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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Kobold

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    Default List of the Giant's Houserules?

    I don't think it's been done before, at least a google search didn't turn up anything.

    What I'm talking about is a list of elements in OOTS that don't follow the rules set in 3.5

    Some examples include:

    Haley Sneak Attacking Crystal despite her having Uncanny Dodge;

    Called Shot with O-Chul stabbing Red Cloak's eye; Roy leaving Thog temporarily blind; and Tarquin breaking Haley's arm;

    Using a bow while prone;

    Pathfinder's Cleave.

    Sure, some of these might just be the Giant ignoring the rules for the sake of cool story telling, but there should more of these.

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    HalfOrcPirate

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Elan's (and Julio Scoundrel's) "Dashing Swordsman" prestige class.

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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Are we including homebrew things in here?
    How vampires work in OOTS.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Suggestion, charm, and dominate effects are way more powerful than they are "by the book".
    I like semi-colons; they make me feel smart.

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    ElfRangerGuy

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Back in one of the Class and Level Geekery threads after #886 showed Roy attacking Xykon and disrupting his spellcasting, people thought he might have a certain feat. Rich chimed in to say that all new characters have unspecified classes, all items are homebrewed and all feats have been homebrewed for some time to avoid rules-lawyering. You may also wish to read this later reply for context.
    I'm the ranger
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  6. - Top - End - #6
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Kobold

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Adding to the list: AMF affecting Forcecage


    Quote Originally Posted by Jaxzan Proditor View Post
    Are we including homebrew things in here?
    Quote Originally Posted by KillingAScarab View Post
    Back in one of the Class and Level Geekery threads after #886 showed Roy attacking Xykon and disrupting his spellcasting, people thought he might have a certain feat. Rich chimed in to say that all new characters have unspecified classes, all items are homebrewed and all feats have been homebrewed for some time to avoid rules-lawyering. You may also wish to read this later reply for context.
    Sure, go ahead and include homebrewed feats and items, as well as homebrewed classes that have been especified (Dashing Swordman), but let's try to stay clear of things that haven't (Bandana being "rogue-type" for example)
    Last edited by heavyfuel; 2015-01-26 at 11:24 AM.

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    Pixie in the Playground
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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by heavyfuel View Post
    Haley Sneak Attacking Crystal despite her having Uncanny Dodge;
    Is there solid proof of Crystal having uncanny dodge at a high enough level to avoid being flanked by Haley? Bozzok does (he can sneak attack her), but all we know about Crystal is that she is "pretty deadly with that funky sword". That she's Bozzok assassin does not mean she is of the assassin class.

    PS: i didn't read the book.

  8. - Top - End - #8
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Kobold

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by Noodz View Post
    Is there solid proof of Crystal having uncanny dodge at a high enough level to avoid being flanked by Haley? Bozzok does (he can sneak attack her), but all we know about Crystal is that she is "pretty deadly with that funky sword". That she's Bozzok assassin does not mean she is of the assassin class.

    PS: i didn't read the book.
    We know for a fact that she has levels in Assassin, as seen in the first speech buble of this comic

    I suppose she could be a 1st level Assassin, but given her being level 13 in the least (same as Haley) according to the class leve lthread , this is highly unlikely

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    Ettin in the Playground
     
    SwashbucklerGuy

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Complete List of the Giant's Houserules

    1. No D&D rule will ever get in the way of telling the best possible story.

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    Troll in the Playground
     
    littlebum2002's Avatar

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by Noodz View Post
    Is there solid proof of Crystal having uncanny dodge at a high enough level to avoid being flanked by Haley? Bozzok does (he can sneak attack her), but all we know about Crystal is that she is "pretty deadly with that funky sword". That she's Bozzok assassin does not mean she is of the assassin class.

    PS: i didn't read the book.
    Sneak Attack works only when the target is flanked or denied their Dexterity bonus to AC. Uncanny Dodge keeps you from ever losing your Dexterity bonus to AC. So Crystal didn't need Improved Uncanny Dodge to avoid the Sneak Attack.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Kobold

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay R View Post
    Complete List of the Giant's Houserules

    1. No D&D rule will ever get in the way of telling the best possible story.
    You don't say!

    I said so in the OP, but still, he follows the rules pretty closely most of the time, and I wated to know which rules are actually houserules

  12. - Top - End - #12
    Ettin in the Playground
     
    SwashbucklerGuy

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by heavyfuel View Post
    You don't say!

