Constantine

[Avilan the Grey]

...So...

135296748 times better than the "movie".
Good use of a limited Effects budget. Good performance.

I think I will like this series.





...Also, I can't help but wonder how a Dresden / Constantine crossover would look...

[BWR]

It is a helluva lot better than that awful Keanu Reeves abomination. If the pilot is anything to go by it promises to blow Arrow, Flash and Agents of SHIELD out of the water as an adaptation of comic material. for one thing, he actually looks like John.

Being rather fond of the comic there are a few sticking points.
1. not a Scouser. Still, they got something other than RP or Cockney, so I guess I'll give it a pass
2. No smoking. I'm about as anti-smoking as you can get without going bat**** insane over the subject but this is such an integral part of the character. I find it baffling that anti-smoking laws are that extreme.
3. Billing himself as an exorcist. Like the KR movie, they play up this angle. Yes, JC has taken part in an exorcism or two and royally ****ed one up, but he's a mage. Magic and weird ****, not just getting rid of possessing ghosts and demons.
4. Most importantly, Chas. It's not as bad what they did to poor Chas in the movie but this guy neither looks nor sounds like Chas and apparantly has magical powers. WTF? How difficult is it to get a Chas that is a) a Cockney cabbie, and b) as magical as a brick, whose closest thing to a superpower is insane levels of loyalty to untrustworthy and borderline abusive ********?


I'm sure there are Hellblazer/DF crossovers on fanfiction-net or similar sites.

[Traab]

You know, this is actually kind of interesting. Its like the tv series versions of the comics snuck up on me and now all of a sudden they are everywhere. Oh sure its probably because I dont watch tv and havent for over a year now, but still. I guess after smallville did so well they were willing to put up even more series. And as these others have done at the very least decently well, they will keep coming up with them. The downside has to be the special effects budget though. So many good comics out there that could be made into a live action tv series, but the budget would be nuts to handle. I still want to see Heroes for Hire. I think that would be an ideal tv series. From what I recall its mostly low tech on the special effects. One guy is bulletproof and strong, the other is bruce lee. Plus, I want to see Luke break into latveria to force doom to pay a relatively small sum of money.

[comicshorse]

4. Most importantly, Chas. It's not as bad what they did to poor Chas in the movie but this guy neither looks nor sounds like Chas and apparantly has magical powers. WTF? How difficult is it to get a Chas that is a) a Cockney cabbie, and b) as magical as a brick, whose closest thing to a superpower is insane levels of loyalty to untrustworthy and borderline abusive ********?

Think of the number of powerful Mages, Phycics and god knows what who have died just from being around John. I suspect Chas is actually an arch mage of staggering power, its just that it's all locked up by not dying from being John's friend

[Anteros]

I was going to skip this, but I think I'll give it a shot based on this thread.

[Brother Oni]

It looks like they're using the same primarily Christian mythology that the movie did, presumably to make it more accessible to people unfamiliar with the franchise.

While I can see why they did it, it does lose a bit of flavour with the lack of competing mythologies, plus it makes my favourite story (City of Demons) impossible.

[Traab]

It looks like they're using the same primarily Christian mythology that the movie did, presumably to make it more accessible to people unfamiliar with the franchise.

While I can see why they did it, it does lose a bit of flavour with the lack of competing mythologies, plus it makes my favourite story (City of Demons) impossible.

I havent seen it so I wouldnt know, but have they flat out said only christian mythology is in this? Because if not, its highly likely they will branch out more once the series has its feet under it and a dedicated audience willing to listen to explanations of other mythologies and such.

[Anteros]

I just watched it. It's definitely more Christian based than anything else right now, but there are a few references made to other religions and mythologies...mostly in Constantine's spells. It wouldn't surprise me at all if they branch out later.

First impressions. It's a bit darker than I would like. I'm not that familiar with the source material, so maybe it's faithful. It's very similar to Supernatural except not as campy/humorous. I wasn't wowed, but I was entertained enough to give it a few more episodes to draw me in.

[Soras Teva Gee]

I'm pretty sure broadcast television would violate FCC regulations to truly capture Hellblazer on screen... also I'm not sure I'd trust it unless I knew it had already offended some group.

Though you might still get a halfway decent show out of it in more general terms.

