Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. III: Cut off one thread, two more shall take its place

[Palanan]

Spoiler: Deciding Locations

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I'm with you as far as in-universe reasoning; clearly the Kree had their own rationale for dropping the City where they did.

Rather I'm thinking in terms of the decision by the writers to locate the City in Puerto Rico. I'm assuming there's some practical balance between a quasi-exotic feel and an affordable location shoot. Puerto Rico is probably a lot less complicated to do location work than, say, Tibet, or even somewhere like the Aleutians or Hawaii.

[Flickerdart]

Another great episode, with a good mix of action, plot, and long-delayed emotional conversations.

Spoiler: Location, Location, Location

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Seriously…mysterious alien city hidden under Puerto Rico?

I'm guessing at least some of the scenes were on location, since those thunderstorms looked authentic in the background of the exterior fortress shots. I can't think of a Kree-related plot reason why the city should be in Puerto Rico, so I'll go with "mildly exotic yet affordable location shoot." Puerto Rico is probably a lot less expensive than most of the places I'd put a hidden alien city, like Kamchatka or Patagonia.

Kamchatka is the worst place for a hidden city! It's so damn cold. I'd put my hidden cities in nice places, cause it's not like these things get built overnight and the unions are bound to complain.

[Kitten Champion]

I enjoyed tonight's show. I really like that they're continuing on with the Lovecraftian vibe with the meta-plot stuff, and they actually seem to be going with the Patton Oswald siblings as SHIELD's version of Nurse Joy/Officer Jenny which amuses me to no end.

I think this series would be perfect to binge watch as a DVD/Blu-Ray collection, it's very serialized and the episodes keep building momentum off the previous one.

Anyways, really looking forward to the Marvelized SF spy thriller version of Raiders of the Lost Ark they seem to be setting up.

[Athaniar]

Spoiler: ...Ye Who Enter Here

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To repeat what I say every week, this was another strong episode.

Really, though, this episode was very exciting and I can hardly wait to watch the midseason finale. Some specific points (in no specific order):

• Agent 33 is creepy now (in a cool way). That face (and that reveal at the beginning), that voice...
• The show's just waiting for the right moment to finally say the word "Inhuman". It almost happened in Raina's conversation with Skye. Next episode, perhaps?
• I know "there's a storm coming" is a huge cliche, but I still love it whenever it's used for some reason. Fitz taking it literally (much like Dr. Watson) was also amusing.
• Ward's working against Whitehall and probably for Skye's Dad (in all likelihood just to get Skye's approval). Whitehall clearly knows they're up to something, though. Someone's gonna stab someone in the back and very soon.
• So what was it that possessed Mack, exactly? Anything from the comics?
• The Koenig brothers keep being a weird but amusing element.
• Bobbi is up to something. I'm very curious to find out what.
• What was behind the Bermuda Triangle, anyway?

[LaZodiac]

Spoiler: ...Ye Who Enter Here

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Really, though, this episode was very exciting and I can hardly wait to watch the midseason finale. Some specific points (in no specific order):

• Agent 33 is creepy now (in a cool way). That face (and that reveal at the beginning), that voice...
• The show's just waiting for the right moment to finally say the word "Inhuman". It almost happened in Raina's conversation with Skye. Next episode, perhaps?
• I know "there's a storm coming" is a huge cliche, but I still love it whenever it's used for some reason. Fitz taking it literally (much like Dr. Watson) was also amusing.
• Ward's working against Whitehall and probably for Skye's Dad (in all likelihood just to get Skye's approval). Whitehall clearly knows they're up to something, though. Someone's gonna stab someone in the back and very soon.
• So what was it that possessed Mack, exactly? Anything from the comics?
• The Koenig brothers keep being a weird but amusing element.
• Bobbi is up to something. I'm very curious to find out what.
• What was behind the Bermuda Triangle, anyway?

Spoiler

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They mentioned a place that's inside the Bermuda Triangle, and the general idea I gathered was that "oh this place was so enjoyable people 'went missing' to go to it."

