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  1. - Top - End - #61
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by KenderWizard View Post
    ... ... ... oh, and I got engaged to my long-time partner.
    Oh, goodness! Congrats!

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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Congrats, Kender.

    -----------

    So, I went to take photographs for my new ID today with my mom. She not only outed me to the photographer; luckily he was very good about it; but also showed him pictures of me from a few years ago. And just before we left she asked if he had guessed that I was trans before she had told him, which he didn’t apparently. (Which is nice and affirming.) And like, she says she tells people to teach me self-confidence and that I shouldn’t be ashamed but I wish she didn’t treat my being trans as public information so much. :/
    Last edited by Astrella; 2014-07-30 at 06:17 PM.
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Astrella View Post
    So, I went to take photographs for my new ID today with my mom. She not only outed me to the photographer; luckily he was very good about it; but also showed him pictures of me from a few years ago. And just before we left she asked if he had guessed that I was trans before she had told him, which he didn’t apparently. (Which is nice and affirming.) And like, she says she tells people to teach me self-confidence and that I shouldn’t be ashamed but I wish she didn’t treat my being trans as public information so much. :/
    Well...you can't say she isn't trying, at least. I guess.
    Frankly, you've got every right to not want that, but relatives and friends seem to have this annoying "I'm showing the bare minimum of effort, so you have no excuse to be mad at me for going this far out of my comfort zone" attitude about trans stuff. Like my dad and his maybe-occasionally-if-he-remembers using gender-neutral pronouns instead of super-mandude ones. But never female ones, much less any form of support. That wouldn't be acceptable to ask for, oh no.
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Ugh, that's pretty stinky. That's not really public information. Like you don't go around announcing, "My daughter is HIV positive! I bet you couldn't tell. Doesn't she look great? Here are some photos from before she lost so much weight from her meds." (Not that transsexuality is a disease, HIV is just the first other heavily-stigmatised invisible thing that popped into my head. Probably because we were arguing about whether this disinfectant at work can actually "kill AIDS" as advertised, considering that a. AIDS is a condition caused by the virus HIV, and b. HIV is only debatably "alive" in the first place.)
    Jude P.

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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by noparlpf View Post
    Ugh, that's pretty stinky. That's not really public information. Like you don't go around announcing, "My daughter is HIV positive! I bet you couldn't tell. Doesn't she look great? Here are some photos from before she lost so much weight from her meds." (Not that transsexuality is a disease, HIV is just the first other heavily-stigmatised invisible thing that popped into my head. Probably because we were arguing about whether this disinfectant at work can actually "kill AIDS" as advertised, considering that a. AIDS is a condition caused by the virus HIV, and b. HIV is only debatably "alive" in the first place.)
    Actually, that may be a good metaphor. In both cases, it's something you should share before having sex with someone as a safety issue if nothing else (I mention this because there was a sad local story about a transwoman who didn't tell her boyfriend before their big night, and was murdered by him when he found out she was post operative later) but is nobody else's business unless you're going to be swapping fluids.
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by golentan View Post
    Actually, that may be a good metaphor. In both cases, it's something you should share before having sex with someone as a safety issue if nothing else (I mention this because there was a sad local story about a transwoman who didn't tell her boyfriend before their big night, and was murdered by him when he found out she was post operative later) but is nobody else's business unless you're going to be swapping fluids.
    It honestly eludes me how people like that exist. I mean... how can you go from "I love you" to "You deserve to be destroyed"... just like that? I guess I can sort of understand why somebody might be angry and confused, considering how little most people seem to understand of trans stuff, but murdering someone for it... it's just so ****ing senseless.
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Hum... Weird parents stuff. I asked them if my girlfriend could come to a family meeting (my sister's coming back from Japan after more than a year!), and they started to talk confusingly about how my grandmother would take it because she doesn't know yet, stuff like that. Meh. Sounded awkwardly familiar. Anyway.

    EDIT: Also, a beggar (is that word pejorative? I don't know...), after the usual begging, asked me if I was trans and said I had courage and positive things like that. It was nice But I'm apparently not passing...

    @ Kender: Yay Great news!

