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  1. - Top - End - #241
    Colossus in the Playground
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    I dunno, im pretty sure he is yanking her chain, but then again it IS entirely possible he is that oblivious.
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
    Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Traab is yelling everything that I'm thinking already.
    "If you don't get those cameras out of my face, I'm gonna go 8.6 on the Richter scale with gastric emissions that'll clear this room."

  2. - Top - End - #242
    Ettin in the Playground
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Quote Originally Posted by Traab View Post
    I dunno, im pretty sure he is yanking her chain, but then again it IS entirely possible he is that oblivious.
    That's not a good sign either. This type of trolling is emphatically not pro-relationship behavior.
    Last edited by Lethologica; 2016-07-29 at 11:16 AM.

  3. - Top - End - #243
    Colossus in the Playground
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Quote Originally Posted by Lethologica View Post
    That's not a good sign either. This type of trolling is emphatically not pro-relationship behavior.
    True, but if I were say, the pilot hired by the family to helicopter them around it might be amusing to go through this whole "subconscious" elitism only to take a left turn and head to his apartment on the grounds and go, "Nah, im not related to the vonstuffingtons, I just work for them as a pilot. You should have seen the look on your face!" Well, amusing for us. Not so much for him.
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
    Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Traab is yelling everything that I'm thinking already.
    "If you don't get those cameras out of my face, I'm gonna go 8.6 on the Richter scale with gastric emissions that'll clear this room."

  4. - Top - End - #244
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Quote Originally Posted by Traab View Post
    True, but if I were say, the pilot hired by the family to helicopter them around it might be amusing to go through this whole "subconscious" elitism only to take a left turn and head to his apartment on the grounds and go, "Nah, im not related to the vonstuffingtons, I just work for them as a pilot. You should have seen the look on your face!" Well, amusing for us. Not so much for him.
    A bit too late for that, and frankly the comic doesn't have a good track record on these matters. I hope that we're being set up for a subversion... but I'm pretty sure he's not joking. Not in this comic.
    Last edited by Maryring; 2016-07-29 at 03:44 PM.

  5. - Top - End - #245
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    PirateCaptain

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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Outside of the obvious that's just dumb... Read your audience dude come on. I have to hope he's not being serious, because I know the writer is better than that. The whole thing with Feral and Cleaver was gut-wrenching and touching and really well done, if he's being serious here Mulligan either forgot how to be a writer in the last few years or he just stopped giving a crap about quality in favour of burning down strawmen.
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Greenflame133 View Post
    So what do you think? What is best use for Signatures?
    To curate my brilliance and wit, of course. Any other use is a waste.

  6. - Top - End - #246
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    Lizardfolk

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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    If he is joking he is a moron. If he is serious he is a jerk AND a moron.

  7. - Top - End - #247
    Colossus in the Playground
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Somebody put it down int he comments and I kinda agree with them, this seems like it might also be another setup in the "things are more complicated than black and white allison" series of events to try and make her more aware of that. Ok, first off, I dont know the name of the guy who mows my lawn. I know the name of his boss because thats who I pay. If I didnt pay the boss, its doubtful I would know HIS name either as I wouldnt be handling any of that stuff and would have no reason to bother people who are there to work with idle conversation. Secondly, overtime. Not everyone gets paid overtime. It sucks but its true. So long as their day wages are sufficient enough for them to not want to complain then there is really no reason to get too offended on their behalf. Under the table is kinda illegal I believe because its avoiding paying taxes, but it also means thats all cash in hand for the employee, so long as your boss doesnt cheat you. I have worked under the table jobs before, some turned out ok, some not. As for working "late" whats the weather like right now? I cant even go outside for a walk during the mid morning to late afternoon hours its so hot and muggy. Working in a well lit garden area at night could easily be how they avoid frigging heat stroke.

    Im not saying this is how it will play out, but I AM saying I can see it happening. Its been a kind of running theme of the comic that allison sees everything in good or bad a or b and then has the vast array of grey shades shoved in her face to try and teach her thats how the real world work.
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
    Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Traab is yelling everything that I'm thinking already.
    "If you don't get those cameras out of my face, I'm gonna go 8.6 on the Richter scale with gastric emissions that'll clear this room."

  8. - Top - End - #248
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    I...just found this webcomic yesterday and finished reading the whole thing today. I'm so glad to have found it, it's awesome.

