The Expanse

[Chigetai]

Kinda cool thing I learned; the general Belter hairstyle, of mohawk-esque shaved sides and long top (which both Miller and Naomi sport), is a reference to Larry Niven's Belters in the Known Space universe. They wear it that way (the Belter's Crest) because the short sides are less likely to snag on helmets when taking them off or putting them on. The style in Expanse is basically the same thing, but more stylized.

[Maquise]

Something I'm curious about, for anyone who's read the books:

Assuming this question doesn't spoil any plot points (I'm assuming it doesn't), do they ever say where the big super ship that the OPA guy's building for the Mormons is supposed to fly to? Is it the outer Sol system, or actually extrasolar?

[GloatingSwine]

It's supposed to be an interstellar generation ship but I don't remember it being specified where exactly it's aiming for.

Tau Ceti.

Closest star spectrally similar to the sun.

It's not actually certain there'll be a life bearing planet at the end of the journey.

[Mikeavelli]

Watched the first episode. Bored to tears. Nothing happened, just talk about nothing important. The interrogation was something but cliche. Suddenly a ship gets blown up. Watched the second episode. Still bored half an hour in. I was already on the internet and found myself more interested in viewing people celebrating D. Van Dyke's birthday by singing a medley of songs from "Mary Poppins". I like dialogue in sci-fi action shows. I don't want just laser fights and ship battles, but the story has to be interesting. It has to make me want to know what is happening, why, and what will happen. The best I can say is I didn't hate the characters, but I also didn't care about them. I'm passing on this show.

I had this reaction to the first 3 episodes or so, but I've been gradually becoming more interested with each one. Now that I'm caught up, I'm actually pretty excited for each new episode to drop. For anyone interested, the first episode is really poorly done, it skips around to too many characters and none of them are particularly sympathetic, so I think this reaction is going to be common. Don't let it turn you off from the show as a whole.

[wobner]

well, i still have no idea what is going on, but atleast the sides are starting to make a little sense. That was getting frustrating.

are Frederick Johnson and Anderson Dawes different factions of OPA? They don't seem to be working together, yet they both have some of the same information and call themselves OPA. honestly when they revealed

Spoiler: identity

Show

julie mao was lionel pollanski

i almost quit watching i was so confused, now it makes a little more sense.

Spoiler: season finale spoiler

Show

I was a little disappointed in the radiation exposure scene. Generally at the coughing up blood stage, my understanding is your organs toast. removing the radiation is like closing the barn dorn after the horses are out. you prevent further damage, but its already too late, especially if you progressed to that point in less than 3 hours.

Too little information to speculate on anything for season 2.

[Dragonus45]

Spoiler: season finale spoiler

Show

I was a little disappointed in the radiation exposure scene. Generally at the coughing up blood stage, my understanding is your organs toast. removing the radiation is like closing the barn dorn after the horses are out. you prevent further damage, but its already too late, especially if you progressed to that point in less than 3 hours.

Too little information to speculate on anything for season 2.

Wait, the season ends half way through?

[Ranxerox]

Wait, the season ends half way through?

Actually, if it ended half way through that would make more sense. It ended 3/4 of the way through.

At the end of episode 8, I was thinking that they were going to combine the two trips to Eros into one piece and wrap it up in two episodes that way. However, since they didn't go that route, unless they want to pad it with a bunch of political stuff, they should finish with the events of Leviathan's Wake about 3 episodes into season 2.

Spoiler

Show

Bye bye, Thomas Jayne.

Then I guess they can get about half way through Caliban's War by the end of season 2. At least I hope they go that route. I would really suck if they tried to get a whole season out of what little is left to Leviathan's Wake.

[Reverent-One]

Actually, if it ended half way through that would make more sense. It ended 3/4 of the way through.

Pretty sure it's closer to halfway. When I was checking where the end of the Eros trip was before the finale aired, I believe it was around page 325, give or take 20 pages. Checking Amazon, the book is 583 pages. So unless I'm misremembering, it's a little over halfway.

[Dragonus45]

Spoiler

Show

I've heard some speculation that they plan on fusing certain elements of Caliban's War with the end of Leviathan Wakes. It's been a while since I read the books, but I think the events on Ganymede could possibly be brought forward and Bobbie introduced early? Then season 2 would be the end of LW and all of CW.

Spoiler:

Show

Anything that brings Bobbie into the show faster is good with me.

