LGBTAIitp # 49: Please check all baggage before boarding the Rainbow Rail Road

[Lex-Kat]

I don't even know what was said that started this entire mess rolling down a hill.

I neve said I didn't want the help. but I also made it clear at the same time that the idea of just getting over something was not helping me.

It escalated.

Just let it go.

Let it go and be free.

Hello. *offer of Hugs* I don't know what started this whole conversation, but I read the post where you mentioned your "scars that will never heal". And all I can say is that from other posts I've seen, you look to be a good person. Someone of wisdom, of knowledge. I like you. And it looks as if you have others who wish to be here for you.

[SiuiS]

Kesnit: was marathoning old episodes of House M.D., so my level of direct antagonism might be higher than normal. If so, sorry about that. >_<

I am never above asking for help. And I do not often outright reject help.

But I will not sit by while people tell to me to "just get over" my problems, or that they can "fix me."

Things are, as many in here know, not always that simple. I didn't complain about ruining a pair of shoes or breaking a nail. I didn't rip out the crotch on my last pair of pants, or lose a map of counterstrike because my squadmates dropped the ball when we rushed long A.

I complained about hating everything there is to me. My mind, my soul, my body.

There is blood on my hands that will never come off.

There is guilt over being the reason three good men will never see America, their wives, or their children again.

There are the nightmares of beatings I will never forget.

There are scars upon my soul that will never heal, never dull.

Never fade.

I truly am less than nothing. Something contemptible.

Something unforgivable. An abomination that should not be suffered to live.

And yet I am.

I have no choice but to continue, for as dark as my mind and soul are, there are four other living beings who depend upon me for their own existences.

I can never atone for my past. I can never be whole. Never truly be happy.

But I can try.

I forget sometimes that not everyone grows up specifically trying to deal with this stuff beforehand.

I feel for you, dove. I don't think I can say anything that would be helpful, but I am here for you.

Probably an unholy mixture of feeling abandoned, unimportant and unloved and of finals coming up, coupled with a new hormone dose.

I also forget sometimes that hormones are aupposed to make these feelings worse. Och.

This covers the subject rather well, I thought.

Oh, no. I just entirely missed that link, then. Sorry Anders. Thank you, Coidzor.

I think this may have been the best stuff doctors have ever given me man.

XD

Cool! Glad you're happy for now~

Spoiler: About the limits of "common sense"

Show

Another lurker here. The only reason I read this thread is to learn to understand, at least to some degree, the feelings and issues of fellow human beings I otherwise have very little in common with. The only reason I post anything in it is, well, maybe it will provide useful food for thought to somebody, although I'm not at all sure it will. If it doesn't, as shown by others' reactions (and, very likely, even if it does) then I'll go back to my corner.


Same here. That's why I felt like trying to explain the reactions you're seeing on this thread.


I think you were mistaken in that regard - an honest mistake but a mistake nonetheless. #1 rule of helping: First, do no harm. To your credit, you considered that possibility. But you discounted it too easily. Lentrax's reaction is proof of that.


Here, you discounted the possibility that your analogy might:
1) Be completely inaccurate and/or irrelevant in regard to the person's problems; I'm not saying it is, but you know virtually nothing about said problems, do you?
2) Be rejected as offensive, whether valid or not.

Sometimes, no help is better than misguided help. (And yes, I'm aware of the irony: Indeed, this post could fall under that category. If so, then, I got it wrong and I apologize.)

Sure.
*Hugs*

Hi there! Lurkers are nice, it's always good having more of those!

There's nothing common about common sense, an indeterminate and barely-remembered family member used to say enough that I parrot her even now. Something like this came up recently in a technology thread: the optimal answer for one scenario is not always optimal for other possible scenarios. Common sense is a system of ignoring useless information and arriving at a good conclusion. But when people say common sense, they often mean to fall back on a heuristic maxim and hope it works. That only works some of the time.

[lord pringle]

Kesnit: was marathoning old episodes of House M.D.

Hey, I'm doing the same thing right now!

[golentan]

My sexuality is, as always, a moving target.

[Asta Kask]

My sexuality is, as always, a moving target.

What's the penalty to hit it?

My sexuality is rather small, so it has a high AC.

