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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2014

    Default I can help you do that better!

    So playground heres one i dont think has been done before, plz help me make a character who is support incarnate, i was thinking that bard, dragon shaman, and marshal levels are in order, any other classes that would be useful, and what order do you think i should take them in?

    Edit: The idea is auras, bardic music, such things that will buff my allies that i can do while in combat rather than actual combat my guy isnt much for doing stuff himself but he would be GLAD to help you do it better

    So playground...

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    Last edited by Hazrond; 2014-07-09 at 03:12 AM.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2010

    Default Re: I can help you do that better!

    Support is a broad term that can take many forms. Buffing, debuffing, healing, control, skillmonkeying... All can be argued to be a form of support.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2014

    Default Re: I can help you do that better!

    Quote Originally Posted by weckar View Post
    Support is a broad term that can take many forms. Buffing, debuffing, healing, control, skillmonkeying... All can be argued to be a form of support.
    I realized that and shortly amended it with an edit to the main post, do you have any ideas that could help with my now-explained concept?

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Ogre in the Playground
    Join Date
    Nov 2010

    Default Re: I can help you do that better!

    Nope. Sorry.

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    DwarfClericGuy

    Join Date
    Jan 2014

    Default Re: I can help you do that better!

    Bard is one way of doing it. You'll have two spare levels when going bard / virtuoso / sublime chord, so take marshal and (maybe, if you really want) dragon shaman then.

    Most casters can be a great support characters. God wizards have excellent buffs, as do clerics and archivists. If you want a PRC focused on buffing your party members, take a look at War Weaver.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2014

    Default Re: I can help you do that better!

    Quote Originally Posted by HammeredWharf View Post
    Bard is one way of doing it. You'll have two spare levels when going bard / virtuoso / sublime chord, so take marshal and (maybe, if you really want) dragon shaman then.

    Most casters can be a great support characters. God wizards have excellent buffs, as do clerics and archivists. If you want a PRC focused on buffing your party members, take a look at War Weaver.
    Sounds like a plan with the whole bard thing, might i ask what is the suggestion on which order to take them in? im not particularly adept in optimization quite yet

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Bugbear in the Playground
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Leeds, UK

    Default Re: I can help you do that better!

    Bard 7 / Warweaver 1 / Marshal 1 / Virtuoso 1 / Sublime Chord 2 / War Weaver +4 / Virtuoso +4

    Silverbrow Human

    1. Dragon Fire Inspiration
    H. Enlarge Spell
    F. Lingering Song
    F. Chaos Music
    3. Martial Study
    6. Song of the White Raven
    B. Song of the Heart (ACF in Eberron Campaign Setting lets you trade suggestion for this)
    9. Words of Creation
    12. Draconic Aura
    15. Draconic Aura
    18. Double Draconic Aura

    Key Items
    Vest of Legends
    White Raven Crown (granting a white raven stance)

    Buffing abilities you have
    Inspire Courage equal to a Bard 20 (with chaos music and a vest of legends), doubled (words of creation) +1 (song of the heart) for +9 to hit and damage or +9d6 fire damage with Dragon Fire Inspiration activated as a swift action thanks to song of the white raven. Note that depending on your reading of it Words of Creation might double all bonuses to Inspire Courage.
    Marshal aura of your choice, I recommend motivate dexterity for the bonus to initiative checks
    Two draconic auras of your choice at +4 (have them running all the time as you don't want to be activating them in combat and there is no penalty to doing so)
    9th level spells from sublime chord
    The ability to cast lots of spells at once with warweaver and have them affect the entire party.