[hamlet]

I've never read the books (which I will have to remedy) but I thought the show was moderately entertaining.

Most of the actors were pretty good at what they were asked to do, though I do not like the one woman on Earth who seems so very flat. I honestly can't remember her character's name, but she's the main Earth character anyway. I just can't understand why she's interesting to some folks. She's almost like a political cypher really.

The biggest complaint I do have is that it is so very dark. Not the subject matter, but the filming itself. It's so dark at times that it's tough to see what in the hell is on screen, which is a serious failing. There's realism, and then there's making a show that your audience can't actually watch because of it.

Looking forward to season 2 and happy that SyFy has finally gotten back into the Sci-Fi business!

[Dragonus45]

Avasarala is a lot more interesting in the books, I feel like part of the problem with her in the show is that they wrote her in early to introduce her faster. Also in the books every second word out of her mouth is ****, which is a better character trait than it sounds like.

[zorenathres]

The good:
-The books are very good, & have the potential to make a great show if done right (are movies getting worse, while tv is getting better?).
-Great production value (especially for syfy), the show simply looks great.
-Well, its really the only thing close to a "hard" sci-fi show on tv atm. And only having shows like Dark Matter & Killjoys to compare to...

The bad:
-Don't read the books first (because you will likely be disappointed by the show).

-Characterization: Likely only an issue because I read the books first, I came into the Expanse with something close to expectations for some of the characters, & almost all of them came up short (Holden is getting pretty annoying with the boy scout routine, Amos is a 1-dimensional psycho, & they were my 2 fav characters in the books). Naomi's & Miller's characters were done much better, & while they also have very little material to work with, they play with what they are given much better.

-Avasarala: Is simply a waste of time atm. The show does its best to bring the tension to the max with dramatic music & effects while the crew of the roci do risky things in space. The next moment, you are back on earth following a manipulative politician while she works hard at her craft. IMO, it breaks any tension & drama you felt for the crew, & each time an Avasarala scene comes up, you are left wondering what the hell is happening out in the void.

To me, it feels like two different shows are working at opposite ends, & they hope that one day they might coincide in a way that compliments the other.

I do understand the need to show what is happening elsewhere in the sol system, but the way it was done just felt out of place, given that they are doing their best to make a dramatic series, why dispel all of that?

[Reverent-One]

(Holden is getting pretty annoying with the boy scout routine

Huh, I thought they really turned down the boy scout-ness of him from the book.

Comparison between Show!Holden's and Book!Holden's actions so far:

Spoiler: No show spoilers, though technically book ones

Show

Show!Holden doesn't support checking out the distress signal immediately, Book!Holden does.
Show!Holden releases the message about the Martian beacon they found on the Scopuli as insurance to make sure they don't get killed, Book!Holden releases it because people need to know the truth (making a separate message later as insurance against being disappeared by the Martians).
Book!Holden complained more about Miller's shooting people on Eros, and while the spy subplot wasn't ever in the book, it seems unlikely to me he would have done what Show!Holden did there.

[Z3ro]

The bad:
-Don't read the books first (because you will likely be disappointed by the show).

I don't know if I agree that either one is better, but rather that they are different.

As Reverent-One pointed out, consider the first actions of book-Holden vs. tv-Holden in regards to the distress signal. Book-Holden is completely on board with checking it out, while tv-Holden, though in support of checking it out, goes behind everyone's back to do so. But to me, the real difference is in the setup. Clearly the authors of the book wanted the crew to check out the distress call, so they simply had the ship answer it, no questions asked.

In the TV show, they set up the stakes and what it means to everyone. The captain informs us that they will lose their bonus if they investigate it, giving us a clear motivation. Holden then tattles anyway, showing us that helping people is more important to him than money. It's a subtle shift, but they pack a lot of characterization into this action, as well as setting up future tension with his soon-to-be crew.

The book just threw the crew together and had them operate perfectly. In the TV show, they end up in the same place, but the directors make them work for it, which seems more realistic and is much more interesting to me.

[Joran]

Season 2 of the Expanse starts tonight.

To get up to speed, here's a recap of the first season of the Expanse done with cats (SPOILERS for the whole season): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ivej0OW7WZk

Yes... cats.

I watched the series first and then sped through the books. I'm completely caught up with Babylon's Ashes. I was generally happy with the first season of the Expanse, although, I felt a little blindsided by the ending. I felt like I was watching a political, kind of Cold War style politics and the introduction of the weird science felt really weird and out of place.

