Relationship Woes and Advice XXVI. Status: It's Complicated

[FinnLassie]

Hm, I had an idea to go around and see if any of the nice people from when I was in high school would be interested in dating. The plan would be to take a quick look on facebook to see if any of them have a listed relationship status or pictures suggesting a relationship as well as seeing if they still live in the area. Is this a terrible idea?

Also thanks to the person who responded to me quite a while after I last posted here.

I think the best thing to do is think about the following points:

• How close were they to you in school?
• How close are you to them now?

As I don't know how you'll go about this nor do I know your personality, but the best idea wouldn't be to immediately say "hey ho wanna date-o", but to catch up with their life at first and see if your interests match and such.

[Glass Mouse]

As I don't know how you'll go about this nor do I know your personality, but the best idea wouldn't be to immediately say "hey ho wanna date-o", but to catch up with their life at first and see if your interests match and such.

This. I would be pretty weirded out if someone I knew in high school messaged me "hey wanna date" out of the blue. To be honest, unless it was someone I liked very much (and thus probably someone I'm still in contact with), I would probably also wonder why he couldn't get dates in his current life circumstances.

I would also be annoyed/amused if someone wrote me a "hey, let's catch up" message and then, after realizing I wasn't interested in dating, disappeared again. That's the kind of story I'd probably share with other high school friends over a few beers. I'm pretty sure my girl friends would find it amusing. Point is, that would spread.

So, uh. Hitting up people solely for dates might work against you, unless you're extremely suave. Now, hitting up old high school acquiantances for dates and potential friendship? I heartily endorse that. Hell, I have a good list of high school people I wouldn't mind seeing again, just to see if we could still have fun together. Dating is just such a high bar for someone who's grown into pretty much a stranger.

[Grytorm]

Sorry for bringing it up then.

[Glass Mouse]

Sorry for bringing it up then.

I'm not quite sure how you got that from me and FinnLassie's responses? "Consider the context and person" and "don't treat people as pieces of meat, but as cool people who have a value (aka, friend potential) outside of their pant contents" are pretty basic, 101-type pieces of dating advice. That really shouldn't discourage you.

[Grytorm]

Depression and the fact I have about two friends who I can think of and I have seen neither of them for months.

Both of those things are good advice though, I just really don't know how to be friends with people very well. So it makes things more difficult.

[Glass Mouse]

Depression and the fact I have about two friends who I can think of and I have seen neither of them for months.

Both of those things are good advice though, I just really don't know how to be friends with people very well. So it makes things more difficult.

Lots of sympathy hugs for you!

Then you should definitely reach out to people (whether from high school or not), and definitely be open to friendship. Because friends are awesome, and you deserve a million of them. Okay, no, not a million, that sounds horrifying, but as many as you need.

Connecting to people is hard work, but it's not as hard as dating. Start with friendships. Go to board game nights. Invite people over for movie nights. Find a meetup group. Get engaged in whatever community projects you can handle. Go to the Friday bar of your workplace/school. Putting yourself out there works for both friends and dating, and friend hunting pays off way faster. Start small, make it a habit - something as small as "I must drink one beer with my colleagues after work every Friday" can work wonders, as long as you keep at it.

And yes, if it's easier for you to reach out online, definitely start sending out those "I'm doing a Project Reconnect With Cool People From the Past. Remember [funny memory]? How did [that thing you wanted] go? Are you still into [cool hobby]?" messages. Like I said, I'd personally be happy to be contacted by someone who genuinely wanted to reconnect and not just suss me out for potential no-pants time. It's always awesome to know that you made a strong enough impression for someone to remember you and still wanna be your friend. I'm sure a lot of your former high school classmates feel the same way.

Depression is a jerk, and I hope you're getting the help you need. Good luck out there!

[Coidzor]

Depression and the fact I have about two friends who I can think of and I have seen neither of them for months.

Both of those things are good advice though, I just really don't know how to be friends with people very well. So it makes things more difficult.

