Legend of Korra, Book 4: Too Graphic for TV

[Reverent-One]

I don't see how his assersions are unfounded.

I'd like to see where his claim that bending brings only suffering and is the cause of all wars is supported. I'd also like to see the non-bender oppression from the government that he railed against.

[cobaltstarfire]

This episode was really bland and Tenzins kids have grown to be extremely annoying....

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I can see what they were trying to do somewhat.

It feels like to me that Korra needed to learn how to be mindful and to have compassion for herself, and that others do still care for her and things. On top of needing to understand and let go of her problems with her past enemies.

But everything that went on in this episode could have been compressed, and made room for more indepth story telling for Korra, or to move the story along.

[Morty]

This episode was really bland and Tenzins kids have grown to be extremely annoying....

Spoiler: Ep4

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I can see what they were trying to do somewhat.

It feels like to me that Korra needed to learn how to be mindful and to have compassion for herself, and that others do still care for her and things. On top of needing to understand and let go of her problems with her past enemies.

But everything that went on in this episode could have been compressed, and made room for more indepth story telling for Korra, or to move the story along.

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The writers seem to be under the impression that we find the antics of Tenzin's kids amusing or endearing.

As far as Amon goes, this discussion misses the point, apart from having been done to death - of course Amon was a monster who did monstrous things to people. But the show has just basically equated him with Unalok as a man who was nuts, but had a point somewhere in there. And yet, while Korra was willing to go through with Unalok's plans for a while, and then saw his point of view right at the end, she didn't stop for a second to consider where the Equalists - not just Amon - are coming from. That's jarring.

[Reverent-One]

As far as Amon goes, this discussion misses the point, apart from having been done to death - of course Amon was a monster who did monstrous things to people. But the show has just basically equated him with Unalok as a man who was nuts, but had a point somewhere in there. And yet, while Korra was willing to go through with Unalok's plans for a while, and then saw his point of view right at the end, she didn't stop for a second to consider where the Equalists - not just Amon - are coming from. That's jarring.

Clearly Hyena disagrees about how obvious it is that Amon is so monstrous.

But still, Korra didn't really stop to consider that Unalok could have a point until AFTER she defeated him, that same point for Amon falls into the writer-admitted equalist aftermath gap. And like I said, they clearly thought that Amon had a partial point too, and took action based on this. So there's not really a difference in the response between the two other than it's presentation to us.

[Kd7sov]

I'd like to see where his claim that bending brings only suffering and is the cause of all wars is supported. I'd also like to see the non-bender oppression from the government that he railed against.

That oppression showed up just fine: when Tarrlok was doing his extraordinary-measures thing and imposed a nonbender curfew. Indeed, I'm still not entirely convinced he wasn't doing it specifically to give the Equalists ammunition.

[Reverent-One]

That oppression showed up just fine: when Tarrlok was doing his extraordinary-measures thing and imposed a nonbender curfew. Indeed, I'm still not entirely convinced he wasn't doing it specifically to give the Equalists ammunition.

You mean the thing that happened after Amon started talking about the supposed oppression? That doesn't actually help his argument that much, since his terrorist actions caused it.

[Hyena]

Yes, I don't thnik that things Amon did were monstrous, but I can't talk about it further, because that would violate forum rules, so let's move on.

[Morty]

Does anyone know how many episodes this season will have?

[Kd7sov]

You mean the thing that happened after Amon started talking about the supposed oppression? That doesn't actually help his argument that much, since his terrorist actions caused it.

Yes, that's exactly the thing I mean. Which is why I suspected (and still do somewhat) that it was done to increase Amon's credibility.

[Ramza00]

Why, after 3 friggin' seasons, does this show still insist on playing Family Ties with the boring Tenzin family?!?! Didn't we have enough of that for the 1st 3 seasons?
I don't mind the teenage winged squirrel airbending team, but Tenzin's children are juuuust short of being interesting teenage adventurers. They are not relevant. Why must we deal with them when we have ready-made teenage protag airbenders fostered from season 3?

Because to Korra, Tenzin's kids are like the siblings she never had (remember Korra is an only child). Tenzin is not just a mentor but also a spiritual uncle and same thing with Pema being an emotional aunt. Korra's real uncle had a few screws loose and tried to kill her multiple times.

Korra returning to her family by her family finding her is in some ways the same message of Korra finding herself after facing her fears. She is Korra again instead of lost in the wilderness watertribe girl being chased by memories of villains and her fears of being the avatar.

That said we only needed 2/3rds of the Tenzin kids and the last 1/3rd just got old. And Meelo's bushy eyebrows really bother me. No even adult Tenzin and Bumi have that thick of eyebrows.

I don't see how loss of a superpower is a permament harm.

What you call superpower I call crucial to their identity, they see it as part of who they are and when suddenly it is missing the experience depression worse than melancholy.

Furthermore in real life your thumbs are superpowers. Do you really need thumbs? Most animals do just fine without thumbs. You can still grasp things without thumbs it is just a lot harder too, thumbs are something that makes you superior to others and thus unequal.