    Quote Originally Posted by Astrella View Post
    So, I went to take photographs for my new ID today with my mom. She not only outed me to the photographer; luckily he was very good about it; but also showed him pictures of me from a few years ago. And just before we left she asked if he had guessed that I was trans before she had told him, which he didn’t apparently. (Which is nice and affirming.) And like, she says she tells people to teach me self-confidence and that I shouldn’t be ashamed but I wish she didn’t treat my being trans as public information so much. :/
    Meh. Not cool...
    Last edited by Miriel; 2014-07-30 at 08:35 PM.
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  8. - Top - End - #68
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Comrade View Post
    It honestly eludes me how people like that exist. I mean... how can you go from "I love you" to "You deserve to be destroyed"... just like that? I guess I can sort of understand why somebody might be angry and confused, considering how little most people seem to understand of trans stuff, but murdering someone for it... it's just so ****ing senseless.
    It's truly disgusting, but people like that do exist, and trans people are at a disproportionate risk of abuse or murder at the hands of sexual partners. And it's not always obvious whether someone will be good on the topic or dangerous, so public spaces and early detection of the baddies are friends.

    There are so many people in this world who don't deserve what they have: so many good people who are given the short end of the stick and so many bad people who take their blessings for granted or throw them away. It makes me so angry, I very much wish I had the power to change things, to protect innocents from victimization if nothing else.
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    Quote Originally Posted by turkishproverb View Post
    I am not getting into a shootout with Golentan. Too many gun-arms.
    Leiningen will win, even if he must lose in the attempt.

    Credit to Astrella for the new party avatar.

  9. - Top - End - #69
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by golentan View Post
    Actually, that may be a good metaphor. In both cases, it's something you should share before having sex with someone as a safety issue if nothing else (I mention this because there was a sad local story about a transwoman who didn't tell her boyfriend before their big night, and was murdered by him when he found out she was post operative later) but is nobody else's business unless you're going to be swapping fluids.
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    Jesus. I would completely ruin him and his ability to walk for that. And I'd only stop there because it'd be more potent to let the ****er stew for the rest of his life.


    Edit: Was hoping somebody else would've said something about cats by now, but whatever. I'm having a ****ty night.

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    Last edited by Jaycemonde; 2014-07-30 at 09:33 PM.
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaycemonde View Post
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    Jesus. I would completely ruin him and his ability to walk for that. And I'd only stop there because it'd be more potent to let the ****er stew for the rest of his life.
    I had a mentor a long time ago who told me the difference between heaven and hell is what you choose to do to yourself when you get there. Anyone willing to destroy something they professed to love shortly before for such a petty reason will, in time, ruin their life enough to forge a hell for themselves, and if they are redeemable enough to repent will have to live with the knowledge they destroyed their own happiness. That seems punishment enough. I'm satisfied with locking someone up where they can't hurt anyone but their fellow damned souls, and trying to redeem anyone you can in light of that worldview. But the existence of such people, and the knowledge that their victims have and will pay the price for someone else's stupidity, ignorance, and hate grates at me, and I wish I had some way to prevent that sort of hate from being unleashed in the first place.

    Sorry. I'm waxing a bit tonight.
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    My motto: Repensum Est Canicula.

    Quote Originally Posted by turkishproverb View Post
    I am not getting into a shootout with Golentan. Too many gun-arms.
    Leiningen will win, even if he must lose in the attempt.

    Credit to Astrella for the new party avatar.

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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    SO I actually tidied my room last night, and put away all my clothes for the first time in goodness knows how long.

    I have too many clothes. They don't really fit in my available storage space. And there was a large pile that went in the wash, so the problem's going to get worse when they come through.

    It sounds ridiculous, but it kinda makes me happy, because it's just such a girly problem to have!


    ...still don't know what I'm going to do about it though.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalirren View Post
    The only person in the past two pages who has known what (s)he has been talking about is Heliomance.
    Quote Originally Posted by golentan View Post
    I just don't want to have long romantic conversations or any sort of drama with my computer, okay? It knows what kind of porn I watch. I don't want to mess that up by allowing it to judge any of my choices in romance.

