Crossroads II: I'm on a Mammoth.

[Almarck]

A freedom doctrine would be cool.

[Admiral Squish]

I think Passion could probably fit under Joy. Basically, my mental image for a Joy priest is based on the quote "beer is proof that god loves us and wants us to be happy".

Hmm. I could see some sort of glory-eque, domain, though the name bugs me. Perhaps I could change Praise to Gratitude and make Praise be about creating things to glorify the divine.

Debating seems like it would fall under Contemplation.

Freedom... tempting, but I think that goes under Unity as part of equality.

My original cross-comparison had 21 traits, which seemed like a lot, so I'm trying to keep the list reasonably trim.

Still, I'm glad the rest of it's been pretty well-accepted. Now all I have to do is figure out is what their mechanical effect is... Some vague ideas I'm considering:
Each doctrine works like a taboo/mandate kinda thing, with things you can do to earn points and things that, if you do, you lose points. You'd get 'faith points' or something, and you could spend them for... something, I dunno what. I have the vague idea that you could use it when you cast a spell (points=spell level) to cast the spell without expending it. Or maybe each doctrine would have a related power of some sort that you can spend faith points on?
The other idea is to make them like class features proper. Like, unity might give you an animal companion, or a leadership-style cohort. Or mindfulness makes you immune to mind-affecting, but only as long as you use a swift action each round or something.

[Admiral Squish]

I'm sorely, sorely tempted to mess with knowing/learning/preparing spells while I'm 'under the hood' so to speak.
What I'd like to do is make it so both wizards and priests just know a number of spells, with no spellbook/prayerbook needed. This would basically just be the base number of spells you learn automatically as you level. Then you could 'ready' a number of spells of each level equal to your spells/day for the level. You can ready spells you know in your brain, or ready spells out of a spellbook/prayerbook/mnemonic geegaw you have access to. Then you can just cast any readied spells you have with any appropriate spell slots, in any combination. (so, you could do one of each, or use all of a given spell level on a single spell, or any combination you want).
Perhaps I'm not super clear about what I'm trying to do there, but it would make it so spellbooks/prayer books would just be an extra, not required adventuring equipment, and players would have a little more freedom about what they do with their spell slots, but they'd keep the freedom of a wide-open spell list.

[Steckie]

So what you're saying is that a caster still readies spells, just not in slots. That caster has a bit more freedom, but still needs to choose spells each day.
I've never really been a fan of Vancian casting (i do like Vance's books though), so for me this wouldn't be much of a problem. Just be carefull not to change too many things, this still needs to be recognizable and we are trying to keep all of this compatible with pathfinder.

[Admiral Squish]

Alright, i just posted what I have for priest thus far, I'd love it if you guys would be so kind as to check it out.
Priest

[Steckie]

Background Skills: Appraise, Bluff, Diplomacy, Knowledge Engineering, Knowledge Geography, Knowledge Nobility, Linguistics.
Background Feats: Cosmopolitan, Deceitfull, Noble Scion, Persuasive, Scholar
Native Language: French, English, Dutch, Spanish, Portuguese, Latin
Bonus Languages: (Languages they would be exposed to, from neighboring areas or groups they have contact with)

A few questions about this part:
Are the background skills and feats good?
What bonus languages should i take for this? Languages from neighbouring areas or groups they have contact with is a long list. Actually it's almost everybody on the whole continent.

[Admiral Squish]

I suppose it would be better worded as groups that have close contact with. While some explorers may have traveled to the western coast and learned the languages of the northwest coast, they're not group that all Europeans would have reasonably close contact with. Similarly, while they might have contact with the plains tribes tangentially through Cahokia, they probably don't have a great deal of contact with them. I'd say, for bonus languages, they should have languages of the northeast, southeast, mesoamerica, and maybe something from the northeast, like norsq or tuniit-language.

The skills seem fine, though maybe profession could be tossed in there, and the knowledges could use () around the varieties.
Feats seem good too. I would like to add some sort of priestly training feat or some other sort of literacy option.

[Mith]

Just posting to say that next week I will plan to get the Arctic Overculture done (or at least a rough draft), since I got a break so I can focus on side projects. I hope what I have sitting in my head works with what has been envisioned by everyone else. Just a heads up, I might be drawing a bit more strongly from the Old Traditions of Scandinavia, even though Iceland (and Scandinavia itself) had converted by this point, mostly for an added flavour (most European powers in setting are some flavour of Christian), and because just because they are Christian does not mean that the old traditions have gone away. Greenland still has actual shamanistic believes in this day and age. (silly comic but it gets my point across).