I look forward to the introduction of Bobbie and hope they loosen up Avasarala some. She's hilarious in the books, but that doesn't convey here. I fine with Holden; for whatever reason, the actor has a face that I want to punch, which is a good face for Holden to have ;)

[Maelstrom]

Just Binge watched the first season and really enjoyed the relative attention to detail (see walls around New York and the Statue of Liberty, Gravity effects on liquids, Delta Accelerations, etc) and am looking forward to more of season 2.

[thorgrim29]

This wasn't closed yet for necromancy so....

I liked the first episode (or episodes I guess, unless every episode in the season is going to be 1.5 hours), it was a good reintroduction to the characters and the mix between action and talking seemed about right.

Spoiler: the show and the first two or three books

Show

The Rocinante crew was in good form, Alex cares about people, Amos... doesn't, Holden and Naomi finally get together. Holden didn't really do much but he's between windmills at the moment so I understand that. Miller was great, it's almost better to see him shoot Dresden without the inner monologue. I'll be sorry to see him go, though I figure they might give "ghost" Miller a bigger and earlier role. Avasarala is starting to get into her book role so I expect her to continue being awesome (I wish she were less friendly though). I'm not completely sold on Bobbie yet, she's a bit too gung-ho, though maybe that's on purpose, she's going to be like that pre-Ganymede and become a more interesting character after. I just hope the actress can pull it off, her resume seems a bit thin and getting Bobbie right is fairly important. I wonder who they cast as Prax.

[tantric]

hard to swallow suspension of disbelief thing that bugged me: i got past having to import water.....but the weirdness of growing food crops on the surface of Ganymede was just bizarre. plants turn light and co2 into sugar, energy is cheap, why, oh why, pull stuff up out of jupiter's gravity well rather than grow your own? i'm hoping this will be glossed over in the show

[Ranxerox]

"Paradigm Shift" is a good title for this latest episode. So far they have been sticking to a fairly straight adaptation of the book. I mean they introduced Chrisjen Avasarala early, but even without her potty mouth she is so awesome that is nothing but win. Otherwise they followed Leviathan's Wake pretty closely.

However, we are one episode into Caliban's War and it is clear they are planning some major departures from the source material.

Spoiler: Examples

Show

No Prax, no firefight with the monster unless they are planning on going back and picking it up later, and Naomi going behind Holden back to spare the Protomolecule.

Now, I'm going to keep an open mind, but I must say that I am somewhat disappointed not to get a straight up adaptation of Caliban's War the way we did Leviathan's Wake.

[Joran]

"Paradigm Shift" is a good title for this latest episode. So far they have been sticking to a fairly straight adaptation of the book. I mean they introduced Chrisjen Avasarala early, but even without her potty mouth she is so awesome that is nothing but win. Otherwise they followed Leviathan's Wake pretty closely.

However, we are one episode into Caliban's War and it is clear they are planning some major departures from the source material.

Spoiler: Examples

Show

No Prax, no firefight with the monster unless they are planning on going back and picking it up later, and Naomi going behind Holden back to spare the Protomolecule.

Now, I'm going to keep an open mind, but I must say that I am somewhat disappointed not to get a straight up adaptation of Caliban's War the way we did Leviathan's Wake.

I've read all the books; I'd prefer them to surprise me occasionally or take the books and characters on interesting diversions. I'm already liking the twist they put on the sample. For me, I'm mostly disappointed that Sam isn't around at the moment, although #2 (I don't think they've officially called her Drummer on the show yet) is a ton of fun.

I'm also glad they let Avasarala start cursing.

[ellindsey]

"Paradigm Shift" is a good title for this latest episode. So far they have been sticking to a fairly straight adaptation of the book. I mean they introduced Chrisjen Avasarala early, but even without her potty mouth she is so awesome that is nothing but win. Otherwise they followed Leviathan's Wake pretty closely.

However, we are one episode into Caliban's War and it is clear they are planning some major departures from the source material.

Spoiler: Examples

Show

No Prax, no firefight with the monster unless they are planning on going back and picking it up later, and Naomi going behind Holden back to spare the Protomolecule.

Now, I'm going to keep an open mind, but I must say that I am somewhat disappointed not to get a straight up adaptation of Caliban's War the way we did Leviathan's Wake.

