Magical IVF in 3.5

[(Un)Inspired]

Now I'm honestly curious: Do you guys actually do some of the things you talk about, or is this just general forum talk? When I came back, I was looking to see if the op gained what he may have needed (though I notice that this is a bit older than I thought it was, so he might not have even seen my comment), so I was coming at it from a genuinely playable standpoint. Are Self Impregnating, Fully Aged Baby Birthing Characters -supposed- to be a thing?

I wouldn't personally do this sort of thing because

1) I almost always DM and never get a chance to be a player

2) When I do get the rare opportunity to go on adventures I'm not got bog myself down with a bloody booger muncher

That being said, If one of my players came up to me and proposed using IHS to conceive I would absolutely let them do it. Melee never gets to have nice things. I'm not about to take away their right to have kids.

I don't find the idea of practicing martial arts to the point that you have extreme-even supernatural bodily control any more ridiculous then going to a genie and wishing a babies into your uterus.

[INoKnowNames]

...

many thoughts about, yet all is but a torrent of confusion and twitchiness.

The only coherent comment I can make will probably be my last question to you on this subject: Would you sincerely find nothing at all ridiculous if, say a male character, or maybe an 75 year old half orc female, did the same thing? Like, is there a limit, or does anything go?

[(Un)Inspired]

...

many thoughts about, yet all is but a torrent of confusion and twitchiness.

The only coherent comment I can make will probably be my last question to you on this subject: Would you sincerely find nothing at all ridiculous if, say a male character, or maybe an 75 year old half orc female, did the same thing?

Yes it's totally ridiculous but this is a fantasy game we're talking about.

Is a 75 year old woman getting pregnant through kung fu pathenogensis any more ridiculous that a person who turns into a bear and shoots hurricanes at people?

Is it any more ridiculous that casting a spell that blast the blood out of someone's pores into a net around them that entraps their allies?

It's definitely not a ridiculous as the number of adventurers that go around fighting with spiked chains.

[INoKnowNames]

Yes it's totally ridiculous but this is a fantasy game we're talking about.

Is a 75 year old woman getting pregnant through kung fu pathenogensis any more ridiculous that a person who turns into a bear and shoots hurricanes at people?

Is it any more ridiculous that casting a spell that blast the blood out of someone's pores into a net around them that entraps their allies?

It's definitely not a ridiculous as the number of adventurers that go around fighting with spiked chains.

That's the thing about magic. The rules of reality apply less when you're given cartblanche to ignore them. Martial Arts, on the other hand, is based on reality, and while there are people who can easily punch you a good 20 times in 6 seconds and make each punch hurt like hell, or who can react swift enough to catch an arrow out of the air or use a bladed weapon to hit it before it can hit them, I've never heard of a martial artist who could impregnate himself.

The stereotype is that magic is allowed to do these things, because that's what magic does. It's like that most water looks blue, or that most fish live in water, or that most birds can fly. It's a naturally assumed constant in most situations. That's why it's far easier for me to swallow a lesbian couple asking a Genie/Angel/God to bless them with a child, or some of your examples of what are actually rather reasonable due to how the fantasy genre works but are being framed as ridiculous, than the idea of someone being able to impregnate themselves with kung fu, which in most cases genuinely is grounded in reality. I've never heard of a Wuxia like story where the main character could Martial Art himself life... I -COULD- genuinely see someone who was made infertile gaining enough control over their body to -fix- that, but self fertilization is a step beyond that...

I mean, I like my fighters being able to jump 50 feet and cut Tyranosaurus Rex's in half while they do it, but I mean.... well dang, even I have a limit on things that I find silly.

And I happen to like the spiked chain in real life as a weapon. Not allowed to walk around with an actual weapon, but a nice long length of chain can be spun and swung to put a hurt on someone. Works for me.

So yes, I sincerely do find that more ridiculous, even as I accept the existence of Dragons, Spells, and Fairies. Maybe I need to be mindraped until it makes sense.

Edit: Like, I'm not trying to be rude, and if I'm failing at that, I'm honestly sorry. This really is just supposed to be a conversation. I'm just honestly trying to wrap my head around this, and it's like.... zuh?

[(Un)Inspired]

I don't find what you're saying to be rude at all. On the contrary, I'm enjoying the conversation.