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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    *Sigh*
    Don't you love it when you think you have yourself figured out, and it turns out you're partway there at best? :(
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Asteron Questar View Post
    That's disgusting. Someone should introduce the author's skull with a hammer.
    Quote Originally Posted by Comrade View Post
    Yeah, let's not get too extreme here. Maybe just the fingers on their drawing hand so they can never produce something this insulting and witless again?
    I know I'm guilty of it too, but it's been asked that we not casually promote violence here in a Safe Space, as many of our former (and possibly current) members have experienced this form of judge mental aggression themselves.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lycunadari View Post
    IOON, I'm about to write a very difficult letter, the first step of a series of actions that hopefully help me heal from past trauma but might also wreck my family in the process. Can I have hugs?


    []
    Oh? Well, good luck. :)

    Quote Originally Posted by golentan View Post
    I'm in a rare moment of self confidence right now, so I want to share it with the world.

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    You know what? I deserve love. I am a nice, smart, occasionally funny person, and I deserve to find someone with the same qualities to share that with.

    Mind, nobody owes me love. This is not an entitlement thing. This is not nice guy syndrome in action, I don't expect anyone to throw themselves at me and sex me up just because I'm not an awful human being. If someone doesn't love me, it's nobody's fault and I'm not going to throw a tantrum or resent them for it: most people don't love me, most people are incompatible, and I don't want love from anyone, I want love from someone special who happens to feel the same way about me.

    But I'm actually feeling good about myself right now. I respect myself, and I know that love is one of the things I want from life. And someday, god willing, I will find a man or woman who is like minded and who also deserves love, and we will build something beautiful based on mutual respect and affection. And until then, I can respect and love myself, because I deserve it.

    So, future husband/wife, wherever you are, I hope we meet at a time when we both know what we are looking for, and with enough time left in our lives to really make the most of it. I'm willing to wait.
    Yup. All this. :)

    Quote Originally Posted by KenderWizard View Post
    In Kender News, I have two designs up for consideration on two different websites (a Thor Is A Woman Now design on Qwertee and a Geek Girl Solidarity Yeah design on We Love Fine, if anyone is interested / would be kind enough to look and consider voting for me) ... ... ... oh, and I got engaged to my long-time partner.
    Congrats!

    Quote Originally Posted by Marnath View Post
    I wonder if some people when they say they always knew, actually mean that they had the same feelings of being different that you did but they're just applying hindsight to that and sort of retroactively adding the rest of what they know to it?
    Yes and no. Say someone is 100% positive they should have been a girl. But that person doesn't know that trassexuality exists. They do know that homosexuals are classified as having traits of the other sex. This person may not call themselves transsexual. They may just think they are gay, or gender fluid, or just "off".

    If that person later finds out what transsexuality is and decides that it's a 110% perfect fit, and they felt transsexual all along, are they wrong? How can they feel something they don't even know exists? How much of it is rationalization? How much of it is fitting the label to the thing, versus the thing to the label?

    Does it matter?

    At 4 I was a little girl. At 10 I was fantasizing about being a girl. At 13 I couldn't take the stain anymore and decided that if I was stuck as a boy I had damn well better do a bang up job to earn karma for next time. At 25+ someone made a series of statements about sexuality, transsexuality and secondary sexual characteristics and I felt relieved to know I wasn't alone and that others had gotten help and it worked.

    I spent all my formative teenage years being as Masculine as possible and had all but forgotten crying to sleep over having a penis. Yes, I knew all along. No, I didn't know for a long time. Hell, I have some doubts even now, if only because beig considered female is so normal that the slight buzz of validation has worn off. The question seeks to condense an important facet of human life experience into something that cannot contain it. The answer to the question will be either too detailed or too simple, like a condensed computer file.

    Quote Originally Posted by Neo_Leviathan View Post
    *Sigh*
    Don't you love it when you think you have yourself figured out, and it turns out you're partway there at best? :(
    Care to talk about it, love?

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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by SiuiS View Post
    I know I'm guilty of it too, but it's been asked that we not casually promote violence here in a Safe Space, as many of our former (and possibly current) members have experienced this form of judge mental aggression themselves.
    Totally didn't think of that. I'll try and not do that again in the future!
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    I got a reply and it's more than I dared to hope for. I'm so happy I'm nearly crying.
    You can call me Juniper. Please use gender-neutral pronouns (ze/hir (preferred) or they/them) when referring to me.

