I will draw your character (later)

[Artman77]

Okay, finishing up foxhole, working on girl in mandalorian armor and changeling too. (Cuz I can't just do one at a time.) And, you know how I said I've got 100 projects going on at once? Well, here's one of the other 99 I've been working on since last month:

Spoiler

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It'll be a shirt by July, hopefully. Probably about 20% done.

[dantiesilva]

I give you credit artman77 can draw, are a great DM, and can make chainmail.

[TheDragonmaster]

Always fun to see a fellow maille enthusiast . By "shirt", do you mean a byrnie, or something larger like a haubergeon or full hauberk? Attached coif or not? Are you using only European 4-1, or will you use other weaves (such as stronger areas in 6-1) as well? How are you doing the shoulders and neck area, joined triangles or circular expansion? How are the arms attached, 90 degree angles or with diamond-shaped gussets (assuming, of course, that the weave is horisontal in the arms as well and you are not "cheating"... which I guess is completely valid to do if one is not making full-length arms)?

[Artman77]

I don't think I could call myself an enthusiast , I hadn't even touched a single ring, much less thought of doing a shirt til late January. Only 4-1. This is because A, it's about 30% less weight and B, I'm lazy. This also means I will most likely be making a byrnie, not a full-on hauberk, nor will I be likely to make a coif. If I do, the coif will be made after the fact.

How are the arms attached, 90 degree angles or with diamond-shaped gussets (assuming, of course, that the weave is horisontal in the arms as well and you are not "cheating"... which I guess is completely valid to do if one is not making full-length arms)?

Even though I am a novice, I immediately noticed the horizontal pattern and realized it would present a challenge at the shoulders. No, I will not "cheat" on the sleeves; no matter how long they are... I am the ultimate paradox of sluggard and perfectionist(which is why I say in the OP I hardly ever finish anything).
As far as sleeve attachment goes, I am open to suggestion. I don't mind complexity, and would prefer to wear whatever is the most comfortable. What would you recommend?

[TheDragonmaster]

Spoiler: Suggestions spolered for a false sense of brevity

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My preference for the construction of a piece of maille armour is to build it around four parallellograms fitted together (using "45 degree" seams (which, in actuality, are closer to 60 degree seams, but it works out since they are draping over a rounded form rather than laying flat)) to form a somewhat skewed rectangle (skewed because the measurement over the back is generally a little longer than that over the chest) with a smaller rectangle-shaped hole inside of it, forming the piece that goes around the neck and across the shoulders. This allows the weave to neatly fall in the "preferred" horisontal alignment on both chest and back and over the shoulders.

To this, one adds two large parallellograms, covering the upper chest and back, that meet at points a bit below the armpits. To each shoulder one attaches a parallellogram folded around the arm to connect to itself to a point above the elbow. This leaves perfect diamond-shaped holes in each armpit that can be filled with gussets fitted on all sides with 45 degree angles. At this point, one has a T-shirt that is far too short.

The real work is done here, and all that remains is for the body piece to be lengthened by attaching a cylinder to accommodate the lower torso and if applicable the upper legs as well (though this obviously requires slits), and, if required, the sleeves to be lengthened in the same way by the attachment of cylinders. To tailor the maille suit better, column expansions and/or contractions can be made wherever necessary (and since the weave is at all points facing "correctly" with horizontal rows, hole row expansions can be avoided, which is a good thing)... which probably means along the upper torso and the upper arm.

If one is only making a byrnie or haubergeon, the sleeves generally stop above the elbows, and as such one can make them rather snug. If one wants a hauberk with full-length sleeves one has the option of either making wider sleeves to accommodate the joint movement, which is what most people settle on, one may resort to diamond-shaped gussets again (and probably a ton of column expansions/contractions), or the dreaded hole row expansions/contractions. My advice, after making myself a hauberk with snug-fitting arms and elbow joints is... do not make elbow joints, at least not on your first few tries. Just take the additional weight of looser sleeves or settle on shorter ones. It takes too much trial and error to achieve good enough mobility, and if you were not before, repeatedly having your joints immobilised while trying it on will make you at least mildly claustrophobic.


This is only one way of making a piece of maille armour, there are many others that are conceptually easier to put together, but I find this to be my preferred method by far as it entirely avoids both 90 degree seams, which tend to be less elegant than 45 degree seams, and hole row expansions/contractions, which practically require multiple ring sizes to even begin to resemble an elegant solution.

[Artman77]

I have a pretty large chunk of maille and would like to get started on the shoulders but am having trouble making sense of your last post. I'm more of a visual learner. Could I trouble you for a link to some pictures of what you're talking about? Also, most pictures of people making maille online look like they have the weave hanging vertically?

[TechnoWarforged]

Artman77, this is such a cool idea. Appreciate your work man.

No rush on this one. Just take your time...