You don't want to go trying to start relationships willy-nilly, especially when depressed. Look into some treatment before you start asking people out, so you don't just try to use them as emotional surrogates or what have you.

The great thing about friends is that by seeking them out and having them and interacting with them you can practice the skills of friendship. Also, you can learn social skills, some of them you can even get the basic jist of down on paper by researching them before you start the practical lesson.

[Stuebi]

So besides looking for advice, I needed to get this off my chest for some time.

My last relationship ended very, very badly. It was a mix of cheating, a huge argument followed by pretty much my entire friend-circle splitting up. This was almost a year ago, and I still don't talk to a lot of people from back then. I shut myself off for quite a while, kept to myself and a couple Internet-Friends.

Recently, my Bestie contacted me again. She missed me, and asked if I was okay with meeting her again, maybe go out sometime. Honestly, I had missed her too, and the radio-silence was basically unintiontional in her case. So we've been meeting again the last couple weeks.

The thing with my Bestie, she hates seeing me lonely (Even if I'm not that bothered by that myself) and tries to introduce me to single ladies from her friend-circle.

Problem is, I feel awful even at the slightest hint of romantic feelings or flirting. I hadn't realized that my past relationsship actually hit that hard. But it... just doesnt work anymore. I get uncomfortable, defensive even. It's really hard to explain, and I know it sounds stupid, but it's like my entire Body just goes into full-on "Nope!" mode. It's especially awful since there's absolutely nothing wrong with the women I talk to. We were in a Bar and Bestie introduced me to one of her friends from school. She was really nice, we talked and laughed. But the moment it got flirty, I got flashbacks to from a year ago. I eventually left early, saying that I didnt feel all that good (Which was true).

I talked tomy Bestie and some other friends, and just asked them to keep me away from stuff like that for a while, but I dont even really know what's wrong with me. I know I felt awful towards people right after the breakup, especially women. But I seriously thought I got over that. I dont know why I cant get over these feelings. It's like I'm scared of betrayal, even if I have just met the person.

I allways had confidence issues when it comes to relationsships. And my Ex basically shattered me. It's a horrible feeling to realize, that it still haunts me more than a year afterwards. And I dont know what to do.

[Grytorm]

Well I tried to reconnect with a friend on Facebook, it went okay at first then collapsed.

My dads an art program teacher and he pulled out some old pictures. I recognized the friends name on one of them and asked her online if she went to the same school when we were younger. She said it would be cool to see it and I asked what a good time would be. She responded negatively because she doesn't have a car and I asked if she was living in the nearby city to where we are from. Then she didn't respond.

That conversation took about 20 minutes and after a few days she has not responded.

Her Last Response was:

"I don't know that's where it gets way trickier. I don't live in [Hometown] and I don't have a car. I probably am never going to get a chance to see it."

My last response was:

"Ah, where do you live? Your profile mentions [CITY]"

[Iruka]

Well I tried to reconnect with a friend on Facebook, it went okay at first then collapsed.

My dads an art program teacher and he pulled out some old pictures. I recognized the friends name on one of them and asked her online if she went to the same school when we were younger. She said it would be cool to see it and I asked what a good time would be. She responded negatively because she doesn't have a car and I asked if she was living in the nearby city to where we are from. Then she didn't respond.

That conversation took about 20 minutes and after a few days she has not responded.

Her Last Response was:

"I don't know that's where it gets way trickier. I don't live in [Hometown] and I don't have a car. I probably am never going to get a chance to see it."

My last response was:

"Ah, where do you live? Your profile mentions [CITY]"

How about you take a photo or scan the picture and send it to her?

[Glass Mouse]

I talked tomy Bestie and some other friends, and just asked them to keep me away from stuff like that for a while, but I dont even really know what's wrong with me. I know I felt awful towards people right after the breakup, especially women. But I seriously thought I got over that. I dont know why I cant get over these feelings. It's like I'm scared of betrayal, even if I have just met the person.

Many, many internet hugs for you.

You broke up a year ago, right? And it was a horrible mix of betrayal, cheating, hurt feelings and friend abandonment? That's a big deal, and it's okay if it still hurts. Honestly, I'd be surprised if you were over it so soon.

