Why are the gods scared of Pandorym?

[Raven777]

What about Lady of Pain vs Pandorym?

[Mystic Muse]

What about Lady of Pain vs Pandorym?

It results in a Romantic comedy that actually manages to be good?

[FenAseph]

It results in a Romantic comedy that actually manages to be good?

Nope, Pandorym hates the gods, and if Lady of Pain is an overdeity, it results in a romantic tragedy, as Pandorym will kill Lady of Pain.

[Clistenes]

Nope, Pandorym hates the gods, and if Lady of Pain is an overdeity, it results in a romantic tragedy, as Pandorym will kill Lady of Pain.

Or they furiously hump, breaking the minds of all the inhabitants of the Cage, who will pull out their own eyes and eat them before jumping into the nearest portal and spend screaming every second of the rest of their lives (that is, until they are killed or die of starvation because they can't scream and eat at the same time).

[Vedhin]

Lady of Pain gets irritated at Pandorym invading Sigil with its overdeity-esque power level and mazes/kills it.

But in general, reformed Pandorym's stats are: You Lose. Game Over. Please Insert Quarter.

[Alleran]

Nope, Pandorym hates the gods, and if Lady of Pain is an overdeity, it results in a romantic tragedy, as Pandorym will kill Lady of Pain.

Her Serenity isn't a deity, berk.

[FenAseph]

Her Serenity isn't a deity, berk.

Maybe she is a deity, berk.

Seriously, nobody knows what she is. But this is off-topic.

Returning to Pandorym, a story that will end with its release would be very interesting. I'd like to read about the epic battle between the gods and Pandorym. And the destruction of the Realms, and their reinvention.

[afroakuma]

Maybe she is a deity, berk.

Oh no, she's definitely not. That much has been made clear.

[iceman10058]

she has the power of a diety with out being divine or having a divine rank, due to the fact she wants no worshipers.

[FenAseph]

Is Sigil part of the Realms? If so, Pandorym could kill Lady of Pain, because it is supposed to destroy the entire Realms.

[Alleran]

Is Sigil part of the Realms?

No. The "Realms" can refer to Faerun specifically, the planet of Toril as a whole (which includes places like Kara-Tur and Zakhara) and the rest of Realmspace (i.e. the crystal sphere in its entirety), or various things in between.

[The Oni]

There's no guarantee that destroying Sigil would destroy LoP. In fact, it might just *free* her instead.

[Vedhin]

There's no guarantee that destroying Sigil would destroy LoP. In fact, it might just *free* her instead.

Now there's a campaign idea.

Except for the fact that Sigil is sort of the linchpin that keeps the Great Wheel from disintegrating, or something like that.

Maybe if it disintegrated slowly, and the players had to fix it...

[Dr. Azkur]

This thread is awesome...

By the way, I would argue that Pandorym is not actually psionic, not ever anything actually like it, it's just that we are not going to invent a new parallel of casting and psionics just for an Elder Evil. They don't have psionics or magic where Pandorym is from, but psionics is the cleanest way to handle his powers. Since he's not psionic, the Annulus is Useluss.

This is the Far Realm we're talking about, people. In fact, I would find it utterly ridiculous if they had the exact same psionic system that we have.

[MeiLeTeng]

This is the Far Realm we're talking about, people. In fact, I would find it utterly ridiculous if they had the exact same psionic system that we have.

Pandorym isn't from the Far Realm.

[Raven777]

He's from a place perpendicular to reality.

[RavynsLand]

Maybe he just says really hurtful things whenever he gets invited to parties.

[iceman10058]

Maybe he just says really hurtful things whenever he gets invited to parties.

or is the person that goes there to pick fights cause he gets bored, and usually wins.

[FenAseph]

He's from a place perpendicular to reality.

This must be an interesting place.
Answering to the OP's question, the gods are scared of Pandorym because:
-It is, at its full power, much more powerful than the deities together.
-It wants to completely destroy the gods. Completely in the sense that it will kill the souls of the gods, their essences. It wants to send the gods to eternal oblivion.
-It will destroy the Universe.

These aren't enough reasons?

[Gemini476]

This must be an interesting place.
Answering to the OP's question, the gods are scared of Pandorym because:
-It is, at its full power, much more powerful than the deities together.
-It wants to completely destroy the gods. Completely in the sense that it will kill the souls of the gods, their essences. It wants to send the gods to eternal oblivion.
-It will destroy the Universe.