Spoiler: Query: Eberron Warforged Archivist

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An illegally made Warforged in Eberron. My Character's class is an Archivist. It also make and sell drugs (Dreamlily). It is completely incapable of facial emotions. The people he venture with usually just hoards the loot so he isn't wearing much except for a Belt of Healing, A circlet of Intelligences, and a +1 Cloak of Resistance. It's travelling companions thinks the Warforged creepy and may have dabbles in the occult.

[Artman77]

I'm just going to come out and say it; I lost interest in doing this for a little while. In spite of that, the foxfolk is done! Yay!

Spoiler: foxfolk

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Workin on the next two. I've gotten farther on the changeling than the sci-fi girl, but I'll finish her up and post them both at the same time probably. Maybe it's because I find black clothes/armor tedious.

[Blackhawk748]

I'm just going to come out and say it; I lost interest in doing this for a little while. In spite of that, the foxfolk is done! Yay!

Spoiler: foxfolk

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Workin on the next two. I've gotten farther on the changeling than the sci-fi girl, but I'll finish her up and post them both at the same time probably. Maybe it's because I find black clothes/armor tedious.

Sweet, and YAY getting towards mine!

[Rakaydos]

I'm just going to come out and say it; I lost interest in doing this for a little while. In spite of that, the foxfolk is done! Yay!

Spoiler: foxfolk

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Workin on the next two. I've gotten farther on the changeling than the sci-fi girl, but I'll finish her up and post them both at the same time probably. Maybe it's because I find black clothes/armor tedious.

Looks great regardless- looking foreward to what you can do on my raptor dragon.

[QuidEst]

I'm just going to come out and say it; I lost interest in doing this for a little while. In spite of that, the foxfolk is done! Yay!

Spoiler: foxfolk

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Oh man, thank you! That's fantastic. *scurries off to go leave a big tip* Love the outfit design especially! Sorry he wasn't very cooperative- I really appreciate you tackling it despite that.

[goto124]

That tail is really fluffy.

[Artman77]

Glad you like it QuidEst! And thanks for the tip!!

[TheDragonmaster]

I popped in to look at the absolutely stunning newly finished artwork, and saw that I had completely missed your (@Artman77) questions... sorry about that. I am sure this is too late now and thus useless, but in the unlikely scenario it is not, here are my answers:

Spoiler: OT: Answers that probably rather few people are even remotely interested in (concerning maille suits)

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I have a pretty large chunk of maille and would like to get started on the shoulders but am having trouble making sense of your last post. I'm more of a visual learner. Could I trouble you for a link to some pictures of what you're talking about?

I whipped this template up in GIMP in 5 min (I would have done it properly in a vector format were I not on my Windows machine), hopefully it is no more cryptic than my last post. Black edges outline the imagined maille pieces laid out flat, grey lines depict the "grain" of the weave (they should be parallel with what most people refer to as the "rows" of a European weave), pink edges are attached straight to the adjacent edge, and other coloured edges are attached to the edge sharing the same colour (deciding on what colours to use took 80% of the drawing time ), either straight or using "45 degree" seams. Assume nothing whatsoever is to scale:

Spoiler: Ugly Pixmap Template

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Also, most pictures of people making maille online look like they have the weave hanging vertically?

What I meant by having the weave oriented "horizontally" was to have the "rows" of the weave go horizontally, which obviously to anyone without the same frame of reference as me means just as little (as "rows" and "columns" are interchangeable concepts without an underlying frame of reference). So for reference, here is the first picture suitable for my needs that a Google Image Search for "maille" provided, the piece of maille on the left is improperly hung with rows going vertically while the piece on the right is properly hung with rows going horizontally (assuming your monitor is oriented in the way one would expect in relation to the horizon):

Spoiler: E 4-1 Orientation Image snatched directly from my Google Image Search

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[Trevortni]

I've got to say, I quite like your style. I've been contemplating posting a request, but I've hesitated due to your statement on the first post that you're not currently accepting new requests. Nevertheless, I see other people posting requests and you're not saying "no", so I figured I could at least write up what I'm looking for, and if you don't want to do it, then at least I have it written it so I can copy and paste it somewhere else if I do find someone that is accepting submissions:

Spoiler: Kelatu

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Not actually a character, so much as a race. These are the ancient progenitors of the human race, who fled the evil Verada (who are pretty much the Puppet Masters from Robert Heinlein's book The Puppet Masters) and colonized Earth about 6000 years ago. They were the most highly advanced race the galaxy remembers; physically they tend to most closely resemble African tribesmen. It would be nice if I could get a picture of a typical captain on the bridge of his starship, with African-tribal-themed but futuristic-looking attire and weapons.

Spoiler: Verada

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Gray parasitical lumps of jelly. Yeah, I probably don't need a picture of these guys, but it makes the set complete.