You're doing the right things, Stuebi. You're connecting with people. You're putting your toes in the water, gauging the temperature, and adjusting accordingly. Knowing that you're not yet ready for romance is a useful thing to know about yourself.

Now, while it's good not to be bothered by one's own company, you also need to be careful. Because especially for introvert nerdy-types like us (I'm assuming), that can also be used as a shield. "Nope, I'm okay on my own, nope I don't need people, nope I don't need to heal, I'm totally okay here". Which is... a bad direction to go. You don't get over your breakup just by sitting at home and nursing your feelings. A quintessential part is building new and better experiences. And I'm including the friendship breakups in that, because those might be the bigger deal.

So keep getting out there. Meet people for friendship and fun. Attempt flirting once in a while, and see how that feels. Keep adjusting according to your needs and your optimal pace.

You have both friend and relationship drama to get over, and it's totally okay if either or both of those takes a while. Good luck out there.

Well I tried to reconnect with a friend on Facebook, it went okay at first then collapsed.

You took the initiative and wrote someone. That's awesome. Good first step :)

Now go repeat that fifty times. No, I am not kidding.

One thing, though: I'm not trying to dissuade you from anything, but you need to keep this in mind going forward: Most women are not overly keen on meeting up with strange men that they barely remember. You know that you're totally harmless, but she doesn't - you could go anywhere from perfectly nice to axe-murdering rapist. Asking her to meet up while you're still a statistically-likely-to-hurt-her stranger really does you no favors. You need to chat long enough for her mental calculations to include actual info on what a cool and respectful guy you are.

IMHO, you should probably think of this project as a connection-building exercise. Practise chatting with strangers, finding points of commonalities, keeping a conversation going. Keep things low-key and low-investment at first, because that matches what people on the other end feel. Maybe abandon the idea of meeting up completely, unless she brings it up.
And remember: one fizzled conversation doesn't mean you failed. I know every conversation feels like a huge investment and energy drain right now, but it'll get easier - which is part of the reason you need to do this again and again. There's a lot of criteria for succes here: actually sending a message, getting a reply, having a five minutes+ conversation, uncovering a shared obscure interest, making her laugh at a joke, yourself laughing at a joke, her asking you questions, you asking her out, her asking you out, you gracefully accepting a rejection, her later sending you something relating to your conversation, you remembering to do the same, etc., etc. These are all markers of succes, and some conversations will have fewer, some more, but the more you talk to people and build your conversation skills, the more the general trajectory will be upwards.

This is also why I recommend talking with everyone. If basic socialising and connection is an issue for you, you can learn a lot by chatting up the cashier, the old lonely guy at the bus stop, etc. If you're in the habit of striking up conversations, it gets much easier to connect to that cool person at the boardgame night who'll make an awesome friend.

Note: I speak a lot about socialising as if it's a skill to learn. That's because it totally is. You build it by talking to people, by cooling your own assumptions, by listening, and by finding ways to relate to what they're saying in a meaningful way. It's work, and sometimes it's hard, but it's also really rewarding while you're doing it.

Also, you are getting help for your depression, right? Right? Because if not, that is your very first step.

[Serpentine]

In the world of modern technology, I would find it really, really weird if someone insisted on meeting in person just to show me a decade old photograph instead of just sending me a scan of it or whatever, and I pretty much definitely wouldn't do it unless I wanted to see that person anyway.

[Talar]

So I just wanna rant about a few things cause well it has been frustrating. So I guess I will go through it all in chronological order. So I went on a date with an amazing, funny cute girl 3 days before I went out of state for my final year of university (admittedly not the best idea, but I don't regret it). This was my first date in two years, anyway we decide to just keep in touch and get to know each other more. This was a month ago, and yesterday she told me she recently came in contact with an ex and they decided to give it another try, which bummed me out. But I guess I have the consolidation of the fact for the most part second flings like that don't usually work out. But still I'm bummed about it and frustrated cause I really liked her. Meanwhile since me and her weren't going anywhere any time soon, I went on a couple dates with another girl at school, but as time marched on she responded less and less frequently to me and the prospect of hanging out. So I am calling it dead in the water at this point, and I don't really care that much cept for the fact that she couldn't give me an honest goodbye. So all this subtle and not so subtle rejection has sorta kicked me down a bit.

