LGBTAI+ 53: The Nefarious Rainbow Syndicate

[Lex-Kat]

And now with Transgender Day of Remembrance fresh in in everyone's minds, 4chan's /pol/ just descended to even greater depths of douchebaggery.

I will resist, thankfully, to read the words of these people. I have come to learn that those really do hurt me, and I cannot bear to torture myself further by reading the vile words of hateful pieces of.....

I'm really sad.

My trans friend who I did nothing help still mad with me. Her father knows about it now and it is making her go to the "moral counselor" every saturday.

My depressed friend still depressed and won't talk to me.

And I just lost THE GAME.

I don't know what to do. The entire school is nothing but homophobic comments. I don't even want to go anymore. I mean I already passed in all subjects. And that place makes me sick now.

All I can offer is a cyberhug and this small bit of advice. Don't give up on her. Don't push too hard, but whenever you can, let her know that you want to be there for her. Don't say you're sorry too much, as that will start sounding like a broken record, and meaningless after a while.

As for school.... I don't see much choice except to defend her publicly if she is attacked. Be there for her when she needs you later, as you were not there before. Watch out for her, if and when you can. It's a hard line I'm proposing you tread, as I'm suggesting you place yourself in the line of fire as well. But if you don't, you may find you regret it later in life.

Perhaps someone else has a better idea.

[SowZ]

I'm really sad.

My trans friend who I did nothing help still mad with me. Her father knows about it now and it is making her go to the "moral counselor" every saturday.

My depressed friend still depressed and won't talk to me.

And I just lost THE GAME.

I don't know what to do. The entire school is nothing but homophobic comments. I don't even want to go anymore. I mean I already passed in all subjects. And that place makes me sick now.

That sucks. School can really suck. All I can say is this, "It gets better." There's ignorance everywhere, but you can choose where and with whom you spend your time far more often as an adult. And college has, if not fewer prejudiced people, more people who will support your gender identity or sexual orientation or ethnicity or whatever. There's still plenty of hate, but in my experience more love, too. It can be really hard right now, don't let anyone diminish your experiences as 'kid stuff.' That's Bull****. But life gets better, so if standing up for people means social ostracism, that is temporary. Even if the rest of your time in school becomes a lot harder, it will get better. Living with your conscience and choices you've made lasts your whole life, although it is possible to get past guilt and move forward.

That's all the advice I can give, hopefully someone else can be more supportive.

[golentan]

My trans friend who I did nothing help still mad with me. Her father knows about it now and it is making her go to the "moral counselor" every saturday.

You threw her to the wolves out of cowardice. You betrayed her and were complicit in her public humiliation. That's not the sort of thing that an apology solves. If you had done that to me I'd cut you out of my life entirely. But see below.

My depressed friend still depressed and won't talk to me.

What're they depressed about? Or is it just generalized depression? If it's a problem, be there for your friend, ask what they need you to do to help. If it's generalized depression, help them find a psychiatrist, support them, and just be there as needed.

And I just lost THE GAME.

I can't tell if this is a joke.

I don't know what to do. The entire school is nothing but homophobic comments. I don't even want to go anymore. I mean I already passed in all subjects. And that place makes me sick now.

You know what makes this sort of thing better? Taking a stand. Pick a fight (metaphorically, do not hit people), stand up for your trans friend, come out publicly if it's safe to do so, say "this is not okay." If you're waiting for someone to come along and magically fix the culture of the school, well, heroes are rare in the world unless you choose to be one yourself. And yeah, it'll probably suck. Bullying might get more specific towards you, but here's the thing. Most bullies are cowards, and back down when their prey bares fangs. Most bullies can't hurt you with something you're not ashamed of. And as someone who has been there it sure as hell sucks less than hiding who you are, constantly living in fear and living with constant background bullying that people don't even realize is targeting you. You're almost done with school? My advice is go for it. Stand up, and be counted.

[Thufir]

The first sentence made me physically ill. Then I read until the end and now my faith in humanity is completely destroyed. If a giant asteroid collides with Earth it will be a great day for the universe. Seriously ****ed up.

How do people get that full of bile?

Kind of relevant to this is the comment I posted on Serp's facebook status about the Day of Remembrance:
"So much of how to deal with people who suffer from discrimination can be summed up as "Don't be a jerk." It depresses me that so many people in the world seem to have a problem with that simple concept."

[Ifni]

You threw her to the wolves out of cowardice. You betrayed her and were complicit in her public humiliation. That's not the sort of thing that an apology solves. If you had done that to me I'd cut you out of my life entirely. But see below.

