Worm (text, no graphics)

[halfeye]

In the Grrl Power thread:

Wait DaveB is the Author? Have you heard of Worm? Read it.It should give you good ideas for powers.

seconded. Seriously read this. It's very gritty and long though.

Long? you're not kidding! I started on Monday a week ago, and I'm still not up to date.

White text on a black (dark blue?) ground has probably cost me some reading speed, maybe up to 1/3rd, but this is still longer than "A song of ice and fire" probably not half as good, but it's got it on lenght.

[Landis963]

It also had a thread in Media Discussions, here.

That said, it is a good story, IMO, just bear with our protagonist. She's... bullheaded at the best of times, and an army of tiny minions that she can replenish on the fly has not been helpful to this viewpoint.

[Eldan]

The story also majorly suffers in structure for a while at around 2/3 through. It catches itself again for the finale, though.

[halfeye]

It also had a thread in Media Discussions, here.

Thanks for the link. Shame the thread seems to be dead, and the mention of yet another thread doesn't provide a link so I can't tell whether that one's still going.

[Douglas]

Thanks for the link. Shame the thread seems to be dead, and the mention of yet another thread doesn't provide a link so I can't tell whether that one's still going.

Two posts further down there is a link to it. That thread has been dead for a while, though - the story's finished, so there isn't any new material to drive discussion.

[Fjolnir]

we are discussing the author's new serial work as well though, Pact...

[JeenLeen]

White text on a black (dark blue?) ground has probably cost me some reading speed, maybe up to 1/3rd, but this is still longer than "A song of ice and fire" probably not half as good, but it's got it on lenght.

I got a headache trying to read it, so I copied the text into Word, then removed the background/highlighting and changed the text to black.
I wrote a VBA macro, activated via a button-click (though I think ActiveX buttons are broken now, after a recent MS update), that copied my clipboard to the Word doc then edited it to make it legible. I don't have it on me right now, but I could try to find it and post it here. Or you could record a macro of yourself doing that, then save it, to reuse with each chapter.

It's a bit of a hassle, but it helped make it readable for me.

Otherwise, great story. I just wish (really, really minor spoiler, maybe, about pacing)

Spoiler

Show

that there was more downtime. There's one massive (at least substantial) time skip in the book, but I feel like there should be a few months at least between some story arcs, to give the characters a break if nothing else.

Well, that and that more of the metaphysics were explicitly explained some point near the end of the book, but I'm a big fan of metaphysics and systems.

[Eldan]

Pact is even worse in that regard. I stopped reading it because it's so relentless battle after battle with barely a sentence in between.

[JeenLeen]

Pact is even worse in that regard. I stopped reading it because it's so relentless battle after battle with barely a sentence in between.

This is real spoilers, if not significant ones.

Spoiler

Show

I really felt that there should have been a while while Skitter and the others owned part of the city under Coil, before Coil made his grab for the city and the aftermath with that and Echnida (sp). Also, a time when they ruled the city, with the Ambassadors under them, seems like it would have made sense. But I think it was only a few weeks after the Slaughterhouse Nine left before Coil's move and defeat, and then they rule the city for just a little bit before Skitter becomes Weaver.

I just felt bad for the Undersiders, not even having a month or two to consolidate their forces, have some relative peace, and just enjoy their lives a little bit. I like the protagonists to get to celebrate their victory for a least a little while.

Note: it's been a while since I read, so some of the times/order above might be wrong, but I think the idea is still what I mean.

[Fjolnir]

One of the big things to notice is that this story is a solid Draft, the author has (multiple times in fact) announced his intention to go in and clean up many of the issues with the pacing, including the timeskip at the end.

[Landis963]

One of the big things to notice is that this story is a solid Draft, the author has (multiple times in fact) announced his intention to go in and clean up many of the issues with the pacing, including the timeskip at the end.

Especially the timeskip near the end. Speaking as a member of the contingent who found it incredibly jarring on first view.

[BRC]

This is real spoilers, if not significant ones.

Spoiler

Show

I really felt that there should have been a while while Skitter and the others owned part of the city under Coil, before Coil made his grab for the city and the aftermath with that and Echnida (sp). Also, a time when they ruled the city, with the Ambassadors under them, seems like it would have made sense. But I think it was only a few weeks after the Slaughterhouse Nine left before Coil's move and defeat, and then they rule the city for just a little bit before Skitter becomes Weaver.

I just felt bad for the Undersiders, not even having a month or two to consolidate their forces, have some relative peace, and just enjoy their lives a little bit. I like the protagonists to get to celebrate their victory for a least a little while.

