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Thread: Erfworld 49
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2007-04-26, 02:42 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Erfworld 49
AHAHAHA! Wonderful bit of very appropriate Shakespeare; followed by the battlecry of desperate and frustrated gamers everywhere: 'sploitable mechanic...
Good job Elvis in the Playground! :D
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2007-04-26, 02:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Erfworld 49
The thing is, he uses the term 'exploit' [I assume]. That to me means that he intends to use something within the game mechanics as opposed to disregarding them or acting out of turn, which to me would be a hack or cheat.
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2007-04-26, 02:47 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2006
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2007-04-26, 03:52 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2006
Re: Erfworld 49
For those that might like a little analysis on the sonnet itself, check it out here.
Or, the next sonnet:
When in disgrace with fortune and men's eyes
I all alone beweep my outcast state,
And trouble deaf heaven with my bootless cries,
And look upon myself, and curse my fate,
Wishing me like to one more rich in hope,
Featur'd like him, like him with friends possess'd,
Desiring this man's art, and that man's scope,
With what I most enjoy contented least;
Yet in these thoughts my self almost despising,
Haply I think on thee,-- and then my state,
Like to the lark at break of day arising
From sullen earth, sings hymns at heaven's gate,;
For thy sweet love remember'd such wealth brings
That then I scorn to change my state with kings.
... Any ideas on what might happen next from WS?
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2007-04-26, 03:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2007
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- Greensboro, NC
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Re: Erfworld 49
I wonder - if Parson 'typed' a tilde (~) in his klog, would it open the console so he could enter cheat codes?
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2007-04-26, 04:13 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2006
Re: Erfworld 49
Y'know, I think the positioning of the lines are telling us something about the characters, with the line about torture over Wanda, and the line about grief over Jillian. I wonder what it's saying about Parson and Ansom?
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2007-04-26, 04:13 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
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- The Great State of New Jersey
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Re: Erfworld 49
he Has A Plan!!! I Can't Wait Until Saturday!!
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No Hamster Can Stop Me -Prince Ansom
D McCoy 1693
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2007-04-26, 04:15 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2007
Re: Erfworld 49
!!!
I see how Parson is going to exploit this.
Spoiler
What we know so far:
1.) In the 'little battle', Ansom split his forces into fliers and nonfliers.
2.) Fliers can only be attacked by other flying units when over dense forest, moutains, etc.
3.) The basic unit of Erfworld is the 'stack', comprising up to eight individual 'models'.
Exploit:
Unlike Ansom, Parson doesn't split his forces into fliers and non-fliers.
Parson creats a stack containing at least one flying unit. That stack, should it be in dense forest, mountains, or over water, can only be attacked by other fliers because it contains a flying unit.
Last edited by ChiefDesigner; 2007-04-26 at 04:16 PM. Reason: Fixing tags
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2007-04-26, 04:17 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2004
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- The world will never know...
Re: Erfworld 49
Aha, but what cheat codes would he input? Black Sheep Wall? Power Overwhelming? Operation Cwal?
Still, a really good comic--the Shakespeare quote was really nicely done, and kinda gave the suggestion that maybe Miss Zamussels isn't being manipulated as much as Wanda thinks.
Also, I think Parson really needs to find the User's Manual or Strategy Guide for this game.Tallest member of the fanclub.
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2007-04-26, 04:20 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2007
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- Illinois, USA
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Re: Erfworld 49
I wonder if people don't continue fighting at night because of movement restraints... That would give Parson a decided advantage if he isn't restricted by movement limitations, right?
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2007-04-26, 04:23 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2004
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- I wish I knew...
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Re: Erfworld 49
Gurrella Warfare is a spanish term. The word Gurrella originally means 'Little War'. This speaks to me of using the same tactics that won USA it's independence. The British troops marched out, all nice and pretty in their formations. The Americans started sniping anyone with a funny hat from the treelines. Mind you, they learned it from the Native Americans during the French/Indian war, who developed it independantly from Spain who invented it to keep people out of their land.
The other thing could be the old saying 'Defeat in Detail'. Force your opponent to split his troops until they break down into managable sized chunks for you to take down, one at a time.
A Shakespearean Sonnet he may want to remember, though...
The painful warrior famoused for fight,
After a thousand victories once foiled,
Is from the book of honour razed quite,
And all the rest forgot for which he toiledSpoilerQuite possibly, the best rebuttal I have ever witnessed.
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2007-04-26, 04:26 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
Re: Erfworld 49
I'm not sure.
Spoiler
The logical (okay, logical by the real world) reason for only being attackable by fliers due to terrain is that the terrain is impassible to ground based troops. Also, when the attack happens, the combat will be between Parson's few fliers and Ansom's full stack of fliers. (This assumes, of course, that 'attack' is reciprocal, which it need not be: ground troops may be capable of defending.)
... and then you drop the One Ring into Mt. Doom and win.
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2007-04-26, 04:29 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
Re: Erfworld 49
Awesome. It was nice to see how the day dwellers (if the could be called that) go to sleep and the night ones come out as if on some sort of cycle...what a genius mind that continues to create the unimaginable precipice!
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2007-04-26, 04:31 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Erfworld 49
an exploit that the units in the game use, is no longer a exploit it's a feature.
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2007-04-26, 04:36 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2007
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- Boston, MA
Re: Erfworld 49
Irrelevant. In the real world we don't think of the laws of physics as being game rules to be exploited. That doesn't stop people from researching new technology and generals making new tactics. Sometimes those tactics are so revolutionary or clever they would very likely look like exploits to someone from a different universe.
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2007-04-26, 04:40 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Hawai'i
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Re: Erfworld 49
OHhhh..Parson figured something out, now we will see Kick ass
Memento mori
I see that your Wiki-Fu is strong.
