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2015-07-08, 01:11 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2015
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Created an account to ask for your help and I am about to embark on a 5e journey! I read the guide and is very thorough, but I didn't see anything in regards to a Battle Cleric against the Undead.
I am wanting to make a Variant Human Str/Wis Cleric who is meant for battle, and feared by the Undead (kind of like a Cleric of Kelemvor). Please helps!
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2015-07-08, 05:28 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2010
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Ah, the classic anti-undead Cleric. Fortunately for you there are a lot of good builds for that type of character. Really your spell selection will be more important than most of the rest of your build.
For a Str/Wis Human you're looking at probably Life or War Domains. Heavy Armor + Shield + 1h weapon is probably advantageous, though for War a good Maul or Greatsword works as well.
In terms of spells, besides the general advise in the spell section of the thread there are a few flavorful choices. Detect Evil and Good and Protection from Evil and Good, while a lackluster spells overall, fit your concept and make you feel like a specialist. Lesser Restoration, and Remove Curse or Greater Restoration if you're high enough level, can counteract many of the worst things undead can bring to the table. If you're particularly high level Holy Aura is a must-prepare for this type of character. All of that being said, Clerics have a great spell list in general with healing, blasting, and support that makes them quite effective against the undead- and everything else they encounter.
Honestly, after taking all of the above into consideration, this is more about roleplaying than your character build overall. As I've said already- Clerics are a great class in general, so if you're roleplaying as "the guy who vocally hates undead" and playing a generally competent Cleric then you'll be remembered as the anti-undead Cleric.Avatar by the lovely and talented Ceika
The Devout and the Dead: a guide to 5e Clerics
5e MM Resistances Immunities Vulnerabilities and Damage
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2015-07-08, 10:56 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2015
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Thank you for the reply. I have definitely tailored my Cleric around your suggestions and think I have come up with a fairly solid Battle Cleric. Joining a group at level 2, so I will use your recommendations for the future.
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2015-07-09, 04:43 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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- The Netherlands
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Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
No it isn't. Dual wielder isn't a trap. With a fighting style you get one of the highest melee damage in the game and an AC point more. If you get more attacks you out-damage most builds.
Without an extra attack you do two damage more and you have one AC more.
With one extra attack, you do three damage more and you still have the AC.
And remember two weapon fighting is the best in-combat build if you don't have many attacks (one or two) like the cleric.
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2015-07-09, 05:04 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2014
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
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2015-07-18, 08:17 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2015
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Silly question for clarification, w/ 5e clerics: I just dont know all the spells of my appropriate level? I have a Wis of 18 (+4) and am level 3. The class chart says I have 4 level 1 and 2 level 2 spell slots. Do I know all the cleric spells, or do i have to choose from the list, then prep those?
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2015-07-18, 09:18 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2014
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2015-07-18, 12:24 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2010
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
This is correct. For example let's look at you as a third level Cleric with a Wis of 18. You know every spell on the Cleric list, but each morning you pick 7 spells (3 from level & 4 from wis-mod). Let's say you pick:
1. Cure Wounds
2. Bless
3. Healing Word
4. Guiding Bolt
5. Spiritual Weapon
6. Prayer of Healing
7. Silence
In addition you add your domain spells to the list for free. At this point you consult your class chart and you see that you have 4 first level spells per day and 2 second level slots. Each of the spells above can be cast using those slots. So in a day where you're needing to deal a lot of damage you might cast 3 guiding bolts, 1 healing word, 1 Spiritual Weapon, and 1 Guiding Bolt in a second level slot. On the other hand if that same day instead requires more healing focus you could cast 3 Cure Wounds, 1 Bless, and 2 Prayer of Healing. And, once again, you an change your prepared spell list each day.Avatar by the lovely and talented Ceika
The Devout and the Dead: a guide to 5e Clerics
5e MM Resistances Immunities Vulnerabilities and Damage
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2015-07-18, 07:22 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2015
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Thank you so much for the breakdown, this definitely helps me understand and plan accordingly :)
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2015-08-03, 01:08 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2015
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
In September I will play a 1st level cleric with the light domain for an AL Underdark campaign and I was wondering what you thought about race choice between Hill Dwarf, Wood Elf and Half-Elf. Under normal circumstances I would have used the variant human (as you suggested) but for an Underdark campaign I don't want to play a race without darkvision.