This seems like extremely harsh language to describe staying silent out of fear of being targeted too. Blame the right people, the ones who were actually engaged in the bullying. Bystander intervention is great if you can do it safely, but only the person who's actually there can judge whether that's true, and nobody has an obligation to put themselves at risk for someone else (except in certain professions where they are employed to do so, and hopefully remunerated and honored accordingly). My experience is also that most people have trouble figuring out the best course of action on the fly, in threatening and emotionally charged situations. This doesn't make you horrible, it makes you human.

I mean, I also completely understand why his friend would be angry at him for not helping her, I don't think she's in the wrong here - but I don't think berating Zurvan is very helpful either.

You know what makes this sort of thing better? Taking a stand. Pick a fight (metaphorically, do not hit people), stand up for your trans friend, come out publicly if it's safe to do so, say "this is not okay." If you're waiting for someone to come along and magically fix the culture of the school, well, heroes are rare in the world unless you choose to be one yourself. And yeah, it'll probably suck. Bullying might get more specific towards you, but here's the thing. Most bullies are cowards, and back down when their prey bares fangs. Most bullies can't hurt you with something you're not ashamed of. And as someone who has been there it sure as hell sucks less than hiding who you are, constantly living in fear and living with constant background bullying that people don't even realize is targeting you. You're almost done with school? My advice is go for it. Stand up, and be counted.

My bolding. And this doesn't just mean physically safe. I would be pretty reluctant to advise someone to deliberately make themselves a target of bullying in the hope of preventing it for others. It can sometimes work (maybe?), but I feel like it should only be done by the free choice of the person themselves, because there's a decent chance they're going to get hurt (emotionally, not physically, although the latter is also possible). It's also relevant to know how the school authorities are likely to react: if they side with the bullies / the teachers are also homophobic, things can get pretty unpleasant. Saying "this is not okay" sounds good, but does not work very well if there's a deep-seated institutional culture in place that will defend the principle that yeah, actually it is okay.

Now, this may well not be the case for Zurvan! My most direct experience with anti-gay bullying was in a place and time where being gay was a felony punishable by prison time, which is obviously not the situation here, and I may be too cautious about advising people to come out as a consequence. If you're sure the worst you'll have to deal with is a handful of students calling you names, and speaking up might actually get the school authorities (or other students) to notice and take a stand against it, then yeah, coming out could be a good anti-bullying strategy, and make you feel much better. But this is an "if".

(And "Most bullies can't hurt you with something you're not ashamed of" does not match my experience very well. Maybe if it's a matter of name-calling.)

@Zurvan: whether you decide to follow golentan's advice or not, you're nearly done. Stick it out. It does get better.

[SiuiS]

This seems like extremely harsh language to describe staying silent out of fear of being targeted too. Blame the right people

Yes and no. It is harsh language but that doesn't make it wrong, or uncalled for, or inappropriate to the situation.

I again cite Martin Luther King jr. As relevant.

The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy.

"First, I must confess that over the last few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro's great stumbling block in the stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen's Council-er or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate who is more devoted to "order" than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice; who constantly says "I agree with you in the goal you seek, but I can't agree with your methods of direct action;" who paternalistically feels he can set the timetable for another man's freedom; who lives by the myth of time and who constantly advises the Negro to wait until a "more convenient season."

Zurvan has stumbled and is hurting. He has asked us what the lesson to be learned is, here. We have said the lesson is that the pain of standing aside and letting bad things happen is worse than the pain of conflict for standing up for what is right.

Sometimes there are no nice truths. Sometimes we must give our consequences teeth for them to be more than academic exercises. Sometimes we do bad things and need to be responded to as people who do bad things, rather than people who slipped up but it's okay in the end. It's all about whether Zurvan's emotional health or his trans friend's emotional health is priority. And if her health must be priority for his health to be okay, then harsh words are the best medicine.

I'll await his own response though. Perhaps he disagrees? If so, I'll respect that.

[Serpentine]

I'm really sad.

My trans friend who I did nothing help still mad with me. Her father knows about it now and it is making her go to the "moral counselor" every saturday.

My depressed friend still depressed and won't talk to me.

And I just lost THE GAME.

I don't know what to do. The entire school is nothing but homophobic comments. I don't even want to go anymore. I mean I already passed in all subjects. And that place makes me sick now.