And yes, Raina was basically strangling herself with her attempts to not say Inhuman and I kinda love it.

[dehro]

Spoiler: ...Ye Who Enter Here

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Really, though, this episode was very exciting and I can hardly wait to watch the midseason finale. Some specific points (in no specific order):

• Agent 33 is creepy now (in a cool way). That face (and that reveal at the beginning), that voice...
• The show's just waiting for the right moment to finally say the word "Inhuman". It almost happened in Raina's conversation with Skye. Next episode, perhaps?
• I know "there's a storm coming" is a huge cliche, but I still love it whenever it's used for some reason. Fitz taking it literally (much like Dr. Watson) was also amusing.
• Ward's working against Whitehall and probably for Skye's Dad (in all likelihood just to get Skye's approval). Whitehall clearly knows they're up to something, though. Someone's gonna stab someone in the back and very soon.
• So what was it that possessed Mack, exactly? Anything from the comics?
• The Koenig brothers keep being a weird but amusing element.
• Bobbi is up to something. I'm very curious to find out what.
• What was behind the Bermuda Triangle, anyway?

Spoiler: in the same order

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• I still am a bit annoyed that they didn't just shoot her in the head once she was down. it would have been the logical thing to do. (although, she's sure to have told Whitehall all she knew about Coulson by now...and most of that is outdated anyway)
• I'm guessing inhuman will be a term coined by the media once they start popping up in public.
• yeah
• no, I think Ward is being the Joker in this situation.. the uncontrollable wildcard who follows only his own lunatic agenda. other than that, yeah, that threeway alliance is going to implode, one day soon.
• I'm guessing a variation of the berserker staff, used as a safety measure.
• I think they double bluffed and that there are indeed 13 of them around...12 now (reminds me of Zathras, Zathras and Zathras and... well.. you get it, from Babylon 5)
• I think she just doesn't want her ex husband to know that she and Mac have had a thing when they were on a break. (unlikely and probably not it, but that wouldn't surprise me either...)
• you're going to have to read those SHIELD files... but I wouldn't be surprised if Agent Carter gave us the answer to that.

also..

Spoiler: the Coulson moment

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"ooh, hats!"

[thorgrim29]

Wow, I just caught the season 1 netflix trailer... It was weird seeing Ward right in the middle of things.

Anyway, good episode as is the norm recently, anxious to see where it leads and steadily growing more and more exited about Agent Carter.

[The New Bruceski]

My vote for best line:

Spoiler

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"First you give us [what's-his-face] and now this? You really need to pick a side."
"Don't worry, I have."

Ward just doesn't know how not to be creepy any more.

[The New Bruceski]

By the way, if anyone hasn't figured out yet where AoS is taking this story there's a couple of things to note from the trailer for next week's episode and an alternate cover for Ultimate Avengers #1 next month. Spoilers for non-current episodes, obviously.

Spoiler

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Pay close attention to the floor, particularly the markings on the sides.

And in the trailer for next week Raina says "now we discover what we will become" or something like that, which is a big red Terrigen Mists sign.

[Dusk Eclipse]

Holy CARP I just watched the episode... seriously I have no other words to sum up my thoughts.

[Devonix]

Am I the only one annoyed with just how proficient Skye has become so fast. It really feels like they're gonna have Skye fight Ward one on one and have her beat him soon enough.

Now not only is she a super hacker, and Inhuman, she's also a master Marksman, and expert in hand to hand combat

[LaZodiac]

Am I the only one annoyed with just how proficient Skye has become so fast. It really feels like they're gonna have Skye fight Ward one on one and have her beat him soon enough.

Now not only is she a super hacker, and Inhuman, she's also a master Marksman, and expert in hand to hand combat

I wouldn't say she's expert, given that she couldn't beat Agent. And the only person she's succeeded in shooting was a non moving target.

I think it's justified, because she DID go through a lot of training off screen, and the fact that she IS an Inhuman might be part of WHY she's gotten so good so fast.