[Lentrax]

What's the penalty to hit it?

My sexuality is rather small, so it has a high AC.

But Golly's has concealment which gives it a miss chance.

[Heliomance]

Does anyone know what effect hormones have on metabolism? I'm currently one of those irritating people that can eat pretty much whatever I want without putting on weight, but mum reckons that'll probably change when I start hormones, and I'll need to change my eating patterns.

[Asta Kask]

We hates you! We hates you forever!

There are cis women who can eat whatever they want without gaining weight, so... maybe?

[golentan]

What's the penalty to hit it?

My sexuality is rather small, so it has a high AC.

-4 with, as lentrax says, a 50% miss chance.

Helio, yeah. Estrogen can encourage the putting on of body fat, in part because as I understand it the basal metabolic needs of females except during pregnancy or a few key other stages are generally lower than males.

Not a guarantee that you'd put on weight, mind, but it would probably be something to watch.

[Zorg]

Does anyone know what effect hormones have on metabolism? I'm currently one of those irritating people that can eat pretty much whatever I want without putting on weight, but mum reckons that'll probably change when I start hormones, and I'll need to change my eating patterns.

It can lead to weight gain, I've put on 5-6 kilos myself and I've been eating less than normal of late w/ depression so maybe. But weight gain cam mean curves so not necessarily a bad thing. Mind you I've also gotten almost two inches shorter since starting so can be quite a bit of physical change.

[Mystic Muse]

So, I'm hoping to start on hormones this fall, since it sounds like the process is going to be relatively easy here in Indiana, and both my brothers should have moved out by then. As a result, I need some pointers.

1. What to do to work on my voice. I guess I have a sort of general idea, but if anybody could help in detail in some way, that'd be great.
2. What to wear. I'd love to wear dresses and skirts especially. I'll probably pick up some stockings as well.
3. Will panties work, or will I have to get surgery before I can wear those and have them feel proper?
4. Will there be a point where the hormones prevent me from having an erection entirely? I'd like to prevent awkward situations in public...
5. What sort of budget will I need for new clothes, and what sort of tips can people give me to look more feminine in them? I mean, I'm assuming I'll have to ditch some of my baggy T-shirts (Especially ones that don't look particularly feminine), but I'm a bit unsure what I'll need to pick up to replace them.
6. How soon do the effects of hormones start coming in?

[Togath]

I've been curious about those subjects as well(I've learned a bit about the voice, and what sorts of outfits would be good, but I know less about questions 3-5)...

[Astrella]

So, I'm hoping to start on hormones this fall, since it sounds like the process is going to be relatively easy here in Indiana, and both my brothers should have moved out by then. As a result, I need some pointers.

3. Will panties work, or will I have to get surgery before I can wear those and have them feel proper?
4. Will there be a point where the hormones prevent me from having an erection entirely? I'd like to prevent awkward situations in public...
5. What sort of budget will I need for new clothes, and what sort of tips can people give me to look more feminine in them? I mean, I'm assuming I'll have to ditch some of my baggy T-shirts (Especially ones that don't look particularly feminine), but I'm a bit unsure what I'll need to pick up to replace them.
6. How soon do the effects of hormones start coming in?

3. I can wear them now without any discomfort or such, there's a bulge though so if you want to avoid that you'll have to tuck. But in general I can wear women's jeans without discomfort or without anything really being visible too cause bits shrink on HRT. (Well, technically only your testicles mostly, though the penis will lose a bit of size due to not having erections all the time.)

5. Just, women's fitted clothes help. Like, women's tops have a different shape then those for men, so it'll help you come over more female.

6. It's really dependent on the person for that one. Some minor things pop up after a few weeks, but it's a few months before anything decent starts happening. If you have specific questions about specific effects it'd be easier to answer that considering most of them happen on a timescale of several years.

[Mystic Muse]

6. It's really dependent on the person for that one. Some minor things pop up after a few weeks, but it's a few months before anything decent starts happening. If you have specific questions about specific effects it'd be easier to answer that considering most of them happen on a timescale of several years.

Basically, I'm wondering when I'll start growing boobs, since if it'll be a few months, then I could try and get started on hormones ASAP, but if it'll be a few weeks, I'll want to wait until my two brothers have moved out.

