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  1. - Top - End - #481
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

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    Huh.

    Now why would the Great Minds be withholding that sort of information from Parson? While I can think of a few possible explanations, only one of them seems likely and satisfying in any measure to me - that being that they intend to use Parson to defeat Charlie, but afterwards turn against Gobwin Knob and dismantle Stanley and/or Wanda as well. Scary.

    The interactions between Parson and Maggie when they are not talking about secrets and strategies, on the other hand, are as charming, adorable and a little bit sad as always.
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  2. - Top - End - #482
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Something just twigged after reading this update:

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    Has it ever been commented on just how similar Archons are to Decrypted units when it comes to how they view their, for the lack of a better word, masters? It probably has but since I don't religiously read these threads, I don't recall it coming up before.

    It was the thinkamancy link that made me realize what was probably blidingly obvious to others (in that they are very similar). Makes me wonder if the thinkamancy link is what causes that love/obsession/whatever.

    Perhaps not completely as the decrypted Archons still had feelings for Charlie, IIRC. But I do wonder if that is a large part of it.
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  3. - Top - End - #483
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by Porthos View Post
    Something just twigged after reading this update:

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    Has it ever been commented on just how similar Archons are to Decrypted units when it comes to how they view their, for the lack of a better word, masters? It probably has but since I don't religiously read these threads, I don't recall it coming up before.

    It was the thinkamancy link that made me realize what was probably blidingly obvious to others (in that they are very similar). Makes me wonder if the thinkamancy link is what causes that love/obsession/whatever.

    Perhaps not completely as the decrypted Archons still had feelings for Charlie, IIRC. But I do wonder if that is a large part of it.
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    Well, it's clear in any case that something about Arkentools makes the units linked to them - dwagons for the 'hammer, Archons for the 'dish, Decrypted for the 'pliers - (almost) unerringly loyal to the person attuned to the respective tool. Whether that's the thinkamancy strings Maggie is talking about in the latest update or not is probably of minor importance - severing that thinkamancy, if she is right, would destroy the attunement, thus ending the blind loyalty regardless of which magical effect of the 'tools exactly is causing it (though, as you say, some affection may remain).

    I find it curious that the Arkenshoes seem to not have had any type of unit tied to it - that's unique amongst the 'tools we know about thus far. Maybe there was such a unit type, and Judy just never found out what those were and how to tame or create them...
    Last edited by Winterwind; 2014-11-25 at 05:23 AM.
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  4. - Top - End - #484
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

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    I think the Arkenhammer might be a little different than the Pliers and Dish. It tames Dwagons rather than is involved in their creation. So it may as less vulnerable to have it's powers turned off. We actually already knew that the Dycrpted could break away as we saw it in Book 2. Wanda is actually aware of the fact as well.

    Wild Speculation I wonder if the person that is going to get the Arkenshoes is Jillian?
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  5. - Top - End - #485
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by HandofShadows View Post
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    I think the Arkenhammer might be a little different than the Pliers and Dish. It tames Dwagons rather than is involved in their creation. So it may as less vulnerable to have it's powers turned off. We actually already knew that the Dycrpted could break away as we saw it in Book 2. Wanda is actually aware of the fact as well.

    Wild Speculation I wonder if the person that is going to get the Arkenshoes is Jillian?
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    The Arkenshoes are, as far as we know, gone from Erfworld. Overlady Judy clicked her heels and went home.
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  6. - Top - End - #486
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by Landis963 View Post
    Spoiler: The Arkenshoes
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    The Arkenshoes are, as far as we know, gone from Erfworld. Overlady Judy clicked her heels and went home.
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    But did they STAY there though? Think a moment to the spell that could send Parson home. The only thing it does is break the Ultimate Warlord Spell keeping Parson in Erfworld. After the shoes took Judy home, they may have been forced to return to Erfworld. Of maybe Judy figured out a way to send them back. It's just a wild guess though. :)
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  7. - Top - End - #487
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by HandofShadows View Post
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    But did they STAY there though? Think a moment to the spell that could send Parson home. The only thing it does is break the Ultimate Warlord Spell keeping Parson in Erfworld. After the shoes took Judy home, they may have been forced to return to Erfworld. Of maybe Judy figured out a way to send them back. It's just a wild guess though. :)
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    Well, in the actual Wizard of Oz books, the shoes slipped off Dorothy's feet while transporting her back home - which did not interrupt her being transported back home, mind - and dropped down to Oz again (or more accurately, into the Deadly Desert). I would be immensely surprised if anything happened that was not Judy losing the Arkenshoes while returning home, with the 'shoes themselves returning to Erfworld.
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  8. - Top - End - #488
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by Landis963 View Post
    Spoiler: The Arkenshoes
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    The Arkenshoes are, as far as we know, gone from Erfworld. Overlady Judy clicked her heels and went home.
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    It seems plausible that the shoes remain somewhere on Erfworld though.

