New OOTS products from CafePress
New OOTS t-shirts, ornaments, mugs, bags, and more
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 30 of 52
  1. - Top - End - #1
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Swordmage

    Class Features:
    Hit Die 1d10
    Hit Points at First Level: 10+con modifier
    Hit points at later levels: 1d10 (or 6) + constitution modifier per Swordmage level.

    Proficiencies:
    simple weapons
    Longswords, rapiers, scimitars, shortsword.
    light armor
    medium armor

    Starting Equipment
    (a)Chain Shirt or (b)Leather Armor
    (a)Two Scimitars or (b) Longsword
    (a)An Explorer's Pack or (b)a Scholar's Pack
    A dagger and 20 darts.

    Save proficiencies: intelligence and constitution.

    Tool Proficiencies: none.

    Skill Proficiencies: choose two from arcana, history, investigation, survival, athletics, or perception.

    Spell caster ability: Intelligence.

    Spell focus: you may use any weapon you are proficient with as a focus for your spells.

    Blade Chant: You have learned to compel reality with the rhythm of your blade and a soft chant. You recover all of your spell slots after a short or long rest.

    Level Proficiency Bonus Features Spells Known Spell Slots Spell Slot Level Focus Points Eldritch Strikes Damage
    1 +2 Insightful Dodge, Eldritch Strikes, Blade Chant 2 1 1st 1d8
    2 +2 Swordmage Warding 3 2 1st 2 1d8
    3 +2 Discipline Feature, Sword Bond 4 2 1st 3 1d8
    4 +2 Ability Score Improvement 5 2 2nd 4 2d8
    5 +3 6 2 2nd 5 2d8
    6 +3 Grimoire of the Soul 7 2 3rd 6 2d8
    7 +3 Discipline Feature 8 2 3rd 7 2d8
    8 +3 Ability Score Improvement 9 2 3rd 8 3d8
    9 +4 10 2 4th 9 3d8
    10 +4 Discipline Feature (Student of Malediction) 10 2 4th 10 3d8
    11 +4 11 3 4th 11 3d8
    12 +4 Ability Score Improvement 11 3 4th 12 4d8
    13 +5 12 3 5th 13 4d8
    14 +5 12 3 5th 14 4d8
    15 +5 Discipline Feature 13 3 5th 15 4d8
    16 +5 Ability Score Improvement 13 3 5th 16 5d8
    17 +6 14 4 5th 17 5d8
    18 +6 14 4 5th 18 5d8
    19 +6 Ability Score Improvement 15 4 5th 19 5d8
    20 +6 Reclaim Soul 15 4 5th 20 6d8



    Eldritch Strikes: As an action, you may make a spell attack with a weapon with which you are proficient. This is a melee spell attack if used with a melee weapon or a ranged spell attack if used with a ranged weapon. This attack deals 1d8 + your intelligence modifier force damage. This damage increases as you level, as shown in the Eldritch Strike Damage column of the table.

    Soul bond: At 3rd level, you learn to implant a piece of your soul into a weapon, making it an extension of your self. By meditating with a weapon for 1 hour, you can attune yourself to it. You can only be attuned to one weapon at a time. A weapon you are attuned with is considered magical. As a bonus action, you can store an attuned weapon in a secure extra dimensional space or retrieve it from said space. You may also call an attuned weapon to your hand from up to 500 feet away as an action.
    Your choice of discipline determines which weapons you may be attuned to.

    Swordmage Warding: At 2nd level, you gain Swordmage Warding. Your Warding Level is equal to one-third of your Swordmage level, rounded down, with a minimum level of 1. You also gain a number of focus points which you may use to augment your ward. You recover focus points on a long rest.

    Insightful Dodge: Once per short rest, you may use your reaction to add your wisdom modifier to a dexterity save that you make. Additionally, when you are not wearing heavy armor, you may use your wisdom modifier in place of your dexterity modifier to determine your ac.