Now pardon me I sense the Ruffled Beard of Glycon is modestly perturbed in its meditations and wish to avoid its eldritch revenge upon my thoughts.

[Avilan the Grey]

Well when I was reading the comic, in the 90s, it was definitely very "Christian" (as in using the Bible as the main framework) with demons, angels, the devil, the mother of the antichrist etc.

[Cheesegear]

Well when I was reading the comic, in the 90s, it was definitely very "Christian" (as in using the Bible as the main framework) with demons, angels, the devil, the mother of the antichrist etc.

As someone who loves John in all forms - including the movie, which, in canon, is an alternate reality and therefore totally fine - making John, Christian, is actually a change that kind of makes sense. If you're going to change anything about John, making him religious is probably the least objectionable thing I can think of.

[BWR]

As someone who loves John in all forms - including the movie, which, in canon, is an alternate reality and therefore totally fine - making John, Christian, is actually a change that kind of makes sense. If you're going to change anything about John, making him religious is probably the least objectionable thing I can think of.

Excedpt it doesn't make sense, it's entirely at odds with how John's been portrayed throughout the series. He hates the divine side about as much as he hates the inernal. God and the angels are a bunch of self-important wankers who randomly throw people to hell for ridiculous things and try to make themselves into the good guys. Yes, the series has a lot of Christian-based stuff, like god and the devil and angels and demons and anti-Christs and whatnot, but John has never been on the side of angels. Yes, he wants to avoid going to hell, but worrying about 'saving his soul' seems a bit too boot-licking to be John Constantine.
Another point of irritation - Constantine rhymes with 'valentine', producers. 'tine', not 'teen'. Really, why is that so difficult. There is absolutely no reason to get this wrong.

Regarding Chas' longevity, he never got smashed in a car wreck and showed up a few hours later with no problems.

Edit: Maybe I should comment on the most recent episode.
It was pretty much like any Hellblazer mini-story. It stayed pretty faithful to the type of story told and the resolutions that we are familiar with from JC. Some minor issues like the comment about 'nothing wickeder than gypsy magic' (seemed unnecessarily racist from someone who in the comics is anything but) and again they are too fond of having John spout Latin all over the place - I'd really like to see them bring in the comment about how the exact words and rituals aren't really important, it's the will behind it. On the whole, a pretty good episode, especially the various famous JC covers in Zed's apartment.

[Dienekes]

Excedpt it doesn't make sense, it's entirely at odds with how John's been portrayed throughout the series. He hates the divine side about as much as he hates the inernal. God and the angels are a bunch of self-important wankers who randomly throw people to hell for ridiculous things and try to make themselves into the good guys. Yes, the series has a lot of Christian-based stuff, like god and the devil and angels and demons and anti-Christs and whatnot, but John has never been on the side of angels. Yes, he wants to avoid going to hell, but worrying about 'saving his soul' seems a bit too boot-licking to be John Constantine.

Give it some time, it seems like they're setting up that angel guy being up to something and rage against the heavens stories are popular right now. If I had a guess, Constantine will uncover something about the angelic side he dislikes and that will start him going against both sides.

[Cheesegear]

Yes, he wants to avoid going to hell, but worrying about 'saving his soul' seems a bit too boot-licking to be John Constantine.

I guess it's just not something that I mind. I've been reading Hellblazer for a long time, I've read Justice League Dark, and right now Constantine is one of the only comic books I'm reading right now. JLD did some pretty dumb stuff, but I assume that was 'New 52 Blues', and trying to work John into being a team player - which he isn't. And now John's back in his own book, and he's, well he's okay. But, he did try to steal Shazam's magic from Billy Batson, that was a **** move, even for John.

But, it's TV, it's a major network. There's some stuff that just wont get shown, and some things will just have to get left behind.

On the whole, a pretty good episode, especially the various famous JC covers in Zed's apartment.

I almost lost my [poop], when Liv picked up the Helmet of Fate. If Dr. Fate shows up in Constantine, I will lose my bananas.

[BWR]

I guess it's just not something that I mind. I've been reading Hellblazer for a long time, I've read Justice League Dark, and right now Constantine is one of the only comic books I'm reading right now. JLD did some pretty dumb stuff, but I assume that was 'New 52 Blues', and trying to work John into being a team player - which he isn't. And now John's back in his own book, and he's, well he's okay. But, he did try to steal Shazam's magic from Billy Batson, that was a **** move, even for John.