    They're probably associated with munchkins or something similar.

  9. - Top - End - #489
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    The magic to break the link would be turnamancy wouldn't it? Maybe it wasn't Jillian that Charlie was mainly interested in protecting?
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  10. - Top - End - #490
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by Winterwind View Post
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    Well, in the actual Wizard of Oz books, the shoes slipped off Dorothy's feet while transporting her back home - which did not interrupt her being transported back home, mind - and dropped down to Oz again (or more accurately, into the Deadly Desert). I would be immensely surprised if anything happened that was not Judy losing the Arkenshoes while returning home, with the 'shoes themselves returning to Erfworld.
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    Ok, I DID remember that correctly then. Wasn't sure about the shoes dropping off when Dororthy went back home.
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  11. - Top - End - #491
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by Winterwind View Post
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    Huh.

    Now why would the Great Minds be withholding that sort of information from Parson? While I can think of a few possible explanations, only one of them seems likely and satisfying in any measure to me - that being that they intend to use Parson to defeat Charlie, but afterwards turn against Gobwin Knob and dismantle Stanley and/or Wanda as well. Scary.

    The interactions between Parson and Maggie when they are not talking about secrets and strategies, on the other hand, are as charming, adorable and a little bit sad as always.
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    The Thinkamancers probably judged that the information wasn't actionable, and revealed too much about how Thinkamancy works to be worth it. It's also possible that only Maggie knows about how the links can be severed, and that the information she claims the Thinkamancers are keeping from him is how Thinkamancy itself works, which we've already established they do so they have a trick up their sleeve at all times.
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  12. - Top - End - #492
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by HandofShadows View Post
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    I think the Arkenhammer might be a little different than the Pliers and Dish. It tames Dwagons rather than is involved in their creation. So it may as less vulnerable to have it's powers turned off. We actually already knew that the Dycrpted could break away as we saw it in Book 2. Wanda is actually aware of the fact as well.

    Wild Speculation I wonder if the person that is going to get the Arkenshoes is Jillian?
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    I hope Jillian doesn't end up with them. I don't want to see what she would even try to do with unlimited move. I believe the shoes do not bestow their effect on any other unit besides the wearer, right? Cause if it did and she decided to stack up some gwiffons and go after Ansom...

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  13. - Top - End - #493
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by Lentrax View Post
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    I hope Jillian doesn't end up with them. I don't want to see what she would even try to do with unlimited move. I believe the shoes do not bestow their effect on any other unit besides the wearer, right? Cause if it did and she decided to stack up some gwiffons and go after Ansom...
    Spoiler: arkenshoes
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    the effects of an attuned arkentool are exceptional and beyond the standard level of power... so (for the shoes) they could easily apply to the whole stack the wearer is in. We don't know.
    Last edited by Killer Angel; 2014-11-25 at 02:36 PM.
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  14. - Top - End - #494
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by tomaO2 View Post
    The hobs and gobwins committed the regicide. Stanley was simply the one that benefited when he made them become allied again. There is still plausible deniability that Stan was the cause of the whole thing though. Even Sizemore didn't outright state that he believed that Stanley was the cause of Saline's death. Having it confirmed will almost certainly cause ripple effects, or else why have this set up to begin with?

    It might not be other nations either. Maybe Charlie messages Sizemore and this bit of info becomes the last straw and causes him to defect. He really hates his kingdom right now, so I could see him being pushed into turning traitor.
    They may go for the theme of mind control. Very early in the summer updates there was update with Vurp and Parson and it ended with Vurp feeling loyalty for Parson. Charley can and does ruthless use his thinkamancy to alter people's loyalties and mind. Parson does inspire people to follow him out of their own decision. Maybe they will find out if loyalty and trust are simple stats or if they are more. And from Vurp's last look he seems to have regrets about the change of alliance.

    For Sizemore is may mean something, but I think he already guessed it. And he doesn't really have anywhere to go; Gobwin Knob is his home and even in the Magic Kingdom Janis wants him to stay with Parson.

    Quote Originally Posted by HandofShadows View Post
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    But did they STAY there though? Think a moment to the spell that could send Parson home. The only thing it does is break the Ultimate Warlord Spell keeping Parson in Erfworld. After the shoes took Judy home, they may have been forced to return to Erfworld. Of maybe Judy figured out a way to send them back. It's just a wild guess though. :)

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    I think they are still in Earthworld. This would mean that only Parson is able to bring them back with the carnymancy scroll. Maybe he will attune and bring them back.
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  15. - Top - End - #495
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    One common theory I've seen with the Arkenshoes is that Parson will use the scroll to go back to earth, find the Arkenshoes, and use them to return to Erfworld, which he now considers his "home."