[Astrella]

Basically, I'm wondering when I'll start growing boobs, since if it'll be a few months, then I could try and get started on hormones ASAP, but if it'll be a few weeks, I'll want to wait until my two brothers have moved out.

Hmm, I got sensitivity in my chest about a few weeks in, you'll feel like buds behind your nipples, but it'll take a few months at least until anything really gets visible, and even then baggy shirts and such can easily hide them.

[Asta Kask]

If anyone notices - call them man-boobs. It happens, I know.

[Zorg]

#6 is unfortunately impossible to say with any certainty, most of what I've been told and seen say "within about two to three years you'll see all the changes" so yeah, it is highly variable I'm afraid.


2 & 5 - what sort of dresses? I love dresses and have spent from $10 to $800 on them. Usually I'll bay around $100 give or take. Some things like Bernie Dexter I pay a bit more for if if I can't resist, but something like this one I was prepared to pay more for because look at it it's gorgeous! But I also buy a lot of Dangerfield and on sale they're only $40-50 sometimes. I buy probably 90% of my clothes online.
Depending on the dress you may need to wear a slip or a camisole, it's an underskirt type thing that prevents the skirt from riding up as you walk essentially. Lined dresses can usually go without, but most dresses aren't and you'll need one particularly if you're wearing stockings. They are also useful if the dress is a light material. Wear one underneath so it's not so see-through.

[Asta Kask]

Some things like Bernie Dexter I pay a bit more for if if I can't resist, but something like this one I was prepared to pay more for because look at it it's gorgeous!

It is beautiful but $300 for a piece of clothing? Yikes!

ETA: I just watched a review of "The Island of Dr. Moreau" (1996), where among other things you can watch Marlon Brando wear an ice bucket on his head. But I came upon this quote:

To eat flesh, or fish. To make love to more than one, every which way. These are all bad things. These are not the things that men do.

And yeah, I'm fairly certain men do these things. And women too.

[KenderWizard]

Does anyone know what effect hormones have on metabolism? I'm currently one of those irritating people that can eat pretty much whatever I want without putting on weight, but mum reckons that'll probably change when I start hormones, and I'll need to change my eating patterns.

It's good that you're bearing this in mind. Also, remember, sometime in your early to mid twenties your metabolism is likely to slow anyway. Lots of people say "When I was in college I was eating 16" pizzas for every meal and sleeping like a cat and I was super thin, but now if I ever deviate from a carefully curated diet of watermelon and lettuce, I put on a stone, even though I run a marathon every weekend!" (Disclaimer: no one has ever said that. But they say things _like_ that.)

So, I'm hoping to start on hormones this fall, since it sounds like the process is going to be relatively easy here in Indiana, and both my brothers should have moved out by then. As a result, I need some pointers.

1. What to do to work on my voice. I guess I have a sort of general idea, but if anybody could help in detail in some way, that'd be great.
2. What to wear. I'd love to wear dresses and skirts especially. I'll probably pick up some stockings as well.
3. Will panties work, or will I have to get surgery before I can wear those and have them feel proper?
4. Will there be a point where the hormones prevent me from having an erection entirely? I'd like to prevent awkward situations in public...
5. What sort of budget will I need for new clothes, and what sort of tips can people give me to look more feminine in them? I mean, I'm assuming I'll have to ditch some of my baggy T-shirts (Especially ones that don't look particularly feminine), but I'm a bit unsure what I'll need to pick up to replace them.
6. How soon do the effects of hormones start coming in?

Well, from my totally non-expert understanding:
1) There are voice coaches and voice training tutorials out there. You could YouTube around and see if you can start working on it?
2 and 5) It might be a good idea to buy cheap clothes for the trasitionary period, like the way people often buy cheap clothes for kids and teens, becuase their bodies are changing so much they won't get very long out of the clothes. We have Penneys here that does decent cheap clothes; I got my Enchantress dress there for 7euro. I think it's called Primark elsewhere, or since you're in the States you presumably have stuff like WalMart? Not good for long term clothes, but for a few summer dresses and stuff as your body is changing, might be a way to go?
Also, on tshirts, a baggy tshirt with leggings can be a feminine outfit. And tshirts are super easy to modify; you or someone you know could easily "feminise" your baggy tshirts by putting a curve into the side seams. Also, cutting the collar off to give a scoop-neck really feminises a tshirt.