    I said so in the OP, but still, he follows the rules pretty closely most of the time, and I wated to know which rules are actually houserules
    None of them are house rules, in the sense of a rule that the house now applies consistently. They are not rules at all, but exceptions used to advance the plot, no more inviolable than any other rule.

    Actually, there is one rule I can think of being applied consistently, that is in direct conflict with D&D - how vampires work. But that's being consistently applied as a rule only to further the plot.

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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Starmetal is homebrewed. I believe Roy's disrupt thing is also a homebrewed feat.
    How vampires work in OOTS.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    oppyu's Avatar

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Wasn't there a thing where the Giant said pretty much everything lately has been homebrewed to avoid complaints about not following the rules?

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    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Lizardfolk

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by oppyu View Post
    Wasn't there a thing where the Giant said pretty much everything lately has been homebrewed to avoid complaints about not following the rules?
    Yeah, and it's been quoted once already:

    Quote Originally Posted by KillingAScarab View Post
    Back in one of the Class and Level Geekery threads after #886 showed Roy attacking Xykon and disrupting his spellcasting, people thought he might have a certain feat. Rich chimed in to say that all new characters have unspecified classes, all items are homebrewed and all feats have been homebrewed for some time to avoid rules-lawyering. You may also wish to read this later reply for context.
    But that said, I think there's at least a little potential in finding out what things have been consistently houseruled. For instance, I'm pretty sure the Giant has always ignored the weight rules when it comes to flight, not just when it's relevant to the plot.
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    Also, as a rule of thumb, if you find yourself defending your inalienable right to make someone else feel like garbage, you're on the wrong side of the argument.
    Quote Originally Posted by oppyu View Post
    There is nothing more emblematic of this forum than three or four pages of debate between people who, as it turns out, pretty much agree with each other.




    Why "because the plot said so" is not a good answer.

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    littlebum2002's Avatar

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaxzan Proditor View Post
    Starmetal is homebrewed. I believe Roy's disrupt thing is also a homebrewed feat.
    Starmetal is from Complete Arcane, but the idea that it damages undead is homebrewed. It's a key component of the famously horrendous Green Star Adept prestige class, and it'd be a great joke if one of them tried to steal Roy's sword.

    Roy's feat is called Mage Slayer from the same book but it is slightly different from that version (because Xykon didn't know he couldn't cast defensively, but the feat says he's supposed to know)
    Last edited by littlebum2002; 2015-01-27 at 10:03 AM.

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    Orc in the Playground
     
    MindFlayer

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by ti'esar View Post
    For instance, I'm pretty sure the Giant has always ignored the weight rules when it comes to flight, not just when it's relevant to the plot.
    Not always (2nd panel)

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    Ettin in the Playground
     
    SwashbucklerGuy

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    One of the main ways I'm mitigating the effects of the people who complain about rules accuracy is by deliberately obfuscating all rules, so it's impossible to tell exactly what is or isn't being done. No one can complain that I messed up the interpretation of a certain feat if they don't know what feat it is. The only exceptions are spells, because I unfortunately established that casters shout the name of the spell when they cast it, and I can't change that now. But for a while now, ALL feats have been homebrewed feats, all items have been homebrewed items, all new characters have unspecified classes, etc. Even when I have a specific actual game rule in mind when I use them.
    So the rules that you're trying to list here in this thread exist for the specific reason that the Giant doesn't want us to have a list of the rules.

  19. - Top - End - #19
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    littlebum2002's Avatar

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay R View Post
    So the rules that you're trying to list here in this thread exist for the specific reason that the Giant doesn't want us to have a list of the rules.
    Rich has always said he has no problem with people listing all the rules he's using. The problem he has is when people complain that he's not following the rules correctly. As long as this remains a "list of all the times Rich hasn't followed the rules" and contains no subjective opinions on the matter, it should be fine.
    Last edited by littlebum2002; 2015-01-28 at 01:55 PM.

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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Peelee's Avatar

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay R View Post
    So the rules that you're trying to list here in this thread exist for the specific reason that the Giant doesn't want us to have a list of the rules.
    The Giant doesn't want us to have a list of the rules, you say?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    I, in no way, meant to imply that anyone is doing anything wrong by having this thread. If anything, this thread keeps these conversations from springing up all over. And in here, you argue over the strip as written rather than complaining that the strip gets it wrong.

    However, I saw Kish making an assumption about the level of in-comic proof that would be required to state that Tactic X was Feat Y, and I thought it would be useful to point out that such is not a useful standard to hold anyone to anymore, because I've long since changed the way I write certain aspects of the comic. In other words, I was trying to help. I may have had some leftover snark from a thread I had just locked, though. Sorry about that.
    It appears The Giant doesn't mind people figuring out what he's doing or how he's doing it; only that he hates it when people say, "you're doing it wrong." Which this thread, by its very nature, is explicitly against.
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  21. - Top - End - #21
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
    Mike Havran's Avatar

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    I think there is another rule that neglects the limits of creatures one can take with Teleport. There is no way Shojo would need OotS if he had at least level 18 Wizard on his payroll.
    Last edited by Mike Havran; 2015-01-28 at 04:01 PM.
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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    He needs someone not in the Sapphire Guard though, to carry out missions to Other Gates.
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    Bugbear in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by hamishspence View Post
    He needs someone not in the Sapphire Guard though, to carry out missions to Other Gates.
    Arguably, if the Sapphire Guard is all Paladins, the wizard is ipso facto not Sapphire Guard. Your meaning holds, though. It needed to be covert, and agents not involved with Azure City at all up until that point was ideal.
    DZ-4049 in the 501st Legion! Silver Dragon avatar by the awesome Cuthalion!

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    hamishspence's Avatar

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Arguably, if the Sapphire Guard is all Paladins, the wizard is ipso facto not Sapphire Guard.
    Some are flying robed casters:

    http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0447.html

    though those could have all been clerics. The tourist guidesheet in War & XPs does talk about a "cabal of divine spellcasters answering only to the Lord of the City" (and says that, after exhaustive investigating, no evidence of their existence has been found).
    Last edited by hamishspence; 2015-01-28 at 04:32 PM.
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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by hamishspence View Post
    Some are flying robed casters:

    http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0447.html

    though those could have all been clerics. The tourist guidesheet in War & XPs does talk about a "cabal of divine spellcasters answering only to the Lord of the City".
    Hmmm. You have proven the more well-versed. I surrender to your superior knowledge, oh Spence of the Hamish. I'd always read that line as an intended vaguery of the order of paladins.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by hamishspence View Post
    The tourist guidesheet in War & XPs does talk about a "cabal of divine spellcasters answering only to the Lord of the City"
    I assumed the Divine Spellcasters they were referring to were the Paladins.


    Also, in #459 Evil clerics are turning undead which is certainly a houserule
    Last edited by littlebum2002; 2015-01-28 at 08:18 PM.

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    Barbarian in the Playground
     
    Rakoa's Avatar

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by littlebum2002 View Post


    Also, in #459 Evil clerics are turning undead which is certainly a houserule
    Maybe they're just Misunderstood Clerics.
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    Ogre in the Playground
     
    Lizardfolk

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by littlebum2002 View Post
    Also, in #459 Evil clerics are turning undead which is certainly a houserule
    No, that one's explicitly explained in comic. They're using their Rebuke Undead ability to "turn" the positive energy spirits; it's not really any more of a houserule than the same thing occurring with Eberron's deathless.

    (Or were you joking? I couldn't tell).
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Giant View Post
    Also, as a rule of thumb, if you find yourself defending your inalienable right to make someone else feel like garbage, you're on the wrong side of the argument.
    Quote Originally Posted by oppyu View Post
    There is nothing more emblematic of this forum than three or four pages of debate between people who, as it turns out, pretty much agree with each other.




    Why "because the plot said so" is not a good answer.

  29. - Top - End - #29
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    littlebum2002's Avatar

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by ti'esar View Post
    No, that one's explicitly explained in comic. They're using their Rebuke Undead ability to "turn" the positive energy spirits; it's not really any more of a houserule than the same thing occurring with Eberron's deathless.

    (Or were you joking? I couldn't tell).
    That explanation was always confusing for me. So they're using Rebuke undead, but it's acting like a Turn undead. I get it now, thanks.

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    Orc in the Playground
     
    Flumph

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    Default Re: List of the Giant's Houserules?

    Quote Originally Posted by littlebum2002 View Post
    Roy's feat is called Mage Slayer from the same book but it is slightly different from that version (because Xykon didn't know he couldn't cast defensively, but the feat says he's supposed to know)
    I don't think that's significant. That attack on Xykon happened in the illusion, which means it didn't happen at all and any information in it is based on what Roy, Elan, and Haley know or think they know. The only time Roy has used his Mage Slayer feat is when he disrupted Miron's Horrid Wilting.
    Random thought: If Vaarsuvius donned the Girdle of Femininity/Masculinity, would anyone notice?

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