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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Lycunadari View Post
    I got a reply and it's more than I dared to hope for. I'm so happy I'm nearly crying.
    Congratulations!
    Witty sig here nosey, aren't ya?

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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by KenderWizard View Post
    I know not of what you speak, but I am a bi woman.
    It's a movie. A horror movie, I suppose. With lesbian (or at least bi) protagonists.
    I quite enjoyed it, but I think there's a few problematic bits in it. I was hoping to get an idea from the people it directly relates to of whether the bad bits outweigh the good.
    Quote Originally Posted by KenderWizard View Post
    ...oh, and I got engaged to my long-time partner.
    Congratmutations

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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Lycunadari View Post
    I got a reply and it's more than I dared to hope for. I'm so happy I'm nearly crying.
    OMG that's awesome! Do you have any further details that you'd like to share?
    *Hugs if you would like them*
    So happy for you ^^

    Quote Originally Posted by SiuiS View Post
    Care to talk about it, love?
    Well, in a nutshell, I've been considering myself as gender fluid for a while, and trying to work out where to move forward with what I want to do and such from there but having a pretty reasonable idea.
    So I'm seeing a psychiatrist at the moment, referred by my GP before looking at hormones.
    I've now had two sessions with the psych, and she thinks that I've got more dysphoria than I'm letting myself admit, and if I really admit to myself what I daydream about and stuff... I'm starting to think/realise that I'm less "Gender fluid" and more "Transgirl with large family reasons why I can't go full girl" and.. yeah, it's kinda doing my head in with just not knowing what I should do from here and which way to go and stuff.
    Last edited by Kittenwolf; 2014-07-31 at 10:01 AM.
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    I have to wonder how often gender fluidity is actually a long-term thing, rather than just a phase people move through on their way to coming out as trans.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalirren View Post
    The only person in the past two pages who has known what (s)he has been talking about is Heliomance.
    Quote Originally Posted by golentan View Post
    I just don't want to have long romantic conversations or any sort of drama with my computer, okay? It knows what kind of porn I watch. I don't want to mess that up by allowing it to judge any of my choices in romance.

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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Heliomance View Post
    I have to wonder how often gender fluidity is actually a long-term thing, rather than just a phase people move through on their way to coming out as trans.
    I think people often discover new stuff about their identities over time. I know of quite a few binary trans people who found out that they weren't that binary when they were a while into their transition too as a sorta "counter-example".

    And like, dysphoria is hard to figure out, since it's talked about so little and it's like, it takes time to pin it down precisely.
    Last edited by Astrella; 2014-07-31 at 01:35 PM.
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Heliomance View Post
    I have to wonder how often gender fluidity is actually a long-term thing, rather than just a phase people move through on their way to coming out as trans.


    "It's just a phase! You'll get over it!"

    Where have I heard this before?

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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Jormengand View Post


    "It's just a phase! You'll get over it!"

    Where have I heard this before?
    I was idly speculating, not enforcing anything on anyone. Okay, so "phase" is a charged word, and I possibly could have chosen a better one. That doesn't change the fact that I identified as gender fluid on the way through to trans, Neo is apparently doing the same, and I'm sure I remember one or two other people in this thread who also did so. I'm recognising a pattern and speculating, that's all.

    On a different note, the topic in the Questions thread has just made me remember that in primary school, I was very annoyed that there wasn't an equivalent of "tomboy" for girly boys, except the very perjorative "cissy".
    Last edited by Heliomance; 2014-07-31 at 01:50 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalirren View Post
    The only person in the past two pages who has known what (s)he has been talking about is Heliomance.
    Quote Originally Posted by golentan View Post
    I just don't want to have long romantic conversations or any sort of drama with my computer, okay? It knows what kind of porn I watch. I don't want to mess that up by allowing it to judge any of my choices in romance.

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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Heliomance View Post
    I was idly speculating, not enforcing anything on anyone. Okay, so "phase" is a charged word, and I possibly could have chosen a better one. That doesn't change the fact that I identified as gender fluid on the way through to trans, Neo is apparently doing the same, and I'm sure I remember one or two other people in this thread who also did so. I'm recognising a pattern and speculating, that's all.
    I'd hazard a guess that relatively common, just like some gay people identify as bi before coming out. Of course, speculation on such things is probably better left to doctors, not a forum.