Did you talk to her like we told you to, without making it all about you and how you feel? If not, of course she's still angry. If so, and you're sure you did it properly, then all you can do is keep making it clear that you are there for her now and actually stand up and do so when she needs it, and otherwise wait it out. Let her be angry for a while. She has a right to be, and apologies don't magically make everything better. And a heads up: if you have another opportunity to stand up for her, and you fail miserably again, all the apologies in the world will ring as hollow as a bell.

[RabbitHoleLost]

Still not sure if this should go into this thread or the other--
My cousin let her seven year old son go to school in a dress today after he'd been asking for weeks
She was reluctant because she was afraid what other kids at school would do but he came home today really happy and she was proud of him and happy for him
So far, he still identifies as male but she's open and ready to support him if this changes in the future

However! She did ask about support groups and I was wonderig if you guys knew anything about support networks for parents of young genderqueer/questioning children, either online or in/around the Boston, MA area or books that I could get and send to her
She wants to make sure she's as educated and able to support him in whatever choices he makes as she can so that he can grow up happy and loved

Any help is super appreciated <3

[Astrella]

Still not sure if this should go into this thread or the other--
My cousin let her seven year old son go to school in a dress today after he'd been asking for weeks
She was reluctant because she was afraid what other kids at school would do but he came home today really happy and she was proud of him and happy for him
So far, he still identifies as male but she's open and ready to support him if this changes in the future

However! She did ask about support groups and I was wonderig if you guys knew anything about support networks for parents of young genderqueer/questioning children, either online or in/around the Boston, MA area or books that I could get and send to her
She wants to make sure she's as educated and able to support him in whatever choices he makes as she can so that he can grow up happy and loved

Any help is super appreciated <3

Aww, that's sweet.

Hmm, maybe check if there are any PFLAG groups nearby? httpI found these but I'm not familiar with the area so I don't know if any of these are easily reached. I'll do a bit of research about books and see if I can find anything.

[Serpentine]

Saw this on Imgur. For once you can read the comments! (I probably still wouldn't dig too deep, but it actually looks pretty good)

[Jormengand]

Saw this on Imgur. For once you can read the comments! (I probably still wouldn't dig too deep, but it actually looks pretty good)

So cute.

So much prettier than me...

[Philemonite]

Saw this on Imgur. For once you can read the comments! (I probably still wouldn't dig too deep, but it actually looks pretty good)

That is one pretty girl. If I was straight I would be all over that.
Seriously, she is so cute.

[Astrella]

Visiting grand parents wasn’t great, lots of deadnaming, uncle 1 was a racist and ableist jerk as usual, uncle 2 kept misgendering his trans coworker and when my cousin wanted to show me her room uncle 1 was all like “no boys allowed in your room”. :/ And it just, all of that really doesn’t help with my self-image when it’s already low and I look so gross. :c

And on top of that just silly gender policing towards my cousins.

[Serpentine]

So, what you're saying is, it's not just your parents who are messed up, but your whole family?
Especially, you know, she's your cousin! Even without getting into the whole "is it okay to kiss cousins?" thing, where are you that it's assumed something's gonna happen? Bleck.

[golentan]

So, what you're saying is, it's not just your parents who are messed up, but your whole family?
Especially, you know, she's your cousin! Even without getting into the whole "is it okay to kiss cousins?" thing, where are you that it's assumed something's gonna happen? Bleck.

There is spontaneous dysfunctional family relationship syndrome, but more often it's passed down mother/father to daughter/son. I have a friend who never wants to get married/have kids because his whole experience with familial relationships is screaming at each other.

[Zrak]

To be fair, there is a reason they call it bunking cousins.

Also, more seriously, romance between cousins is considerably less taboo in some cultures. Typically, provisions against marrying into one's extended family arose to essentially force political marriages. For example, marriages between first cousins were typically rare and generally frowned upon in medieval Europe, but were permitted in order to end a blood feud within a family.

[Mono Vertigo]

There is spontaneous dysfunctional family relationship syndrome, but more often it's passed down mother/father to daughter/son. I have a friend who never wants to get married/have kids because his whole experience with familial relationships is screaming at each other.

It's turtles all the way down.
(Except when it's not.)
(And sometimes the turtles stop.)

[Reality Glitch]

It's turtles all the way down.

I mean, someone had to teach them their rad martial arts skills.