[Mith]

Just posted the Arctic Over-Culture thread. It's very bare-boned, but I feel that having the structure online will serve as a motivator to get it done. I will hopefully have this finished by the weekend. Feel free to post any suggestions, although I may not implement them until my first write up is done.

[Steckie]

Good luck, European Culture has been quite a task so far. Still working on it, i hope to have it finished by the next Skype call.


Oh, and wasn't the plan to discuss what we're going to do with Cahokia and the Plains tribes? I completely forgot about it.

[Admiral Squish]

Hey, everyone, sorry about the radio silence, I haven't had the chance to sit down and type up the kind of detailed replies I usually do. Anyways, I'm back, and ready to get back to work.

Arctic Culture
Awesome! I'm definitely gonna stop by there next and give my full thoughts on the culture. I'm really looking forward to seeing what you come up with!
Just remember, the arctic culture may include vinlandrs, but vinlandrs are a distinct sub-group, so you don't want to put too much European influence in there.

European Culture
Excellent! I'm definitely looking forward to that, too. I did a bit of work on a few of the european cultures, back when we were working on them as a couple different cultures, and I gotta say, it's really interesting to research your own culture and try to see it from an outsider's perspective.

Plains Culture
Yes! We do definitely need to discuss this one.
Well, for starters, the horse is gonna be a major aspect of the plains cultures. The horse came a little earlier in crossroads than it did in the real world, thanks to more developed trade routes, links, and the Chinese, so they're had more time to convert to the new way of life. Horses reinvented everything about the culture in the last 50-100 years, and put a lot more focus on an individual's ability to hunt and fight, rather than a group's ability to coordinate.
Bows and arrows are still the main weapon here. There's not a lot of trade coming into the region from either coast, so guns are still reasonably scarce. Some spears might be in use, and there might be some groups who prefer crossbows, but the bow and arrow is still the focus.
Since riding horses and using bows both require training and physical fitness, there's more pressure to meet those standards. If you can't keep up, you and your tribe go hungry. Strength and skill become expected, necessary, and those with both are raised up, praised, and held as examples to others.

What I was thinking was we're basically looking at a perfect setup for a 'proud warrior culture' kind of thing. Not a stereotypical one, since the focus is on riding and bows, but the feeling's still there. Every able-bodied male is expected to be able to ride, hunt, and fight, if necessary. The whole thing is covered over with a strong religious overtones, with priests and wise men in every village keeping everything in line and making sure the proper respects are paid.

What I wanted to do was throw some sort of big, uniting disaster into their history. Something big enough to gather all the plains tribes together against a common foe, and something that continues to loom as a possible threat in the future. The tribes were at war with each other, some trying to leverage their new-found horses for advantage, others struggling to catch up to the changing battlefield, and then crap went down. The tribes are forced to band together to fight. Massive losses, but they win. The only warriors who survive the climactic battle were those on horseback, their horses' hooves and forelegs stained red with the blood of those around them, bloody hand-prints left on their fur by the dying. A chieftain orders his tribe's warriors to attack, to wipe out the last remnants of another tribe's forces. They refuse, and the warriors of all the gathered tribes make a pact, never to war with each other again, before returning to their tribes and training others to follow this new code.
Of course, conflict is inevitable, and you can't have warriors who don't know how to fight when it comes down to it. So, these warriors set up a sort of code of honor for all the warriors to follow. Let's call those who follow this code 'braves' for the moment, for the sake of clarity. Braves mark themselves and their mounts with red dye, a few strategically-placed handprints and a coating on the legs and hooves of their horses. (I'm imagining a magical horse that has such markings naturally) Braves can't kill other braves or attack civilians, they must accept a fellow brave's surrender, and they must abide any deal struck with another brave. If you break the code, you're not considered a brave anymore, and everybody else can let loose on you. Mostly, combat between braves is a battle of honor, counting coup. One tags another with a coup-stick, or hits with nonlethal arrows, or they steal the other side's horses, or otherwise prove themselves sufficiently better than the enemy. This goes on until one side admits defeat and surrenders, and they negotiate a settlement of some sort. Of course, there would be issues with people pretending to be braves when not following the code. Maybe the marks could be magic, turning black and much harder to clean off if you break the code, maybe it's some sort of feat, or a 0-level spell for priests, requiring the warriors to receive the marks from a priest before battle.