Also a couple weeks ago I found out that my ex, we split about 2 years ago now and who I dated for 2 and a half years, is now engaged to be married. I do not know really how to handle this news cause well at one point we were talking about the possibility of marriage, even talking about what to name our future kids. So to here that she is engaged to be married, after she was adamant about becoming a nun just hurts. Apparently something changed while she was studying abroad in Rome last semester. So in less than five months after deciding not to become a nun she is engaged. And I do not know how to feel about it. It's strange.

Thanks for reading, and I am sorry if this it is incomprehensible in anyway, if it is I will try to clean it up a bit later on.

[dehro]

Falling in love is one of the main reasons why nuns and priests in training walk out on said training. It's not that uncommon and makes a great deal of sense if you look at it from the outside... You're About to dedicate your life and love, and love-hate to something that is based on pure faith and hope...Then you find out that you can find those things in the here and now and still be a good Catholic and enjoy the perks of an actual physically present partner...The closer you get to making that life-changing choice, the better the alternative looks, I guess.
And getting married is kind of a logical step after finding a partner well suited enough to make you falter in your convictions, especially so for a Catholic, AFAIK.
It's no fun when you're on the third corner of that triangle, but it's not all that strange either.

[Feytalist]

Also a couple weeks ago I found out that my ex, we split about 2 years ago now and who I dated for 2 and a half years, is now engaged to be married. I do not know really how to handle this news cause well at one point we were talking about the possibility of marriage, even talking about what to name our future kids. So to here that she is engaged to be married, after she was adamant about becoming a nun just hurts. Apparently something changed while she was studying abroad in Rome last semester. So in less than five months after deciding not to become a nun she is engaged. And I do not know how to feel about it. It's strange.

Yeah, I know that feel. I was in a surprisingly similar situation to you a couple of years ago. Ex of 3-odd years, we were seriously talking about marriage, and she ended it for religious reasons. No contact for a couple of years, and then I found out she was married in the stupidest of ways: by seeing her surname change and wedding photo on her Google+ profile.

It's a weird feeling, yeah. It's gonna hurt for a while, if you're anything like me at least. But the best thing is to realise that it's not part of your life anymore, and just let it go. People are fickle, they change their minds a lot. Better to just acknowledge that, and move on. I know it's an easy thing to say Anyway, good luck.



Now, I have some developments on my side as well. Last weekend, on a group outing, I met a lovely young lady; very friendly, personable, open (though, to be fair, she was that way with everyone ). Anyway, we exchanged numbers, saw each other again at a dinner party thing on Tuesday, been chatting ever since, and will see each other again on Wednesday for a housewarming thing. We both seem to be not in any real rush for anything serious, but I'm pretty happy with progress so far. But... I seem to have totally forgotten how to flirt! via text, but in person as well. I mean, I was never Don Anyone, but this is just a bit weird. Mojo at 0%. I feel like I need to relearn a basic skill... No real advice needed really (although feel free to share anyway), just an amusing aside.

[dehro]

Take the crafty road and tell HER you've forgotten how to flirt. It will make any subsequent attempt vaguelly endearing and cute .. Especially so if you make an effort to look extra-bumbling in your efforts
P.S. No, I'm not actually being serious.. Though it might work, stranger things have happened

[Serpentine]

Grr arg.
Not seeking advice, just venting, and maybe a bit of "please don't be this person".

The short version is a good friend of mine has cut me off (mostly) because his new girlfriend has decreed that he's not allowed to be friends with any of his exes.