[Grytorm]

I've randomly started wondering about Monty Pythons treatment of LGBTAI issues. I remember the mouse parties sketch which was a straight up parody I think of media sensationalism although maybe somewhat offensive. The Lumberjack Song I have enjoyed in the past but I don't really know how to take it. And a character from Life of Brian is trans but it could be considered an offensive mockery. I don't know. The character is not a straight up offensive so it comes down how they are meant to be interpreted. But she does get support from her friends after the initial shock in the first scene. Any other bits I haven't watched?

[Serpentine]

There's lots of references to homosexuality (my favourite is "SQUAAAAD camp it... UP!"), but most of those featured Graham Chapman who was gay so...
Regarding gender variance and transsexuality, I'm not sure. I think considering the time it was made and the fact they acknowledged it as a thing at all, it's not too bad - it almost seems to me that it's everyone else's responses that are the butt of the jokes, not the nonheteronormative people themselves. But I don't feel very strongly about that, and I'm sure others would disagree.

[Astrella]

So, what you're saying is, it's not just your parents who are messed up, but your whole family?
Especially, you know, she's your cousin! Even without getting into the whole "is it okay to kiss cousins?" thing, where are you that it's assumed something's gonna happen? Bleck.

Best part is that she's 8. I have no clue where the comment even comes from, she like wants me to come up to her room to play with her playmobile stuff everytime we visit.

[Kesnit]

I've randomly started wondering about Monty Pythons treatment of LGBTAI issues. I remember the mouse parties sketch which was a straight up parody I think of media sensationalism although maybe somewhat offensive. The Lumberjack Song I have enjoyed in the past but I don't really know how to take it. And a character from Life of Brian is trans but it could be considered an offensive mockery. I don't know. The character is not a straight up offensive so it comes down how they are meant to be interpreted. But she does get support from her friends after the initial shock in the first scene. Any other bits I haven't watched?

There's lots of references to homosexuality (my favourite is "SQUAAAAD camp it... UP!"), but most of those featured Graham Chapman who was gay so...
Regarding gender variance and transsexuality, I'm not sure. I think considering the time it was made and the fact they acknowledged it as a thing at all, it's not too bad - it almost seems to me that it's everyone else's responses that are the butt of the jokes, not the nonheteronormative people themselves. But I don't feel very strongly about that, and I'm sure others would disagree.

I'm with Serp. Given that it's Monty Python and they mock EVERYTHING, I wouldn't read too much into it.

Best part is that she's 8. I have no clue where the comment even comes from, she like wants me to come up to her room to play with her playmobile stuff everytime we visit.

Actually, that makes more sense, sadly. You are a "deviant," which means you are (by default) a "child molester." *eye roll*

[Serpentine]

Cracked's done an article on asexuality. What do you think?

[noparlpf]

Cracked's done an article on asexuality. What do you think?

I think I saw something about that on AVEN not long ago. I don't look around much there so I didn't check that thread. I'll read it in a bit.

Speaking of AVEN, they tweeted some video by a woman named Arielle something-or-other. I've heard some pretty bad things about her videos being transphobic and gross though. Anybody know who that is?

[Astrella]

This is what I can find about her.

[noparlpf]

This is what I can find about her.

Oh yeah, I've seen that post. Doesn't give me much confidence to click through to her video on asexuality, really.

[Philemonite]

Cracked's done an article on asexuality. What do you think?

I can only speak as an outsider, since I'm not asexual, but I found it very interesting.

[Zrak]

Cracked's done an article on asexuality. What do you think?

That Cracked writers are overpaid at half a cent a word or whatever it is content mills are paying these days. I mean, it's sort of insulting to imply that asexual people can't really understand sex in media, but otherwise I don't think the article is really bad in its treatment of its subject; the only thing really offensive is the prose.

[Athedia]

Cracked's done an article on asexuality. What do you think?

I think it isn't too bad. I brings it into the public eye which is nice. Some of the comments are... well a comments section. I don't know why I read them.

[Marnath]

That Cracked writers are overpaid at half a cent a word or whatever it is content mills are paying these days. I mean, it's sort of insulting to imply that asexual people can't really understand sex in media, but otherwise I don't think the article is really bad in its treatment of its subject; the only thing really offensive is the prose.

Actually I was about to say I agreed with that entire part of the article. I understand intellectually why there's an association between attractive models and sales figures but for me personally if the product isn't what I want or if they literally don't tell me what it is beyond "look hot people use this!" then I don't get anything from it. As far as movies, I appreciate romance when it's actually done well and it annoys the crap out of me when they follow the formula of "immediate dislike, maybe you're not so bad, let's have sex. We love each other now."

I feel that the article is pretty accurate, compared to their usual work.