    Grimoire of the Soul: At 6th Level you create a magical Grimoire that is linked to your mind. The grimoire and the chains which bind it to you contain a piece of your soul. The grimoire cannot be destroyed or forcefully separated from you while you are alive. The grimoire contains all the knowledge you have collected. You have advantage on skill checks to remember information while you hold the grimoire.
    You can also inscribe spells in the grimoire. When you create the grimoire, select two first-level spells that have the ritual tag from any class' spell list and add them to your grimoire. You may cast these spells as rituals. In addition, you may inscribe spells that have the ritual tag with a level no greater than one half of your Swordmage level and cast those spells as rituals.

    Reclaim Soul: Once per long rest, you may spend one minute reclaiming power from the piece of your soul imbued in your blade. You recover one-quarter of your hit points, 2 spell slots, and 10 focus points.

    Spell/Ward list:

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...it?usp=sharing

    Sub Classes:
    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...it?usp=sharing
    Last edited by bloodshed343; 2014-12-18 at 07:15 PM.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    GreataxeFighterGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Alright, few critiques/questions

    1. How powerful are these buffs going to be? Having them lack concentration is a big deal. Tread carefully. Given he already has medium armor he will be barely more fragile than any other frontline combatant.

    2. By similar to warlock casting, do you mean the 2-4 slots per short rest with a cap of lvl 5? Or are you also including some access to lvl 6-9 as warlock gets later on.

    3. I'd avoid flat attack bonuses myself, they aren't needed this edition and it's something they stayed away from in most cases. It might be worth considering having the bonded weapon treated as under the effects of a magic weapon spell (of the highest level the character can cast), as this would prevent it from stacking on an already magic weapon.

    4. Letting him make melee attacks with intelligence makes him very SAD (especially with medium armor prof and fewer concentration saves), which puts him miles ahead of the other caster/melee combos (ranger, paladin, monk/fighter to an extent). That needs to go.
    Last edited by silveralen; 2014-11-26 at 04:00 PM.

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    I really want to keep eldritch strikes.

    I think I should drop the armor proficiency to light.

    The buffs will all add a +2 bonus to ac, give damage resistance to a certain type based on constitution modifier, and at higher levels have another effect. I was thinking they should require a free hand to maintain.

    And yes, I was thinking that casting would cap at 5. I was thinking of adding a feature which allowed access to 6th-9th level spells as rituals.

    I was also thinking that most of the spells should be concentration buffs. I was planning to make the class int/con/wis.
    Last edited by bloodshed343; 2014-11-26 at 04:55 PM.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    These newest changes should make it happier (less SAD)

  5. - Top - End - #5
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    GreataxeFighterGuy

    Join Date
    Dec 2012

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    The new version looks pretty decent, needing some investment in con and wisdom to hit peak efficiency works well, and helps the character overall as solid saves there make things much easier. Helps make up for intelligence being underwhelming this edition.

    For eldritch strike, are you adding your spellcasting attribute to the damage as well, adding your normal ability score to the damage as appropriate for the weapon, or adding only con from the elemental blade feature?

    Overchannel is interesting. It effectively reads as a more complicated sneak attack, with you effectively needing to confirm the extra damage with a second attack.

    It's very unique in how it fights to be sure, I think it looks about right, it might need some play testing (and the power is very dependent on the spell list and warding spells) but just a quick eyeballing has it not too far off.

  6. - Top - End - #6
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    I was thinking of using str for damage, but that might make it too MAD. I don't think it will be overpowered to have int for damage.

    I'll write the wards up soon. I have the spell list made and just need to post it.

  7. - Top - End - #7
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    I forgot that resistance works differently in 5e. I'll rewrite all the ward spells accordingly later.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    After some calculations I found that the characters damage was low compared to... well, everything. Replacing overload with extra attack.