I don't have a problem with spiked chains as a weapon in general. It the Dungeons and Dragons spiked chain that I hate with a passion. Haveyou seen what it looks like in the artwork? It's got to be the stupidest thing in the universe:

http://www.dmfiat.com/wp-content/upl...3/04/chain.jpg

It wielding by holding it near the middle and swing both ends simultaneously. So lame.

[INoKnowNames]

I don't find what you're saying to be rude at all. On the contrary, I'm enjoying the conversation.

Thank goodness.

I don't have a problem with spiked chains as a weapon in general. It the Dungeons and Dragons spiked chain that I hate with a passion. Haveyou seen what it looks like in the artwork? It's got to be the stupidest thing in the universe:

http://www.dmfiat.com/wp-content/upl...3/04/chain.jpg

It wielding by holding it near the middle and swing both ends simultaneously. So lame.

.... what the **** is that?! That's not a spiked chain; that's some Klingon bullcrap! Who the hell drew that?! How are you supposed to use that without stabbing yourself?!

[Red Rubber Band]

.... what the **** is that?! That's not a spiked chain; that's some Klingon bullcrap! Who the hell drew that?! How are you supposed to use that without stabbing yourself?!

Iron Heart Surge.


Also INoKnowNames, (Un)Inspired and Venger, I very much enjoyed your comments on the last page

[Kazyan]

Now I'm honestly curious: Do you guys actually do some of the things you talk about, or is this just general forum talk?

Though the forum once liked to use half-joking TO in response to everything, people have largely stopped with the "half-joking" part. I hang around because this place has stimulating information, but the D&D 3.5 I actually play is so unlike the D&D 3.5 discussed on this forum that, if you doubled the differences, you would get something like V:tM.

[(Un)Inspired]

INoKnowNames, (Un)Inspired and Venger, I very much enjoyed your comments on the last page

Thanks, we're here all week.

[Sith_Happens]

But getting back on the serious track, er, relatively speaking. I suppose if you don't want to be evil, and finding a Wizard skilled enough to Wish or a Cleric Clericked enough to Miracle for you, the Candle of Invocation isn't too much more costly than the third-party magic item, and one would guess if you were on good enough grounds with the good guys or maybe did a favor for team wings and halos, maybe a Solar would be willing to spot you a Wish. I mean, yeah, you typically don't want Candles of Invocations in play just due to their mechanics at that cost, and maybe the rest of your party might think you're a little bit crazy wasteful, but you can't put a price on RP Motives and using a decidedly game-wrecking item in a decidedly not-game-wrecking way.

I like this idea. A lot.

"I AM EZKALIEL, COMMANDER OF THE FIFTH LEGION OF HEIRONEOUS. WHAT IS THY BIDDING, MORTAL?

"I want you to Wish that the next time she [*points*] has sex with me, that I become pregnant with a child to which each of us is one of the parents."

"UM... OKAY."

*points Detect Evil at you to know whether you and your future kid need to be kept on watch (as I assume is standard procedure)*

*does the thing*

*vanishes*


"A PRODUCTIVE DIVERSION, COMMANDER?"


"TECHNICALLY YES. TWO-AND-A-HALF MILLION YEARS IN THIS FORM AND I AM STILL SURPRISED BY THE THINGS I GET CALLED FOR SOMETIMES..."

I'ma.... I'ma go out on a limb and say no, that's not normal. Despite what people like to say about it, Iron Heart Surge wasn't designed to remove the sun or the game rules, let alone impregnate it's user.

I like how becoming pregnant is the "let alone" rather than turning off the sun.

I've never heard of a martial artist who could impregnate himself.

Maybe not in real life, but in myth anything goes and that should really be your comparison point when the other guy is doing, you know, magic.

[TypoNinja]

Ah, found something. The False... er, Phallus on page 138. Basically, a female character straps it on and...

...Actually I'll just post the crafting requirements:



Amusingly, they didn't include rules to take it off when you're... done. But a dispel magic to suppress it for 1d4 rounds should take care of that.

Ok, I've been giggling about this, and tormenting my friends with the pun for days now. I was trying to be mature and serious but I have to share.

Spoiler for NSFW gag.

Spoiler

Show

I'm a horrible person for this, but... The magical Phallus here is a slotless magic item.

*snerk* Slotless. Well, once you've equipped it anyway....