The long version is this: I went out with this guy for a few months in high school before breaking up with him because he was in love with me and I wasn't with him. We faltered a bit but we rebuilt our friendship and have been good friends ever since.
That was just the start of his terrible luck with women, though. Then there was the girl who decided after a couple of weeks that she was gay. Then, when he was somewhere around early-mid 20s, the girl who told him she was 18 or whatever and then her brother quietly informed him that she was actually 15. Then the literally crazy abusive one who tried to isolate him from his friends and especially his family (and they're a REALLY close family) and then when he finally decided to leave her she tried to lock him in the bedroom and wouldn't let him go - he had to climb through the window. The last one seemed more normal - he was engaged to her, even, but then she broke it off because he couldn't find work. So he moved interstate and found a job within a week (typical).
So he's a lovely guy and sensitive and prone to loneliness, which was hitting especially hard with is relocation. So when I found out he'd finally found another girl I was elated! It was great, and he deserves to be happy and I was so glad for him!
And then I discovered that he'd uunfriended me on Facebook while his mother had added me and apparently sent me a message. It said that his new girlfriend was "jealous" and said he's not allowed to stay in contact with any of his exes, that he'd try to sort it out but in the meantime we could talk through his mother's account because his girlfriend checks his (!!!!).
So now I'm more than a little pissed off and even more worried about. He's already been in an abusive relationship, and this is sending up huge red flags for me - deciding who he may or may not be friends with? Monitoring his private accounts and messages? Holy ****. What the ****. I want to be happy he's found someone, but this particular someone sounds pretty crappy.
Thinking about asking his sister to just keep an eye on it. Probably not necessary, but it'd make me feel a bit better.

Edit: oh also I was talking to a guy on Okcupid who seemed cool and interested and now his account is closed, so that's a bummer.

[Astrella]

Yep, major red flags, bluh. :c

[Insane Trystane]

Serpentine, yeah that's not okay. Sounds like he has trouble distinguishing what is a problem (I've been there, too.) Tell him through his mom's account that you don't believe that's a healthy situation--that it demonstrates at least two warning signs of an abusive relationship--and do tell his family to keep an eye on him. You might not be able to convince him, but speaking from personal experience, I'd prefer "Your S.O. is emotionally abusing you" to "Well, (s)he's probably a pretty cool person..." when the advice-giver can see what the involved party can't.

[The Bandicoot]

Hello, my name is Hipho and it's been about two and a half years since my last confession.

The last time I was here I posted asking whether I should pick between Girl A or Girl B and I believe the resounding answer was "neither". Well, I didn't listen to your advice but I come asking more.

Spoiler: Spoilered for Length

Show

I recently got out of a two year relationship. Me and this girl weren't head over heels, we had a very grounded relationship. We knew we loved eachother, and we knew that we both eventually wanted marriage and kids and whatnot.

Now our breakup was a mutual thing that we both saw coming for about six months or so. Despite the fact that we loved eachother, we had differing opinions when it came to our core beliefs. Things like her being rather homophobic and me being the opposite, her being completely religious and me being completely spiritual.

Anyway, that doesn't really matter. What matters is it happened about a month ago during which we've stayed in contact and been on generally friendly terms. Now I jokingly suggested a mild "friends with benefits" arrangement of meeting once every month or two to blow of some steam because we're both very frustrated and pent-up in that regard. I said this as sort've a half joke 'but if you go for it I'm all for it' not expecting her to go for it in the slightest.

This girl, who is twenty and some odd years old, who once told me she wanted to wait until marriage to have sex, who it took me eight months to convince her to NOT save her first kiss for marriage. She went for it. Not completely, she says she wants a little more time to think about things, but she's also talking about possibly wanting to have sex. It's really throwing me for a loop and I don't really know what kind of advice I'm looking for but just......wat.

tl;dr Jokingly suggested "friends with benefits" to ex, ex actually going for it and wanting to go further than we did when we were together. Wat do.