[noparlpf]

Also, first "transgender" species found. The males have a vagina and the females have a penis.

The title is kind of misleading. I was assuming the female somehow deposited her large, heavy, immobile egg cells into the male, who then became pregnant, which didn't make sense. This thing isn't really a penis. Penises don't suck stuff up. It's just penis-shaped. So technically they're wrong. It's not the first female animal with a penis. There's already a female animal with a penis-shaped non-penis. Hyenas are weird.

(I'm not counting trans women with penises as female animals with penises because in this context female refers to individuals with ovaries who produce eggs.)

[Delusion]

6. How soon do the effects of hormones start coming in?

I am six months in, and I can easily hide my breast growth with baggy shirts.

Actually anything more than T-shirt and its not noticeable.

[SMEE]

Also, do not expect it to give you large breasts.
At best, it will give you one cup under what your mother breast size is because genetics.

I am 7 years in and all I have are AAs, which are very easily hidden under a normal shirt even without binding.
Mom has As, so this was expected.

[Miriel]

Does anyone know what effect hormones have on metabolism? I'm currently one of those irritating people that can eat pretty much whatever I want without putting on weight, but mum reckons that'll probably change when I start hormones, and I'll need to change my eating patterns.

I didn't notice a change in my eating patterns. But then, I control them a lot (eating disorder and stuff).

You'll gain some fat, but lose some muscle mass too. I'm pretty sure I lost some weight with hormones.

So, I'm hoping to start on hormones this fall, since it sounds like the process is going to be relatively easy here in Indiana, and both my brothers should have moved out by then. As a result, I need some pointers.

1. What to do to work on my voice. I guess I have a sort of general idea, but if anybody could help in detail in some way, that'd be great.
2. What to wear. I'd love to wear dresses and skirts especially. I'll probably pick up some stockings as well.
3. Will panties work, or will I have to get surgery before I can wear those and have them feel proper?
4. Will there be a point where the hormones prevent me from having an erection entirely? I'd like to prevent awkward situations in public...
5. What sort of budget will I need for new clothes, and what sort of tips can people give me to look more feminine in them? I mean, I'm assuming I'll have to ditch some of my baggy T-shirts (Especially ones that don't look particularly feminine), but I'm a bit unsure what I'll need to pick up to replace them.
6. How soon do the effects of hormones start coming in?

1) There are some videos or guides online (here's one, otherwise, you can look up what's on Youtube). + coaches. Personnally, I practiced a bit early on, as I transitioned socially, it sorted itself out. But then, my voice was already pretty high.
2) What you prefer Dresses and skirts are good.
3) Yes, they work, but you may have to tuck, as Astrella said.
4) Yes. In my case, I stopped having erections within a month.
5) If you go to cheaper stores, you can have a new dress for $20-30 and tops/skirts for $10-20. I haven't bought jeans or pants, I don't know how much they cost. Thrift stores are a great help though. I have bought beautiful skirts and tops at $5. My favorite skirts almost all come from the equivalent of the Salvation Army. All of my favorite dresses are second hand too, but from a more selective store.
6) As many people have said, it varies. I started noticing difference very early on, but nothing major. It really started to kick in during my second month.

[Themrys]

I didn't notice a change in my eating patterns. But then, I control them a lot (eating disorder and stuff).

You'll gain some fat, but lose some muscle mass too. I'm pretty sure I lost some weight with hormones.

We're talking about female hormones, right?

I guess it depends on whether you can eat what you want because you have big muscles that burn all the energy, or whether you're just underweight because your digestive system is not very effective or whatever. The latter usually causes you to have neither fat nor muscles, so hormones can't cause much of a change.

[Lentrax]

Speaking of voice:

I have been trying for a while now to try and get my voice sounding decent, but it just sounds scratchy.

Or I go into falsetto.

So frustrating.

[SiuiS]

It can lead to weight gain, I've put on 5-6 kilos myself and I've been eating less than normal of late w/ depression so maybe. But weight gain cam mean curves so not necessarily a bad thing. Mind you I've also gotten almost two inches shorter since starting so can be quite a bit of physical change.