[Eldan]

I'ma.... I'ma go out on a limb and say no, that's not normal. Despite what people like to say about it, Iron Heart Surge wasn't designed to remove the sun or the game rules, let alone impregnate it's user. Just because the Raw is crappy about how it does it's job doesn't mean it's supposed to have been the end all be all for Yukari Yakumo esque shenanigans.

It probably wasn't intended that way, but honestly, in a world where casters create new worlds and new civilizations where no man has gone before, I have no problem at all with martial arts masters who do some ridiculous things, so I allow some shenanigans within reason. Given that pregnancy would mostly be a fluff thing anyway and not done for mechanical power, I'd allow it. Perhaps with some training quest involving a hermit on a distant mountain and a few fertility-themed fae, but still.

Now I'm honestly curious: Do you guys actually do some of the things you talk about, or is this just general forum talk? When I came back, I was looking to see if the op gained what he may have needed (though I notice that this is a bit older than I thought it was, so he might not have even seen my comment), so I was coming at it from a genuinely playable standpoint. Are Self Impregnating, Fully Aged Baby Birthing Characters -supposed- to be a thing?

Pregnancy has never come up in my games, as far as I recall. But given the generally more high-magic nature of my games, if a player came to me and said "My character would like to have a child, but she can't be pregnant while adventuring", then yes, I'd help them figure something out, likely involving shapeshifting, fertility rites and, depending on the character in question and their morals, surrogate mothers, flesh-shaping or just extracting the baby into some kind of flesh sac that acts as an artificial uterus and can be stored in extradimensional storage.

Solved with high-magic, yes, solved with silly RAW-abuse, no.

That's the thing about magic. The rules of reality apply less when you're given cartblanche to ignore them. Martial Arts, on the other hand, is based on reality, and while there are people who can easily punch you a good 20 times in 6 seconds and make each punch hurt like hell, or who can react swift enough to catch an arrow out of the air or use a bladed weapon to hit it before it can hit them, I've never heard of a martial artist who could impregnate himself.

The stereotype is that magic is allowed to do these things, because that's what magic does. It's like that most water looks blue, or that most fish live in water, or that most birds can fly. It's a naturally assumed constant in most situations. That's why it's far easier for me to swallow a lesbian couple asking a Genie/Angel/God to bless them with a child, or some of your examples of what are actually rather reasonable due to how the fantasy genre works but are being framed as ridiculous, than the idea of someone being able to impregnate themselves with kung fu, which in most cases genuinely is grounded in reality. I've never heard of a Wuxia like story where the main character could Martial Art himself life... I -COULD- genuinely see someone who was made infertile gaining enough control over their body to -fix- that, but self fertilization is a step beyond that...

I mean, I like my fighters being able to jump 50 feet and cut Tyranosaurus Rex's in half while they do it, but I mean.... well dang, even I have a limit on things that I find silly.

And I happen to like the spiked chain in real life as a weapon. Not allowed to walk around with an actual weapon, but a nice long length of chain can be spun and swung to put a hurt on someone. Works for me.

So yes, I sincerely do find that more ridiculous, even as I accept the existence of Dragons, Spells, and Fairies. Maybe I need to be mindraped until it makes sense.

Edit: Like, I'm not trying to be rude, and if I'm failing at that, I'm honestly sorry. This really is just supposed to be a conversation. I'm just honestly trying to wrap my head around this, and it's like.... zuh?

I don't like this argument. Never have. Magic isn't based on the real world. Why should fighting be? There's probably far more precedent in legend and myth for fighters doing ridiculous things than wizards. If only because full wizard-type shenanigans rarely come up, it's mostly divine power, providence, the divine right of kings, or some such. If I put a Solomon or Circe or Väinämöinen into my world, I have no problem putting in a Heracles or Cu Chulainn or, hm, anyone in the Three Kingdoms, really.

Edit: and if you don't think martial arts can do that kind of thing in fiction, you need to read more Chinese myth. And Wuxia based on it.

[Know(Nothing)]

Yes, exactly.

To anyone, DM or player, who would genuinely argue that heterosexual intercourse(or a magical reiteration thereof) is the ONLY method of conceiving in a world which is inherently full of magic that could supersede that-- what do you care? What motivates you to be so against such an idea? Does that ruin the game for you? Do you think it's broken?