[SuperDave]

Hi everyone. I'm not dead!

I've been away from the thread for a while, mainly because I've let the backlog build up so much that I was afraid to start up again. But now I'm back, and pretty much caught up.

I'm really enjoying the work that's been done on the overcultures so far, and I'll be posting more in-depth analysis in their respective threads.

I'm loving Admiral Squish's idea for the Braves, by the way. They're almost like a cross between a chivalrous knightly order and a Native warrior-society. They'd make a really interesting PrC, methinks. Not sure about the name, though: "Braves" is culture-neutral, but harkens back to a time when Indians were not depicted in a very positive light in most media. Then again, it's instantly recognizable, and they ARE supposed to be brave...

[Mith]

I guess the connotations of the term "Brave" depends on the region, since I do not think there is any negative connotations with the term, so long as the person calling themselves "Brave" were actually acting in a manner one associated with the role.

[Admiral Squish]

Plains
I don't think it should be a PrC, it's more like.. 'soldier', or 'knight', it's a title that's given to a combatant who is sworn to follow the rules, and can be taken away if they break them. Making it a PrC would make it impossible to get into before 6th level, and would necessitate a more narrow focus of what they can do. Anyone can be one, it's just a matter of following the rules, and it has implications about a certain level of training.
As to the word... it seems to be an iffy subject. What I found seemed to indicate it was considered offensive, but it seems to be more of an issue of using it to refer to all native men. Theoretically, if we were to use it as a title, that wouldn't be a concern, but perhaps it would simply be best to come up with a different term. Maybe they could bear a name related to the event that united them (which we still need to figure out). Or maybe something related to the marking?

I'm considering a couple possible options for what the mechanical side of this organization/title would be.
One option is a spell, a 0-level priest spell that allows a priest to place the markings on a warrior and their mount. This would mean you'd have to go to a priest for a blessing each day of combat, which would help keep the warriors on the up-and-up and reinforce the spiritual aspect of the markings. It could also possibly grant the warrior some minor benefits, like reducing the penalty to making nonlethal strikes with lethal weapons, or a bonus to ride checks, and it would also make it so the mark could indicate that the warrior is keeping to the code, possibly changing colors and becoming more permanent if the warrior broke it. Kind of a specialized arcane mark thing.
Another option is a feat. This would make it so the warrior could mark themselves, and would make the code a permanent, personal kind of thing. It could be a normal feat and be included on the plains culture feats list. Maybe it grants some other benefits as well, like giving you a horse animal companion (half progression or something). Maybe it could include a special option for 1st-level characters, to represent a growing warrior's extra training. this could be combined with the spell option, making it so the warrior could just use the spell.
It could be nothing mechanical, just an oath and a marking of dye, a kind of uniform and oath of service, swearing them in as a fighter.

I'd also like to have counting coup be a thing. Though, whether it's a kind of combat maneuver that anyone can use, a feat only the cultures listed can use, or it's a combat maneuver with extra benefits due to a feat is still a question.
There's a lot of ways to do it. Touch an opponent with a weapon (including a bow) or the hand, touch an enemy's defensive structures (such as a wall or pallisade), or steal an enemy's weapon or horse, and escape unharmed. Technically speaking, any successful attack counts as a coup (according to wikipedia), and it still counts if you get injured, but it's a bigger honor if you don't harm, and if you escape unharmed. Apparently some cultures allowed warriors who had made a coup to wear an eagle feather in their hair, but it had to be painted red if you were injured in the attempt.
If I go with a combat maneuver, I'd probably limit it to touching the enemy. You make a melee touch attack against an opponent that deals no damage and provokes an attack of opportunity. You can do it with a weapon, gaining the weapon's bonus to the attack roll, but you can't do it at a reach, since the danger's the point of it. If successful, you gain a +1 morale bonus and the opponent takes a -1 morale penalty, which applies to attack, damage, and AC until the end of the encounter. You'd probably want to make it so it stacks. Maybe improved coup feats grant a bonus to the touch attack, or make the act grant a bigger bonus.
If it's a feat, it would grant the use of the above maneuver, but it would probably also apply if you successfully disarm an opponent, and maybe you gain the bonus bonus if you touch a defensive structure.