  9. - Top - End - #9
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Giant2005's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2014

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    This class is immensely powerful.
    Firstly the proficient saves are pretty wrong - you can't give someone two common saves like that. Each class gets one of Wisdom, Dexterity and Constitution and one of the other saves. You can't give him both Con and Wis.
    Secondly, Elemental Blade and Extra Attack are just plain crazy. Giving him an extra ability score worth of damage is okay but giving him up to an extra ability score x3 is way too far. Giving it to him as low as level 5 also breaks the standard within the game. Combining it with extra attacks is another no-no. If you are going to give him extra damage on his attacks, you can't give him more than two attacks per attack action.

    Also... What exactly are the Wards? Do they use spell slots or something or can you spam them as much as you like? If they were of limited use (as often as Battlemaster Maneuvers seems reasonable) and a much shorter duration (1 minute tops) then most of them would be okay. Even if they have limited uses, I'd be pretty tempted to just throw away all of the level 17+ ones. Not only are they incredibly powerful but between them and everything the class already offers, you are pretty much rendering every other class in the game obsolete.
    Last edited by Giant2005; 2014-11-28 at 11:39 AM.

  10. - Top - End - #10
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    The wards have their own slot and the slots refresh on a long rest.

    I added a paragraph explaining how wards work.

    I'll give him con/int saves instead.

    Edit: brought back overload in place of extra attack.

    Compared to an eldritch knight at 16th level, the Swordmage:
    does less damage
    has lower ac
    is more MAD
    has better spellcasting.
    Has some damage resistance.

    And that's assuming you max int, con, AND wis.
    Last edited by bloodshed343; 2014-11-28 at 12:32 PM.

  11. - Top - End - #11
    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Giant2005's Avatar

    Join Date
    Aug 2014

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Quote Originally Posted by bloodshed343 View Post
    Compared to an eldritch knight at 16th level, the Swordmage:
    does less damage
    has lower ac
    is more MAD
    has better spellcasting.
    Has some damage resistance.
    Eldritch Knight damage: 1D10+5 x3 attacks +1D4+5 (Polearm Mastery bonus attack) = 38 average damage
    Swordmage damage: 1D10+20+4D8 x1 attack +1D4+20+4D8 (Polearm Mastery bonus attack) = 84 average damage
    Eldritch Knight AC: 18 (Plate) or 20 with shield
    Swordmage AC: 19 (Light or medium armor with maxed Wis + ward)
    Eldritch Knight prime attributes: Int, Str/Dex, Con
    Swordmage prime attributes: Int, Wis, Con

    The Swordmage is pretty much superior at everything but the only thing that is really out of control is the damage and of course those level 17+ Wards that makes level 9 spells look lame by comparison.
    Last edited by Giant2005; 2014-11-28 at 01:02 PM.

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Ahh, I did my calculations with a great sword and great weapon mastery, which had the fighter at 67 damage and the mage at 54.5. I suppose the overload needs to have a once per turn clause.

    I'll tone down the wards at 17+.

    Edit: man oh man that bonus attack from polearm mastery breaks the balance hard. I'll add a clause so that you only get the bonus damage on standard action attacks and/or limit the proficiencies and damage to one-handed weapons.
    Last edited by bloodshed343; 2014-11-28 at 01:44 PM.

  13. - Top - End - #13
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    With these changes the average damage of a Swordmage is 42.5. As cool as a polearm wielding mage would be, it's easier to balance a long sword or rapier.

    EDIT: these latest changes allow a Swordmage to dual wield trading their warding for more damage. The damage for a dual-scimitar Swordmage is 60 at level 16.

    This means that the Swordmage has similar survivability and damage to a rogue when dual wielding (well, less damage, but slightly tougher) and has similar damage/survivability to an eldritch knight with a ward (either slightly less damage and slightly tougher or slightly more damage and slightly squishier depending on if the fighter uses a shield. )

    If I make subclasses, one will be a dpr centric dual wielder with enhanced mobility, one will be a tank focusing on wards, and one will have more casting capability.
    Last edited by bloodshed343; 2014-11-28 at 03:25 PM.

  14. - Top - End - #14
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Bump. Made some changes. Added subclasses.