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2007-04-26, 04:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2005
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- Shire of Glaedenfeld
Re: Erfworld 49
"To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women!" -- Conan, on what is best in life
"A good plan, executed violently now, is better than a perfect plan next week." -- George S. Patton, Jr.
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2007-04-26, 04:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Erfworld 49
Agreed. If I recall correctly, the sun didn't set until Ansom specifically ordered that the turn be ended once Jillian arrived.
I like ChiefDesigner's idea. Everyone else is thinking of mechanics which could be exploited for every battle, not things which are just useful in the upcoming battle. Remember that this can't be a universally game-breaking find for Parson or Erfworld would be a very short comic as he quickly takes over the world.Work in progress.
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2007-04-26, 04:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Boston, MA
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2007-04-26, 04:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2005
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- Shire of Glaedenfeld
Re: Erfworld 49
"To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women!" -- Conan, on what is best in life
"A good plan, executed violently now, is better than a perfect plan next week." -- George S. Patton, Jr.
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2007-04-26, 04:46 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2005
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- Shire of Glaedenfeld
Re: Erfworld 49
"To crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and to hear the lamentation of their women!" -- Conan, on what is best in life
"A good plan, executed violently now, is better than a perfect plan next week." -- George S. Patton, Jr.
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2007-04-26, 04:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Erfworld 49
Edit: Hmmm... separating the lines from the original referents and context of the sonnet and reading each section independently with an eye toward its application to the associated character:
The four lines over Parson describe being harried, one's sleep troubled by the problems of the day and one's day troubled in turn by lack of proper rest. That certainly fits Parson's situation.
The "enemies to either's reign" in the lines over Wanda would fit her and Jillian being on opposite sides of the war, and "in consent" has an obvious connection to the notion that there's more to their relationship than Wanda simply using Jillian.
Edit: It may be significant that Wanda is the only one of the four who is (perhaps) sleeping peacefully.
The lines over Ansom describe speaking of the day as "bright" notwithstanding the fact that "clouds do blot the heavens" -- an implication that his prospects are not as bright as he believes?
The lines over Jillian are perhaps the most straightforward of all, speaking of persistent and worsening sorrow and grief. She seems to feel something for Ansom, but won't act on it; she may be getting something other than exploitation from Wanda, but the exploitation is definitely present, and painful.Last edited by SteveMB; 2007-04-26 at 09:37 PM. Reason: Clarification
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2007-04-26, 04:50 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Erfworld 49
Okay, interesting notes...
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2007-04-26, 04:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Erfworld 49
The Shakespeare sonnet and Jillian at the campfire made me think of the campfire scene in Henry V. Which fits quite nicely, because it's addressing the doubts and fears and hopes of the various people involved right before a major battle.
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2007-04-26, 04:56 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2007
Re: Erfworld 49
I think you are correct, but i suspect it goes further than that. The people of Erf World are part of the system - they are part of a game mechanic that they are physically and mentally incapable of working outside of. Think of the agents from the Matrix series - as powefull as they were, everything they did conformed to the rules of the world into which they had been programmed. it was those who hacked into the system from outside who could exploit loopholes and quirks.
I don't even pretend to know what the loophole or quirk is that parson has figured out. I'm looking forward to reading on to find out!
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2007-04-26, 05:00 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Erfworld 49
A few things... I've been critical of Erfworld since its start, so why stop now?
The second line of the sonnet as quoted in the comic has an error. THERE IS NO CHARACTER BETWEEN THE E AND THE D.
The word in that second line should, strictly speaking according to the rules for updating English from the 1600s, be written as "debarr'd." In recent times, we've given up on pronouncing the -ed suffix on a verb as in the word "red" and have elected to simply pronounce most or all of them as if they were spelled with the apostrophe which prevents the syllable from being pronounced. Aged, and a few others, are the throwback exceptions.
If you're going to quote the Bard, get it right.
On another note, I tend to think ChiefD might be onto something there. There're a number of possibly exploitable mechanics which would have been revealed in the course of the attempt to decapitate the opposing force, and that's certainly a possibility. There are others of course.
SpoilerFor example, if Parson's able to stage a stack of 7 melee anti-air units and put a flyer on the same square, perhaps he can draw the opposition's air units into a crushing defeat - of course this hinges on different attack vs defense values, potential synergy bonuses between unit types and so forth. Or perhaps he can put multiple stacks in the same area and use a bunch of infantry to defend the area against incoming flyers lured to a single dwagon. In any case my interest is piqued as to whether we've already received the clues we'd need to decipher the exploit, or whether it's predicated on something we've not yet been told. If it's based on what we know, the flyer defense thing almost has to be part of it. Otherwise, sky's the limit.
In terms of why the Erfworlders haven't thought of whatever it is, that's obvious. They live in the box, and their capabilities are defined thereby. As a result, if they're even capable of thinking outside it, that capability is limited. Parson comes from outside and is familiar with a society where gamers habitually exploit rulesets, so not only is he capable of thinking outside the box, he's bound to have some insight into typical design flaws which the Erfworlders simply aren't capable of developing - at least until he's demonstrated it for them.Don't bother trying to appeal to my better nature; I don't have one.
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2007-04-26, 05:14 PM (ISO 8601)
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2007-04-26, 05:22 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Erfworld 49
For Parson's sake, I hope we don't get to witness him explaining his plan before he actually executes it. If we see him explain it in excruciating detail first, then we KNOW it's not going to work. Basic "law" of dramatic fiction. ;)
Also, I happened to enjoy the poetic transition. Nice touch, and unexpected.
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2007-04-26, 05:35 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Erfworld 49
I love the detail of parson drooling in his sleep.
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2007-04-26, 05:35 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Erfworld 49
That's a lot of dwagons.
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