Note: it's been a while since I read, so some of the times/order above might be wrong, but I think the idea is still what I mean.

There were a lot of points in the story that could have been really interesting. However, the story kept moving at a breakneck pace from one terrible situation to the other, without giving us much time to explore things as they were, or do much character building outside life-and-death struggles. I suppose it might have worked better being read week-by-week, rather than in a bingeread like I did it.

I suppose that, for practical reasons, Skitter's reign of terror had to wrap up before Winter showed up and froze all her bugs, but still.

Also, maybe this was just me, but I was always fascinated by the interlude sections where we got to see how other characters saw her. Simply because we spent so much time inside the head of this highly intelligent, terrifying character whose power gave her an almost inhuman outlook. Getting out of her head, and seeing her through other characters eyes was always fascinating.

Which I suppose takes us back to the whole Pacing issue/a side-effect of the week-by-week format. High-tension combats can drag on and on for weeks, and make reliable cliffhangers to bring readers back next week.

I think I read somewhere that Wildbow is planning to re-write Worm after he finishes with Pact.

[Landis963]

I think I read somewhere that Wildbow is planning to re-write Worm after he finishes with Pact.

As I recall, he's continually rewriting Worm; while his current stories are going on.

[halfeye]

There were a lot of points in the story that could have been really interesting. However, the story kept moving at a breakneck pace from one terrible situation to the other, without giving us much time to explore things as they were, or do much character building outside life-and-death struggles.

That's almost a potted review of Restoree by Anne McCaffery. Nice weather, isn't it.

[BRC]

That's almost a potted review of Restoree by Anne McCaffery. Nice weather, isn't it.

I've never heard of Restoree, Anne McCaffery, or a "potted review". Care to elaborate?

[halfeye]

I've never heard of Restoree, Anne McCaffery, or a "potted review". Care to elaborate?

It's her first published book. Something dramatic happens every three pages or so. It still sort of works.

IMHO she got better at storytelling, sales seem to say so too.

"The Ship who sang" is my favourite of her books, but I like the early Pern books as well.

[BRC]

It's her first published book. Something dramatic happens every three pages or so. It still sort of works.

IMHO she got better at storytelling, sales seem to say so too.

"The Ship who sang" is my favourite of her books, but I like the early Pern books as well.

And what did you mean by "Potted Review", and that thing about the weather?

[halfeye]

And what did you mean by "Potted Review", and that thing about the weather?

Potted review = short review (approxmately), the weather was more or less a joke or for misdirection, it was an attempt at a subtle thing, probably didn't work.

[Fjolnir]

There were a lot of points in the story that could have been really interesting. However, the story kept moving at a breakneck pace from one terrible situation to the other, without giving us much time to explore things as they were, or do much character building outside life-and-death struggles. I suppose it might have worked better being read week-by-week, rather than in a bingeread like I did it.

I suppose that, for practical reasons, Skitter's reign of terror had to wrap up before Winter showed up and froze all her bugs, but still.

see I doubt this would happen, it would limit her ability to operate in certain areas but the thing is urban areas are pretty much insect havens all year long.

[Landis963]

see I doubt this would happen, it would limit her ability to operate in certain areas but the thing is urban areas are pretty much insect havens all year long.

Would Brockton Bay's New Hampshire, coastal environment have any bearing on this? The wiki says it's got a very mild winter.

[Fjolnir]

I still cannot believe that BB is north of CT but what I would say is that outside of buildings, you would run into trouble keeping insects alive in the winter, however once skitter gets her terrariums and such, she'd pretty much have a year round supply of bugs, especially given her ability to force breeding instinct in insects she controls

[BRC]

I still cannot believe that BB is north of CT but what I would say is that outside of buildings, you would run into trouble keeping insects alive in the winter, however once skitter gets her terrariums and such, she'd pretty much have a year round supply of bugs, especially given her ability to force breeding instinct in insects she controls

She could have a supply sure, but her power would be greatly diminished.

She couldn't used bugs outdoors, she would need to transport Bugs with her, she couldn't saturate areas with bugs to keep an eye on enemies, and she couldn't call up swarms if caught offguard.

A later chapter deals with how she must operate during the winter. She was able to do it, but it required a lot of planning and preparation, and she was basically limited to harassment and tracking enemies, and even then only when she caught them off-guard (She had bugs hide in their coats), Hardly the sort of power that would let her control a large swath of the city.

[Fjolnir]

By the time she has control of a large portion of the city, she has both human henchmen and stores of terrarium insects across her territory.