  9. - Top - End - #249
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    For work like that, you hire an agency, and for actual workers there's usually a rotation, often keeping just one person between visits so they can tell the other people what to do.

    I mean, I only know the names of the cleaning ladies at my workplace because they write their names on the receipts...

    I dunno. I can't help but feel there's going to be some payoff to this little twist, otherwise all our time and story spent with Max was basically a waste of time.
    Rider avatar by Elder Tsofu

  10. - Top - End - #250
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Quote Originally Posted by Guancyto View Post
    For work like that, you hire an agency, and for actual workers there's usually a rotation, often keeping just one person between visits so they can tell the other people what to do.

    I mean, I only know the names of the cleaning ladies at my workplace because they write their names on the receipts...

    I dunno. I can't help but feel there's going to be some payoff to this little twist, otherwise all our time and story spent with Max was basically a waste of time.
    Yeah in all honesty, im feeling more and more that this is a setup because its like he said everything possible to be surface objectionable but it fails the fridge logic test for being bad. He doesnt hire the help, so why would he know who they are? Despite watching mr belvedere and seeing how well tony gets along with the family in whos the boss, its not that abnormal to not spend time talking with "the help". Especially when its the landscaping crew who are likely extremely busy. I know for the crews in my middle class area they have about a dozen houses to mow, weed whack, and otherwise make look nice every day. They flat out dont have time to waste chit chatting, though of course would never say that considering it isnt bright to be rude to the people who pay you.

    Its highly unlikely this is like old tyme medieval fantasy books where the noble family has had the same family working as their servants for generations so they are somewhat closer than master and servant, so not knowing their names is as objectionable as not knowing the name of the barrista at the starbucks you go to every day. There is nothing wrong with knowing it, nothing wrong with not knowing it either. Everything is too clearly calculated to set off allison and also clearly in the realm of the reasonable so she looks crazy for flipping out once the other shoe drops.
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
    Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Traab is yelling everything that I'm thinking already.
    "If you don't get those cameras out of my face, I'm gonna go 8.6 on the Richter scale with gastric emissions that'll clear this room."

  11. - Top - End - #251
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    It's not about him not remembering the names of his workers. That's fair enough. Al asked the question and he couldn't answer. And not knowing the name of someone who works for you is not automatically a bad thing. That in itself can have many nuances.

    The problem is that he then goes on to state that the workers are paid a daytime rate under the table. The stupidity comes from the fact that he's volunteering this information.

    The jerkishness comes from the fact that part of it may be illegal (most places legally oblige employers to provide overtime payment and evening/night payment) and some of it is certainly illegal (under the table payment, which means that the income isn't taxed).

    And even if he later makes the argument that under the table deals leave more pay for the employees, that is *not* what he led with. He led with not paying them any overtime. In other words, not paying them as much as he implicitly agrees they deserve for their job.

  12. - Top - End - #252
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Unlike most of you, I haven't been watching Max develop in real time (since I read the whole thing after last Friday's strip was posted). That said, from my perspective, I kept getting the impression that he was not a particularly nice person, and I expect we will see more of his negative side in tomorrow's update. But I could be completely wrong.
    What time of day are the updates usually posted?

  13. - Top - End - #253
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    I don't know at what time it is updated, but in general I suggest using the RSS feed.
    Quote Originally Posted by J.R.R. Tolkien, 1955
    I thought Tom Bombadil dreadful — but worse still was the announcer's preliminary remarks that Goldberry was his daughter (!), and that Willowman was an ally of Mordor (!!).

  14. - Top - End - #254
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Oh my stars. It's even worse than I thought it would be.

  15. - Top - End - #255
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    The snake shows its head - and not in a sexy way!

    I guess it's better than a joke in the sense that it gets the plot moving, but... uhm... why does it feel so bad?
    Quote Originally Posted by J.R.R. Tolkien, 1955
    I thought Tom Bombadil dreadful — but worse still was the announcer's preliminary remarks that Goldberry was his daughter (!), and that Willowman was an ally of Mordor (!!).

  16. - Top - End - #256
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    RedWizardGuy

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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Ouch! That guy has some issues.

  17. - Top - End - #257
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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Ok, this is getting worse ... I'm not quite sure where this is supposed to go really.