Last edited by Ogre Mage; 2015-08-03 at 01:08 AM.
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2015-08-03, 02:11 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2014
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2015-08-03, 06:33 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2010
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Hill Dwarf increases your survivability a fair amount and allows you to be the focused caster that Light Domain wants you to be. Wood Elf is runner up here since it opens up a bow build, but honestly Light Domain is the wrong Domain for that build. Half Elf would be your skill-monkey and/or party face option, but doesn't bring much to the table for Clerics.
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The Devout and the Dead: a guide to 5e Clerics
5e MM Resistances Immunities Vulnerabilities and Damage
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2015-08-04, 04:48 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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- The Netherlands
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Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Charisma saves are black, but they are with inteligence the least common, I think it's purple or red and not black.
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2015-09-21, 04:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2015
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Sorry for being late to the game here, but I feel like I'm missing something obvious with this build. I'm sure it's something with me just being dense. You use medium armor with this build, but I am not sure why you are not using heavy armor. Dwarves have no speed reduction for heavy armor and the Nature Domain grants a proficiency in heavy armor (unless I am misreading things). Is there a reason you are using medium armor? I read through the comments, but I didn't see anything about this unless I missed that as well. Thanks!
Last edited by tclayton; 2015-09-21 at 04:13 PM.
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2015-09-21, 11:02 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2010
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
In part it was me being mentally lazy and forgetting that Dwarves ignored armor penalties. In part it was just using an example that could easily have it's race changed without changing the build too much. But yes, technically you could do Heavy Armor in this build, but until you get access to Full Plate medium will probably be comparable or better.
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The Devout and the Dead: a guide to 5e Clerics
5e MM Resistances Immunities Vulnerabilities and Damage
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2015-09-22, 01:22 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2011
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- eberron
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Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
So another nice thing to note about splashing paladin is that you get a 9th level slot (not spells mind you) if you take it for the extra attack. I'm doing it on my light cleric (he is seriously filling every conceivable party role and owning at it) and let me tell you 20d6 damage on my scorching ray while also being able to bash face with a sword really well sounds good to me (probably will end up being 22d6 at end game because the book of exalted deeds has my name on it, and before you ask everyone is going to get something op as all get out)
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2015-09-22, 07:44 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2015
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2015-09-22, 08:01 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2010
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Avatar by the lovely and talented Ceika
The Devout and the Dead: a guide to 5e Clerics
5e MM Resistances Immunities Vulnerabilities and Damage
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And also 1 internet!
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2015-09-22, 12:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2010
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Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Level 7 is strong out of combat -- Plane Shift, Regenerate, Resurrect, Conjure Celestial (which I take to mean Couatl, who has vast out of combat utility). Planar Binding the Couatl is even better, but we've had various RAW/RAI threads about that challenge.
The Level 8/9 spells, however, seem a lot less versatile than their arcane counterparts, or Shapechange. I'd agree that Level 6 is meh as well.
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2015-09-22, 01:18 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2012
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- Saint Louis
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Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
I wanted to share a build that I've played a couple times that is a bit weird.
Human Variant (or goliath) Life Cleric + Tavern brawler (+rogue for expertise). Essentially you hit people with weird religious stuff and then grapple them. You then run away from the group*. With prof, decent str, and expertise the creature isn't getting away. Plus you can heal yourself so you essentially take a creature out of the fight against your allies. Mostly works at lower levels but with Mage slayer I've seen some positive results.
I'll post a build at some point. It may or may not have barbarian levels too.
Edit:* while still grappling enemy.Last edited by TopCheese; 2015-09-22 at 01:23 PM.
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2015-09-22, 01:45 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2014
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
I'm not sure how being a cleric is helping with your grapple build. Also the grapple feat's pinning ability is worse than simply grappling and shoving them prone. Someone has a grapple guide out there that breaks it down. If you're dipping rogue and barbarain that's a rather hefty loss of spell slots.
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2015-09-22, 02:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2012
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- Saint Louis
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Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
They can wail on me all they like, I can heal myself until the cows come home.