[Kitten Champion]

I've grown to like Skye now that they aren't writing her as the mysterious gutsy outsider who's part exposition tool and part Swiss army plot resolver with a romantic relationship I'm somehow supposed to give a damn about.

In this season her characterization is a zealously dedicated genius whose been spending every waking moment working to be the person she needs to be to protect her adopted family. They've toned down the sarcastic quips and moxy, moved the story ahead a couple months, and emphasized her doing training to make her development seem far less implausible.

It can still strain the suspension of disbelief, particularly because it really felt like the writers were trying to force the audience to like the character last season, but I think overall they've retooled her in a positive direction.

[LaZodiac]

I've grown to like Skye now that they aren't writing her as the mysterious gutsy outsider who's part exposition tool and part Swiss army plot resolver with a romantic relationship I'm somehow supposed to give a damn about.

In this season her characterization is a zealously dedicated genius whose been spending every waking moment working to be the person she needs to be to protect her adopted family. They've toned down the sarcastic quips and moxy, moved the story ahead a couple months, and emphasized her doing training to make her development seem far less implausible.

It can still strain the suspension of disbelief, particularly because it really felt like the writers were trying to force the audience to like the character last season, but I think overall they've retooled her in a positive direction.

That and the Mary Sue name joke made it clear they knew they oversold her and were making meaculpas.

I personally always liked Skye, because I felt it was cool to get someone who was outside Shield to be in Shield, to see how they all tick, and I'm glad they integrated her the way she did. I still have a secret hope that she's Miss Marvel, and I want all you peeps who know comics more then I do to search for everyone named Angel Eyes, because in her flashback/dream sequence where baby Skye is left on a table and her father (replaced with Coulson in her eyes because that's who she considers her father now) called her Angel Eyes, and I want to know if there is a connection here.

[Kitten Champion]

What aggravated me about Skye wasn't the Mary Sue elements or the feeling of being a somewhat too archetypal Whedon character. That was first season stuff that can be corrected as they got a better handle on the character. What annoyed me was they gave her a back-story as a hackitivist skeptical of the secretive and all-powerful SHIELD, which made her a perfect foil for these life-long SHIELD personnel who trust the system far too much, but around mid-season they pushed that aside almost entirely for her long-lost orphan character arc and... well, shipping. Her brief dalliance with her old hacker friend ended in both of them looking foolish, and she became naively attached to Coulson's group by the time Turn, Turn, Turn came about.

While it's all well and good to have heroic spies, even the current James Bond - a franchise which has absurdly romanticized espionage for decades - is more morally grey than SHIELD was until late season one. Having someone there acting like maybe this was all kind of problematic would have been an interesting source of conflict, particularly given what inevitably becomes of SHIELD.

Now, there was still some good stuff in there. In retrospect her relationship with Ward went from bland melodrama to one of the more interesting character dynamics of the show, her desire to find a home is a relatable motivation, and it set up the arc for the current season which is running strong. So I won't say they dropped the ball on her and simply that they zigged where I would have zagged.

What if, in stead, they made her arc about uncovering HYDRA? That as the series went on we had more snippets of her acting like Simmons did for HYDRA early in season two. That she starts to uncover the alarming truth bit by bit as the season went on, and at some point Ward discovers her espionage and decides - apparently out of concern for the organization he represents - to act like he's on Skye's side leading to a secret bond with romantic undertones between them as he puts a wedge of distrust between her and May/Coulson.

Skye's ultimate goal could have been to do what Black Widow did in Captain America: The Winter Soldier, pulling a Snowden on the whole organization for good or ill, but naturally she gets intercepted dramatically before she can go about it so the movie deals with the rest.

[LaZodiac]

The only problem with that is that season 1 suffered a great deal due to having to wait for Winter Soldier to drop the Hydra bomb, and having hints of it earlier in the season might of spoiled Winter Soldier. So it's a flaw they had to go with, for good or ill.