Channels Steve Blum

The era of thumbs are over, the era of equality has begun.

[Metahuman1]

Do you really need your ability to do math? Most creatures on this earth have at absolute best the barest possible concept of numbers, let alone mathematics. We should do a lobotomy for you to equalize you with all those life forms that don't bother with math.


And you, Mozart! You need one too, your too good at music, makes you unequal!

Same with you and public speaking Abraham Lincon!

Goes for you and personal level combat tactics Miyamoto Mushashi!

And you with the science Issac Newton!

You all need lombotomy's to be equalize! After all, no one could argue the world wouldn't be better with out more people like these people!








Seriously, Amon's position was always garbage, he got sympathy by being charismatic and tieing into a message of "Your problems are there fault not yours!" which has historically sold well to large groups of people once you get them running on more emotion the logic.

[LaZodiac]

My two cents: I liked this week's episode. It was cute and, though I do like darker stories, it was nice to get a break from "and then Korra continues her downward spiral into putting a bullet in her head". Over all it was a good episode.

[Seerow]

My two cents: I liked this week's episode. It was cute and, though I do like darker stories, it was nice to get a break from "and then Korra continues her downward spiral into putting a bullet in her head". Over all it was a good episode.

I'd agree with this if I could exorcise Meelo from my memory.

[AdmiralCheez]

I'd agree with this if I could exorcise Meelo from my memory.

Same here. Decent episode, but brought down overall by the presence of the annoying one. Hopefully now that they've found Korra, they can take him back out of the story and leave him there.

I do have to wonder if there's anyone out there that actually likes Meelo's antics, aside from the writers. The overall impression I've gotten is vastly negative.

[LaZodiac]

Same here. Decent episode, but brought down overall by the presence of the annoying one. Hopefully now that they've found Korra, they can take him back out of the story and leave him there.

I do have to wonder if there's anyone out there that actually likes Meelo's antics, aside from the writers. The overall impression I've gotten is vastly negative.

I thought some of it was kind of cute. Like

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his being a good artist and his silly childhood girlfriend.

[AdmiralCheez]

I thought some of it was kind of cute. Like

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his being a good artist and his silly childhood girlfriend.

Okay, I'll give you that. Those were pretty good moments. It's just a shame that those two highlights got overshadowed by annoyances; so much so that I almost completely forgot them.

[Metahuman1]

I've seen worse in real life form 6-8 year old boys so, not a big deal for me.

And Ikki was actually enjoyable this time around.

And hey, Janora even got a funny one liner in.

[MLai]

Meelo is the result of Tweedle-Dee and Tweedle-Dum trying and failing to recreate a success from ATLA, namely the likeable bald kid doing kid things. Same with the unintended Zutara. When they actually try to recreate it intentionally, it fails on all accounts.

[GenericMook]

Seriously, Amon's position was always garbage, he got sympathy by being charismatic and tieing into a message of "Your problems are there fault not yours!" which has historically sold well to large groups of people once you get them running on more emotion the logic.

Not really?

It's pretty standard "minority ruling class vs. majority working class" rhetoric that shows up a lot in history. I'm not saying it's truly right in this context, but there are points of contention.

For starters, the Republic City council was made up of what, four benders and one non-bender? That puts non-benders, who are more or less everywhere, into getting one fifth of representation in policymaking. And then you have jobs. Anything a non-bender can do, a bender can do better. Police? Nope, got metalbending dudes from zeppelins. Lightning benders (while admittedly rare) can handle power generation, as opposed to good ol' fashioned power plants.

And keep in mind that these opportunities are denied to them because they weren't born with fancy powers. That's the logic that Amon uses to push his campaign. He does skew things a lot, but the fundamentals of his arguments aren't incorrect.

[Morty]

Because to Korra, Tenzin's kids are like the siblings she never had (remember Korra is an only child). Tenzin is not just a mentor but also a spiritual uncle and same thing with Pema being an emotional aunt. Korra's real uncle had a few screws loose and tried to kill her multiple times.

Korra returning to her family by her family finding her is in some ways the same message of Korra finding herself after facing her fears. She is Korra again instead of lost in the wilderness watertribe girl being chased by memories of villains and her fears of being the avatar.

That said we only needed 2/3rds of the Tenzin kids and the last 1/3rd just got old. And Meelo's bushy eyebrows really bother me. No even adult Tenzin and Bumi have that thick of eyebrows.

In theory, yes, that works. In practice, though, the airbender kids just don't evoke any emotions beyond occasional irritation, to me. Meelo is the worst of the lot in that he's actively annoying. Ikki and Jinora just aren't engaging as characters, and their sibling drama is hard to care about.

[MLai]

In theory, yes, that works. In practice, though, the airbender kids just don't evoke any emotions beyond occasional irritation, to me. Meelo is the worst of the lot in that he's actively annoying. Ikki and Jinora just aren't engaging as characters, and their sibling drama is hard to care about.