    In other news, some of you folks in this thread may be interested in seeing Paizo's latest iconic character for Pathfinder, Shardra Geltl, even if you're not generally into tabletop games.
    There was something here and in the avatar box, and there will eventually be again. I just need to figure out what I want...

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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Heliomance View Post
    I have to wonder how often gender fluidity is actually a long-term thing, rather than just a phase people move through on their way to coming out as trans.
    Probably about as often as people come out as bisexual only to later come out as gay. It happens, sure, but bisexual isn't a pit stop on the road to gaytown and it's not cool to assume that someone who says they're bi is gay.

    I know this is just speculation, I'm not trying to come down on you.
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    My motto: Repensum Est Canicula.

    Quote Originally Posted by turkishproverb View Post
    I am not getting into a shootout with Golentan. Too many gun-arms.
    Leiningen will win, even if he must lose in the attempt.

    Credit to Astrella for the new party avatar.

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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Ilorin Lorati View Post
    I'd hazard a guess that relatively common, just like some gay people identify as bi before coming out. Of course, speculation on such things is probably better left to doctors, not a forum.
    I very highly disagree with this, but I tend to distrust doctors with anything relating to gender or sex that isn't very specifically tied to the genitals themselves, like odd lumps or smelling funny. Too many trans, intersex and nonbinary people (sometimes all three rolled into one) have had bad experiences with doctors deciding who they are.
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    I will admit to having self IDed as bi for a few years before learning about asexuality (my thoughts were I felt to same toward both males and females so that must mean I was bi) more recently I have figured out I am a biromatic asexual, but I hadn't known about romantic orientations. I know someone who is a panromantic lesbian and was somewhat confused about her identity for a while. For both of us the bi 'phase' was a part of a bigger picture. For others they are completely bi or pan and that is great too.
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    It's not up to doctors to say what we should think of ourselves

    Still, it is true that at least some trans people identify as something else before finally understanding that they are trans. Not necessarily gender fluid though. I identified as "not having a gender category", so some kind of agender (I didn't know agender existed either until much later). Some FAAB trans people first identify as butch lesbians too. And so on.
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaycemonde View Post
    I very highly disagree with this, but I tend to distrust doctors with anything relating to gender or sex that isn't very specifically tied to the genitals themselves, like odd lumps or smelling funny. Too many trans, intersex and nonbinary people (sometimes all three rolled into one) have had bad experiences with doctors deciding who they are.
    I understand where you're coming from, but I'm not talking about practicing medical doctors that would be in a position of power like that, I'm talking about statistical researchers that can see a bigger picture over long periods. Data is important, it just needs to be used responsibly.
    Last edited by Ilorin Lorati; 2014-07-31 at 10:18 PM.
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Ilorin Lorati View Post
    I understand where you're coming from, but I'm not talking about practicing medical doctors that would be in a position of power like that, I'm talking about statistical researchers that can see a bigger picture over long periods. Data is important, it just needs to be used responsibly.
    However,
    1) A lot of clinical research is done by practicing doctors, so they are the same people.
    2) Knowledge and power depend on each other. cf. Foucault's work.
    Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul, ash nazg thrakatulûk agh burzum-ishi krimpatul.

  30. - Top - End - #90
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    Default Re: LGBTAI+ #52: Aces High

    Quote Originally Posted by Heliomance View Post
    I have to wonder how often gender fluidity is actually a long-term thing, rather than just a phase people move through on their way to coming out as trans.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jormengand View Post


    "It's just a phase! You'll get over it!"

    Where have I heard this before?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ilorin Lorati View Post
    I'd hazard a guess that relatively common, just like some gay people identify as bi before coming out. Of course, speculation on such things is probably better left to doctors, not a forum.
    When I first realized I'm attracted to women, I was engaged to a man. So ("naturally") I came out as bi. A year later - after breaking up with my fiance - I realized I'm not into men and came out as a lesbian. A friend good-naturally teased me that I "rode the Bi-Train to Gays-ville."

    I always found that phrase funny (though true, in my case).
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