  16. - Top - End - #496
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by Killer Angel View Post
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    the effects of an attuned arkentool are exceptional and beyond the standard level of power... so (for the shoes) they could easily apply to the whole stack the wearer is in. We don't know.
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    That doesn't actually like much of an upgrade though. Lone assassin to strike team is nice, but not a terrible game changer. Maybe with mastery you can move all forces under your command in the hex? Teleporting an army seems about on par with decryption. Requiring some preparation to maximize effectiveness, but a total game breaker once the conditions are fulfilled. And like decryption, the set up is fragile enough to lose everything if you get careless.


    Quote Originally Posted by Sweetie Welf View Post
    They may go for the theme of mind control. Very early in the summer updates there was update with Vurp and Parson and it ended with Vurp feeling loyalty for Parson. Charley can and does ruthless use his thinkamancy to alter people's loyalties and mind.
    True, but that's hardly something he has a monopoly on. Every turnamancer trades in at least the former, and pretty much every Ruler whether they like it or not uses some form of mind control. Point being, it was already essentially a part of the story, merely one of a dozen subsystems that keep everyone in line.

    Quote Originally Posted by Winterwind View Post
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    Well, in the actual Wizard of Oz books, the shoes slipped off Dorothy's feet while transporting her back home - which did not interrupt her being transported back home, mind - and dropped down to Oz again (or more accurately, into the Deadly Desert). I would be immensely surprised if anything happened that was not Judy losing the Arkenshoes while returning home, with the 'shoes themselves returning to Erfworld.
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    Agreed. Between the literary allusion and the fact we know now it takes a magical effect for Parson merely to stay in Erfworld, it seems pretty likely we'll be seeing the shoes showing up in Erfworld again. Another attuned side entering the conflict at some point feels right, considering the widening scope book 3 has. Once this war spreads far enough, I imagine we'll be seeing Digdoug again. Someone is trying to defeat Charlie? Why yes we'd love to ally with Gobwin Knob.


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    Look Maggie, this is all very well and entertaining...but this is still too subtle. That fact that you gave him copious amounts of alcohol also seems to working at cross purposes here.

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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Spoiler: With regards to the flashback panel
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    So Parson has heard of Death Note, or at least his shirt has. The manga was originally serialized in 2003-2006, and the anime broadcast 2006-2007 (and as I remember it, the manga was pretty obscure in America before the anime got popular). When exactly did Erfworld start, again? And does that make the reference at least somewhat anachronistic?

  18. - Top - End - #498
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by EnragedFilia View Post
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    So Parson has heard of Death Note, or at least his shirt has. The manga was originally serialized in 2003-2006, and the anime broadcast 2006-2007 (and as I remember it, the manga was pretty obscure in America before the anime got popular). When exactly did Erfworld start, again? And does that make the reference at least somewhat anachronistic?
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    Parson got sent to Erfworld in the present day, minus however long he's been in Erfworld. Otherwise his earlier references to more recent Internet memes would be anachronistic.

  19. - Top - End - #499
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by EnragedFilia View Post
    Spoiler: With regards to the flashback panel
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    So Parson has heard of Death Note, or at least his shirt has. The manga was originally serialized in 2003-2006, and the anime broadcast 2006-2007 (and as I remember it, the manga was pretty obscure in America before the anime got popular). When exactly did Erfworld start, again? And does that make the reference at least somewhat anachronistic?
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    I suspect the Earthworld he left is stuck in Comic Book Time™, and thus will always have some slightly-out-of-date references and such.

    That said, Erfworld was somewhere in the middle of Book 1 when I joined in late 2007, IIRC.

  20. - Top - End - #500
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    It's past 24 hours so stripping spoiler bars...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mando Knight View Post
    I suspect the Earthworld he left is stuck in Comic Book Time™, and thus will always have some slightly-out-of-date references and such.

    That said, Erfworld was somewhere in the middle of Book 1 when I joined in late 2007, IIRC.
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Calling it now.

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    Parson break's charlie's attunement with the dish, causing the Archons to revert to their true master, who just happens to be "The only enemy worth fighting" thus killing off Charlie, wand "TOEWF" will be very hostile to Gobwin Knob and really most of the world. This is what causes Wanda to break with Parson, as she considers being attuned to the Pliers fated and thus Parson is going against Fate by breaking attunements.

    Incoming addition to it as a joke

    TOEWF it is an Elvis Impersonator(Titan)..who is trying to get his Satellite Dish, his hammer his pliers and his slippers so he can watch the super bowl.
    Last edited by ryuplaneswalker; 2014-11-26 at 08:58 AM.

