on whether to approach an argument about possible deliberation!

That is so objectionable, it's bananas!

[Jasdoif]

What you call endless debates I call fascinating discussions. I think we should have a vote to decide what exactly to call those previous discussions!

I would likely want to debate with you on that point, but first I will need to debate with myself on whether it is appropriate to do so under the rules of this thread, and agree on the rules for setting up a vote on which debates to engage in. I'll be back to you when that's all done.

I find your debating debate debating...debatable.

I find your stance on debate controversial and would like to continue the dispute on whether to approach an argument about possible deliberation!

That is so objectionable, it's bananas!

Such a fruitful exchange. Orange you glad I didn't say banana (this time)?


In (semi-)seriousness, we've had more than one kind of "endless debate" in Index thread history. The debates about whether or not a particular quote should be included in the Index or not, I do miss. It's nice to see people having and expressing their opinions on whether/how a quote meets our guidelines; and as our founder mentioned on occasion, people have changed their minds during such discussions, so refinement of thought processes happens. And, well, our debates here about including quotes tend to be more harmonious than debates about the contents of the quote themselves

The debates about debating, as well as debates about debating debating, are more of a mixed bag. They can range from iterative hilarity (the above, for example) to recursive acrimony. Not to say there's no value to them, the well-received voting process we use now did result from one of the less funny ones. I just don't think I can accurately say whether or not I miss them as a category

[Porthos]

A "See Also", I think, on the fate of children who die in OotSWorld, along with a comment about fairness.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

A "See Also", I think, on the fate of children who die in OotSWorld, along with a comment about fairness.

I agree with it being included as a "see also".

[Joerg]

The statement that there is no "overgod" in OotSverse could be new, though.

[ti'esar]

I'm also in favor of including that as a "see also".

[Jasdoif]

Looks like we have our first quote for the next update cycle!

The statement that there is no "overgod" in OotSverse could be new, though.

Since the Giant wanted to be clear on the point, it's worth mentioning, at least.

---

OK, how's this look?

On Children, Souls and Afterlives And D&D cosmology makes no sense. More here (also, there is no "overgod" in the OotS cosmology).

#946

03/19/2014

[ORione]

The High Priest of Hel and Durkon's memories are going to be around for a while.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

The High Priest of Hel and Durkon's memories are going to be around for a while.

I think the information in the quotes is good to know, but I am also against including information that will eventually be obsoleted. Hmmmm.

[Peelee]

I think the information in the quotes is good to know, but I am also against including information that will eventually be obsoleted. Hmmmm.

Samesies. With a QAD look through the existing character/plot quotes, it looks like the vast majority are explaining things that already happened, or clarifying character aspects. This knowledge, while nice, is basically going to be played out as the comic progresses. I don't think it merits inclusion.

[Gwynfrid]

Samesies. With a QAD look through the existing character/plot quotes, it looks like the vast majority are explaining things that already happened, or clarifying character aspects. This knowledge, while nice, is basically going to be played out as the comic progresses. I don't think it merits inclusion.

Same here. It's very little information to begin with, and it's going to become obsolete. Not worth the space.

[Jasdoif]

The High Priest of Hel and Durkon's memories are going to be around for a while.

Aside from what everyone else has said, the tone of the tweets (particularly the second one) reminds me of a post that the Giant asked us not to include.

[Jasdoif]

It's unlikely anyone's missed that Blood Runs in the Family and the 2015 Calendar are now available for preorder, what with the news post and Twitter comments and forum thread.

But what might not be as apparent is that there's a product page on this website, mentioning that the book includes the very early unpublished/unused OOTS strip where Durkon was turned into a vampire.

A strip that effectively has its own entry in the Index:

Durkon Becomes a Vampire Originally, Durkon was going to become a vampire in the dungeon of Dorukan. This plot element has been developing for some time and even predates Xykon himself.

#906

07/28/2013

Anyone have any thoughts on whether the mention warrants being included in the existing entry?

This is totally not not totally an attempt to keep this thread from falling into obscurity.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

It's unlikely anyone's missed that Blood Runs in the Family and the 2015 Calendar are now available for preorder, what with the news post and Twitter comments and forum thread.

But what might not be as apparent is that there's a product page on this website, mentioning that the book includes the very early unpublished/unused OOTS strip where Durkon was turned into a vampire.

A strip that effectively has its own entry in the Index:

Durkon Becomes a Vampire Originally, Durkon was going to become a vampire in the dungeon of Dorukan. This plot element has been developing for some time and even predates Xykon himself.

#906

07/28/2013

Anyone have any thoughts on whether the mention warrants being included in the existing entry?

This is totally not not totally an attempt to keep this thread from falling into obscurity.

I think that since it is print-only content, anyone who doesn't own BRitF will not be privy to the exact details of the strip or any commentary (which, if it exists, would probably be similar to that post) accompanying it, and we should keep it for reference for those people.

[NerdyKris]

Since we can't link to it anyways, I think it should just be added onto the end of the description:

Durkon Becomes a Vampire Originally, Durkon was going to become a vampire in the dungeon of Dorukan. This plot element has been developing for some time and even predates Xykon himself. This strip was included as a bonus in book 5 (Blood Runs in the Family)

#906

07/28/2013

[DaggerPen]

Since we can't link to it anyways, I think it should just be added onto the end of the description:

I'm going to second this one. It's very useful to link to for people who don't have the book.

[137beth]

Yea, I think it should stay in the index.

...
...
Awhile back I remember a quote by The Giant saying that he had spent all (or almost all?) the money from the kickstarter--i.e., if he makes a profit off of it, it wouldn't be until after a lot of the reprinted books were sold. I went looking for the quote and couldn't find it. Anyone else know what I'm talking about and/or if I am delusional?