    Tactics
    Round one
    Swift action activate DFI, move action release the buff spells from your weaving, standard action cast a buff spell.
    Round two
    Swift action activate Inspire Courage, standard action cast a spell.
    Last edited by Dread_Head; 2014-07-09 at 04:18 AM.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    DwarfClericGuy

    Join Date
    Jan 2014

    Default Re: I can help you do that better!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hazrond View Post
    Sounds like a plan with the whole bard thing, might i ask what is the suggestion on which order to take them in? im not particularly adept in optimization quite yet
    Bard 7 / Marshal 1 / Dragon Shaman 1 / Virtuoso 1 / Sublime Chord 2 / Virtuoso +8

    I've done something like this before and must say the woefully small amount of low-level spells you can cast can be a problem, but you can fix it somewhat by using scrolls. I don't think the dragon shaman level is worth it, but if you want it it's no big deal. Sublime Chord gets a nice and free(ish) CL boost, so I'd focus on things that get better with CL, such as some buffs, Black Tentacles and Grasping Hand. As with many other bard builds, Improved Familiar can be great if you give it some low-level scrolls and keep it nearby for Share Spells. It gets your UMD ranks, after all.

    Note that this isn't the best Dragonfire Inspiration build, but with the right feats and equipment you should be able to reach fairly good DFI numbers if you want to.

    Edit: As Dread_Head suggested, sublime chord war weavers are possible, but I'd refrain from it, to be honest. Having a rather poor selection of low-level spells means War Weaver will only be good from fourth level on and the crappy skills WW gets mean you'd be like a sorcerer WW, but worse. Though as with any support build, it depends on your party composition aka what you want to support.
    Last edited by HammeredWharf; 2014-07-09 at 04:20 AM.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jun 2014

    Default Re: I can help you do that better!

    Quote Originally Posted by HammeredWharf View Post
    Bard 7 / Marshal 1 / Dragon Shaman 1 / Virtuoso 1 / Sublime Chord 2 / Virtuoso +8

    I've done something like this before and must say the woefully small amount of low-level spells you can cast can be a problem, but you can fix it somewhat by using scrolls. I don't think the dragon shaman level is worth it, but if you want it it's no big deal. Sublime Chord gets a nice and free(ish) CL boost, so I'd focus on things that get better with CL, such as some buffs, Black Tentacles and Grasping Hand. As with many other bard builds, Improved Familiar can be great if you give it some low-level scrolls and keep it nearby for Share Spells. It gets your UMD ranks, after all.

    Note that this isn't the best Dragonfire Inspiration build, but with the right feats and equipment you should be able to reach fairly good DFI numbers if you want to.

    Edit: As Dread_Head suggested, sublime chord war weavers are possible, but I'd refrain from it, to be honest. Having a rather poor selection of low-level spells means War Weaver will only be good from fourth level on and the crappy skills WW gets mean you'd be like a sorcerer WW, but worse. Though as with any support build, it depends on your party composition aka what you want to support.
    Dragon Shaman was only an idea, if you think another level in bard or SC or something else is better thats fine by me

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    DwarfClericGuy

    Join Date
    Jan 2014

    Default Re: I can help you do that better!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hazrond View Post
    Dragon Shaman was only an idea, if you think another level in bard or SC or something else is better thats fine by me
    Well, it depends on your other party members. Draconic Aura is, indeed, better than a level of Dragon Shaman, but in this case I'd say feats are more valuable than class levels pre-10. After all, the only things you need are seven levels of Bard and possibly one of Virtuoso. So, some suggestions:

    You could grab a Cleric dip. Cleric dips are awesome for domain powers and devotion feats. Trickery Devotion is one of my favorites on a bard, but it's tricky (*rimshot*). Protection Devotion is an alright AC bonus that stacks with almost everything. Baator and Bestial domain powers are useful for scouting. Time gives Improved Initiative. There's a handbook for this.

    You could also dip in Warblade or Crusader. They're far from obvious at first, but White Raven has a whole bunch of useful stances and the abovementioned Song of White Raven is a great feat action economy wise. You won't have to spend a feat on Martial Study, but "lose" a class level.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    WolfInSheepsClothing

    Join Date
    Nov 2013

    Default Re: I can help you do that better!

    bardblade any good?

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