These aren't enough reasons?

Well, Pandorym's motivation is pretty much just to kill the gods to fulfill it's end of the contract and then go back home. He only goes on his omnicidal rampage if he's stopped from doing one of those two, especially the latter.

Incidentally, the solution that the gods had was pretty much just to batten down all hatches to the Prime Material and let Pandorym eat it, if his Sign is any indication. I'm pretty sure that Reality Revision lets him get through it, though.

[Envyus]

Well, Pandorym's motivation is pretty much just to kill the gods to fulfill it's end of the contract and then go back home. He only goes on his omnicidal rampage if he's stopped from doing one of those two, especially the latter.

Incidentally, the solution that the gods had was pretty much just to batten down all hatches to the Prime Material and let Pandorym eat it, if his Sign is any indication. I'm pretty sure that Reality Revision lets him get through it, though.

The Gods did not trap Pandorym however and have no power over him they can't even use their divine power to find out were he is.

[Melcar]

What I have never understood was how can a being be more powerful than all the gods combined and still be split and imprisoned by mortal artificers? How did they even get information about this creature? And since, to my knowledge, AO has complete power within his own crystal sphere could this Pandorym pose any threat? Personally I have never liked the idea of something that powerful and yet weak enough to be imprisoned by mortals. That to me is strange. And also the fact that somehow the Imaskar was more clever that the gods. And even more powerful. I don’t know what level spells they cast to create the godwall, but if they can imprison pandorym and the deities can’t do nothing about the pandorym then why did the imaskar need to get such a being in the first place when they were obviously more powerful than the gods?

The whole thing makes no sense to me.

[AnonymousPepper]

This must be an interesting place.
Answering to the OP's question, the gods are scared of Pandorym because:
-It is, at its full power, much more powerful than the deities together.
-It wants to completely destroy the gods. Completely in the sense that it will kill the souls of the gods, their essences. It wants to send the gods to eternal oblivion.
-It will destroy the Universe.

These aren't enough reasons?

Well, yeah, but, my point, or rather that of my esteemed friend RPGaddict28 aka one of my 3.5 DMs (incidentally, the fact that he's reading EE has me somewhat scared), was that, despite all this, the gods have an artifact that no-questions-asked instagibs any psionic creature.

[Eldan]

What I have never understood was how can a being be more powerful than all the gods combined and still be split and imprisoned by mortal artificers? How did they even get information about this creature? And since, to my knowledge, AO has complete power within his own crystal sphere could this Pandorym pose any threat? Personally I have never liked the idea of something that powerful and yet weak enough to be imprisoned by mortals. That to me is strange. And also the fact that somehow the Imaskar was more clever that the gods. And even more powerful. I don’t know what level spells they cast to create the godwall, but if they can imprison pandorym and the deities can’t do nothing about the pandorym then why did the imaskar need to get such a being in the first place when they were obviously more powerful than the gods?

The whole thing makes no sense to me.

Probably more a stone-scissors-paper situation than a strict linear power situation. Powers smite primes, Pandorym eats powers, primes imprison Pandorym.

So, he probably has a kind of specific anti-power power.

[FenAseph]

Well, yeah, but, my point, or rather that of my esteemed friend RPGaddict28 aka one of my 3.5 DMs (incidentally, the fact that he's reading EE has me somewhat scared), was that, despite all this, the gods have an artifact that no-questions-asked instagibs any psionic creature.

The mind shard is a psionic creature, but maybe the fully formed Pandorym isn´t. Therefore, the artifact might be useless against Pandorym. Even if fully Pandorym is psionic, you will not have the chance to use it against Pandorym, because ¨the wielder can trigger this effect as a special action requiring 10 rounds of continuous concentration to complete¨. I doubt that Pandorym will wait 10 rounds - you will be killed in no time, long before you can use the artifact.

How did they even get information about this creature?

Well, I have some speculations. A few posts before we talked about Sigil. Maybe Sigil is the answer to this question. The Imaskari learned about Pandorym through their contacts in Sigil. Maybe they found a portal that leads to the reality of Pandorym. Why not?

why did the imaskar need to get such a being in the first place when they were obviously more powerful than the gods?

They were not more powerful than the gods - after all they were wiped out by the said gods.

What I have never understood was how can a being be more powerful than all the gods combined and still be split and imprisoned by mortal artificers?

