Magic the Gathering XX: KHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANS!!!

[Lhurgyof]

Why do you need creatures in your superfriend's deck? Both tezz's seem cuttable. Sarkan doesn't seem very good. Lily of the dark realms seem bad. Pyromaster and nalaar are both weak. Decree of Annihalation I am not sure of. Burnished Hart is just bad. Cut Scroll Rack because you don't play fetches. Cut Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief. Cut Dragonmaster outcast. Cut Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind.

I would add:
Five lands
Phyrexian Arena
Blue sun's zenith
More card draw
In Garruk's Wake

Mostly because if I don't have access to creatures my planeswalkers would die even more often than they already do and I'd die pretty easy; this deck gets focus fired at the table because they know decree is coming. I like running as many walkers as I can as it is a walker deck, but I can understand your ideas for cuts. Lilly is good to find me shocks and duals, sarkhan is okay for drawing cards (but I see your point). Pyromaster is the only Chandra that can draw cards, even if her ultimate sucks, but I do like Nalaar. And mono-u Tez is good for finding me rocks, chain veil, or artifact lands. Unfortunately for me, though, Grixis walkers is a little harder to do than Bant walkers (because Angus Mackenzie is the perfect general and it opens up cards like wargate, doubling season, and gilder bairn), so I need to protect them as much as possible. I understand the creature cuts you suggest, but only one of the cards you suggested can protect my walkers, and it's a seven drop. So I'd really need more ways of protecting my walkers, because Lethal Vapors doesn't always get the job done. It's my SuperVillains deck, so I want to make sure to have as many of the walkers in it as I can feasibly run, but right now I think I'm at the max I can run.

Burnished hart is the only land ramp available to Grixis, that's generally why I run it in non-green decks. Also, Scroll Rack is bad without fetches? I thought it was pretty damn good, especially with Consecrated Sphinx and other card draw on the board.

I like your suggestions for cards to add, other than five lands (40 seems way too high, I've never run an EDH deck with more than 37).

Edit: Not trying to be an ass, I just want to know the reasoning behind your suggestions, I'm certainly taking them into account. With the cards in the deck being really expensive I want to really be sure of any edits I make to it before I go through with them. :P

Which ones would be OP?

Hmm, I'm not really sure since walkers are much less varied than legendary creatures, giving you many less decks and colors to play with. Probably good ol' mindsculptor though. Play him in a combo/control deck and go to town.

[Androgeus]

Which ones would be OP?

Sorin Markov lets you set other's life to 10 repeatedly and consistently would be a problem. Tezzeret the Seeker would be really good as well letting you search up pretty much any artifact you need. Planeswalkers that make stackable emblems might also have issues.

[Lhurgyof]

Sorin Markov lets you set other's life to 10 repeatedly and consistently would be a problem. Tezzeret the Seeker would be really good as well letting you search up pretty much any artifact you need. Planeswalkers that make stackable emblems might also have issues.

Oh shoot, Tezzeret would be crazy. Kind of like Arcum decks.

[Binks]

Which ones would be OP?

Sarkhan the Mad could actually be pretty ridiculous if recurring him was just a +2 colorless mana cost. Play a dragon's deck and you have, at basically any time, a massive burn spell at the ready (initial cost 5) that leaves behind an alt target or a removal spell and at least 1 card draw. That's not too bad. Still a bit of a 'win more' card given you need dragons out with a lot of power to work but this is commander we're talking about here, stalls that leave you with a massive board and no way to exploit it are the norm.

[Duck999]

Saying that any planeswalker could be commander would put too many cards on the banned as commander list. Their smaller minus ability becomes too good when you can just let them die and only needing to pay 2 extra colorless to return them.

[unseenmage]

Saying that any planeswalker could be commander would put too many cards on the banned as commander list. Their smaller minus ability becomes too good when you can just let them die and only needing to pay 2 extra colorless to return them.

Yeah, we tried this for a good long while and as it turns out any Commander with an Emblem that stacks is too strong to be a Commander. In addition the the unholy trinity that is Jace 2.0, original Tezz, and original Sorin. (Original Bolas used to be on the list but as it turns out he's way too expensive to be a truly OP Commander.)

[Ninjaman]

I guess.

Lord of Innistrad tokens would be pretty disgusting.
Lilliana vess would be like playing imperial seal as your commander.

I get your point.

[unseenmage]

I guess.

Lord of Innistrad tokens would be pretty disgusting.
Lilliana vess would be like playing imperial seal as your commander.

I get your point.

Sorin was bad but at least boardwipes kept his Emblem from being relevant sometimes. Venser was the worst. Absolutely unbelievably badwrongfun.

[Duck999]

Sorin was bad but at least boardwipes kept his Emblem from being relevant sometimes. Venser was the worst. Absolutely unbelievably badwrongfun.