I'm pretty sure that I know what they're planning to do in the upcoming episodes...

Spoiler

Show

The fight against the Protomolecule monster on Ganymede will be shown through the recovered footage from Bobbi's suit-cam. This will be done in a way that keeps the audience guessing and pads out the tension. Bobbi will insist there was a monster, but the audience won't know if she's making it up or hallucinating it or something, and the suit footage will be unreadable. Then, after an episode or two, they'll find the right video drivers to decode the video and the whole fight will be shown that way. It's consistent with how they've been shifting things around in the story so far, and really not any worse than the changes they made to the first book. For example, switching the order of when they went to Eros and when they found the derelict stealth ship with Protomolecule encrusting its reactor core, or completely changing how and when they came into contact with Fred Johnson.

[Joran]

I'm pretty sure that I know what they're planning to do in the upcoming episodes...

Spoiler

Show

The fight against the Protomolecule monster on Ganymede will be shown through the recovered footage from Bobbi's suit-cam. This will be done in a way that keeps the audience guessing and pads out the tension. Bobbi will insist there was a monster, but the audience won't know if she's making it up or hallucinating it or something, and the suit footage will be unreadable. Then, after an episode or two, they'll find the right video drivers to decode the video and the whole fight will be shown that way. It's consistent with how they've been shifting things around in the story so far, and really not any worse than the changes they made to the first book. For example, switching the order of when they went to Eros and when they found the derelict stealth ship with Protomolecule encrusting its reactor core, or completely changing how and when they came into contact with Fred Johnson.

Spoiler: Ganymede

Show

It seems like they've decided that there is no suit-cam footage, which is really odd. I'm guessing they'll get footage of the battle from the "ag-drone", but the lack of any kind of video seems to fly in the face of the tech level. We're at the point where there's cameras almost everywhere.

On that note, I like Anderson Dawes. I'm curious to see what they're doing with Cortazar.

[thorgrim29]

So the prickyest of all pricks Marco is in it, or at least he had representatives in the OPA conclave (I do wish they had subtitles for some of the belter creole, in the books you can take some time to figure it out but in the show it's almost completely opaque). Not sure if they're actually planning on going all the way up to the current books with this series but they're laying the groundwork for it at least. As for the footage, well Bobbie is repairing her suit, maybe she finds it? Also do we know who Fred's #2 is? I thought she might be a version of Michio Pa for a while but I'm not sure anymore.

[Joran]

So the prickyest of all pricks Marco is in it, or at least he had representatives in the OPA conclave (I do wish they had subtitles for some of the belter creole, in the books you can take some time to figure it out but in the show it's almost completely opaque). Not sure if they're actually planning on going all the way up to the current books with this series but they're laying the groundwork for it at least. As for the footage, well Bobbie is repairing her suit, maybe she finds it? Also do we know who Fred's #2 is? I thought she might be a version of Michio Pa for a while but I'm not sure anymore.

Spoiler: Nemesis Games TV adaptation speculation

Show

I need to re-watch the episode to see if Naomi has a reaction when his name is called (Edit: Rewatched the scene, she's not in the initial shot so we can't see her reaction). It does seem weird that Naomi would willingly go to an OPA meeting where she might meet someone from her old crew.

Fred's #2 is Drummer (the writers verified this in the podcast The Churn), although she's picked up the bits of the plot that Sam provided in Caliban's War. It'll be interesting if they introduce Michio Pa, or if they blend her in with Drummer too.

[Desiderata]

I'm hope this "Drummer/Fred's #2" does end up being our Michio Pa, (since if I recall Drummer herself wasn't exactly fleshed out beyond being Fred's #2), and they keep all the other Michio elements; she is awesome!

Spoiler

Show

Because poly-amorous space pirate family!

Also, where is Prax?? I love Prax!

[thorgrim29]

Yeah she's pretty cool. No reason they couldn't just cast another actress to play her when they do the whole slow zone thing (in... I'm going to guess season 3? Maybe 4) either. Man I hope we get to see a whole lot more of this series, I want to hear the best line of the books IRL "It's okay, I took a lot of speed".

Actually both Michio Pa and Clarissa are probably going to be more interesting characters in the tv series, for all that I love the books portraying inner conflict is not the authors' strong suit.