It's a flavor choice in a game that is all-too-often devoted to what is most powerful instead of what makes a better story or character. This shouldn't be hemmed in by heteronormative interpretations of what "should" make a baby. There is a spell that specifically only makes people dance. This is firmly in DM fiat territory, and again, if the DM has druthers that force you into a creepily sex-toy-based side-quest as your only option, you should find a new DM.

[toapat]

So no other items exist that achieve the desired effect?

Every magic belt in a Drow Necropolis? Seriously it seems almost Absurd that between the lack of risk in 3rd of using The Girdle, and Lolth's immortal outrage, that male drow would not be virtually non-existant.

Now I wonder if you could surgically implant a fetus into a new mother in D&D and then use some kind of regeneration magic to connect it properly.

Regeneration is worded loosely enough to allow the possibility of asexual reproduction with the proper scrying devices and an incorporeal caster

Does anyone know if a thread about optimizing the magic strap on would violate forum rules? Because I kind of want to accept this challenge.

No, but you just need to give a belt the Drawback curse of gender inversion. its a natural -1 enhancement modifier. Any discussion further then this about said belt is raw modbait

And this is why people ban the weeaboo fightin' magicks book. Bloody Kung Fu masters are so OP they can self procreate. Creating a whole army of the buggers! It only takes 9 months. One weeaboo at a time.

No, see, you arent using IHS properly. A crusader uses it every 6 seconds to in order: Genesis spawn, Cause Spawn to reach young adulthood, Train to perfect competence the spawn's class, then perfect their attributes.

Every 30 seconds this army of Crusaders doubles in number.

[Urpriest]

For the record, I wouldn't allow IHS to accomplish parthenogenesis...but I'd probably allow a similar mechanic on a T2 martial class like the Teramach or Bellator. Inducing parthenogenesis seems more in the realm of T2 than T3 thematically speaking, even if practically it has nothing to do with the tier system.

[OracleofWuffing]

I like this idea. A lot.

I was thinking of hamming up the whole "We have true love" angle, but yeah, otherwise spot-on with how I pictured it.

[INoKnowNames]

Iron Heart Surge.

...

I'd be pissed off at you for that answer if I hadn't walked right the **** into it. And even if I were, I'm still laughing so hard I'm vomiting, so I guess I can't be too upset.

Though the forum once liked to use half-joking TO in response to everything, people have largely stopped with the "half-joking" part. I hang around because this place has stimulating information, but the D&D 3.5 I actually play is so unlike the D&D 3.5 discussed on this forum that, if you doubled the differences, you would get something like V:tM.

I remember when I first came to the forum and got introduced to Tome of Battle and accepted that the Fighter is either a glorified door opener or two feat dip without splats or optimization... How far do you go from there to get to "Mind Switching an Ice Assassins of an Alex"?

Spoiler: Snipped

Show

"I AM EZKALIEL, COMMANDER OF THE FIFTH LEGION OF HEIRONEOUS. WHAT IS THY BIDDING, MORTAL?

"I want you to Wish that the next time she [*points*] has sex with me, that I become pregnant with a child to which each of us is one of the parents."

"UM... OKAY."

*points Detect Evil at you to know whether you and your future kid need to be kept on watch (as I assume is standard procedure)*

*does the thing*

*vanishes*


"A PRODUCTIVE DIVERSION, COMMANDER?"


"TECHNICALLY YES. TWO-AND-A-HALF MILLION YEARS IN THIS FORM AND I AM STILL SURPRISED BY THE THINGS I GET CALLED FOR SOMETIMES..."

See, except for the part after vanishes, and only because I feel like that's a reference to something that went over my head, I don't see why that just couldn't be a thing in the first place.

I like how becoming pregnant is the "let alone" rather than turning off the sun.

Because turning off the sun was the joke at least a year ago, and now it's flexing so hard you grow ovaries.

Maybe not in real life, but in myth anything goes and that should really be your comparison point when the other guy is doing, you know, magic.

It probably wasn't intended that way, but honestly, in a world where casters create new worlds and new civilizations where no man has gone before, I have no problem at all with martial arts masters who do some ridiculous things, so I allow some shenanigans within reason.

I honestly don't have any problem with martial art masters who are so good at what they do that even their extraordinary abilities look as if they are Gods in mortal form; punching hard enough to break through metal and steel effortlessly, jumping over mountains or even from continent to continent, stomping hard enough to cause earthquakes, and sword skills that do rival any other being in existence. I'm legitimately fine with that. There's a direct correlation in that that makes sense in my head: Real World Fighting = Bruce Lee. Fantasy World Fighting = Super Heroes.

Given that pregnancy would mostly be a fluff thing anyway and not done for mechanical power, I'd allow it.

This, on the other hand, honestly just doesn't make sense, and I don't think I can justify something that even with suspension of disbelief, completely throws my head out of the gam-why is having a baby, having heirs, descendants, the core struggle of the existence of most creatures after living, considered so unimportant? Because that's honestly the impression I get.

Perhaps with some training quest involving a hermit on a distant mountain and a few fertility-themed fae, but still.

If a hermit exists who could teach you how to impregnate yourself, why would not the clerics or spellcasters or other mythical creatures that also exist not -you even note the existence for fertility-themed fae; couldn't they do the job themselves? I'm honestly just having so much trouble imagining self-impregnation fu. Closest I get are demons or monsters that can lay eggs...

Pregnancy has never come up in my games, as far as I recall. But given the generally more high-magic nature of my games, if a player came to me and said "My character would like to have a child, but she can't be pregnant while adventuring", then yes, I'd help them figure something out, likely involving shapeshifting, fertility rites and, depending on the character in question and their morals, surrogate mothers, flesh-shaping or just extracting the baby into some kind of flesh sac that acts as an artificial uterus and can be stored in extradimensional storage.

Solved with high-magic, yes, solved with silly RAW-abuse, no.

See, while a bit of the end of that sounds a bit squicky (I could never be a nurse/doctor), all of that sounds generally reasonable. That doesn't seem so alien or out of place as a gamer that it doesn't wreck my idea of immersion.

I don't like this argument. Never have. Magic isn't based on the real world. Why should fighting be?

I'm not arguing that fighting needs to be grounded in what can be done in the real world. I'm arguing that the idea of someone who can pop a squat so hard they grow a uterus sounds ridiculous.

There's probably far more precedent in legend and myth for fighters doing ridiculous things than wizards. If only because full wizard-type shenanigans rarely come up, it's mostly divine power, providence, the divine right of kings, or some such. If I put a Solomon or Circe or Väinämöinen into my world, I have no problem putting in a Heracles or Cu Chulainn or, hm, anyone in the Three Kingdoms, really.

I have no problem with martial characters going beyond the beyond and making even the local god of war **** himself. I've just never read a story in which Heracles toned his biceps so hard he could grow his own baby in him, and then flex it again to pop out a full grown Heracles Jr.

Edit: and if you don't think martial arts can do that kind of thing in fiction, you need to read more Chinese myth. And Wuxia based on it.

I probably do, so long as it doesn't edge into Hentai. I'm just saying, Sun Wukong was one of the most broken people in myth I've ever read off, and I don't recall him impregnating himself. Even though he can make infinity clones of himself with his own hair, or cartwheel from one end of the universe to the other quicker than the time it took to make this post, there's a certain stigma in my mind about genuine reproduction that no amount of push ups or punching boards would allow one to master.

Bruce Lee, Chuck Norris, Jackie Chan, Gilgamesh, Iron Fist, Super Man; pretty freaking strong guys good at amazing things. Last time I checked, none of them could sit up so hard a baby falls out.

Yes, exactly.

To anyone, DM or player, who would genuinely argue that 1 heterosexual intercourse(or a magical reiteration thereof) is the ONLY method of conceiving in a world which is inherently full of magic that could supersede that-- 2 what do you care? What motivates you to be so against such an idea? Does that ruin the game for you? 3 Do you think it's broken?

It's a flavor choice in a game that is all-too-often devoted to what is most powerful instead of4 what makes a better story or character. This shouldn't be hemmed in by heteronormative interpretations of what "should" make a baby. There is a spell that specifically only makes people dance. This is firmly in DM fiat territory, and again, 5 if the DM has druthers that force you into a creepily sex-toy-based side-quest as your only option, you should find a new DM.

In order of the bolded:
1) While I may be the only person with a somewhat negative sounding view, I want to make it absolutely clear that that is infact not what I'm arguing. My argument is the "IRON HEART SURGE (I'm not pregnant!). Peep this scenario; F-Rogue, F-Cleric, M-Warblade, M-Wizard

Clarisa, I'm pregnant!
Oh Racheal, my prayers to Ehlonna were answered! Yay!
Congradulations to the both of you!
Pffbt. Pregnancy is easy. Check this out! *Grunt* Totally preggers now.
... I don't think that's how it works.
I'm pretty sure that's now how it works.
Nah, nah, it's totally legit! Watch! *Grunt, belly appears* Yup. There's a baby in there.
What? Isn't that supposed to take a few months? What is going on?
More importantly, if you are pregnant, where does it come out?
.... good question. Let's find out! *Grunt-[censored/redacted]
OH GOOD LORD IT'S EVERYWHERE!
Sigh... let's clean him up so I can raise him...

I can not be the only one who finds that a bit ridiculous.

2) ... I feel like the above answers that, too, actually.

3) Broken? No. The Alaex MindSwitching Ice Assassin stuff is broken. The above, which is the only thing I object to, is just silly.

4) That's why I dislike the above; it sounds entirely stupid from a story based perspective.

5) I 100% agree.

For the record, I wouldn't allow IHS to accomplish parthenogenesis...but I'd probably allow a similar mechanic on a T2 martial class like the Teramach or Bellator. Inducing parthenogenesis seems more in the realm of T2 than T3 thematically speaking, even if practically it has nothing to do with the tier system.

Okay, so I'm not entirely crazy then. Though I don't know what a Teramach or Bellator is...

Overall Edit: Like, if your game is that silly, then by all means, go ahead. I'm not trying to demand you play a certain way. The best thing about roleplaying is more or less doing whatever you want. But please, for what little grasp at sanity I believe I had, don't tell me that that isn't just plain silly. I thought I was still sane. Please don't take that from me.

[Urpriest]

Okay, so I'm not entirely crazy then. Though I don't know what a Teramach or Bellator is...

Homebrew T2 martial classes by Xefas. The Bellator is the Fighter analog, the Teramach is the Barbarian. I haven't read through the Bellator yet, but high level Teramachs are essentially avatars of rage and hate. A high level Teramach can have a horde of rage-filled followers so devoted/crazy that when they die the follower who manages to dominate the others takes on the original Teramach's identity, eventually becoming the original in every way that matters, so that the horde can never truly be defeated.

In a world containing things like that I could imagine a high level Bellator inducing parthenogenesis in a flavorful way. Imagine a female warrior defined by self-sufficiency, who accepts no assistance from any outsider and who no man can touch (and live). One day, she travels into the mountains, returning in nine months with a babe in her arms. While some say that she merely adopted another's child or found a man to lie with, those who have seen her know that she birthed the child purely from herself, through pure force of will, needing no other to complete the closed circle of her existence.

[INoKnowNames]

See, that sounds cool! I could see that happening in a story and flowing rhythmically. It's all in how eloquently you put it, and that sounds far more elegant than "I Iron Heart Surge away not being pregnant".

I hope Xefas has these classes in his signature or something. If nothing else, the Teramach sounds worth a look.

[animewatcha]

There is a semi-Raw way to achieve this. Like toapat said, there is a curse-drawback for this, but ( going by the d20srd on this so I don't know the actual source ) the curse doesn't work like he/she said it would ( no minus 1 modifier or direction inversion ).

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/cursedItems.htm

30-32 has that the character's gender changes. There is no specifics as to what it changes to. So one of you could be 'cursed' to be a hermaphrodite or shemale. Heck, it can even be a 'quest' to redeem the cursed object.

[Eldan]

I'm not arguing that fighting needs to be grounded in what can be done in the real world. I'm arguing that the idea of someone who can pop a squat so hard they grow a uterus sounds ridiculous.

[There were more points, but this was the essence of it]

I'm not saying that it's done by flexing. But fighting, especially at higher levels, involves a lot of mastering one's own body. Why could one not, with meditation techniques, body control, perhaps a spark of divine blood, become pregnant? I'm not saying "grow uterus". I'm just saying a meditation technique that allows parthenogenesis in a woman is not outside what I'd still include in a high-level world if necessary.

[INoKnowNames]

[There were more points, but this was the essence of it]

I'm glad you understood the essence of it. I know I talk way too freaking much about everything, even when only one part is the important part.

I'm not saying that it's done by flexing. But fighting, especially at higher levels, involves a lot of mastering one's own body. Why could one not, with meditation techniques, body control, perhaps a spark of divine blood, become pregnant? I'm not saying "grow uterus". I'm just saying a meditation technique that allows parthenogenesis in a woman is not outside what I'd still include in a high-level world if necessary.

See, that sounds cool! I could see that happening in a story and flowing rhythmically. It's all in how eloquently you put it, and that sounds far more elegant than "I Iron Heart Surge away not being pregnant".

As I just said, I'd be willing to see something like that out of a high level character, so long as it is done tastefully and with a bit of class.

nine months?

uhhh, just IHS the condition "not finished having baby" away and ecce homo, you've got your little tyke all ready.

Yeah but then you IHS again and Fiat Homo, you've got an useful adult instead of a little poop-factory sprog

Belt of Genderchange exists. Use it, get a baby, then throw it away.

Who needs to be sold on things nowadays? Use Mindrape and she'll be totally okay with it. Remove the spell afterwards. Rogue's got a baby, mission complete.

That does not imply tastefulness or class.

There is a semi-Raw way to achieve this. Like toapat said, there is a curse-drawback for this, but ( going by the d20srd on this so I don't know the actual source ) the curse doesn't work like he/she said it would ( no minus 1 modifier or direction inversion ).

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/cursedItems.htm

30-32 has that the character's gender changes. There is no specifics as to what it changes to. So one of you could be 'cursed' to be a hermaphrodite or shemale. Heck, it can even be a 'quest' to redeem the cursed object.

Op already said that changing genders is looked down upon as an option. I think that was like the 1st thing suggested, actually.

[Zakerst]

Possible "reasonable" interpretation of IHSing a baby into yourself, you know how eggs develop and in the end you get 3 junk cells and one egg with an X in it well the solution is you have such control over yourself that rather than forming in the native fashion you produce an egg with 2 Xs (already fertilized effectively) which then goes on as eggs do (you may need to get the IHS to change some hormonal things and the like but that should be easy considering it fixes just about everything else. You end up with a "kinda clone" of yourself, the rough genetic structure will be the same but the exact ordering of genes will be slightly different due to crossing over and possible mutations.

Weather or not its a valid target for IHS is questionable but it seems a semi-plausible method at least as far as the DND cosmos is concerned. And this is presumably even kinda permissible in places where IHSing the Sun away doesn't work (I'd say you IHS away your vulnerability for a time but would be weak to further sudden exposure but that's besides the point).

[One Step Two]

I'm glad you understood the essence of it. I know I talk way too freaking much about everything, even when only one part is the important part.

As I just said, I'd be willing to see something like that out of a high level character, so long as it is done tastefully and with a bit of class.

That does not imply tastefulness or class.

I understand what you mean, to quote: "Procedure is important." - General Tarquin

It's one thing to simply say: "I become pregnant as a standard action!" No Matter how you come about it it seems klunky and it destroys immersion.
Like any good story, it requires more than just for an event to occur, trials tribulations and, emotions, play a vital role. That said, I submit the following:


The warrior sage, Silent Bells Wisdom, worked in solitude in her secluded Dojo reflecting upon her herself, she tended to the rock garden which had helped smooth her wrinkled thoughts many times in her life. A lifetime of battle which left many different signs, from the deadly grace of her step and casual wariness in her eyes, to the small scars of battles that had been much harder than others. She faced a different battle now, one in which her adventurous lifestyle had left her much alone. She feared now that her years of knowledge that may go wasted.

She herself had sat at the foot of the indomitable Reshar himself as a girl, and earned much more wisdom since then had much to teach. She had trained and lived with many warriors, from the bloodthirsty mercenaries of Lashers Keep, to the silent monks of the Alabaster Crown monastery, and all those things would be lost without a legacy.
With a somewhat defeated sigh she returned the rake to it's stand and made her way to the sparring chamber inside. Meditation brought calm, but working the Nine Forms brought its own clarity, from the brash but insightful Desert Wind, to the inspiration that can be found in White Raven.

It was during her meditation of battle that her first lessons returned to her, "Control of the weapon as a tool for battle is only the first step. Control of the body so that it may become a perfect tool for your soul is the final one." She stopped mid-stance, as an idea began to form in her mind.
She hurriedly left the dojo, stopping only to take a quaterstaff to aid her climb.