[Glass Mouse]

Serpentine, yeah that's not okay. Sounds like he has trouble distinguishing what is a problem (I've been there, too.) Tell him through his mom's account that you don't believe that's a healthy situation--that it demonstrates at least two warning signs of an abusive relationship--and do tell his family to keep an eye on him. You might not be able to convince him, but speaking from personal experience, I'd prefer "Your S.O. is emotionally abusing you" to "Well, (s)he's probably a pretty cool person..." when the advice-giver can see what the involved party can't.

I agree that this situation has NOPENOPENOPENOPE written all over it. Much sympathy to your friend, Serp.

But! Barging in there with pointed fingers of "abuse!" is likely not gonna end well. He is likely in the honeymoon phase with this girl, and since he hasn't already kicked her to the curb for her unreasonable demands, it's safe to assume that she will be able to spin any intervention to her purposes - "see, honey, she's already trying to come between us, she really wants you as a standby rebound, huh?"

I don't know the perfect thing to do. But I think it is much more important to convey that "hey friend, I'm sad that you cut me off, but I will always be here for talking or support, should you need it" than any kind of intellectual insight of "you must see that this situation is wrong". People in relationships don't break up because people tell them that they should. They double down. And knowing that they can look forward to love and support rather than "I told you so!" is so, so, so important.

But he definitely could stand to hear some version of "wow, I definitely wouldn't stand for that if it were me, but if you're happy, I respect that". Reality check + acknowledgement of his intelligence and agency (something that abusers are VERY good at stealing from their victims) might be helpful. Don't jump to abuse accusations, just help stabilize what he might be coming to see as normal, acceptable behaviour. That's much more useful for him.

tl;dr Jokingly suggested "friends with benefits" to ex, ex actually going for it and wanting to go further than we did when we were together. Wat do.

Well, do you actually want an FWB arrangement? I'd think that's the important part.

People change in weird ways, and you two just broke up. She's likely reevaluating a ton of things right now. But if it bothers you a lot, I don't think it would be unreasonable to make "this feels kinda weird" noises and then talk it out.

ETA: Some people find sex much easier when less is at stake. You are no longer "the man she will marry, who will judge her for slacking her principles" but rather "that ex she knows to be trustworthy and kind and whose opinion doesn't matter that much anymore". I suspect that might be a factor.

[The Bandicoot]

Well, do you actually want an FWB arrangement? I'd think that's the important part.

People change in weird ways, and you two just broke up. She's likely reevaluating a ton of things right now. But if it bothers you a lot, I don't think it would be unreasonable to make "this feels kinda weird" noises and then talk it out.

ETA: Some people find sex much easier when less is at stake. You are no longer "the man she will marry, who will judge her for slacking her principles" but rather "that ex she knows to be trustworthy and kind and whose opinion doesn't matter that much anymore". I suspect that might be a factor.

I really do want a FWB arrangement but I'm also a bit [Confused T-Rex Screech].

The thing is I was always gently pushing her to relax on those principals of hers because I could tell how much she wanted to. So I was never the judging sort.

[Xapi]

I really do want a FWB arrangement but I'm also a bit [Confused T-Rex Screech].

The thing is I was always gently pushing her to relax on those principals of hers because I could tell how much she wanted to. So I was never the judging sort.

I'd say go for it.

I have to ask, it wasn't clear in your description, did you actually have sex with her during your tenure as boyfriend?

If the answer is yes, then I'd try to be prepared for this new development, if it happens, to change the dynamic of your relationship in a way that would make one or both of you want to get back together.

That may or may not be a good idea. I'm all for love, so in general I'd say go for it, but be careful.

If the answer is no then definitively be prepared for this new development to change the dynamic of your relationship in a way that would make one or both of you want to get back together.

[The Bandicoot]

To put it in baseball terms neither of us has had any home runs but we played all over that ball field.....And she hasn't flat out asked to either, but that's just the vibe I'm getting from the way she's talking. So you also understand my confused dino noises

[Coidzor]

tl;dr Jokingly suggested "friends with benefits" to ex, ex actually going for it and wanting to go further than we did when we were together. Wat do.