    I mean seriously "We pay them a daily wage, so we own them for the day"? Huh?
    "I get paid a monthly wage, so I can't complain about overtime that happens during the month" ?

  18. - Top - End - #258
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    The tricky thing about SFP is that while it occasionally engages in cringeworthy sledgehammer morality lessons, more frequently it is more nuanced than that, so it can be difficult to spot the difference while mid-scene.
    Last edited by Deliverance; 2016-08-02 at 08:42 AM.

  19. - Top - End - #259
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    My opinion of Max continues to decrease.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deliverance View Post
    The tricky thing about SFP is that while it occasionally engages in cringeworthy sledgehammer morality lessons, more frequently it is more nuanced than that, so it can be difficult to spot the difference while mid-scene.
    Yea, I assume this will all read better when you can go through the whole sequence in archive form, after the scene is done.

  20. - Top - End - #260
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    NecromancerGuy

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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    I suppose the lesson is gonna be "Just because someone looks hot in his boxers while the building is burning down, doesn't make him date material"

    Or he's a plant, and the whole fire was setup by the mad professor to proof to Ali that people are *****! What? Come on, we all thought it! No? Just me?

  21. - Top - End - #261
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    MindFlayer

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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    This is really just ridiculous. I can't really say anything that I didn't already say. With the supposedly smooth guy who's been listening to the girl he's after talk about morality and ethics and stuff to so flippantly dismiss the workers he's got, be all "Iunno?" about their rights, "lol they've illegal whatever," and then flip out about talking back to him to the superhero (like what kind of delusional do you have to be to try to get the Dominant Alpha Male status against a superhero?) it's a real effort to try to be invested in the story. Like, I can't believe that someone who acts this way now could have acted nice enough that Allison wouldn't see through him in their first conversation. He would have been like this from the start. Basically, these characters are just very neutral until they suddenly get an extreme personality trait dropped on them to make them worth one conversation. It's kind of weird as far as characterization goes.

    Also, is the writer of the comic a guy? Brennan, according to the About Page? I'm kind of surprised, I had assumed that a comic about a woman dealing with social justice issues applicable to women would be written by a woman.

  22. - Top - End - #262
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Im surprised she hasnt already left. After that comic I would be, "Ok, dates over, never contact me again, buh bye!" That was like, 5 red flags right there in less than 30 seconds of conversation. That never tell me what to do thing would probably have been far more terrifying of a reaction if she wasnt frigging invulnerable and able to fly.
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
    Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Traab is yelling everything that I'm thinking already.
    "If you don't get those cameras out of my face, I'm gonna go 8.6 on the Richter scale with gastric emissions that'll clear this room."

  23. - Top - End - #263
    Eldritch Horror in the Playground Moderator
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Alright, so Max is an awful person. I'm bored with him now, can we move on to a new plot?

  24. - Top - End - #264
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Glyphstone View Post
    Alright, so Max is an awful person. I'm bored with him now, can we move on to a new plot?
    Do you mean a new story or a type of storyline? Because.... yes to both, honestly.
    Truth resists simplicity.

  25. - Top - End - #265
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    Pfff... pretty weird situation. On one side, Max did not lie when directly asked.
    On the other side, no one asked him about the legality of how those people were being paid. This is where his characterisation breaks.Seriously, didn't he notice that Allison has turned from a professional superhero into a social justice warrior (and seriously, how the hell did this definition become deprecated and derogatory, it sounds like a compliment to me)? He could have glossed over it, and waited until Ali got inquisitive, or even just joked about it until Ali gave up.
    Max getting upset is OK from a storytelling perspective (not from a RL "decent behaviour" perspective), since it gets things moving and is the first part of his real character we get to see.

    My sixth sense tells me that he actually doesn't have the authority to send people home, since he isn't the guy paying them.

    Another problem is that, TBH, I don't really get the whole deal - how is it a good idea to have them stay there until late? Pay them for the job when the job is finished, even if it takes a few days. I have never, ever seen anyone doing this work during the night, although things may be different in America. Is there a hurry to get the garden in place? As if that kind of garden didn't require constant care, rather than just a few days at a time. And the added risk of incidents during the night, with commonfolk and police officers asking themselves, "how did that guy lose a hand in there?", and the fact that gardening machines are loud.
    Quote Originally Posted by J.R.R. Tolkien, 1955
    I thought Tom Bombadil dreadful — but worse still was the announcer's preliminary remarks that Goldberry was his daughter (!), and that Willowman was an ally of Mordor (!!).