Also freedom of movement allows me to ignore difficult terrain and be able to escape the grapple IF I end up grappling something I shouldn't (and it grapples me back). Plus cleric gives me heavy armor.
Sacred Flame is also nice, pinning gives disadvantage to dex saves while prone does not. I may be strength based but that doesn't mean I'll have a great weapon attack. Plus others can target the creature with ranged attacks and not take disadvantage.
It isn't so much +omg great grapple build+ so much as +good grapple build that is FUN+
:)
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2015-09-27, 02:15 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2015
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Just wanting your opinion, I'm rolling a level 1 cleric to replace my unfortunately deceased fighter. The rest of the party is level 2 now and the entire adventure seems likely to take place in the underdark. That said, I was looking towards a tempest cleric, but my party (not the dm) is trying to talk me into the life or war domain on the basis that weather spells, especially call lightning, will be next to useless in the underdark. Do you think it might be a gamble to use tempest in this setting?
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2015-09-27, 04:07 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2012
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- Saint Louis
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Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
You are bringing weather to a new area and showing them what they are missing out.
I'm not sure how many spells do worse in doors/underground... Call Lightning does extra damage when done in a storm. Call Lightning needs room to be but I don't think it really matters if you are outdoors or in a huge cave. You really only need a 60' radius 100' above you either you are outdoors or inside.
Nothing else comes to mind really.
Perhaps your tempest cleric is in the underdark wanting to learn about the environment down there?
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2015-09-27, 07:43 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2010
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Well, fortunately for you the "weather" spells don't come online until later in the build, and are not crucial to your success as a Cleric anyway. At level one you're getting Thunderwave and Fog Cloud, both of which work great underground. In fact, other than Call Lightning there are very few space constraints you can't work around. And again- nothing says you have to cast Call Lightning. It's really kind of mediocre for a blasting spell unless you're really needing to conserve spell slots, and even then your Sacred Flame (which if your DM is generous can be re-flavored to Divine Bolt or something) will catch up to it in damage. So I'd say that if you're really feeling a Tempest Cleric, go for it. Most people are hung up on Life and War because those are more "popular" domains, but they are by no means universally the most effective.
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The Devout and the Dead: a guide to 5e Clerics
5e MM Resistances Immunities Vulnerabilities and Damage
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2015-09-29, 11:21 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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- Texas
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Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Tempest Cleric here, and it's got plenty of flexibility. The "other" third level domain spell isn't too bad at slowing down a load of bad guys. Call Lightning is OK IF you make the concentration checks along the way and keep raining down bolts on the foe. If you miss that first concentration check, arrgh. I"ve had it work both ways.
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2015-09-29, 12:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2012
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- Saint Louis
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Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Though Sleet Storm is better in the Sorcerer (careful spell) I've found that the cleric can use it to great effect.
I'm a big fan of using it as an area denial spell rather than dropping it specifically on an enemy to make them fall/lose concentration). One or two rounds of them trying to figure out a way around the area is another one or two rounds my allies are safe.
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2015-10-10, 02:14 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2015
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
For Divine Intervention I've always liked a spell from the domain's list one level above the casters current level (If applicable to the fight.) But that's advice to GMs not to the Clerics, hah.
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2015-10-10, 08:14 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2010
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
Avatar by the lovely and talented Ceika
The Devout and the Dead: a guide to 5e Clerics
5e MM Resistances Immunities Vulnerabilities and Damage
Two Cookies Received!
And also 1 internet!
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2015-10-15, 11:51 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2010
Re: The Devout and the Dead: a guide to Clerics
I've updated the guide!
I was looking at Bard builds today and noticed how Life Cleric 1/Lore Bard 19 is a freaking amazing support build. Inspired by that, I decided to add a brief section at the end of the guide on using Cleric dips in other builds. Feel free to chime in with your thoughts on what should/shouldn't be in that section. Most of it is, unfortunately, theorycraft. I'd love to hear from anyone that's actually played a Cleric/Monk or a Cleric/Sorcerer, for example, to see how it turned out.Avatar by the lovely and talented Ceika
The Devout and the Dead: a guide to 5e Clerics
5e MM Resistances Immunities Vulnerabilities and Damage
Two Cookies Received!
And also 1 internet!