[Mith]

I see the title of "Brave" in this idea to be similar to that of a Paladin, so perhaps there is an initial swearing in ceremony that gives the Brave and their horse permanent tattoos that grow more elaborate as the brave gains levels.

[Steckie]

I like the idea, but it all hinges on the disaster that unified the tribes. It has to be interesting enough and it still needs to be a threat in 1750 for the tribes to stick together. Finding a threat that big is tricky, there's not much around the area that could be a threat.
A Cahokian or Aztatlan invasion could do the trick, but they're nowhere near powerfull enough to try and subjugate the whole of the Great Plains. Not with the Europeans knocking on their doors. Fusang is too far away. Hisatsinom on a conquering spree would just be weird. And the Tuniit have Cahokia between them and the Great Plains.
An invasion by another nation is probably off the table.

So we're going to need to look at something different and that means something mythological or magical. A few ideas:
- Something that came from the Rocky Mountains or Great Basin, big and scary. Probably something that needed to migrate when the Fusangese set up shop. This might not work with the horse-angle you're giving, horses were introduced later and they wouldn't appear in large enough numbers for the plains tribes to effectively use them in combat.
- Tornado elementals gone crazy (tornado alley, right?).
- Something dangerous appeared out of a Link site. Mongol tribe (free horses!)? Hessian mercenaries? European mythical creatures fleeing the inquisition?
- The medicine plague mutates on the plains and causes people there to become zombies/mutants/whatever.

[Admiral Squish]

Marking
Hmm. I could possibly see some sort of ritualized magical ceremony. Maybe it's a higher-level spell, which is normally accessed via ritual, and permanent until the code is broken. But then, most warriors don't usually walk around in war paint all the time, it might be weird. Or a status symbol. (Mental image, a cloaked stranger approaches a warrior, then pulls off a glove to reveal they bear the markings of a warrior as well). Though, it would protect them from being targeted by other warriors if attacked unexpectedly... I would say, I don't think the marks should develop as they level, though.
Perhaps the feat is just the code and some passive benefits (like a horse companion, or no penalty on nonlethal attacks), and the markings are just added on as a uniform kinda thing.

Also, what exactly should the markings be? I'm imagining a couple possibilities, but the one that appeals the most at the moment is red-dyed hands and red handprints on each shoulder (applied by warriors standing in a circle and clasping hands to their neighbor's shoulders).

Event
The first tribe to adopt a fully nomadic horse-tribe lifestyle did so in 1730, I think we can step that timeline up a bit considering the increased ease of long distance travel and more robust trade routes.

On specific events:
A big monster is just gonna ignore an army, it'd have to be taken care of by adventurers. Whatever the threat is, it would have to be an army of smaller things for an army of warriors to be of any use.
Tornado activity is actually more centered around Cahokia, though the eastern parts of the plain are in the periphery.
Hmm. The event bringing a sudden influx of horses could be cool, but I think throwing mongols onto the plains is just gonna end up with a lot of dead, horseless natives.
Ehh, zombies seem overdone...

Hmm. What if it's not an outside event, but internal conflict? Some gigantic clash of warriors, an unthinkably bloody massacre, or some sort of unconscionable war crime, something that would be bad enough to cause the warriors to reach out to their fellow warriors and turn their backs on their leaders. At least enough of the warriors that it became this cross-cultural pledge thing.

Heal
I was musing on heal checks to heal the injured in another thread, and I think I came up with a decent idea for how to run it.

So, heal becomes trained only. To heal an injured individual, you make a DC 10 heal check. This check requires one hour, and the target must rest throughout. the target heals hit points equal to their hit die, as though they rested for 8 hours.
The healer can attempt more aggressive treatments for more dire injuries. Each stack of aggressive treatment increases the healing by 1d6, and the DC of the check by 5.
If you fail by <5, the check has no effect.
If you fail by >5, something goes wrong, and the target takes 1d6 damage/stack of aggressive treatment.

There would be a couple other modifiers, like treating multiple patients at a time, or working in poor conditions, or working without tools.
Then you'd have DCs for treating various other effects, like conditions, diseases, poisons, or ability damage.
Maybe throw in material components/supplies that allow you to treat magical diseases, curses, ability drain, or similar.

[Mith]

Marking

The Markings could fade during peace time, and be brought to bear by a minor ritual of the Brave in question to grant him buffs. There are basic markings of the Brave, with other markings being feats for Agility buffs, strength buffs and so on.