Mostly good though, because the quality of the show rose exponentially after Hydra was revealed. But yeah, I get what you mean, that would of been awesome.

[Flickerdart]

Am I the only one annoyed with just how proficient Skye has become so fast. It really feels like they're gonna have Skye fight Ward one on one and have her beat him soon enough.

Now not only is she a super hacker, and Inhuman, she's also a master Marksman, and expert in hand to hand combat

Expert, my ass. She could barely hold her own against a crippled Agent 33, who at her best wasn't able to beat May fresh out of brutal torture.

[Rakaydos]

Food for thought... but the Age of Ultrom movie is being spun as having a "well intentioned extremist" villian, possibly enviremental in nature.

Perhapse Ultron is "cleaning up" the "Terrogen Problem?"

Then, once they establish terrogen for the movie audience, they can start using inhumans as plot devices, like an inhuman vs AIM soldier fight in a crouded staduim that resuts in the aim soldier blowing up and killing thousands... to start Civil War: Captian America.

[Kitten Champion]

Food for thought... but the Age of Ultrom movie is being spun as having a "well intentioned extremist" villian, possibly enviremental in nature.

Perhapse Ultron is "cleaning up" the "Terrogen Problem?"

Then, once they establish terrogen for the movie audience, they can start using inhumans as plot devices, like an inhuman vs AIM soldier fight in a crouded staduim that resuts in the aim soldier blowing up and killing thousands... to start Civil War: Captian America.

I don't know if it'll tie in so directly as that, but the basic theory seems pretty sound based on the direction of the show thus far.

At the start of the season I wouldn't have credited that they'd really introduce Inhumans four years before the movie (which was generally assumed to be coming eventually based of rumours ) - or do anything as paradigm altering as that. However, it makes a great deal of sense from a franchise perspective to want them sooner than later. It also gives them a slight edge in explaining where Quicksilver and The Scarlet Witch come from, since re-imagining them as Inhumans is really their best option short of just saying "they have powers, because why not?"

Then there is the movie in 2018, in which case the thrust of the plot can be taken from the current Inhumans comics, where the Attilan monarchy is trying to establish its reign over the sudden flood of Inhumanity on Earth created after the release of a Terrigen bomb. By establishing the conflict now they can really have it grow over that time.

[Carl]

That and the Mary Sue name joke made it clear they knew they oversold her and were making meaculpas.

I've never really understood this line of thinking. TV show scripts, and often most or all of the shooting are complete long before we the viewer see them. If that episode wasn't actually filmed by the time AoS aired the script would certainly have been finished, particularly in a show that was as inter-tied as this.

I actually think Skye's issue was that she was mostly the only character for much of season 1 besides Coulson who was dynamic. All the other where fairly bland because they where all proverbial claymore's waiting to go off when winter soldier hit. It made Skye seem over focused which created a lot of the hate IMO via the impression it gave.


As for ongoing things. I'm a fair bit behind the curve on actual episodes but TVTropes recap page is letting me keep up.

Ward: I think Ward isn't quite as far gone as people think. Clearly Whitehall wasn't willing to let the Bus go, but Ward was willing to do so and seemingly willing to go through with it. Wards capable of being very sociopathic, but he isn't anywhere near as nasty or ruthless as HYDRA at large and seeing how exactly he takes Whithalls override next episode could be telling. For me in Ward i see someone who despite a very clear psychotic break in collage genuinely wants to be the good guy, but who's been so traumatized and so indoctrinated as to actually be incapable of that without a lot of effort and hard work by someone else, even if he's too messed up to see that. And thats a fairly important distinction in the end IMO.

Skye and the stuff posted about inhumans:

IMO i'm going to go out on a limb here and say that the blue guy wasn't actually a kree, just mistaken for one, as i recall reading the inhumans had a built in summoning protocol, if that was activated somehow it would explain his thoughts and if he had extreme regenerating abilities as a power it would explain the healing factor of the serum, something i believe being Kree doesn't, (and how it transfers the memories, it's rebuilding partly to his DNA), whilst neatly explaining why Skye isn't affected. As an Inhuman she allready has the map in her as part of the recall program.