...Yeeeaaah... Some planes walkers just don't work here. Player: I gain 10 life, now at 50. Sorin: I set you to 10. Player: I gain 20 life, now at 30. Sorin: I set you to ten. Player: I attack for 39, you are at 1. Sorin: Nope, I'm also at 10.

[Androgeus]

...Yeeeaaah... Some planes walkers just don't work here. Player: I gain 10 life, now at 50. Sorin: I set you to 10. Player: I gain 20 life, now at 30. Sorin: I set you to ten. Player: I attack for 39, you are at 1. Sorin: Nope, I'm also at 10.

unseenmage was talking about Sorin, Lord of Innistrad. Also I don't think you ever cast Sorin Markov unless you actually kill the player whose life you set to 10 that turn (or setting your life to 10 keeps you alive).

Is The Chain Veil almost an instant include in Planeswalker Commander?

[ChaosOS]

More or less, the 3 so far all seem to enjoy double activations and have ultimates you would enjoy ticking up to.

[ChaosOS]

Then allow me to blow your mind by telling you that layers mean some static effects are "faster" than others. But this isn't something you are expected to know.

That reminds me of a question I saw once:
You have two opalescence, a humility, a life and limb,a Xenograph on saproling and a blood moon. They have all been put into play with warpworld, meaning you choose the timestamps. What are the possible outcomes?

This is just like the "Judge Tower" format that was just posted to Reddit

[Ninjaman]

This is just like the "Judge Tower" format that was just posted to Reddit

I have played a similar game called "You're Out". We don't use a specific deck for it. It is sometimes played as a drinking game but I haven't tried that.

[Khay]

Remember how I talked about struggling to find a budget-friendly replacement for Wurmcoil Engine?

Guess what's getting a reprint in Commander 2014.

Well that was easy.

(BONUS: "Legendary Token Artifact Creature - Goblin Golem" is evidently too long to fit on the type line.)

[Sith_Happens]

Remember how I talked about struggling to find a budget-friendly replacement for Wurmcoil Engine?

Guess what's getting a reprint in Commander 2014.

Well that was easy.

Exactly the opposite; this means that whichever deck has the Wurmcoil in it is going to get marked up accordingly.

[Khay]

Exactly the opposite; this means that whichever deck has the Wurmcoil in it is going to get marked up accordingly.

I thought Commander products weren't limited print runs like From the Vault. Is it really possible to mark these up that much?

[Mystic Muse]

The Grixis commander deck got marked up to $60-$70 because of True-Name Nemesis

[Duck999]

unseenmage was talking about Sorin, Lord of Innistrad. Also I don't think you ever cast Sorin Markov unless you actually kill the player whose life you set to 10 that turn (or setting your life to 10 keeps you alive).

Is The Chain Veil almost an instant include in Planeswalker Commander?

Yeah. I was just pointing out how annoying some could get. Stackable emblems are very annoying when death is temporary. This would also probably jump some planes walker prices up for use as commander.

Edit: Teferi in super friends with chain veil and unwinding clock. 4 activations avery round.

[IcemanJRC]

I thought Commander products weren't limited print runs like From the Vault. Is it really possible to mark these up that much?

It's generally recommended to go to your local WalMart/Target and pick up the decks before other enterprising individuals do. Wurmcoil will probably not mark them up nearly as much as things like True-Name Nemesis or Scavenging Ooze did, seeing as it's a reprint rather than unique to Commander 2014. BUT, there's always one, so be conscientious.

[Svata]

Heh, commander. Good fun. I've got a Vorosh, the Hunter (6/6, flying, and any time he does combat damage to a player you canplay 2g and add 6 +1/+1 counters) commander deck that runs a Vorel of the Hull Clade (GU, Tap to double counters on target permanent), a Cryptoplasm(can become copy of one target creature each turn), and an Experiment Kraj (has all activated abilities of creatures with +1/+1 counters). And I have ways to give Vorosh double-strike. Needless to say, he gets big in a hurry. Did I mention the Tuskguard Captain (Trample to everyone with +1/+1 coutners), Prophet of Kruphix (untap all lands and creatures during every untap step), and Kruphix, God of Horizons (Unused mana converts to colorless at a 1:1 ratio) in that deck?

[Androgeus]

Yeah. I was just pointing out how annoying some could get. Stackable emblems are very annoying when death is temporary. This would also probably jump some planes walker prices up for use as commander.

Edit: Teferi in super friends with chain veil and unwinding clock. 4 activations avery round.

Talking of Teferi, anybody got any absurd things to use planeswalkers ability for on opponents turns? Silliest I can think of on the spot is Gideon Jura making all creatures attack him, then turning in to a creature to block one of them. This can lead to a situation where Gideon Jura taunts Gideon Jura in to attacking him instead of his planeswalker buddy, unfortunately Gideon Jura's attack on Gideon Jura gets blocked by Gideon Jura.