Two inches shorter? How did that happen?

The title is kind of misleading. I was assuming the female somehow deposited her large, heavy, immobile egg cells into the male, who then became pregnant, which didn't make sense. This thing isn't really a penis. Penises don't suck stuff up. It's just penis-shaped. So technically they're wrong. It's not the first female animal with a penis. There's already a female animal with a penis-shaped non-penis. Hyenas are weird.

(I'm not counting trans women with penises as female animals with penises because in this context female refers to individuals with ovaries who produce eggs.)

I agree, actually. But for different reasons; female is a meaningless word. Buffalo buffalo buffalo etc., y'know? We use 'female' and 'male' and their direct derivatives to mean so many things for ease of conversation, but when going into the nitty gritty it loses all value. We now know that female, female, female, female and female are all very different things and we should have had different terms for them in the first place.

I don think calling these transgender bugs is a valuable statement. I also don't think your own aside on why transgender women aren't female is a valuable statement. Hell, all of language has sort of unraveled in my head and all of it is equally profound and meaningless. I guess I've gone over the absurdity horizon.

[Heliomance]

Also, do not expect it to give you large breasts.
At best, it will give you one cup under what your mother breast size is because genetics.

I am 7 years in and all I have are AAs, which are very easily hidden under a normal shirt even without binding.
Mom has As, so this was expected.

There's more to genetics than your mother. I'm hoping to get a fairly reasonable size despite my mother only being a B-cup, because my paternal grandmother was apparently stacked, and my sisters are DD and D.

[Mono Vertigo]

Does anyone know what effect hormones have on metabolism? I'm currently one of those irritating people that can eat pretty much whatever I want without putting on weight, but mum reckons that'll probably change when I start hormones, and I'll need to change my eating patterns.

That would make us two if you keep that metabolism with hormones. We can irritate the rest of the world together.
Joke aside... what I do know is that in one case (and that would be BF's), metabolism hardly changed. It's the placement and quantity of muscles and fat that made a difference, and his weight dropped, too. Of course, when one takes in consideration BF also eats less, and differently, than he did before HRT, it's difficult to come to a valid conclusion. Beside, it wouldn't be accurate to expect you'd be in the same situation as BF pre-hormones.
Long story short, the same amount of hormones can affect individuals differently. For something such as metabolism, I'd assume it's not going to change noticeably, although it might.


I should stop making posts that amount to "maybe, maybe not". Doesn't help as much as I'd like to think it does.
EDIT: although it's the sort of "maybe, maybe not" that would be clarified by a health professional.

[Delusion]

*wearing my new girly clothes*
Dad: "When we go visit your granny don't wer those"
Me: ....
Dad: "They'll smell of tobacco smoke otherwise"
Me: "Oh right"

For a moment I was confused and hurt there. (My granny smokes indoors so when ever we visit those clothes will smell for at least a week).

[Axinian]

Also, do not expect it to give you large breasts.
At best, it will give you one cup under what your mother breast size is because genetics.

I am 7 years in and all I have are AAs, which are very easily hidden under a normal shirt even without binding.
Mom has As, so this was expected.

Hm. Well hopefully this ends up true for me, because I think I may end up with a C if that's the case and that's exactly the size I'm hoping for!

Speaking of voice:

I have been trying for a while now to try and get my voice sounding decent, but it just sounds scratchy.

Or I go into falsetto.

So frustrating.

Same issue. Grr. I can stay out of falsetto OK, but the scratchiness is being a major pain.

_____

So I'm really having a hard time deciding whether I should come out to my parents, like, today. I know I've been moving pretty fast in this but I've got the momentum and I really feel like I need to let it out. At the same time though, I have not yet talked to my psych about this and I want her feedback. Also, my parents are leaving on a trip pretty soon and I don't want it to be like "Oh by the way I'm trans... K bye!" Also though, I've come out to my sister but she said she's feeling some pressure from being the only one who currently knows, but I'm also still grappling with my feelings a bit and I don't freakin' know.

I'm thinking it's just best to wait until after I've seen my shrink, but holding it in is really weighing on me right now I guess