However there's a really interesting point here. Somehow Skye's father has a LOT of info, of the sort only a well informed first hand source could provide. He may even be lying a bit to Whitehall and have even more accurate info he ain't sharing, (specifically the way the kree get the religious treatment seems at odds with the sciency part but a first hand account slightly re-interpreted would explain the discrepancies whilst much more of a gap should preclude him knowing so much about the diviner IMO). Either way it raises questions. If it is Skye's Father then how is it that he's survived all these years and how come Whitehall doesn't recognize him. And if not who? Skye's Mother is an obvious candidate. It couldn't be Raina though i wouldn't rule out her being way, way, way older, but her attitude is also a bit too religiousy for her to be a first hand source.

Questions, questions, questions....

EDIT: Regarding the dream's, not having caught upto that yet i can;t say for sure, but my guess is they don;t want to push Skye into some super combat monster if they activate her powers, (as seems likely), so unless they don't have that happen they have to come up with one. Having it be some kind of divination thing, aside from the pun, might work, and dreams are a common way to handle that, (possibly the GH35 acted as a weak trigger that's taking months to work).

[LaZodiac]

Ward: I think Ward isn't quite as far gone as people think.

Skye and the stuff posted about inhumans:

Concerning Ward, they've made it explicit this wasn't a "Collage break" and that he's been like this since a child. And trust me, if you see Ward and hear his acting...it's pretty clear that he's exactly as psychotic as he seems. But then that might be bias.

Concerning the Inhuman stuff, I DO think the Guest is a Kree, but a lot of what you made makes a lot of sense.

[Carl]

Concerning Ward, they've made it explicit this wasn't a "Collage break" and that he's been like this since a child. And trust me, if you see Ward and hear his acting...it's pretty clear that he's exactly as psychotic as he seems. But then that might be bias.

People don't just randomly decide to go try and do something like burn the house down with everyone inside for giggles. He's gone from actively loathing his family to being willing to kill them. Thats a big jump and it seems to have happened suddenly since you know he wasn't trying to kill them before that or anything. That's pretty much the definition of a breackdown.

[LaZodiac]

People don't just randomly decide to go try and do something like burn the house down with everyone inside for giggles. He's gone from actively loathing his family to being willing to kill them. Thats a big jump and it seems to have happened suddenly since you know he wasn't trying to kill them before that or anything. That's pretty much the definition of a breackdown.

People also don't beat their brother in the face with a screwdriver on a whim, but child Ward did that to his younger brother once. There's also the incident at the well. The senior Ward said that he wanted to push the youngest brother into the well, but that he couldn't so he asked Grant. Not that he said asked. Didn't force, didn't make him do it, but simply asked. It's clear Grant Ward was unhinged even as a child, and setting the house on fire was just him slipping into that insanity (again, like the senior Ward brother said. Sometimes he just got this look in his eye, like he was looking through you.)

Now, weather you think Grant doing the well torture or the screwdriver thing was him trying to kill his brother, or just "lashing out" depends on your own personal thoughts, because we really don't know for sure one way or the other. But we do know that after getting his brother to admit that he asked Ward to push the younger Ward down the well, and they all reconciled and stuff...he killed his parents and forced his brother to commit suicide and then burnt their house down. If he's not a psychopath as a kid, he clearly is one now.

[Carl]

AFAIK the whole incident with the screwdriver was something claimed by the older brother but never confirmed. As to the well. Trust me when you get subjected to enough abuse, (as i was when i was younger), there comes a point where you just start to go along with it because it's easier, because you just can't fight anymore. Now i never had anything as bad as the well incident, but i also never got anything like the abuse Ward did. His reaction in that situation is very human to me and reverberates with my own experiences. And a lot of literature on torture talks about the same phenomenon.

