Pathfinder: Player wants to play an exiled Devil

[dascarletm]

So, a friend of mine has expressed interest in playing an exiled devil. He wants to have been fairly high powered, perhaps a general, but was demoted and banished to the material plane.

The idea is he would start as a weak devil and as the party levels he would gain back power, and eventually grow to an arch-duke at the high end of things.

The idea I like, however, I don't know how to run this at all.

Does anyone know of something that would simulate this well, perhaps a ruleset or class? I'm open to most anything.

Thanks.

[frogglesmash]

You could have him turn into more powerful devils as he levels up (starting as a lemure and eventually working his way towards Pit Fiend). IIRC this is how demons typically grow in power.The downside to this method is that it would hellishly difficult to balance and your PC would have almost no control over his build.

Another more reasonable approach would be to let him use one of the monster classes from Savage Species.

[Psyren]

I would have him start as a Tiefling, represented by him being stuffed into a human(ish) body that suppressed most of his powers. Then as he levels give him more devilish abilities until he is a half-fiend, then at late levels let him ascend (descend) into being a full-blown devil of the type he's interested in, with class levels and zero (or only a little) LA.

[nerghull]

Maybe import some savage species progression ?

[CGNefarious]

Someone once put together an entire thread called "Advanced Monster Classes for PCs" or something like that where there are several types of devils mapped out to be played through a 20 level progression. They are fairly powerful, but you build is limited. They were made for 3.5 but the port should be easy enough. It might suit what you're looking for.

[dascarletm]

I'll work with him around some of these ideas. I know he wanted to start as an Imp so I might bump the starting level on this one to accomodate.

According to the PCs as monsters, it says he would be treated as a level 2 character as an Imp.

He would then get a level halfway between 3 and 4.

Does this sound right, the imp chassis seems a little good for 2nd level with 3 HD and all.

[Telonius]

Fiendish Codex 2 is a good resource for this. It has the rules for promotion and demotion within Infernal ranks.

[frogglesmash]

Savage Species gives imps an ECL of 7.

[Runeclaw]

Savage Species gives imps an ECL of 7.

You guys, this is Pathfinder, ECL is completely different (more or less doesn't exist) and LA definitely doesn't exist.



You could fairly easily do this concept as just a Tiefling with the fiendish bloodline feats and maybe play him as a sorcerer with the fiendish bloodline. The increase in power from simply leveling up would represent his increasing power fairly well. But if he wants to use the actual monster with class level rules, such as they are, then I think you're on the right track. Periodically allow him to replace his Imp stats with more powerful demon stats, re-doing the level calculations. Doing it this way, almost any class would work fine, because the flavor of the concept is already baked in. You'll just want to keep an eye on what at-will abilities he may be gaining as some of those (teleport, wish) don't work well in PC hands.

3HD at an 2nd level game isn't necessarily going to break anything - it's going to be more about what abilities he has than just 1 extra HD that determines his effective power level.

[Forrestfire]

One possibility is to use a tiefling synthesist summoner, with the two forms representing a (currently weakened) true form and the tiefling form being what he was initially reverted to when demoted and banished.

As he levels up, he gradually regains his personal power, being able to shift between his natural form and the "powerless" one. Possibly alter the spell list to focus less on summoning and more on fiendish stuff (give some unholy spells and elemental blasting, maybe?), and fluff his Summon Monster as being able to still command some authority over minor beings thanks to what he is, even if he's been demoted. At later levels, as his personal power grows and he gradually returns to his old power level, he can summon more powerful fiendish creatures and bind them to his will, and eventually actual devils, too (which could have some fun plot hooks, if he's summoning fiends that recognize him).

[Callin]

Could make a custom Race along the lines of a Tiefling suited to what he once was then create a PrC that gives certain abilities as well as progressing the class he once was. Sort of like that PrC that does it with devotions or what not. I would say when he gets Devil Bonuses its a Stat increase and a SLA or Resistance instead of class abilities. Tailor it to what you want his final power to be.

[Faily]

I second the idea of letting him start as a Tiefling... being reduced to a "mere mortal" but still with enough taint of evil to be obviously not human.

What you could do is to refluff something like Dragon Disciple into something that will as a capstone turn him into a full-on devil, or at least a half-fiend. Unlocking each new ability could not only be a matter of gaining a new level, but also committing truly evil acts that identify him as an evil outsider. Just an idea though if you want to add some more fluff to it.

[dascarletm]

Interesting ideas, but I think he is tied to the idea of being an imp from the start. I wonder if an at-will self invisibility is a problem or not. Invisibility is gained by casters at 3, though it isn't at-will.

I can usually trust this player not to abuse things of this nature, but I don't want to force him to hold back.