But, it's TV, it's a major network. There's some stuff that just wont get shown, and some things will just have to get left behind.



I almost lost my [poop], when Liv picked up the Helmet of Fate. If Dr. Fate shows up in Constantine, I will lose my bananas.

I was sorely disappointed with the end of Hellblazer, upset at the death of Vertigo and not impressed by JLD, so I haven't read Constantine. Fate would be fun (how did John, of all people, end up with that helmet?) but I hope they're building up to getting the Swamp Thing in some place. Him or Papa Midnite or any of that lot.

[comicshorse]

I'd like to see Map but I can't help thinking he's such a part of the London setting of Hellblazer that he'd only fit there

(Having just seen the first episode I now find my own comments about Chas strangely prophetic )

[Anteros]

He didn't seem to be particularly fond of the Angels in the show from what I've seen. Again, I'm not very familiar with the source material, but I think these complaints are a bit pre-mature.

[Ebon_Drake]

I was sorely disappointed with the end of Hellblazer, upset at the death of Vertigo and not impressed by JLD, so I haven't read Constantine. Fate would be fun (how did John, of all people, end up with that helmet?) but I hope they're building up to getting the Swamp Thing in some place. Him or Papa Midnite or any of that lot.

Spoiler: Future characters

Show

Papa Midnite is confirmed. Swamp Thing is rumoured, but the effects budget limits what (if anything) they can do with him so I wouldn't expect him to show up for a while.

Other DC magic characters have been teased, so far Jim Corrigan is the only one that's been confirmed - although it's not yet clear if he'll be/end up as The Spectre. Zatanna seems likely, if she does show up I just hope they don't go all JLD and give her and Constantine an overwrought romance. I don't mind them being old flames, but I dislike them as an actual couple. It isn't good for her life expectancy.

[Anteros]

Spoiler: Future characters

Show

Papa Midnite is confirmed. Swamp Thing is rumoured, but the effects budget limits what (if anything) they can do with him so I wouldn't expect him to show up for a while.

Other DC magic characters have been teased, so far Jim Corrigan is the only one that's been confirmed - although it's not yet clear if he'll be/end up as The Spectre. Zatanna seems likely, if she does show up I just hope they don't go all JLD and give her and Constantine an overwrought romance. I don't mind them being old flames, but I dislike them as an actual couple. It isn't good for her life expectancy.

The Dr. Fate helmet was in this episode as well, so that's probably coming.

[RabbitHoleLost]

Haven't seen the second episode and actually just sat down to watch the first episode on Thursday

I was pleasantly surprised. When my local comic book shop went out of business I bought all but three of the 300 issues of the Hellblazer run and devoured them (about two and a half years ago) and then watched the movie for the first time and thought I was going to cry
my best friend had seen the first episode a month early from a leak, and knowing how nit-picky I could be in terms of shows and comics, warned me I might not like it

buuut, considering what they can do on cable TV and what Hellblazer is, I was pretty satisfied. Again, haven't watched the second episode, but it felt more like John than I could have hoped for.
Kinda leans more towards the New 52 Constantine, I think, in terms of attitude, but I'm okay with that

(as for leaning towards Christian mythology...the Eye of Horus carved into the girl's door??? not Christian???)

[Brother Oni]

Yes, he wants to avoid going to hell, but worrying about 'saving his soul' seems a bit too boot-licking to be John Constantine.

Not quite true - in the old series, he nearly started a war in hell when he put the First, Second and Third of the Fallen over a barrel to claim his soul, in order to cure himself of his cancer.

Another point of irritation - Constantine rhymes with 'valentine', producers. 'tine', not 'teen'. Really, why is that so difficult. There is absolutely no reason to get this wrong.

I've been told this is an American habit - they pronounce it 'teen' like the Roman Emperor.

On the whole, a pretty good episode, especially the various famous JC covers in Zed's apartment.

Much like Cheesegear getting all excited over the Helmet of Fate, I enjoyed Tim Bradstreet's covers cameo.

That said, I felt it was a bit choppy in places where they cut off a few seconds either to to squeeze into the allocated run time or because they wrote out Liv and had to re-shoot certain scenes.