  26. - Top - End - #266
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    PirateCaptain

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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Quote Originally Posted by Vinyadan View Post
    (and seriously, how the hell did this definition become deprecated and derogatory, it sounds like a compliment to me)?
    Mainly from people confusing insulting people on twitter and ranting about nonsense on tumblr with activism and then allowing themselves to act deplorably with anyone not in their "woke" (ugh....) in-group because they're the designated good guys so when they do it it's ok.
    Quote Originally Posted by Peelee View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Greenflame133 View Post
    So what do you think? What is best use for Signatures?
    To curate my brilliance and wit, of course. Any other use is a waste.

  27. - Top - End - #267
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    Quote Originally Posted by thorgrim29 View Post
    Mainly from people confusing insulting people on twitter and ranting about nonsense on tumblr with activism and then allowing themselves to act deplorably with anyone not in their "woke" (ugh....) in-group because they're the designated good guys so when they do it it's ok.
    Basically. I'll add that the warrior in 'social justice warrior' is used ironically. Kinda like how it's used in the term 'weekend warrior'.
    Truth resists simplicity.

  28. - Top - End - #268
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    Quote Originally Posted by 137ben View Post
    My opinion of Max continues to decrease.



    Yea, I assume this will all read better when you can go through the whole sequence in archive form, after the scene is done.
    Read better? Perhaps. It depends on where this is going because if it all gets played straight then I feel its only saving grace in retrospect would be the ability to read past it quickly.

    Quote Originally Posted by SlyGuyMcFly View Post
    Basically. I'll add that the warrior in 'social justice warrior' is used ironically. Kinda like how it's used in the term 'weekend warrior'.
    Or keyboard warrior. The term is generally used to denote people who are often... enthusiastic about their causes to a degree that can sometimes feel like parody. Of course the fact that I image a lot of those accounts are actually parody accounts makes things hard to work out.
    Last edited by Dragonus45; 2016-08-03 at 09:13 AM.
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  29. - Top - End - #269
    Colossus in the Playground
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    Depending on the time of year you might work early mornings or late evenings to avoid the worst of the heat. Only reason to work nights that I can think of is, there is a big to-do going on and they need everything looking perfect by a specific time. As for this guy, the only thing I can think of that doesnt involve restraining orders and such in the future of the comic might be that we learn about his tragic back story of hyper controlling rich parents who used to stomp on him hard even as a young child to make sure he always promoted the "proper image" to his fellow socialites. It would explain why he lived in some random apartment instead of a mansion. As soon as he could, he took his trust fund and ran. And now he is stuck back "home" till he can get another place and back under the pressure of mother and father. (never mom and dad)

    But even that doesnt justify the gross overreaction that was about as clear a sign the guy has massive anger issues and is on a hair trigger as you can get short of him saying, "Hi, im max, if you step one toe out of line, I will punch you and tell you its your own fault"
    "Interdum feror cupidine partium magnarum Europae vincendarum"
    Translation: "Sometimes I get this urge to conquer large parts of Europe."

    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd-o-rama View Post
    Traab is yelling everything that I'm thinking already.
    "If you don't get those cameras out of my face, I'm gonna go 8.6 on the Richter scale with gastric emissions that'll clear this room."

  30. - Top - End - #270
    Ogre in the Playground
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    Default Re: Strong Female Protagonist II

    I always figured the warrior part of SJW to be a reference to Don Quixote, speaking about those who see giants where the rest see only windmills.

    Which of course is a problem, because there's also plenty things that are commonly seen as windmills that are actually giant.

    Now if you're talking about the general negativity towards people struggling for social justice, then there's plenty other problems to go along since the field is full of people who can talk the talk but not walk the walk, people who use a social justice movement to prop themselves up and push others down, movements that are over-sensitive, and movements that use an incredibly hateful rhetoric. These tend to also be incredibly loud and/or disproportionately easy to notice, making it easy for them to drag genuine fighters for social justice causes down into the mud.

    Which isn't the problem here in this comic. The problem here is... the scene is awful and terribly written. Max is grasping the idiot ball, artificially creating a conflict with Al for reasons. Which ends up really detracting from whatever lesson you're supposed to learn here.


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