Spoiler: Niktu

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A race that was the ancient allies of the Kelatu, and enemies of the evil Verada. Physically, they resemble giant preying mantises, a little taller than the average human. I suppose it won't matter so much in black and white pencil drawings, but they tend to be colorful, with a tendency to greens, yellows, and reds, often having mutliple colors on a given Niktu. Setting isn't so important, but it would be cool to have a Kelatu and Niktu posing together.

[Artman77]

@TheDragonmaster; Nope. I'm not even done with the main body piece yet. Besides this and the portraits, I've got those other 98 projects going remember? And I do them all at once! (Or, rotate them, I guess.) Thanks, your diagrams helped a lot. Yeah, I had them facing the wrong way. I see how the rows are an even line of links, not the wavy back-and-forth column I saw before. It makes more sense for those to hang vertically, to stretch over the chest and hang more closely around the waist.

@Trevortni; Hey, at least you read the first post. Apparently some can't even do that.
And also, aliens:

[Trevortni]

@Trevortni; Hey, at least you read the first post. Apparently some can't even do that.
And also, aliens:
<sniptemporarily hide Bruce Campbell>

That's right; as is all too commonly the case, Bruce Campbell is why I have to list all my aliens.

[Rakaydos]

That's right; as is all too commonly the case, Bruce Campbell is why I have to list all my aliens.

There was an old Star Wars sourcebook about Hutt space that talked about the hutt client species. they get through the entire book before mentioning them all in a row- the Klatoonians, Baradans, and Nicto.

[Blackhawk748]

There was an old Star Wars sourcebook about Hutt space that talked about the hutt client species. they get through the entire book before mentioning them all in a row- the Klatoonians, Baradans, and Nicto.

OMG. How have i missed this?? I love the Star Wars setting and i love Evil Dead 3, i cannot believe i have missed that.

[Trevortni]

ACHIEVEMENT GET: Thread Hijack!

Yeah, it's not surprising that other people have used the immortal words from Klaatu to Gort to name alien races. The advantage in my scenario is that I can name the campaign after the three races, and even though the players won't even know (for certain, anyway) that there are aliens behind the scenes until late in the campaign, there's pretty much no way they can glean the fact that there are, nor anything about them, from a phrase that has been used for so many different purposes.

[Artman77]

MichaelGoldclaw, Septimus Fabrius, and Boolprop, your guys' art is almost done.

[Artman77]

What's up fellow playgrounders? Long time no see. Anywho... Here's some art:

MichealGoldclaw: Ruusaan Ordo
SeptimusFabrius: Metsa (I started doing both with the intent of finishing Alder, but the changeling was just so much fun to draw I kept on drawing til he was done! I'll clean up Alder and post him for you to though...)

Boolprop: Dakon Bors is so much fun to draw now that I've started him, I don't know which pose to pick! I can't very well finish them all; I'd never get anyone else done.

[Raunchel]

Hi!


Those two again look amazing, I really hope that you will find the time to do Serdy, she is a long-time favourite of mine for who I could never find an image to properly represent her.

[Septimus Faber]

SeptimusFabrius: Metsa (I started doing both with the intent of finishing Alder, but the changeling was just so much fun to draw I kept on drawing til he was done!

That's great, thank you so much! I love the expression on his face. "Why yes, sir, I am breaking into this house. Why do you ask?" My stick figures weep in jealousy of your skills. Keep up the good work! (But no pressure.)

[Boolprop]

Your artwork is amazing. I'm glad you're having fun drawing other's characters. I look forward to Dakon Bors, and your future artworks.

[goto124]

SeptimusFabrius: Metsa (I started doing both with the intent of finishing Alder, but the changeling was just so much fun to draw I kept on drawing til he was done! I'll clean up Alder and post him for you to though...)

I'm convinced he's Deadpool

Keep up the great work! Hope to see my character some time!

[MichaelGoldclaw]

Mine came out pretty good. I didn't care for it at first, but then I looked at it and then it grew on me. When I get the money in, I'll be sure to tip you.

[Artman77]

Was it the armor? I wanted to have both the armor and fabric be black, but still with some sort of contrast so that the armor would stand out. I debated for a while on whether or not to make the armor jet black with a gloss finish and the cloth more of a gray, or the fabric a black light-absorbing material and the armor "regular" black with more of a matte finish... Was there something in the description I missed.

Thanks in advance for the tip! Little things like that go a long way in encouraging artists like me to continue their craft.

[MichaelGoldclaw]

No, it's the hair. The hair style was spot on except that section that is higher than the other.

[Deathkeeper]

I'm not entirely sure if that lady's pose could be done without being somewhat in pain, but trying for dynamic, slightly-silly-at-worst poses beats boring brick poses (coughshooterboxartcough) any day.

I'd have put in a request when I saw the thread ages ago, but me being me I'd probably have leaned towards my kobold (see avatar) and I've always been hesitant to ask for nonhumans when I'm not sure if the artist is comfortable with them.
Either way, been fun keeping up with it; stuff looks great.