**** her, **** her hard, and use a condom.

[The Bandicoot]

**** her, **** her hard, and use a condom.

Something tells me you're the type of person that'd call me a [Insert Name for a Bundle of Sticks Here ] if I implied losing my v-card to a booty call might not be something I want to do.

[Red Rubber Band]

Something tells me you're the type of person that'd call me a [Insert Name for a Bundle of Sticks Here ] if I implied losing my v-card to a booty call might not be something I want to do.

From what little I've seen, Coidzor is blunt. He doesn't pussyfoot around with propriety, but neither is he malicious.

[lio45]

Something tells me you're the type of person that'd call me a [Insert Name for a Bundle of Sticks Here ] if I implied losing my v-card to a booty call might not be something I want to do.

A "V-Card" isn't something that precious, and after you're over a certain age where nearly all your peers aren't carrying that card any more, the sooner you get rid of it, the better.

My first time (a long time ago) sucked.

I dated that "first time girl" for two years, and have much better memories of stuff we did together... (and also much better memories of subsequent exes) but the first few times were all really subpar.

Which, when you think about it... is perfectly normal.

So, I'm seconding Coidzor here. Well, wait a minute -- how old are you exactly?

[Aedilred]

Something tells me you're the type of person that'd call me a [Insert Name for a Bundle of Sticks Here ] if I implied losing my v-card to a booty call might not be something I want to do.

A "V-Card" isn't something that precious, and after you're over a certain age where nearly all your peers aren't carrying that card any more, the sooner you get rid of it, the better.

My first time (a long time ago) sucked.

I dated that "first time girl" for two years, and have much better memories of stuff we did together... (and also much better memories of subsequent exes) but the first few times were all really subpar.

Which, when you think about it... is perfectly normal.

As lio implies, a "v-card" as you put it is one of those things that seems much more important before you lose it than afterwards. Once it's gone, you'll likely be wondering what all the fuss was about hanging onto it; by default (assuming consent, etc.) it's not going to be a life-changing experience and it'll probably be rather underwhelming. After all, the first time you do anything you tend not to be all that good at it - moreover, society and modern popular culture has put such emphasis on having sex that the anticipation is much greater than doing the deed for the first time really merits, and that tends to get in the way of actually enjoying yourself.

But I'm also not going to castigate anyone for not abandoning their principles in that respect, and I can appreciate wanting to "save yourself" for someone special or whatever even if I think that in the vast majority of cases that's probably not going to work out amazingly well in the long run. It's worth bearing in mind though whether there is an element of sunk costs fallacy in the whole thing: the longer you go denying yourself sex the bigger a deal it seems, and the more you feel you'll be compromising yourself if you "give in" for a person or situation that isn't all that important, which in turn plays into the high expectations and intimidation factor mentioned above. That can go for almost anything, of course; it's just that sex occupies a particularly large place in the minds of society in general and young people in particuar.

It sounds like that's more on her side than yours though, given that you say you wanted to sleep with her previously, still do, and aren't bothered about sex before marriage or the like (which in turn suggests you have no real problem with the idea of multiple partners in a lifetime). In which case my advice is not to worry about it now. If she wants to, you want to, and you're not overly concerned about any complications that might result between you as a consequence, it really is a case of "why not?" rather than "why?" - to which frankly I think concern about losing your "v-card" is a pretty nothing reason. You'll probably regret it if you don't. But it's your (and her) decision, not mine.

[lio45]

... and I can appreciate wanting to "save yourself" for someone special ...

I can understand someone thinking like that, but that would be that person's naiveté showing...

'cause seriously, in retrospect, the first few times would actually qualify way more as acquiring experience in preparation for that special someone. Honing your "bedroom skills" so that when you meet that special someone, you've been working to put the chances on your side that 1) that special someone will enjoy it with you as much as possible and 2) you will be able to confirm it's indeed a special someone -- if sex with that person is actually consistently less great than it was with a few of your random exes, you might want to continue looking.

So, yep, it's the other way around IMO.

I "practiced" with my first gf... and yes, that's the appropriate word.

I wouldn't have wanted to be that bad initially with Mrs Right!!!