[Admiral Squish]

Dangit, I just HAD to read this thread. Started this morning, and I'm at 5.1 now. Not sure if I can stop...

[Landis963]

Dangit, I just HAD to read this thread. Started this morning, and I'm at 5.1 now. Not sure if I can stop...

It gets under your skin, doesn't it?

[pikeamus]

Dangit, I just HAD to read this thread. Started this morning, and I'm at 5.1 now. Not sure if I can stop...

It is a real problem. I've lost a lot of productivity at work over the last few weeks. I'm pretty sure the arcs get longer later in the story - some of the episodes start hitting the 10k words mark (I know this because I copy the text into a word document to read because it looks less like I'm slacking off that way). Nearly finished though. I'm on 28.2 now.

I reckon that the early-mid arcs were my favourite. The later stuff has still been really good, but I thought the story was going in a specific thematic direction at the beginning and it doesn't feel as though it followed through in the way I was looking forward to reading. Also, I had a bit of a hard time believing the way events turned out after the Alexandria incident.

[Landis963]

It is a real problem. I've lost a lot of productivity at work over the last few weeks. I'm pretty sure the arcs get longer later in the story - some of the episodes start hitting the 10k words mark (I know this because I copy the text into a word document to read because it looks less like I'm slacking off that way). Nearly finished though. I'm on 28.2 now.

I reckon that the early-mid arcs were my favourite. The later stuff has still been really good, but I thought the story was going in a specific thematic direction at the beginning and it doesn't feel as though it followed through in the way I was looking forward to reading. Also, I had a bit of a hard time believing the way events turned out after the Alexandria incident.

Spoiler: w/r/t the Alexandria incident

Show

All the PRT wants at that point is good press. They've got numerous and sundry eggs on their collective face, and Tagg's reaction to being egged has not helped the situation. They are willing to overlook quite a lot for the "rehabilitation" of a formerly villainous cape. (See also: Madcap/Assault's recruitment) Also, Skitter's power (not the bugs, her brain), is bonkers powerful, and despite her known crimes (Bank robbery, double count of unauthorized murder, and vigilantism at the very least) would be a tremendous asset, especially in a world where honest-to-goodness kaiju run around.

[BRC]

Spoiler: w/r/t the Alexandria incident

Show

All the PRT wants at that point is good press. They've got numerous and sundry eggs on their collective face, and Tagg's reaction to being egged has not helped the situation. They are willing to overlook quite a lot for the "rehabilitation" of a formerly villainous cape. (See also: Madcap/Assault's recruitment) Also, Skitter's power (not the bugs, her brain), is bonkers powerful, and despite her known crimes (Bank robbery, double count of unauthorized murder, and vigilantism at the very least) would be a tremendous asset, especially in a world where honest-to-goodness kaiju run around.

Spoiler

Show

Yeah, The PRT/Cauldron/The Protectorate's (Alexandria is in on the Cauldron Conspiracy, so they're basically the same thing) whole MO is to keep powerful Capes in play as long as possible.

That said, in their previous Rehab efforts, they had the luxury of pretending that the "New" hero was some new person when a villain-with-similar powers suddenly vanished (See the whole Armsmaster/Defiant switch) Here they couldn't do that. Taylor was too well known, and her powerset was too recognizable.

As for PR, yeah "We're recruiting this warlord supervillain" does not sound good, But I think that "We captured this Warlord Supervillain, and she still managed to singlehandedly kill Alexandria" Sounds even worse.

In one version, the Public hears that the PRT and Protectorate captured what they knew to be an incredibly dangerous Supervillain (And 17 year old girl), who despite being in custody, STILL managed to kill one of the world's most powerful Heroes.

In the other, one of the World's most powerful heroes is declared a traitor, who was brought down by the Warlord Supervillain (Who is now working for the good guys) with the assistance of the PRT and Protectorate. Yes, it doesn't sound good, but it paints a brighter picture of the future than sending Taylor to the Birdcage.

As for why they would agree too it? At this point Dragon and Defiant have a pretty good idea of what motivates Taylor, so they can be pretty confident about her staying on the side of the Angels. They know how much of an asset she could be. Also, Dragon has a HUGE amount of power, considering she pretty much singlehandedly runs the infrastructure for the north-american superheros, so she's got the Pull needed.

[Landis963]

Well, The PRT/Protectorate and Alexandria did have sort of a parting of ways as a direct result of the incident, but yeah, both factions want to keep capes in play as long as possible, villain or hero.

[Admiral Squish]

I'm on 13.1 now... I can't stop. I've been so sucked into it, I haven't surfaced more than a handful of times since I started yesterday morning.