  22. - Top - End - #502
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Aaaaand the schedule breaks, with multiple excuses. (Oddly, comics like Penny Arcade, Unsounded, Gunnerkrigg, etc all had no difficulty posting updates today.)

    This indicates that there is exactly zero buffer for text updates, illustrated text updates, or full comic pages. It was my assumption that having a full-time paid art team (David plus unnamed minions) would avoid having this problem recur. I wonder how long before he starts to blame the artist again for delays?

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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    I count 13 comic/text/hybrid updates in the past month, and about the same number the month before. That's been plenty to maintain my interest. Actually, I just went back and read some of the old text stuff that I'd never gotten around to, so my interest in Erfworld is higher than it's been in a while.

    Mostly unrelated, and at the risk of kicking a hornet's nest: after going through Book 0, my appreciation of Jillian as a character has increased.

  24. - Top - End - #504
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by Bird View Post
    Mostly unrelated, and at the risk of kicking a hornet's nest: after going through Book 0, my appreciation of Jillian as a character has increased.
    It at least manages to make her later behaviour a whole lot more understandable and forgiveable. She may not have been the sharpest before, either, but I am willing to cut somebody a hell of a lot more slack knowing that they have been
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    subjected to terrible mental torture, made addicted to gruesome mind-influencing drugs, and then had whole pieces of their mind and soul ripped to shreds.
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  25. - Top - End - #505
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by Bird View Post
    Mostly unrelated, and at the risk of kicking a hornet's nest: after going through Book 0, my appreciation of Jillian as a character has increased.
    That's not surprising; she's at her most sympathetic in book 0.

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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by Winterwind View Post
    It at least manages to make her later behaviour a whole lot more understandable and forgiveable. She may not have been the sharpest before, either, but I am willing to cut somebody a hell of a lot more slack knowing that they have been
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    subjected to terrible mental torture, made addicted to gruesome mind-influencing drugs, and then had whole pieces of their mind and soul ripped to shreds.
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    Aye, though for me, it was more the treatment she endured at the hands of FAQ's court than anything that Wanda or Olive or Charlie put her through. The court's attitude towards Jillian was so massively, senselessly dysfunctional (rescue attempt notwithstanding) that it really textures Jillian's...ah...complicated relationship towards loyalty and duty.

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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by ryuplaneswalker View Post
    Calling it now.

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    Parson break's charlie's attunement with the dish, causing the Archons to revert to their true master, who just happens to be "The only enemy worth fighting" thus killing off Charlie, wand "TOEWF" will be very hostile to Gobwin Knob and really most of the world. This is what causes Wanda to break with Parson, as she considers being attuned to the Pliers fated and thus Parson is going against Fate by breaking attunements.

    Incoming addition to it as a joke

    TOEWF it is an Elvis Impersonator(Titan)..who is trying to get his Satellite Dish, his hammer his pliers and his slippers so he can watch the super bowl.
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    Oh dear god it's going to be Elvis Presto


    You know, I never got the "Sofa King is Sofa-King finished" joke until I saw it explained on the wikipedia page right now
    Last edited by Kornaki; 2014-11-29 at 03:36 AM.

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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Just started trying to read again and wow is the new website unfriendly to new and returning readers. I had to navigate through each individual comic back to the beginning of Book 3 and I still haven't found what hoops I have to jump through in order to access Book 2 to pick up from where I left off.
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  29. - Top - End - #509
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by Coidzor View Post
    new website unfriendly ... I had to navigate
    through each individual comic back to the beginning of Book 3
    There are some big links at the top of the startpage, like "Book 0" .. "Book 3",
    which lead to the start of these books.

    Also, the wiki has Plot Summary and Descriptive Table of Contents.
    Last edited by hajo; 2014-11-29 at 05:26 AM.
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  30. - Top - End - #510
    Titan in the Playground
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    Default Re: Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

    Quote Originally Posted by Coidzor View Post
    Just started trying to read again and wow is the new website unfriendly to new and returning readers. I had to navigate through each individual comic back to the beginning of Book 3 and I still haven't found what hoops I have to jump through in order to access Book 2 to pick up from where I left off.
    You clicked on the "Comic" button, didn't you?

    Yeah, that's the part where this website design is confusing; if you want to read the comic in a comfortable and easy to navigate fashion, you are basically supposed to avoid the Comic-button like the plague. Just click on the big Erfworld button (of which Comic is a subregister) itself, and it will take you to a page where you can access any individual comic you want straight away, with big links towards any Book you want (which then lead you to a neat overview of all the pages to easily find the one you need).
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