Well, the situation was more complex than we think. They had a unique position. They had a vast knowledge of magic and the resources of an entire empire at their disposal. They were a cabal composed of epic wizards.
I can imagine that they have created an one-time epic spell in order to split Pandorym. I guess that they pushed the Weave to its limits to create that spell. The book says ¨many gave their lives to do so¨ (splitting Pandorym).
So the ritual required a tremendous amount of energy, and some casters died during the process.
And maybe they were helped by a powerful entity. Not necessarily Ao or some gods, rather an external entity. Maybe they were helped by a god of from the Abyss. Who knows?

And since, to my knowledge, AO has complete power within his own crystal sphere could this Pandorym pose any threat?

Maybe Ao will allow Pandorym to kill all the gods. Why not? He does not intervene directly in the events of his own sphere. Or maybe Ao will be unable to stop Pandorym. I mean, the reformed Pandorym has the power level of an overgod.

[malonkey1]

What I have never understood was how can a being be more powerful than all the gods combined and still be split and imprisoned by mortal artificers? How did they even get information about this creature? And since, to my knowledge, AO has complete power within his own crystal sphere could this Pandorym pose any threat? Personally I have never liked the idea of something that powerful and yet weak enough to be imprisoned by mortals. That to me is strange. And also the fact that somehow the Imaskar was more clever that the gods. And even more powerful. I don’t know what level spells they cast to create the godwall, but if they can imprison pandorym and the deities can’t do nothing about the pandorym then why did the imaskar need to get such a being in the first place when they were obviously more powerful than the gods?

The whole thing makes no sense to me.

Mortals, especially the magi that would have split Pandorym, are the very definition of Weak But Skilled. You don't need power to outwit an enemy.

[Alleran]

I can imagine that they have created an one-time epic spell in order to split Pandorym. I guess that they pushed the Weave to its limits to create that spell.

The Imaskari were operating in the time period before Netheril, and thus they had access to the Weave as maintained by Mystryl, rather than with the limitations imposed on it by Mystra. They also, IIRC, had the Shadow Weave. So even if they did push the Weave fairly heavily, they were also pushing it on a scale that "modern" spellcasters (i.e. the 1-to-9-and-epic) may not be capable of.

Maybe Ao will allow Pandorym to kill all the gods. Why not? He does not intervene directly in the events of his own sphere. Or maybe Ao will be unable to stop Pandorym. I mean, the reformed Pandorym has the power level of an overgod.

Depends. Ao was the one who summoned the Mulhorandi gods through the Godwall in the first place, allowing them entry and bending the rules of normal Power-into-Crystal-Sphere interaction. He also did intervene during the Time of Troubles, naturally, and once - only once, AFAIK - he directly answered a prayer in place of another god.

[Melcar]

My point was that it seems counterproductive to spends such a vast amount of power getting the pandoryn here in the first place. It would seem that if the spend the time/power getting the pandorym on battling the god they might actually have won.

Also a non-split pandorym might have the power of an over deity (where is this info from btw), which makes it even more unbelievable that the succeeded. And even though the Pandorym might be as strong as AO (which I personally find hard to believe) he still has full command over his own sphere, just like Asmodeus has over hell. Meaning that he could banish and keep out the pandorym if he so wished... AFAIK.

What I also find unbelievably is that the mystryl weave might have no max level spells, we just know that the highest level spell was 12, but we also know that the elves' high magic could surpass what was doable by level 12 and its fair to believe that the imaskari had their own form of ritual magic (godwall). But if they were able to split and imprison pandorym I find it unbelievable that the gods can’t stop the pandorym. It might be some form of rock, paper scissors, but still i find this unlikely.

[Urpriest]

Well, yeah, but, my point, or rather that of my esteemed friend RPGaddict28 aka one of my 3.5 DMs (incidentally, the fact that he's reading EE has me somewhat scared), was that, despite all this, the gods have an artifact that no-questions-asked instagibs any psionic creature.

Again, what do you mean by that? If you mean the Annulus, in what possible sense do the gods have the Annulus? It's a lost artifact of the mind flayer empire, why would the gods have anything to do with it?

[malonkey1]

Again, what do you mean by that? If you mean the Annulus, in what possible sense do the gods have the Annulus? It's a lost artifact of the mind flayer empire, why would the gods have anything to do with it?

I believe Mind Flayers have deities, don't they?