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  1. - Top - End - #121
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    BlueKnightGuy

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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Basically she traded proficiency with pistols/rifles for Force sensitivity. two feats for one.

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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    I guess that would be fine... played intelligently, early-game Force Wizardry is strong enough that a 2-for-1 trade to get into it feels fair, but since it's at the cost of the character's non-Force combat potential (Simple weapons are bad outside of grenades, and those are too expensive for early characters), the first few levels may be a bit rough.

  3. - Top - End - #123
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    i'm trying to work out a Bow for her, not that stupid 'blaster bow' that they use in TCW but a real bow...say blaster pistol range, 2d8 damage (1D less then a blaster carbine). i also want to let her have grenade arrows - drop the damage die by 1 on the grenades she uses and add a little to the credit cost for custom work maybe ?

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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Duke View Post
    i'm trying to work out a Bow for her, not that stupid 'blaster bow' that they use in TCW but a real bow...say blaster pistol range, 2d8 damage (1D less then a blaster carbine). i also want to let her have grenade arrows - drop the damage die by 1 on the grenades she uses and add a little to the credit cost for custom work maybe ?
    There is a bow in the core book. Pg 127, and entry on pg 128. There's also a crossbow (UR pg 39) and a repeating crossbow (GaW pf 37).

    As far as raising the damage, you'd be doing the equivalent of a standard blaster pistol's stun damage, 2d6. Plus, per the core book, you get to add strength to your damage rolls with a bow. Make it 250 or 300 credits, if you wanna raise it. Or treat it as an energy ball - 2d8 damage and only 20 credits, similar priced for arrows for the bow. Depends on how you want to flavor it.

    Personally I kind of like the later, as it has a more diy feel to it, a low tech feel to match the bow.


    Speaking of the Energy Ball, how would y'all stat the damage for the giant ones? You know, the ones that took out tanks and swaths of droids.
    Last edited by Sparx MacGyver; 2015-09-29 at 03:50 AM.
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  5. - Top - End - #125
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    i ddint even notice the bow in teh core book until you pointed it out to me - wow am i blind.

  6. - Top - End - #126
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Giving the bow pistol range is the same as just using the Simple Weapons range (20/40/60/80 squares) anyway (thrown weapons like grenades use a separate Thrown Weapon range group regardless of their proficiency).

    However, one die less of damage for the bow vs a rifle is not within the design spec of the system. A 2d8 bow would deal as much damage as a slugthrower rifle (roughly the equivalent of an M16 given the magazine size and selective fire), and more damage if the bow adds the user's Strength. It would also deal as much damage as a vibrosword or lightsaber without the cost of proficiency or really much of any drawback at all (ranged attacks don't provoke attacks of opportunity in Saga). Moreover, a 3d8 weapon (a blaster carbine) is actually overkill for a level 1 character, since most minions at level 1 generally have 10 HP, which is within the average damage of a 3d6 weapon (10.5) and just above that of a straight-up 2d8 weapon (9).

    The purpose of trading away those feats in favor of Force Sensitivity is the power tradeoff. Negating that trade with a custom weapon that in the early game is as good as a lightsaber (DR doesn't really show up until later, since you're dead on foot against a vehicle with or without a 'saber) without the other tradeoffs that Jedi are forced into for their weapon and Force Sensitivity (a smaller skill list and fewer skills known than even the Soldier, besides the lost feats) is unbalanced.

    The bow in Core is a little weak, though, and is basically what D&D calls a "short bow"--it's a Medium weapon, so it's a small-ish bow for Humans and a big bow for Ewoks. A Large (by Saga's convention, a 2-handed weapon for Medium characters) 1d8 bow would work, with the option of converting grenades into arrows that give the bow the Inaccurate tag (can't fire at long range) due to the added weight. (These grenade-arrows make it like a cheaper grenade launcher, but with a relative major limitation in that a grenade launcher proper uses the relatively extremely long Heavy ranges rather than the shorter Simple ones) A more advanced design with pulleys and such would be more expensive, but could increase the damage to 1d10+Str or add the Accurate tag (no penalty at Short range).

  7. - Top - End - #127
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    It's an easily overlook-able item. After all, whats a bow and arrow set compared to the coolness of a lightsaber or blaster?
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  8. - Top - End - #128
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Duke View Post
    that stupid 'blaster bow' that they use in TCW
    Are you talking about Wookie bowcasters or something else?
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    That's how wizards beta test their new animals. If it survives Australia, it's a go. Which in hindsight explains a LOT about Australia.

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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Quote Originally Posted by Sith_Happens View Post
    Are you talking about Wookie bowcasters or something else?
    I think he's referring to the energy bow they used.

    See here:
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  10. - Top - End - #130
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    yea that thing...i love the bowcaster i do not love the 'Blaster bow' pictured above.