  15. - Top - End - #15
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    Yakk's Avatar

    Join Date
    Nov 2006

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    I think 9th level spells is too much for the concept.

    Reduce to paladin-level spellcasting, or maybe a touch better. This is supposed to be a front-line "champion" type, and as such should not also be a full spellcaster "sage".

    Costing the ward for dual wielding sort of sucks. The dual wielding specialization should somehow get the ward back: balance should be tweaked based on that assumption. Either that, or the ward should be a subclass feature that the dual wielding specialization doesn't get. Similarly the second weapon attunement should be the dual wielding subclass.

    Limit attunement to swords. Subclasses that bond to other weapons can exist.

    I would think about swapping charisma for wisdom as a secondary stat.

    Full ritual casting is decent. But like I said, not full other spellcasting.

    Elemental blade was deleted, but is still referenced.

    Overload as a second attack seems meh. You have to swing, hit, then you have to overload attack again? Lots of conditionals there.

    As noted, your resists are all broken.

    "Improved X" meh. "Spiderclimb ward" meh, not a ward.

    I would find things more interesting if there was a good reason to constantly shift your ward up in combat. So...

    Wards refresh on a short or long rest. You can discharge your ward to do (effect X). As an action or as a bonus action after discharging your ward, you can cast another ward.

    Now we can tie some of your damage budget into your ward discharges. As your wards known increases, you gain more instances of that damage boost per short rest.

  16. - Top - End - #16
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    What's the max spell level which would be appropriate? 8th? 7th?

    I'll update the post to include that soul bonding adds a damage type to your melee attacks and that overload uses this damage type. I'll remove the second attack on overload and just make it extra damage.

    And yeah, it's hard coming up with wards.

  17. - Top - End - #17
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    And thanks for looking it over

  18. - Top - End - #18
    Halfling in the Playground
     
    OrcBarbarianGirl

    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    A Place of Pine

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    This looks very interesting and I'm excited to see how it turns out! But I do have some general nitpicks.

    First of all, sword bond needs more precision in regards to which weapons you can bond with. A great sword qualifies for it but you aren't proficient with them. Maybe specify scimitar, rapiers, longswords and shortswords(i think those are the intended recipients of the bond)?

    Also, looking at it is a little difficult for me, it all blurs together. Perhaps bold or underline the class abilities?

    Very excited to see how it turns out!
    Quote Originally Posted by Knaight View Post
    Cleric: "You siphon power from a water spirit?"

    Binder: "I was into tributaries before they were mainstream."

  19. - Top - End - #19
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Thanks. Updated sword bond to indicate that you must be proficient with the weapon to bond with it.

  20. - Top - End - #20
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Updated all the wards. They might be op.

  21. - Top - End - #21
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Added a new subclass.

  22. - Top - End - #22
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Considering making this a 1d10 hit die like the paladin. It does recover spell slots on a short rest, but it also has fewer slots and a more restrictive spell list. And medium armor. And no shields. I think it should be 1d10.

  23. - Top - End - #23
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Portland, Oregon

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    AFB right now, so I can't look up the name of the feat, but if a Swordmage picked up the x4 weapon proficiency feat, would one of those weapons qualify for Sword Bond? It's called Sword Bond, but refers to the generic term "weapon" six times in the text, but then refers to "sword" once, specifically requiring that "You may only attune to swords with which you are proficient."

    At what level can a Swordmage bond a sword? At level one, a magical elemental sword seems, on the surface at least, too much. Maybe it is not, as I'm thinking about blade pact warlocks and EKs, but can't remember when they get their weapons.

    Hypothetical situation: Level three Swordmage, 16 Int, longsword, attuned for fire. +5 to attack? +3 Damage? Is the +3 damage fire as well?

    Ever Present Ally: does this work only against weapon attacks?

    Still digging in to the rest!