Also i never claimed he isn't a sociopath now. He absolutely is, but that moment in collage where he suddenly snaps and decides to drive a thousand miles home to burn the family home with everyone inside marks the moment he goes from mess up beaten down and broken to complete sociopath.

At the same time though him being a sociopath doesn't preclude him trying in his own mind to do what he thinks is the right thing. But he's so far gone now, both from the abuse induced sociopathy and garrets indoctrination, that telling right from wrong, or even the right methods from the wrong methods is beyond him.

[Joran]

I personally always liked Skye, because I felt it was cool to get someone who was outside Shield to be in Shield, to see how they all tick, and I'm glad they integrated her the way she did. I still have a secret hope that she's Miss Marvel, and I want all you peeps who know comics more then I do to search for everyone named Angel Eyes, because in her flashback/dream sequence where baby Skye is left on a table and her father (replaced with Coulson in her eyes because that's who she considers her father now) called her Angel Eyes, and I want to know if there is a connection here.

Spoiler: Skye speculations

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I'm not well-versed in Marvel comics, but the Kree have been described as "blue angels" so it could be a reference that she has alien DNA in her.

An interesting note (pun unintended) was that the music box in the dream sequence was playing "Daisy Bell". One of the popular theories for Skye's identity is Daisy Johnson AKA Quake. She was an Agent of SHIELD and daughter of Mr. Hyde. One of the popular theories for Skye's dad is Mr. Hyde, because he has super strength and a temper.

The other thing is that "Daisy Bell" is primarily known in pop culture as the song that HAL sang in 2001: A Space Odyssey and we know we're getting killer AIs in the next Avengers movie. XD

[Calemyr]

I think most of Ward's backstory is made up of "Shoot the dog" moments. Everything is set up so ambiguously that nobody - not even the writers - is certain which interpretation is the correct one.

The real question you have to ask is which interpretation of Christian Ward is accurate? Was he the put-upon older brother who has to shoulder the abuse of his mother and the insanity of his brother, or was he an all time mindscrew grand champion whom Rayna would give up her winning smile just to study under and learn his diabolical ways? Was the Well the work of an angry teen as desperate to justify his sins as he was to lash out, or was it all a craven attempt at revenge by manipulative coward using an impressionable little brother to bear the guilt of it all? Two people we have every reason to doubt are telling conflicting stories. Where can the truth be found?

[dehro]

fancy theories aside, we don't know that Skye her dad is an Inhuman. for all we know he's studied them and met his wife that way. She clearly must have been one of the special ones, what with having lived so long.. but there's no actual indication that he shares that same genetic peculiarity, other than that he can be quite an effective and brutal killer (but then, so can Ward who is 100% human as far as we know)

[Helanna]

So now that Agents of Shield is on Netflix, I'm finally getting my mom - who loves Marvel movies but doesn't usually have the patience for TV shows - to watch it.

So far she's really enjoying it. We just finished the third episode, and she expressed a great deal of dismay when it seemed as though Skye might betray the team. She was really upset at the idea that they would have to weave in a dramatic subplot that would ruin the happy little family they were building.

I can't wait.

[dehro]

So now that Agents of Shield is on Netflix, I'm finally getting my mom - who loves Marvel movies but doesn't usually have the patience for TV shows - to watch it.

So far she's really enjoying it. We just finished the third episode, and she expressed a great deal of dismay when it seemed as though Skye might betray the team. She was really upset at the idea that they would have to weave in a dramatic subplot that would ruin the happy little family they were building.

I can't wait.

I like the way you think hail Hydra

[LaZodiac]

I can't wait.

I would pay to see her face when Ward shoots Hand.

Anyway, concerning which of the Ward brothers to trust...I'm inclined to believe the Senator's side of things more. But only because it fits more with how I myself view Ward, and because I have reasons to believe that his confession was genuine. If it wasn't, if Senator Ward was really that manipulative, the instance Grant let his guard down to hug him he would of been tossed into that hole in the ground. I do believe Christian Ward honestly felt that they where making up, because he told the truth.

We saw how that turned out