Back to the currently running season, I'm starting to be a bit concerned by the lack of Prax, maybe the whole Ganymede plot got left on the cutting room floor? I hope not it's good stuff

And what's going on with Amos? Please tell me we're not going to have to go through a "Amos wants to be a real boy" subplot, Amos is fine as he is as a sociopath who attaches himself to good people and cheerfully murders people to protect them.

Finally, why oh why did they not cast Jewel Straite as Sam? She's basically lesbian Kaylee anyway and it would have created more buzz for the show.

[Joran]

Yeah she's pretty cool. No reason they couldn't just cast another actress to play her when they do the whole slow zone thing (in... I'm going to guess season 3? Maybe 4) either. Man I hope we get to see a whole lot more of this series, I want to hear the best line of the books IRL "It's okay, I took a lot of speed".

Actually both Michio Pa and Clarissa are probably going to be more interesting characters in the tv series, for all that I love the books portraying inner conflict is not the authors' strong suit.

Back to the currently running season, I'm starting to be a bit concerned by the lack of Prax, maybe the whole Ganymede plot got left on the cutting room floor? I hope not it's good stuff

And what's going on with Amos? Please tell me we're not going to have to go through a "Amos wants to be a real boy" subplot, Amos is fine as he is as a sociopath who attaches himself to good people and cheerfully murders people to protect them.

Finally, why oh why did they not cast Jewel Straite as Sam? She's basically lesbian Kaylee anyway and it would have created more buzz for the show.

Prax is going to be in the next episode (based on the previews I think).

Jewel Staite was pregnant when they were doing the first season. They also weren't sure if they were going to have Sam; they have a character credited as Sam in the first season, but she hasn't shown up again. The writers figured out that they needed a #2 for Fred F'in Johnson, so they moved Drummer up, but didn't want character sprawl, so they gave her the bits and pieces of Sam. I don't remember much about Drummer outside of her existing, so it's great that she actually has character in the show.

Likewise with Diogo, he sorta of was just there, but in the show he's hilarious.

Spoiler: Book 3 TV speculation

Show

Book 3 is going to be interesting. So far, they haven't introduced any of the big players in that book on the Tycho side (Captain Ashford, Michio Pa, Sam, or Bull). I wonder if we're going to start diverging hard around book 3.

[Ranxerox]

Prax is going to be in the next episode (based on the previews I think).

No character by the name Praxidike Meng is listed on the show IMBD page. There is a Mei Meng listed, though. So we can look forward to seeing the daughter but not the father. Which is a real shame because Prax was an awesome character, and beyond that a great source of exposition (Elan would completely approve).

It is from Prax that we learn the damage to Ganymede will in time cause it to collapse and how the lose of Ganymede is is going to effect the Belt as whole. Now they can put this speech in someone else's mouth, but I don't see how it can ever have as much impact coming from anyone else. Prax has complete audience emotional buy-in and the scientific background to see both the details and the big picture of the Belt's system of interdependence. No one currently on the show has the top down knowledge and if they just have some random scientist explain it, it not going to have the same emotional depth.

I'm sure they have good solid reasons for leaving Prax out, and hopefully they will navigate his absence gracefully. Still, love the character and it seems like a shame.

[Joran]

No character by the name Praxidike Meng is listed on the show IMBD page. There is a Mei Meng listed, though. So we can look forward to seeing the daughter but not the father. Which is a real shame because Prax was an awesome character, and beyond that a great source of exposition (Elan would completely approve).

It is from Prax that we learn the damage to Ganymede will in time cause it to collapse and how the lose of Ganymede is is going to effect the Belt as whole. Now they can put this speech in someone else's mouth, but I don't see how it can ever have as much impact coming from anyone else. Prax has complete audience emotional buy-in and the scientific background to see both the details and the big picture of the Belt's system of interdependence. No one currently on the show has the top down knowledge and if they just have some random scientist explain it, it not going to have the same emotional depth.

I'm sure they have good solid reasons for leaving Prax out, and hopefully they will navigate his absence gracefully. Still, love the character and it seems like a shame.

IMDB is not always up to date.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTrfW47kz1w (possible spoilers).

The literal first scene of the promos for next episode is a man wandering around saying "I'm looking for my daughter" / cut of a cute kid. If that's not Prax, I don't know who he is.

Edit: Yup, it's Prax: https://twitter.com/WencheBandida/st...67199829086208

Terry Chen is playing him.

[Ranxerox]

Cool.

I was kinda bummed by his absence.