  24. - Top - End - #24
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Quote Originally Posted by Iolo Morganwg View Post
    AFB right now, so I can't look up the name of the feat, but if a Swordmage picked up the x4 weapon proficiency feat, would one of those weapons qualify for Sword Bond? It's called Sword Bond, but refers to the generic term "weapon" six times in the text, but then refers to "sword" once, specifically requiring that "You may only attune to swords with which you are proficient."

    At what level can a Swordmage bond a sword? At level one, a magical elemental sword seems, on the surface at least, too much. Maybe it is not, as I'm thinking about blade pact warlocks and EKs, but can't remember when they get their weapons.

    Hypothetical situation: Level three Swordmage, 16 Int, longsword, attuned for fire. +5 to attack? +3 Damage? Is the +3 damage fire as well?

    Ever Present Ally: does this work only against weapon attacks?

    Still digging in to the rest!
    As long as those 4 weapons were swords, they would qualify for swordbond. Or you can ignore the sword part and bond with any weapon you are proficient with. The change was initially implemented to stop an unbalancing combination with the elemental blade feature that is now in the elemental dervish subclass and polearms to deal massive damage with polearm mastery. Now you do lots of damage with dual-wielding.

    Swordbond is a level 1 feature. It changes all damage to the chosen type. I never considered it OP, since other casters get various elemental attacks at level 1.

    Ever-present Escort is meant to only work with weapon attacks. As worded, I think you can throw your shield using intelligence for the attack, but I may need to add a clause clarifying it.

    Thanks for looking it over.
    Last edited by bloodshed343; 2014-11-30 at 08:15 PM.

  25. - Top - End - #25
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Portland, Oregon

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    The elemental part didn't seem op, just it being a magic weapon. Bladelock gets it at 2, Paladin at 5, Moon druid and Monk ar 6, EK at 7, Valor Bard at 10.

    Getting a magic weapon right out of the gate, especially coupled with regular casting, seems op.

  26. - Top - End - #26
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Portland, Oregon

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Also, it looks like this class doesn't have the Extra Attack class feature, so that tempers things a bit.

  27. - Top - End - #27
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Ahh. The weapon isn't actually magical. It's only considered magical for immunities and resistances. It's still a mundane sword in all other respects.

    I think the warlock feature gives you an actual magic weapon.

    Edit: the warlock feature functions similarly, but gives you automatic proficiency in any weapon of your choice and creates the weapon for free while sword bond is limited to weapons with which you are already proficient and requires an already existing weapon. Since blade lock is basically the same but with a feat and a free weapon thrown in 2 levels later, I'd say it's okay, especially since being magic offers absolutely no bonuses those first two levels.
    Last edited by bloodshed343; 2014-11-30 at 11:29 PM.

  28. - Top - End - #28
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Yeah, this class uses overload and the elemental blade feature of the elemental Dervish subclass for damage. It can reach pretty high numbers while dual-wielding if you don't have a ward up. I'm still tinkering with student of Malediction because I don't like it yet.

  29. - Top - End - #29
    Halfling in the Playground
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Portland, Oregon

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    Quote Originally Posted by bloodshed343 View Post
    ...It's only considered magical for immunities and resistances...
    This is what I think is OP for a first level gish.

    That said, so far in the 5E games I've run, this probably wouldn't have been a show stopper. Maybe just some pangs of jealousy :)

    My players did have a hell of s time against three perytons though, (resistant to non-magical normal damage.) Fourth level party of five lost a member since all the melees were only doing half damage.

    Changing the subject, how would Swordmage fit into 5E's multi-classing rules?

  30. - Top - End - #30
    Barbarian in the Playground
    Join Date
    Feb 2013

    Default Re: 5e Swordmage homebrew.

    The best advice I can give when it comes to multitasking Swordmage is "don't". However, I guess they'd be like the warlock, but you'd also gain proficiency in one handed martial swords and medium armor. Dipping far enough to get Elemental Blade from elemental Dervish would be great for a twf fighter. Dipping for ever-present escort is great for a sword and board pally or fighter.

    I need to rework Student of Malediction.

    I'm adding a fourth subclass that focuses on further casting.

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •