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    Default 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    This guide has moved here. The reason is lack of space after XGtE came out. This page will no longer be updated.
    Last edited by hymer; 2018-02-04 at 05:22 AM.
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    Default 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon Post 2

    This guide has moved here. The reason is lack of space after XGtE came out. This page will no longer be updated.
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    Default 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon Post 3

    This guide has moved here. The reason is lack of space after XGtE came out. This page will no longer be updated.
    Last edited by hymer; 2018-02-04 at 05:22 AM.
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    Default 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon Post 4

    This guide has moved here. The reason is lack of space after XGtE came out. This page will no longer be updated.
    Last edited by hymer; 2018-02-04 at 05:22 AM.
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    Default Post 5

    This guide has moved here. The reason is lack of space after XGtE came out. This page will no longer be updated.
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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    I dare say that Feat Human is wonderful for a Moon Druid. It's a +1 WIS and CON and a feat!

    My Bard and a friendly Druid discovered a devastating combo: faerie fire + fog cloud. Make 'em pink then surround the area in fog. You can see them with advantage. They can't see you.
    Last edited by Endarire; 2015-02-13 at 12:10 AM.
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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    Perhaps a little off topic, but was there ever a consensus that the player got to pick his own summons?

    If not, you may want to mention that under the conjure spells.

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    A human moon druid using all his boosts as Feats can walk away with six; a tidy package to build a specialized combat package out of

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    Thanks for the replies guys. I'll try to get back to you, but right now i can't sit at my desk. I think maybe I've pinched a nerve.

    Edit: Some quick replies standing up:

    @ Endarire: It's pretty good, I agree. But there is no equivalent to, say, Heavy Armor Master og Great Weapon Master for druids - feats are good, but not as good as those. For druids, I don't rate humans higher than wood elf or hill dwarf - somewhat depending on the DM, of course.
    As for the combo trick, have fun! But I feel I should point out that by RAW Faerie Fire does not overcome Fog Cloud. It would defeat darkness and is specifically mentioned to defeat the 'invisible' condition; but not blanket heavy obscurement.
    Thanks for your thoughts!

    @ mephnick: I don't want to open up a can of worms. Let's just say I've seen the discussion, and I didn't forget it while writing my bit on Conjure Woodland Beings.
    Thanks for the thought, though.

    @ Naanomi: I can't think of six feats I'd be so desperate to get as a moon druid, to be honest. Resilient, Sentinel, Warcaster and +4 wisdom seems about right to me. Mileage may vary, of course.
    Thanks for weighing in!
    Last edited by hymer; 2015-02-14 at 01:18 PM.
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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    Quote Originally Posted by hymer View Post
    Thanks for the replies guys. I'll try to get back to you, but right now i can't sit at my desk. I think maybe I've pinched a nerve.

    @ Naanomi: I can't think of six feats I'd be so desperate to get as a moon druid, to be honest. Resilient, Sentinel, Warcaster and +4 wisdom seems about right to me. Mileage may vary, of course.
    Thanks for weighing in!
    I can! In addition to the ones you listed, I think the Mobility feat is an excellent choice for any Pounce or charge forms, allowing you to pounce and then still move up to 40 feet away without provoking. And allowing you to dash across long distances of difficult terrain as well as just always been 10 feet faster for all your modes of movement is pretty sweet.

    Alert is also a great feat, A better than improved initiative feat that also gives you improved uncanny dodge and the ability to act in any surprise round? Seems pretty good letting you get into your beast form before you get hit with anything, which may be a necessity depending on how hard you tanked your physical stats.
    Last edited by Ozimandius; 2015-02-22 at 03:22 PM.

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    Sentinel, Mageslayer, Mobile, Alert, Resiliant, Warcaster

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    Although not explicit in the rules, the Wildshape feature describes that you can transform into an animal you have seen. Many DM's will ask you to roll a Nature skill check to decide whether your character actually posesses the lore about the animal you want to transform into. This is also the case for Conjure Animals, and other conjuration spells. If you're in a Scandinavian styled setting, it will be difficult to recall knowledge about animals endemic to the african savanna for example.

    You might reconsider your evaluation of Nature. It should be blue in my opinion, especially for a class that relies so much on the knowledge of animal shapes and plants, and other things related to nature. Besides, from a roleplaying pespective it is hard to take serious a druid who skipped this skill.
    Last edited by Edenbeast; 2015-02-23 at 07:56 AM.

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    I'd also like you to re-evaluate Cha not being red...

    Cha mod would be what you would roll to interact with animals and creatures you come across. Sure you can cast animal friendship on them... But as a real druid shouldn't need to. (I'd make befriending animals be mostly role play) But the relevant skill + mod would be Nature+Cha and/or Animal Handling + Cha.

    If you or your DM puts animal friendship as a sub part of animal handling (+wis) then yes, cha should be red.

    wisdom = read body language, understand someone's feelings, notice things about the environment, or care for the injured.

    charisma = ability to interact effectively (confidence, eloquence, and charming/commanding personality)

    swaying a beast to be friendly would most assuredly be charisma...

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    @ Ozimandius: Your advice is duly noted in the thread for anyone who cares to read it! I'll just add a point or two:
    1: A moon druid with Sentinel cannot make much use of it 40' away from the enemy. Keeping the enemy off the guys in the back makes them much more useful to the party. And many, many enemies have ranged attacks, unlike practically all wild shapes (ape is the only one I can think of off-hand that packs a ranged attack).
    2: Be careful about opening the game up for the goblin conga line - the peculiarity in 5e RAW that lets large groups of lesser creatures all attack the same fighter in a narrow gap every round. If the table already has that, by all means take advantage. If the table think you're free to do it, maybe because you invested a feat, fine. But I'd suggest not lifting the lid off this can of worms in other cases.
    3: Thanks for speaking up!

    @ Naanomi: Fair enough, and the list is now there for anyone to consider. Thanks!

    @ Edenbeast: I think you may confuse Survival (the being out there and seeing) and Nature (the studying of nature, quite possibly in a warm library). If what you need is mere knolwedge of a creature (like for conjuring it), all you need is a big book of animals with illustrations. Just pick one up before level 5. You may be right that many DMs will use Nature for what you suggest. But that seems too contrary to the intention of the two skills for me to make note of it in the handbook.
    But now it is here, voiced for all to see. Thanks!
    On a final note, I really wish Nature was a better skill. Or that the rules had simply amalgamated Survival and Nature. But they didn't and here we are.

    @ Myzz: Well, Animal Handling is a Wisdom skill, so I think you're wrong in your conclusion there. But thanks for taking the time!
    Last edited by hymer; 2015-02-24 at 07:25 AM.
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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    Quote Originally Posted by hymer View Post
    @ Myzz: Well, Animal Handling is a Wisdom skill, so I think you're wrong in your conclusion there. But thanks for taking the time!
    I actually quoted the players hand book for wisdom and charisma...

    wisdom = read body language, understand someone's feelings, notice things about the environment, or care for the injured.

    charisma = ability to interact effectively (confidence, eloquence, and charming/commanding personality)
    so swaying beasts to be friendly would indeed be charisma, understanding a beasts body language would be wisdom. Also in the players handbook it talks about using skills with stats other than the ones normally associated with them. In this case, Animal Handling - Charisma would be the most apt fit. BUT that is a variant... If that variant is used at all, then Charisma would play a very significant role in a druid's stats.

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    Yeah, note that the 5e rules explicitly say that skills can sometimes be used with a different stat than their usual one. I think that befriending an animal would fit pretty well under Charisma (Animal Handling).
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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    In my party we are 2 druids(1 moon druid and 1 land druid), we paly 2 urchin wood elf brother, the moon one is a barbarian 4/moon druid 6 and me in druid 8/ and i must decide 2 lvs.
    In my team we have also a monk a life cleric and an aoe blaster sorcerer. The DMN house rule we can't use divination school, and only conjure animal works( so forget conjure element and conjuer fey), contagion works differently( houserule, now it sucks hard). My combat strat is conjure 8 wolves, monkeys, or octupus and cast non concentration spell. We lack of a sigle-target dmg( the monk and the bear are kore tankish than dmg dealer). So i'm thinking to multiclass in a cleric( tempest, light, DEATH or trickery). What do you think?
    Last edited by Chelios; 2015-02-24 at 10:28 AM.

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    You might want to make notes of spells that can be cast while wildshaped (because of lack of material componants); some spells that are pretty bad look better when other options disappear at that spell level (Storm of Vengeance)

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    @ Myzz: That Animal Handling is a Wisdom skill is from the PHB, too. Thereís no doubt that a DM may choose to see things the way you see them, and Iím not saying you make no sense. But for the purposes of a handbook, I find too many suppositions in your case for it to bear mentioning, because I have to stick with the bookís notion of Animal Handling. Otherwise Iíd be writing an endless number of scenarios and caveats into everything. I mention the occasional thing of this sort I think could come up, but this one I donít see as coming up enough for it to be worth it, and I would certainly want to discourage anyone reading the handbook from making the druid's rapport with animals dependent on charisma.
    To elaborate somewhat, I think that picking wisdom over charisma for Animal Handling was a very deliberate choice. Because the gruff ranger or aloof druid should and would be able to handle animals better than the charming diplomat who thinks about animals in terms of what sauce heíd serve them with.

    @ Chronos: Iím aware. But the DM could also rule that strength could be used to wrestle with a big dog and gain its respect, or dexterity to handle a captured bird deftly, or any other idea that comes into his mind. Being good with people and being good with animals may have some overlap, but they are hardly the same.
    If DMs want druids to be good at handling animals, theyíll let them use the default stat, because druids are good at that. If a DM wants to penalize a druid, thereís nothing you can really do to protect yourself. And if a DM simply has some notion that druids must have high charisma or animals in the forest will hate them, thatís rather table specific, and not really the subject for a general handbook. Hopefully the player will be aware of such a DMís peculiarities before character creation commences.

    @ Chelios: I think youíd be hard pressed to deal a lot of damage quickly. Even sans summoning, land druids can deal very respectable damage per spell slot, but they do less well in dealing a lot of damage per round. Multiclassing will set your advancement in spellcasting back, and I donít see how that should improve the damage in the long run.
    I donít feel qualified at this point to talk much about what cleric dips would do for you, but hereís my feeling: Sacred Flame is somewhat better as an attack cantrip than what druids get, but it wonít bring you anywhere near the at-will damage a fighter, rogue or warlock can do. Nor will access to first level cleric spells.
    Upping your direct damage dealing from straight druid is likely difficult. If you have a really high charisma, then maybe a warlock dip for some Eldritch Blastíing could make sense.
    Iíd ask the DM if heís willing to give something back from what heís taken from you in the summoning spells. Even if he isnít, Iíd go straight druid in your case (as I would as a general rule with druids), forget about being a big damage dealer, and go BC/debuff if you donít feel Conjure Animals is cutting it any more. You can conjure animals too with Conjure Fey, you may want to ask about that. The animals of low CR will be getting rather vulnerable as you level past their prime. And there are plenty of people in the party, so space concerns are likely to crop up. Apes have a ranged attack, so your moon druid and monk wonít have to compete with them for front space, so thatís something to keep in mind. That will also keep them a tad safer than on the front lines. And you can summon more animals with a 5th level spell slot Ė just be mindful of the spacing problem.
    A final note, and it goes for every class in 5th: When in doubt, single-class. There are multiclass traps aplenty, but single class characters are not, as a rule, traps.

    @ Naanomi: Giant2005 already did. See under the spoiler Land vs. Moon: Druid Abilities.
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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    After looking closely at some of the beast entries, I noticed something about the Giant Elk that I don't think has been mentioned. The target for its Hooves attack that does so much damage is against "one prone creature". Meaning you have to attack with your Ram unless they are prone. This brings them down in power significantly. Guess Polar Bear becomes a no brainer comparatively.

    Same goes for the Elephant's and Mammoth's Stomp.

    Also, thanks so much for this guide, it is great, and you are awesome for answering everyone's questions so diligently. I'm new here but it seems like a pretty great place.
    Last edited by Ozimandius; 2015-02-24 at 02:01 PM.

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    @ Ozimandius: Good catch on the stomping, thanks a bunch! I'll see that it gets amended quickly, because you're absolutely right.
    And thanks for the praise, too.
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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon Post 3

    Quote Originally Posted by hymer View Post
    If youíre going to buy your equipment at level 1, you get 2d4x10gp plus what you got from your background Ė 5-25gp.
    What you need to consider:

    Armour and shield: Depending on your pecuniary capabilities and your Dex, you will want to pick 10gp Hide (the obvious starter option), 45gp Studded Leather (for the rich and agile) or simple Leather (for the really agile, dex 18+, who can't afford studded leather). A shield is 10gp and well worth it. Even if you intend to use a bow, you want a shield in your pack. But if youíre that hard up for cash, you can leave it off for now.
    I just wanted to know if Druid's could actually use Studded Leather due to the fact they can't use armor with metal.

    Also in your Land druid rundown section you have ritual spells listed in red (Could be a waste of your stuff); however later in the spells section you have them blue (Good stuff). I was wondering if one of these was a typo.