[Admiral Squish]

I dunno about making feat-buffs for these guys, that seems a little too overtly magical for something that's supposed to be, at least originally, non-magical.

[TheWombatOfDoom]

Event -

What about instead of an internal threat or a monster or invasion, it was a sickness?

[Admiral Squish]

Event -

What about instead of an internal threat or a monster or invasion, it was a sickness?

The problem that sticks out at me with a sickness is 'what good is an army against a disease'? Unless we're talking about some sort of transformation-disease that makes people into zombies, mutants, or similar, and even then, getting an army together would likely just hasten the spread unless you were very thorough with your countermeasures.

[Steckie]

Event

An army of undead bison-taurs raised by Koschei the Deathless?

An internal threat is going to be difficult if you want it to be something that still threatens them today. Either they solve the internal threat quickly or the tribes keep fighting too long and rip each other apart to become easy pickings for the nations surrounding them.

[TheWombatOfDoom]

Event

An army of undead bison-taurs raised by Koschei the Deathless?

An internal threat is going to be difficult if you want it to be something that still threatens them today. Either they solve the internal threat quickly or the tribes keep fighting too long and rip each other apart to become easy pickings for the nations surrounding them.

What if the reason the Great Plains are the great plains is more ominous?

Perhaps the great plains USED to have sites where there were great forests, inhabited completely by evil Ents or living trees. There could have been a great war that commensed that united the tribes against these forests, and they eventually drove back these, but there is still persistant minorities.

[Admiral Squish]

Event
Bison-taurs is a pretty inventive, but Koschei the Deathless is from the Aleutians. Of course, a link is always an option. Perhaps a dinosaur boneyard would be a better destination, though. Or perhaps it's not any individual, it's just a magical disaster that just animates all the dead buffalo at a certain deadfall?

The ongoing threat was mostly to help encourage the tradition to continue on, to ensure it was apparent how important it is that it does. An internal conflict could have been the impetus for the change, and now that it's been, like, two generations since the event, we could have the system starting to come apart as tensions grow.

Hmm. I did have a thing with imperialist treants in an old setting I did. It could be an interesting approach. But I think it would probably be a little too much of a departure from the local mythology.

Perhaps we should see if we can find some sort of monster/disaster/event in the myths of the plains tribes that we could repurpose?

[Steckie]

Event

There are several Great Flood myths among the people of the Great Plains, we could do something with that.
Let's say that when the Spirals reconnected between Eurasia and the New World it gave quite a shock. The reconnection happened probably somewhere between Greenland and Iceland, meaning North America. The shock resonated through the Spirals and that had an effect on the center of the continent: The Great Plains.
Several of the Great Plains link sites went a bit berserk and they suddenly all connected to the other side of the world. Unfortunately that's in the middle of the Indian Ocean and large amounts of seawater flooded those Link sites. The Spirals are connected to the Spirit World and the energy coming out of these berserk Link Sites somehow animated large amounts of bones. This can be from whatever you want: dinosaurs, bisons, binson-taurs, squirrels,...
The Link sites quickly calm down, probably in a few hours.

So now there are flooded Link sites where the grass has died (salt water does that) so that quick communication and transportation is impossible and a large amount of undead creatures roaming the area. The flooding isn't severe enough to cause famine or large scale destruction, it just renders the Link sites temporarily unusuable. And after some time the seawater dries up, the salt gets blown away and the area gets fertile again.
The solution of the Plains Tribes for all these problems is the horse: quick communication lines, quicker transportation, a mobile army to deal with the animated creatures. They are forced to band together to drive away the animated creatures, inventing the braves etcetera.
Afterwards the animated creatures are still a threat in 1750 and sometimes a horde gathers to threaten the tribes.
Maybe some evil sorcerers got animated as well and they continue to greate new animated creatures to harass the tribes.

I've been away from the thread for a while, mainly because I've let the backlog build up so much that I was afraid to start up again. But now I'm back, and pretty much caught up.

Have you taken a look at the Caribbean thread and the Kaya Salina thread? I'd love to have your thoughts on those.