Zatanna would be quite fun, although she definitely won't be appearing like the last time at John's 40th Birthday party, sitting in the kitchen muttering "won thgir hgih os m'I" after polishing off an 8 inch spliff.
I can't think of too many other DC comics characters that would tie in well, but if Dream of the Endless shows up in a cameo, this show can do no wrong in my book.

(as for leaning towards Christian mythology...the Eye of Horus carved into the girl's door??? not Christian???)

True, but the whole "my soul is damned" for the events of Newcastle is very Christian. When an episode is set around a turf war between an Aztec death god and infernal demons looking to muscle in on the lucrative market of claiming of the the souls of the dead, then it'll be like the old series.

[Cheesegear]

I also quite enjoy the soundtrack. Wonder how long they'll keep it up.

[Anteros]

I've been told this is an American habit - they pronounce it 'teen' like the Roman Emperor.

I don't think so. Maybe it's regional, but I don't personally know anyone that uses that pronunciation.

[RabbitHoleLost]

I don't think so. Maybe it's regional, but I don't personally know anyone that uses that pronunciation.

I (and everyone I know irl, including all of my local shop owners) have always pronounced it the way it's pronounced in the show.
Possibly regional.

True, but the whole "my soul is damned" for the events of Newcastle is very Christian. When an episode is set around a turf war between an Aztec death god and infernal demons looking to muscle in on the lucrative market of claiming of the the souls of the dead, then it'll be like the old series.

Mmm, well, it's not as though they can't do it, since Supernatural (granted, I only watched most of season 1) did things outside of the Christian mythology.
I guess it's just up to whether they want to

[BWR]

Not quite true - in the old series, he nearly started a war in hell when he put the First, Second and Third of the Fallen over a barrel to claim his soul, in order to cure himself of his cancer.

I think I may have misstated my position. Of course John doesn't want to go to hell and will do a whole bunch of dangerous stuff to stay out of there, but the whole idea of throwing in with the angels in hopes they will lift the damnation is a bit much to swallow. The whole "save my soul" scene in the pilot smacked too much of the movie's horrible plot of John trying to suck up to the divine, which strikes me as entirely out of character. Sure he badmouths the angel a bit but it does seem too eager to accept that he has to play by the divine rules. Maybe I'm reading too much into that scene, but I just got the feeling that he is not only aware of the rules (God in charge, too many sins = hell) but in some way believes in and agrees with them.

[Cheesegear]

The whole "save my soul" scene in the pilot smacked too much of the movie's horrible plot of John trying to suck up to the divine, which strikes me as entirely out of character.

Rather than explain why adaptions will generally always be different to the source material and that's okay. I'll just echo RabbitHoleLost; Seems more like New 52 John, than Hellblazer John.

[RabbitHoleLost]

LBR, it's so New 52 Constantine, I wouldn't be surprised if eventually "God" presents himself to John as a little white terrier (scottie? Its some small yappy dog, IDK)

[BWR]

Rather than explain why adaptions will generally always be different to the source material and that's okay. I'll just echo RabbitHoleLost; Seems more like New 52 John, than Hellblazer John.

I know adaptations are different. It's why they are called 'adaptations'. There's a matter of degree, and it isn't always ok (the Constantine movie, or the movie adaptations of "I am legend" and "I, robot"). The show is pretty good in itself and isn't a bad adaptation of JC so far. I just think it could be better. I want Hellblazer, not Heckblazer.

[Cheesegear]

I know adaptations are different. It's why they are called 'adaptations'. There's a matter of degree, and it isn't always ok (the Constantine movie, or the movie adaptations of "I am legend" and "I, robot"). The show is pretty good in itself and isn't a bad adaptation of JC so far. I just think it could be better. I want Hellblazer, not Heckblazer.

I like the movie.
What you want, needs to be on at 9:30pm, on a cable network. Not during prime time, on NBC.

[Hopeless]

Anyone know when this is being released over here in the UK?

Caught part of the first episode and it looked quite good so was wondering on what channel and how far past 9pm it would be shown?

Would be nice if it was shown on Channel 4 right after Agents of SHIELD but they put the Flash on Sky 1 and I'm having trouble watching that so it would be nice if it was on a channel that's easier to watch!