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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    So my first thought was that the string and arrow are obviously plasma-coated like a bowcaster bolt or a lightwhip, but nope:

    Quote Originally Posted by Wookiepedia
    The bowstrings and arrows of the weapon were made of pure plasma
    There's form over function and then there's that. Seriously, as soon as you're making your plasma anything functionally solid you might as well just use a blaster (or a lightsaber, these apparently being Nightsister weapons).
    Last edited by Sith_Happens; 2015-09-30 at 01:25 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cirrylius View Post
    That's how wizards beta test their new animals. If it survives Australia, it's a go. Which in hindsight explains a LOT about Australia.

  12. - Top - End - #132
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    I want to know what those gloves are made out of. And how you give a plasma stream tensile strength with which to snap the arrow forward when pulled back and released.
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    I want to know what those gloves are made out of.
    I assume they're just regular gloves; if you look closely you'll see that the place she's holding the string is a metal connector piece as well as the generator for the arrow.

    And how you give a plasma stream tensile strength with which to snap the arrow forward when pulled back and released.
    The point I was just making is that the answer to that question is "Probably not by a method substantially different from how blasters and lightsabers work." However cool-looking the result, the idea behind this weapon just seems needlessly inefficient.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cirrylius View Post
    That's how wizards beta test their new animals. If it survives Australia, it's a go. Which in hindsight explains a LOT about Australia.

  14. - Top - End - #134
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Blasters and lightsabers create a contained particle stream that you then smack into someone. They're not...how is...

    Damn kids' cartoons.
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    I had a d6 game once that had some extensive notes on bowcasters and how they worked... and I actually had them be the basis for the Death Star "Superlaser"... instead of a regular blaster, it was a mass driver that used a blaster containment field to allow it to plow through the atmosphere without losing speed, then exploded.
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    And how you give a plasma stream tensile strength with which to snap the arrow forward when pulled back and released.
    How do you contain a plasma stream into a 1 meter beam with only one emitter? Realism with regards to how we understand physics is not one of Star Wars' strengths.

  17. - Top - End - #137
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Quote Originally Posted by Mando Knight View Post
    How do you contain a plasma stream into a 1 meter beam with only one emitter? Realism with regards to how we understand physics is not one of Star Wars' strengths.
    Magnets, how do they w--okay yeah it's bull.

    I can still accept a plasma stream going in a straight line/loop and being used as an incredibly energetic sharp object better than a moving plasma stream as part of a mechanism that does work, however simple.
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    and this is why the nightsister character will be useing a normal bow.....or if she wants a slug thrower she can get proficiency for that later. (though i told her about light whips and she got a disturbing gleam in her eye...this from a woman who executed a gungan that surrendered in cold blood when i ran them through a dungeon run once....this is gonna be a fun game!)

    Hey on the slug thrower route, any one have any idea if there are force powers or talents one could apply to make some kind of Gunslinger tradition that can like curve bullets and such ? its something i've always wanted to play.
    Last edited by Blue Duke; 2015-09-30 at 05:23 PM.

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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    The Blazing Chain, Unknown Regions pages 32-33, has a Force Directed Shot talent that lets you bounce a bullet (or any other kind of ranged attack, actually) to select a nearby square as the origin square for your attack, so you can shoot around cover more easily. Other than that, Battle Strike (from Core) doesn't limit what kind of attack you can make with the power, so you can use that for extra accuracy and damage, and you can obviously just tack on Force stuff onto a standard Gunslinger core if you wish.

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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Quote Originally Posted by Mando Knight View Post
    How do you contain a plasma stream into a 1 meter beam with only one emitter? Realism with regards to how we understand physics is not one of Star Wars' strengths.
    Ayup. If we're going to accept that a contained plasma stream can have a large rotational momentum (part of the reason lightsabers are nigh-impossible for random schmos to use, don't know if it's made it into the new timeline yet though) I don't think it's that much farther out there to accept that it can at least simulate having tensile strength. Maybe say that it resists changes in density because [reasons].
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cirrylius View Post
    That's how wizards beta test their new animals. If it survives Australia, it's a go. Which in hindsight explains a LOT about Australia.

  21. - Top - End - #141
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Quote Originally Posted by Sith_Happens View Post
    Ayup. If we're going to accept that a contained plasma stream can have a large rotational momentum (part of the reason lightsabers are nigh-impossible for random schmos to use, don't know if it's made it into the new timeline yet though) I don't think it's that much farther out there to accept that it can at least simulate having tensile strength. Maybe say that it resists changes in density because [reasons].
    Wasn't the issue that lightsabers have no rotational momentum, as in the blade is completely weightless and you're basically waving around a flashlight with an Instant Death Beam extending out a meter?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Wasn't the issue that lightsabers have no rotational momentum, as in the blade is completely weightless and you're basically waving around a flashlight with an Instant Death Beam extending out a meter?
    The blade is weightless, yes, but someone at some point decided that it's also gyroscopic thereby compounding the problem (first you accidentally swing it too fast/hard because it's weightless, then you can't stop it in time to not lose your leg because suddenly it's like swinging a spinning bicycle wheel).
    Revan avatar by kaptainkrutch.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cirrylius View Post
    That's how wizards beta test their new animals. If it survives Australia, it's a go. Which in hindsight explains a LOT about Australia.