[Bucky]

Talking of Teferi, anybody got any absurd things to use planeswalkers ability for on opponents turns?

Liliana Vess, Liliana of the Veil or Karn Liberated can soft-lock an opponent by making them discard during their draw phase every turn. And Tamiyo gets to freeze things on their owner's upkeep, meaning she can lock down three permanents at once.

[Khay]

More Commander spoilers! The White planeswalker isn't Serra and the Red one isn't Slobad, which makes me sad. But the Lithomancer is pretty cool, and I have no idea who Daretti is and why he isn't Slobad, but hey, goblin planeswalker. That's still cool. Even though it's not Slobad.

Red deck increasingly looks like it's going all-in on exploiting Wurmcoil Engine, which is pretty cool. White deck looks to have an equipment theme, so - Batterskull reprint, maybe? Dare I hope?

[Landis963]

I honestly went to Doug's tumblr to ask why this Daretti guy couldn't be Slobad, and found this:

I [have gotten / will get] this question a lot, and I wanted to take time to answer it. We definitely considered [your favorite old character/planeswalker] for this product, and we know [color] fans have been asking for [that character] for quite a while — and would probably have preferred [them] to [character we did print] in Commander 2014.

But in the end, we decided that [character we did print] [fit well mechanically / clicked with the deck theme / complemented the other characters] in the [color] deck and [had the most fans overall / had the best chance for a cool card / lacked certain creative problems / filled a niche we had wanted to fill for a long time]. Arguably [your favorite character/planeswalker] might [not have been represented well as monocolor / have overlapped with another character we wanted to focus on / exist in a similar mechanical design space to a more prominent character], as well, so that was on our minds when choosing to go a different direction.

But thanks for writing in. We hear your excitement for [your favorite old character/planeswalker], and maybe someday we’ll see a card for [them]. For now we get to enjoy [character we did print in that character’s stead] and the suite of other cool characters we did choose for Commander 2014. Hope you enjoy them, and that you’re excited to [add some sweet legends to your collection / check certain storyline characters off your personal request list / brew some new Commander decks]!

[Khay]

Since Slobad's stunt as a planeswalker lasted from page 391 to page 399 of the Fifth Dawn novel*, this was probably the one and only opportunity to give him a card. But hey, let's instead be nostalgic about a set released, wow, almost half a year ago? That's also cool.

(I don't mean to sound bitter, getting a goblin tinkerer planeswalker is still super cool and I'll probably get the red deck. I just wish it had been Slobad. )


* German edition, first printing, exact numbers may vary

[Sith_Happens]

Holy crap, so much good stuff for my semi-zombies recursion deck.

I like how Stoneforge Mystic is a planeswalker now.

Raving Dead is definitely my favorite card in the set so far. "It's not my fault you're being attacked by a damned-if-you-block-damned-if-you-don't creature! That's just the way the die roll ended up."

Could have mentioned this before, but Reef Worm is hilarious.

...How the heck did no one notice that Assault Suit doesn't work? As soon as you lose control of a creature it becomes unequipped.

[Androgeus]

Batterskull reprint, maybe? Dare I hope?

There is a Germ in the tokens, so it's possible. The black deck does have Lashwrithe so the token is kinda accounted for, but there is always a chance.

[IcemanJRC]

Holy crap, so much good stuff for my semi-zombies recursion deck.

I like how Stoneforge Mystic is a planeswalker now.

Raving Dead is definitely my favorite card in the set so far. "It's not my fault you're being attacked by a damned-if-you-block-damned-if-you-don't creature! That's just the way the die roll ended up."

Could have mentioned this before, but Reef Worm is hilarious.

...How the heck did no one notice that Assault Suit doesn't work? As soon as you lose control of a creature it becomes unequipped.

Nobody noticed because that isn't how it works. If you equip a creature and then someone else gains control of it, it is still equipped. You can move the equipment, and then it can't go back on that creature till you get it back, but it's still equipped until then.

[Mystic Muse]

Was hoping for Serra, but pre-ordered the white deck anyway.

[Binks]

...How the heck did no one notice that Assault Suit doesn't work? As soon as you lose control of a creature it becomes unequipped.

301.5b An Equipment is cast and enters the battlefield just like any other artifact. An Equipment doesn’t enter the battlefield attached to a creature. The equip keyword ability attaches the Equipment to a creature you control (see rule 702.6, “Equip”). Control of the creature matters only when the equip ability is activated and when it resolves. Spells and other abilities may also attach an Equipment to a creature. If an effect attempts to attach an Equipment to an object that can’t be equipped by it, the Equipment doesn’t move.

Figured I'd give you the relevant rule. Changing a creature's controller doesn't change the fact it still has equipment on it.