The writers must've thought that Lucas' TPM was worthy of emulation: Make you not-for-kids story kid-friendly by adding in annoying kids! Now your story will be loved by both kids and adults, win win!
Pro tip: Never copy anything Old Lucas does. None of them.

[Reverent-One]

I do have to wonder if there's anyone out there that actually likes Meelo's antics, aside from the writers. The overall impression I've gotten is vastly negative.

My girlfriend's up through the first two seasons of Korra and she thinks the airbender kids are cute, with Meelo being her favorite. So they exist.

[AdmiralCheez]

My girlfriend's up through the first two seasons of Korra and she thinks the airbender kids are cute, with Meelo being her favorite. So they exist.

Up through season two I can see. I wonder if she'll still feel that way after he becomes all militaristic and tries to lead an army. That's the point where he went from "mildly annoying, fun kid stuff" to "this got old real quick" for me.

[LibraryOgre]

I've seen worse in real life form 6-8 year old boys so, not a big deal for me.

And Ikki was actually enjoyable this time around.

And hey, Janora even got a funny one liner in.

Heck, Ikki got personality development beyond "The girl who isn't Jinora", which was good. She's empathetic and clever. Meelo is a bit swaggering in his machismo but, like Metahuman says, he's a young boy... I've seen this stuff all the time.

[Hyena]

Heck, Ikki got personality development beyond "The girl who isn't Jinora", which was good. She's empathetic and clever. Meelo is a bit swaggering in his machismo but, like Metahuman says, he's a young boy... I've seen this stuff all the time.

He MAY be a young boy, but it doesn't mean that machismo is something we want to see in Korra.

[cobaltstarfire]

I actually liked younger Meelo, but older Meelo...I haven't been able to appreciate his antics.

[Corenair]

Actually, I would say that the problem with Meelo isn't so much his attitude as the people around not reacting to it. Seeing him being conspicuous jerk to the new generation of airbenders last season with Tenzin was already jarring, but now he goes and tosses away everyone's after berating them ? While they are in the middle of nowhere. But the inevitable reaction to that kind of continued attitude (that someone would eventually call him out on it) is hand-waved because ... humor ? I'm perplexed. How can writers who managed to produce such an excellent (and reliably funny) character as Sokka not see that it doesn't work ?

All of it I think, comes down to one thing: ever notice how no character in the show seems to be able to confront the villains on their ideologies ? I mean, it wouldn't take more than on or two questions to unravel the rhetorics of Zaheer, Unnolok or Amon. And I think the reason is that the authors don't seem to master the eastern philosophies they invoke, or even to have a clear perception of their own views on morality.

Just look at the worst offender of all: Bolin. Like Meelo, it's not that he is made relentlessly annoying by the author's transparent attempts to make him funny, it's that no one seems to mind that he is actually a stupid, all too easily influenced jerk: his own brother rots in prison, foes he help him ? No, he's to busy shooting or attending the premiere of semf-aggrandizing movie. Does anyone bother to tell him he was at the very least foolish ? Nope. And when an army of face-obscured fascists bullies entire provinces and even every world leader in the middle of Republic City, who's wearing the uniform and justifying it with "I like to help people ?". Yeah. (Just wait. That lightning we see him evading in the trailer probably comes from Mako, at whom he seems to have thrown freaking magma. I'm betting right now that he will witness something he doesn't like, turn on Kuvira and get accepted back into the fold no questions asked).

Anyway that's my hypothesis: most problem in this show come from the fact that characters and creators alike are full good sentiments but lack the self-knowledge to do anything but react to the schemes of the villain. Korra's disappointingly superficial recovery last episode is only the last example. But still, LOK's ability to display earnest and genuinely touching moments such as season 3's finale keeps me coming back. Here's hoping they'll manage to achieve at least as well this season.

[Morty]

Apparently, the fan nickname for Zuko's daughter before the writers revealed her name in the Q&A session was Honora. This makes perfect sense.

[MLai]

Well, that was cute. Toph basically said that what separates Korra from all of her villains was not inherent superiority in ideology, but rather that they were unbalanced and she was not. Basically, if Korra went ahead and fought Kuvira as an unbalanced individual, then there would be no difference between the 2 sides even if she could win.

That actually makes friggin' sense?! So the writers do understand? But then why do they suck so much?

[LaZodiac]

Well, that was cute. Toph basically said that what separates Korra from all of her villains was not inherent superiority in ideology, but rather that they were unbalanced and she was not. Basically, if Korra went ahead and fought Kuvira as an unbalanced individual, then there would be no difference between the 2 sides even if she could win.

That actually makes friggin' sense?! So the writers do understand? But then why do they suck so much?

If the writers are doing everything right by your own measure and you still think they suck, it's likely because you just don't like that type of character. Or you've fallen so far into "they're the villain so I should hate them" that it's actually affecting how much you like the show.

Just assuming, though.