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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Magic, got it.
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    It's not just any magic, it's technobabble, the best kind of magic!
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cirrylius View Post
    That's how wizards beta test their new animals. If it survives Australia, it's a go. Which in hindsight explains a LOT about Australia.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sith_Happens View Post
    It's not just any magic, it's technobabble, the best kind of magic!
    Magic with the Technobabble Descriptor is +10 to save vs. Dispel, but is liable to explode into sparks when jostled.
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Couple of things I'd like help on.

    One, energy balls are basically those b lue balls used by the gungans at the final ground battle of Episode I, right? I figure they are since there's a couple weapins for gungans that mention them. Assuming this is true, (there is no entry in the core book for them aside from being listed with the grenades), what damage would you give to the larger version that is seen taking down swaths of droids and the droid battle tank? Would something like 6d6x2 be too much or not enough?

    Two, from my days as a Pathfinder/D&D3.5 GM I learned that special items, even if mundane, can be something the players dig and can even get attached to. I don't want to just give out another +1 to hit/damage. Currently my players on on a sidequest dealing with a request to clear out a temple for a local tribe. Being as they don't deal with credits, my players will receive some bows and arrows. I'm gonna take the basic bow from the core book and I'm not sure what kind of bonus to give it. It's going to be fluffed as ceremonial and very nicely decorated - something you can tell is important to this tribe, something they value greatly and would be willing to give in exchange for freeing their hallowed grounds of worship from the evil Sith who desecrate the Force site and corrupt the creatures that are there. Anyway, I was thinking of making them something like a +5 persuasion/Gather Info Check while having it in the presence of certain individuals. Basically some kind of bonus but not just straight a boost to combat damage.
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  27. - Top - End - #147
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Quote Originally Posted by Mando Knight View Post
    How do you contain a plasma stream into a 1 meter beam with only one emitter? Realism with regards to how we understand physics is not one of Star Wars' strengths.
    Its because its not a plasma stream. Years ago I read a physics PhD's article that basically said lightsabres would have to be exotic matter with some kind of spin, and that the math played out that it would inherently keep its shape and be about a metre long blob of glowing matter that would slice through nearly anything and hum. Also because of the magnetic fields they project would also be able to block each other.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sparx MacGyver View Post
    Couple of things I'd like help on.

    One, energy balls are basically those b lue balls used by the gungans at the final ground battle of Episode I, right? I figure they are since there's a couple weapins for gungans that mention them. Assuming this is true, (there is no entry in the core book for them aside from being listed with the grenades), what damage would you give to the larger version that is seen taking down swaths of droids and the droid battle tank? Would something like 6d6x2 be too much or not enough?
    Yes, the energy balls the gungun blue balls of doom. Yeah, that seems okay for damage. Its roughly comparable to most vehicle weapons.

    Two, from my days as a Pathfinder/D&D3.5 GM I learned that special items, even if mundane, can be something the players dig and can even get attached to. I don't want to just give out another +1 to hit/damage. Currently my players on on a sidequest dealing with a request to clear out a temple for a local tribe. Being as they don't deal with credits, my players will receive some bows and arrows. I'm gonna take the basic bow from the core book and I'm not sure what kind of bonus to give it. It's going to be fluffed as ceremonial and very nicely decorated - something you can tell is important to this tribe, something they value greatly and would be willing to give in exchange for freeing their hallowed grounds of worship from the evil Sith who desecrate the Force site and corrupt the creatures that are there. Anyway, I was thinking of making them something like a +5 persuasion/Gather Info Check while having it in the presence of certain individuals. Basically some kind of bonus but not just straight a boost to combat damage.
    I might go with something about Force Points usage, the bow string vibrate in the presence of the Darkside, or maybe a bonus to hit against the Darkside or some such thing.
    Last edited by Beleriphon; 2015-10-02 at 07:58 PM.

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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    I like it. Although one of my players is not a force sensitive. The party is made of up of two jedi and a smuggler that dual wields a blaster and a vibrosword. I'll need to come up with something for him.
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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Have you considered a fancy Vibro blade with some weapon upgrades from scum and villainy for the smuggler ?

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    Default Re: Saga Edition Thread III: Saga Academy

    Quote Originally Posted by Beleriphon View Post
    Its because its not a plasma stream. Years ago I read a physics PhD's article that basically said lightsabres would have to be exotic matter with some kind of spin, and that the math played out that it would inherently keep its shape and be about a metre long blob of glowing matter that would slice through nearly anything and hum. Also because of the magnetic fields they project would also be able to block each other.
    1. Lightsaber blades are in fact, canonically, a two-way plasma stream contained by a magnetic "shell," because engineers in Star Wars are just that good with magnets.

    2. Anything involving the words "exotic matter" is basically real-life technobabble.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cirrylius View Post
    That's how wizards beta test their new animals. If it survives Australia, it's a go. Which in hindsight explains a LOT about Australia.

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