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon Post 3

    Quote Originally Posted by rlh7yc View Post
    I just wanted to know if Druid's could actually use Studded Leather due to the fact they can't use armor with metal.
    You can probably talk your DM into allowing it if you read the description of Studded Leather:
    Studded Leather. Made from tough but flexible
    leather, studded leather is reinforced with close-set
    rivets or spikes.
    Doesn't say they have to be metal rivets or spikes...

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    The "no metal" thing is stupid anyway. There isn't a much more natural element than metals. Hell, it's even considered an element with water, air etc in a lot of philosophies.

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    @ rlh7yc: About studded leather: Iím in line with Nod_Hero. If you read the descriptions, the key word with studded leather is that itís made 'from leather'. The medium armour descriptions (except hide) mention metal specifically, where studded doesnít. Presumably there may be metal buckles on the armour straps too, for instance, without this counting as the armour being 'made of metal'. The wording of the prohibition is up to interpretation, as is the description of individual armour types.
    Of course, your DM may see it differently, but you should have some arguments to hand at least.
    About Rituals: Since you donít have a choice about being able to use rituals, the Ďit-might-be-a-wasteí is merely in comparison to everything else you get. In the context of a specific spell, it is of course a good thing that you have the option of casting it without expending a spell slot. I wanted something to draw attention to Ritual and Concentration spells, and the colours (and their connotations of 'nice' and 'look out') seemed the obvious choice.

    @ Nod_Hero: I agree completely. Thanks!

    @ mephnick: Itís a taboo, itís not supposed to make sense. But it's not caught out of thin air; the unwillingness to use certain metals for certain tasks is a religious taboo youíll find from a Flamen Dialis of ancient Rome to an American native shaman. The ability to work metals can be seen as a (or the) major step in moving away from humanityís Ďnaturalí stone-age state, and so defying it may seem proper for a druid. Your mileage may vary, of course.
    Last edited by hymer; 2015-02-25 at 07:14 AM.
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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    @ hymer
    Thanks for the response. I guess I was just over thinking it then on the ritual/concentration stuff.

    I was thinking of how real studded leather was made:

    Brigandine
    Also sometimes called a Jack, Brigandine is made of small steel or iron plates sandwiched between layers of leather or canvas and riveted in place. It was a popular defense on its own for less wealthy soldiers and as a second layer over mail for richer knights. This type of armor sees fairly widespread use in the High Middle Ages, and slowly tapering off (although not disappearing completely) in the Late Middle Ages.
    What many role playing games refer to as "studded leather" armor is likely a confused interpretation of medieval artwork that depicted Brigandines (as the only visible metal part of the armor is the rivet structure holding the plates underneath in place).
    Most of what is known about this type of armor is taken from either iconographic sources, or - like the Coat of Plates - from a mass grave site near Wisby largely excavated between 1928 - 1930, and full of remains from a battle fought in 1361.
    http://mercwars.com/armtype.shtml

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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    @ rlh7yc: As the little article suggests, studded leather is largely fictitious. The range of armour in use in D&D is in itself pretty unrealistic, mixing time periods and cultures and throwing in some inventions or misinterpretations. I think it's safe to say that the armours available are chosen more for cinematic reasons or D&D traditions, than for simulating realism.
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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    Personally, I want to smack whichever designer it was back in the day who came up with the abomination that is splint mail. Now, banded mail, that's practical: It puts a lot of solid metal between you and the pointy bits, while still maintaining most of your flexibility. But splint mail would give you exactly as much protection as banded, while greatly restricting your movements, for no added benefit.
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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    Update: Elemental Evil races, cantrips and spells added to the guide. The races are in post one, and the spells and cantrips in post five. Look out for Dust Devil (lvl 2) as a possible replacement for Flaming Sphere, the Investiture spells (lvl 6) for something more to cast at that level, and Whirlwind (lvl 7) which looks promising as well as highly amusing.
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    Default Re: 5e Druid Handbook - Land & Moon

    Quote Originally Posted by Myzz View Post
    I actually quoted the players hand book for wisdom and charisma...



    so swaying beasts to be friendly would indeed be charisma, understanding a beasts body language would be wisdom. Also in the players handbook it talks about using skills with stats other than the ones normally associated with them. In this case, Animal Handling - Charisma would be the most apt fit. BUT that is a variant... If that variant is used at all, then Charisma would play a very significant role in a druid's stats.
    Handle animal is under wisdom... Cha for animal handling was a poor fit in previous editions. Interacting with animals and people are vastly different. It's a good thing they finally distinguished between the two (as far as primary stats). Cuts down on RP based MADness.

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