[TheWombatOfDoom]

Event

There are several Great Flood myths among the people of the Great Plains, we could do something with that.
Let's say that when the Spirals reconnected between Eurasia and the New World it gave quite a shock. The reconnection happened probably somewhere between Greenland and Iceland, meaning North America. The shock resonated through the Spirals and that had an effect on the center of the continent: The Great Plains.
Several of the Great Plains link sites went a bit berserk and they suddenly all connected to the other side of the world. Unfortunately that's in the middle of the Indian Ocean and large amounts of seawater flooded those Link sites. The Spirals are connected to the Spirit World and the energy coming out of these berserk Link Sites somehow animated large amounts of bones. This can be from whatever you want: dinosaurs, bisons, binson-taurs, squirrels,...
The Link sites quickly calm down, probably in a few hours.

So now there are flooded Link sites where the grass has died (salt water does that) so that quick communication and transportation is impossible and a large amount of undead creatures roaming the area. The flooding isn't severe enough to cause famine or large scale destruction, it just renders the Link sites temporarily unusuable. And after some time the seawater dries up, the salt gets blown away and the area gets fertile again.
The solution of the Plains Tribes for all these problems is the horse: quick communication lines, quicker transportation, a mobile army to deal with the animated creatures. They are forced to band together to drive away the animated creatures, inventing the braves etcetera.
Afterwards the animated creatures are still a threat in 1750 and sometimes a horde gathers to threaten the tribes.
Maybe some evil sorcerers got animated as well and they continue to greate new animated creatures to harass the tribes.



Have you taken a look at the Caribbean thread and the Kaya Salina thread? I'd love to have your thoughts on those.

Hmmmm...Salt Lake City anyone?

[Mith]

Hmmmm...Salt Lake City anyone?

Heh. Maybe there was a Link Site in the salt flats?

Also, I have a draft of the Arctic Over-culture here, although I am having difficulties with some sections. Feel free to critique what I have written and perhaps help fill in the gaps.

[TheWombatOfDoom]

Heh. Maybe there was a Link Site in the salt flats?

Also, I have a draft of the Arctic Over-culture here, although I am having difficulties with some sections. Feel free to critique what I have written and perhaps help fill in the gaps.

I'm implying that maybe a link site created the salt flats.

[SuperDave]

I think I like the idea of undead herds of bison more than undead bison-taurs. In real life, bison herds were so huge that they could take hours, even days to pass by, and it stands to reason that herds of skeletal bison would be even larger (since more bison have lived than are alive at any given moment). They would leave swathes of destruction in their wakes comparable to tornadoes, floods, and wildfires. A sufficiently powerful necromancer might even be able to dig up a herd of Pleistocene Bison antiquus, which would be a VERY serious threat indeed.

Undead also have the advantage of being universally hated, which would make it easy for the Great Plains tribes to unify against them. There is no culture on Earth that doesn't tell harrowing tales of ghosts, revenants, and the unqiet dead.

[Admiral Squish]

Event
Alright, I looked into floods, mythological and otherwise, salt flats, and undead.

My first concern is the connection of this event to the links reconnecting. In theory, it seems like the links would reconnect in 1000 CE, with the vikings. There wouldn't be horses around there. all the other major settlement events happen in 1400-1600, at which point they still would have horses. For this to work, the even has to happen sometime around 1675-1700, at the earliest, for them to have access to horses in significant enough numbers for them to play a major role.

And while flood myths are pretty prevalent, it seems like it doesn't quite fit with the rest of the event regarding undead. Maybe if we tied the sudden, massive death of sea life and grass to the rise of the undead, it could work? Also, wouldn't flood-waters pouring through all the plains links give them pretty much the best map of their links? I mean, they'd be marked even after the water dried up by the areas of dead grass.

On the undead themselves, it could just be whatever bodies are near enough to the surface for the magical event to penetrate get animated. Skeletons seem the most likely, since few things just lay around with flesh on their bones for long. Problem with skeletons, though, is they have DR that would make arrows and lances, the two big weapons for the horse-tribes, largely useless.

Still, though, there are advantages to an undead-based problem. As mentioned, they are universally reviled, so they could serve as a unifying force. Having no natural lifespan, it's possible they could still be around, and it's possible that a number of young spell-casters might be inspired by the power of the undead and turn their gifts toward necromancy. In addition, horses are faster than bison, so horsemen would be able to outrun the skeletons, at least as long as their horses hold out, and could 'kite' them with ranged attacks. But again, there's that DR... And finally, the image of miniature negative-energy-infused salt flats stalked by skeletal undead animals sounds awesome.