Weeks later Silent Bells Wisdom sat upon the peak of a tall mountain with her legs crossed, the staff across her knees. There was little life here save for the sparse grass that tried desperately to reach through the snow, and but for the soft rushes of the wind, there was nothing else. It was that nothingness she focused on, forming a perfect void in her mind. In that void she summoned herself, her own avatar, and began to focus on her training, on the long years that had given her not only mastery of the Nine Swords, but over her own body as well.

When she finally opened her eyes, she looked down expecting to find her belly had grown slightly but she knew that was not the way, not yet at least. She was with child and it filled her with joy, and determination. Smiling serenely, she knew knew that her legacy would be passed on. Taking up her staff, she stood and began to walk down from the mountain, the ground now carpeted in hundreds of newly blossoming flowers.

[toapat]

I can not be the only one who finds that a bit ridiculous.

Although i accept that i suggested having the Idiot Crusader clone themselves twice per minute, that doesnt actually mean i accept that IHS is supposed to do that or that its good storytelling. I dont think ANYONE in this thread thinks IHS spam (although IHS being used to conceive magically id say should be allowed to fly. Just not Spamming it) is acceptable for having a kid, only that its absurd, fits the most literal interpretation of the wording of IHS, and technically solves the OP's problem if not really in a way anyone really wants to say "yes".

The magic strapon seems to be the most useful solution presented other then rituals by clerics of progressive goddesses of fertility. And at least as far as RAW and lore goes in 3rd, it seems almost guaranteed that every belt in a faerun drow necropolis would be of the "magical conception aide" variety

alternatively, whichever caster in the party has access to Bestow Curse or the like can hit them with a simple "-4 Penalty to <lets say Use Psionic Device>, subject can be impregnated by women"

Must. Resist. Urge. to. create. "pureblood". Drow.

[Zakerst]

A more time screwy method might involve more bootstrapping/bad wolfing: The child is going to become an powerful wizard or similar, for reasons (my go to in this case is time war with another wizard) has to go back in time and insure he/she is conceived.

The easiest solutions might be placing his/her mother on the quest for the golden phallus, that he/she half remembers from when he/she asked about reproduction.

The next more direct method would be to be the solution him/herself and use wish/miracle to get the job done (other less alignment friendly options also exist along this line of thought).

Depending on methodologies and contingent spells and what not I might not be possible for him/her to safely use wish or what not to do so. Perhaps then the solution might lie with IHS (I am not conceived/existent) making the mother pregnant.

note the above can all be preformed by any heir along the line, think futurama.

[Kazyan]

I dont think ANYONE in this thread thinks IHS spam (although IHS being used to conceive magically id say should be allowed to fly. Just not Spamming it) is acceptable for having a kid, only that its absurd, fits the most literal interpretation of the wording of IHS, and technically solves the OP's problem if not really in a way anyone really wants to say "yes".

Then why is everyone arguing for how much sense it supposedly makes?

[Urpriest]

Then why is everyone arguing for how much sense it supposedly makes?

Nobody's arguing for how much sense it makes. There are people, me included, arguing that it makes sense for a single use, but not spamming it.

[Shieldbunny]

Getting back to the question at hand.

1. Obtain scroll of Shapechange, and a Wand of Reincarnation.

2. Use UMD to activate Shapechange, turning yourself into a sea cucumber.

3. Bud off a baby.

4. Dismiss Shapechange.

5. Kill your baby.

6. UMD the wand of Reincarnation on the corpse.

7. Repeat Steps 5 & 6 until you roll human.

Yeah your baby is now young adult without having the prerequisite experience, but there are established ways to fix that.

[(Un)Inspired]

Getting back to the question at hand.

1. Obtain scroll of Shapechange, and a Wand of Reincarnation.

2. Use UMD to activate Shapechange, turning yourself into a sea cucumber.

3. Bud off a baby.

4. Dismiss Shapechange.

5. Kill your baby.

6. UMD the wand of Reincarnation on the corpse.

7. Repeat Steps 5 & 6 until you roll human.

Yeah your baby is now young adult without having the prerequisite experience, but there are established ways to fix that.

Non-humanoids don't come back as humanoids.